O's have made final offer to vlad

[Hayden2004]

Buster_ESPN Buster Olney
Heard this:O's settled with their position in the Vlad talks.O's want him at their price(package $4.5-5 m.).If not, they'll live with it.
1 minute ago Favorite Retweet Reply

[Dipper9]

Buster_ESPN Buster Olney
Heard this:O's settled with their position in the Vlad talks.O's want him at their price(package $4.5-5 m.).If not, they'll live with it.
1 minute ago Favorite Retweet Reply

So I guess he's not standing behind the curtain, huh?

[Steve I]

Sounds like a fair number, good for AM to hold his ground. DH's have not gotten the huge dollars this season.

[Danielos38]

Very fair amount. If he won't take that, then he shouldn't play here. MacPhail has played this well, IMO.

[blwalt17]

Seems fair. Hope he takes it (if he chooses to) in time for a fanfest announcement.

[Sports Guy]

Sounds like the Orioles are on the fence about Vlad. If we get him, great..if not, who cares.

I feel the same way.

I can see the ups and downs to signing him.

[EtotheKallday17]

I like the way AM handled this. If Vlad doesn't take that, then I don't want him here anymore...

[bird watcher]

Seems fair. Hope he takes it (if he chooses to) in time for a fanfest announcement.

They won't announce it until it is final. They got burned years ago on announcing a reliever (I can't remember his name). they announced his signing and he failed the physical. Despite the physical contingency, they were found liable for part of the contract since they had announced it.

That is why they rebut these signings until the bitter end.

[Frobby]

Sounds like the Orioles are on the fence about Vlad. If we get him, great..if not, who cares.

I feel the same way.

I can see the ups and downs to signing him.

I'm fine with this, too. $4.5 mm is a reasonable line to draw. I hope Vlad decides quickly one way or the other.

[TheBee]

I really hope the outcome is Guerrero signing here. I felt 1 for 5 was fair in the current market. I hope Vlad's side agrees to this 4.5 -5 package...if the report is accurate. I'd love to see Vlad in our colors.

[Bradysburns]

Well, 250% higher than the initial reported offer of $2 million, huh? Hard to not think that's a very solid offer.

At this point I'm with the other posters who say: I hope he takes it for the Orioles' sake, but if not... I won't gripe about it. Bring on the Reimold/Pie era.

It's really feeling like time to get spring training going...

[Blues0080]

Hopefully all of this Vlad talk will put chips on the shoulders of Reimhold and Pie too so that in the future there won't even need to be a discussion about bringing someone else in.

[Moose Milligan]

Agreed, if we get him, that's cool...if we don't, thats fine as well.

[clapdiddy]

I'm fine with this, too. $4.5 mm is a reasonable line to draw. I hope Vlad decides quickly one way or the other.

Agree with this. Let's either get it done or move on. We really don't need the drama.

[TonySoprano]

So then what was all of this talk about an $8 million offer? Andy called their bluff and wants to see their cards?

[Hank Scorpio]

So then what was all of this talk about an $8 million offer? Andy called their bluff and wants to see their cards?

He certainly didn't make an offer he couldn't refuse.

[TonySoprano]

He certainly didn't make an offer he couldn't refuse.
especially since Luca Brasi sleeps with the fishes:D

no "WOW" offer either

[ChuckS]

I would go 1/6 to get the deal done. Not a bad deal for a guy that hit over .300 with 29 dingers last year. This also player who will bring at least some fans to the ballpark and that has to be considered. I don't see any of the other free agent signings doing that alone.

[birdtown]

Assuming that Vlad hits .300 with 20 dingers by the trade deadline...would he net a top 100 prospect from a contender?

[Brendan25]

Assuming that Vlad hits .300 with 20 dingers by the trade deadline...would he net a top 100 prospect from a contender?

If Vlad is hitting .300 with 20 dingers at the deadline, we better be a contender.

[JTrea81]

Agreed, if we get him, that's cool...if we don't, thats fine as well.

Until Roberts, Lee or Hardy go down with an injury...

[nevadaO]

No timetable on Vlad; 4 discussions going

http://twitter.com/Britt_Ghiroli/statuses/31385146280124416

[Birds08]

Until Roberts, Lee or Hardy go down with an injury...

True, I hear Vladdy is a mean shortstop. Supposedly great at second and first as well.

[raypetty]

No timetable on Vlad; 4 discussions going

http://twitter.com/Britt_Ghiroli/statuses/31385146280124416

Wonder what those discussions are? For who?

[statman]

True, I hear Vladdy is a mean shortstop. Supposedly great at second and first as well.

Trea is referring to the depth of our lineup...If Roberts or Hardy go down...you have to supplement Izturis...but I would much rather have Izturis and Vlad in the lineup than Izturis and Pie/Reimold. Reimold would likely get playing time, regardless, if Lee were to get injured...unless they plan on switching Reynolds to 1st and calling up Bell.

[JTrea81]

True, I hear Vladdy is a mean shortstop. Supposedly great at second and first as well.

Offensive depth. The drop in offense due to Izzy or from Pie playing full time in LF over Scott and having somebody like Snyder or Bell DH is going to have to picked up somewhere...

But it seems the Orioles do know what offensive depth is:

http://twitter.com/#!/Buster_ESPN/status/31384399324909569

[statman]

Wonder what those discussions are? For who?

Interesting...I imagine one of them is probably Duchscherer, the others might be trade possibilities in the event that Vlad accepts the deal.

[JTrea81]

Interesting...I imagine one of them is probably Duchscherer, the others might be trade possibilities in the event that Vlad accepts the deal.

http://brittghiroli.mlblogs.com/archives/2011/01/talking_some_vlad.html


If they do get Vlad, what the organization is leaning toward doing is hanging on to everyone and let them battle it out this spring. So those of you who were asking about signing Guerrero and dangling Pie, Reimold or Scott for a starting pitcher can forget that notion, at least for right now. Pie is coming off an injury that forced him to miss most of last season and Reimold had a disastrous 2010 campaign. At this point, competition would be a welcome thing.

As it should be. Go into ST with everybody. Injuries will happen, not just to the Orioles but to other teams as well...

[crawjo]

If Vlad won't take 4.5-5 million, then he probably doesn't really want to play here, in which case, he can go somewhere else. He's unlikely to repeat his 2010 performance and the club would be foolish to offer him more, especially if those millions would take away at all from the amount we can spend in the draft or getting other things that we need.

Vlad is a decent fit for the Orioles lineup, but we have other options. If we did not already have a DH and a plan (however flawed) for LF, I would want the Orioles to overpay for him, but with the team we currently have there's no need to do that.

[PaulFolk]

They won't announce it until it is final. They got burned years ago on announcing a reliever (I can't remember his name). they announced his signing and he failed the physical. Despite the physical contingency, they were found liable for part of the contract since they had announced it.

That is why they rebut these signings until the bitter end.
Xavier Hernandez is who you're thinking of. That was during the Frank Wren era.

[Elston Gunnn]

Buster_ESPN Buster Olney
Heard this:O's settled with their position in the Vlad talks.O's want him at their price(package $4.5-5 m.).If not, they'll live with it.
1 minute ago Favorite Retweet Reply

If accurate, this is great. :2yay-thumb:

[waroriole]

Until Roberts, Lee or Hardy go down with an injury...

Funny how those guys are sure to get hurt but a guy with chronic back and knee injuries will be just fine. Another terrible argument.

[crawjo]

http://brittghiroli.mlblogs.com/archives/2011/01/talking_some_vlad.html



As it should be. Go into ST with everybody. Injuries will happen, not just to the Orioles but to other teams as well...

Yup...Reimold can start the year at AAA to see if he's recovered from 2010, and Pie makes a very good fourth outfielder or insurance in case of injury.

[Sports Guy]

True, I hear Vladdy is a mean shortstop. Supposedly great at second and first as well.

Come on guys, you have to know he is talking about depth.

Its very obvious that having Vlad here makes us a deeper team.

The question is this...is having his bat in the lineup(and the increased depth) more valuable to us than giving the at bats to Reimold and Pie?

Personally, I feel its not but I also wouldn't be upset if they did it for the deal they would get him at.

Put it this way, it makes a lot more sense to to sign Vlad than it does to sign a vet, back of the rotation starter to block Tillman.

[statman]

http://brittghiroli.mlblogs.com/archives/2011/01/talking_some_vlad.html

As it should be. Go into ST with everybody. Injuries will happen, not just to the Orioles but to other teams as well...

Well, that's good news. I was honestly worried that they would sign Vlad just to deal Scott, which I don't believe really improves our lineup at all. We need both of those guys in order to see significant change. I just hope things come together on the field as well as they do on paper. We all saw the disaster in Seattle last year after they added Lee, Figgins, and Bradley. Many thought it to be a complete overhaul and some even projected them to win the West: http://rlyw.blogspot.com/2010/01/extremely-early-2010-mlb-projected.html.

[Hank Scorpio]

Come on guys, you have to know he is talking about depth.

Its very obvious that having Vlad here makes us a deeper team.

The question is this...is having his bat in the lineup(and the increased depth) more valuable to us than giving the at bats to Reimold and Pie?

Personally, I feel its not but I also wouldn't be upset if they did it for the deal they would get him at.

Put it this way, it makes a lot more sense to to sign Vlad than it does to sign a vet, back of the rotation starter to block Tillman.

Let's say we don't sign a veteran starter and Britton significantly outpitches Tillman in Spring Training.

What do you do?

[JTrea81]

Funny how those guys are sure to get hurt but a guy with chronic back and knee injuries will be just fine. Another terrible argument.

The most Hardy ever played was 151 games back in 2007.

Last year he only played in 101 games. It's not a stretch to think Izzy is going to get a lot of playing time in 2011...

Vlad's played in 140+ games for 5 out of the past 6 years and played in 152 last year.

Harold Baines had knee issues as well and played until he was 42.

In 1999 at age 40 in 107 games for the Orioles he put up a .322/.395/.583/.977 line.

[statman]

Funny how those guys are sure to get hurt but a guy with chronic back and knee injuries will be just fine. Another terrible argument.

Over 14 full seasons, Vlad has missed "significant" time in 2 of them...Meanwhile, Roberts only played in 59 games last year, Derrek Lee is coming off of thumb surgery, and Hardy has been injured each of the last two seasons. You're just failing Vlad on the old "eye test." If you're judging him by what you saw in San Francisco last year, it's not like we plan to play him in the field...

[waroriole]

The most Hardy ever played was 151 games back in 2007.

Last year he only played in 101 games. It's not a stretch to think Izzy is going to get a lot of playing time in 2011...

Vlad's played in 140+ games for 5 out of the past 6 years and played in 152 last year.

Harold Baines had knee issues as well and played until he was 42.

In 1999 at age 40 in 107 games for the Orioles he put up a .322/.395/.583/.977 line.

Good job of skating around the point. I can't believe you didn't address the real issue: your hypocrisy. This place looks more your speed: http://www.oriolesanonymous.com/

[El Gordo]

Let's say we don't sign a veteran starter and Britton significantly outpitches Tillman in Spring Training.

What do you do?I keep Brittin in the rotation and send Tillman to AAA. AM has said he will be given a shot to make the teasm out of ST. I think he will.

[Sports Guy]

Let's say we don't sign a veteran starter and Britton significantly outpitches Tillman in Spring Training.

What do you do?Well, how does Tillman pitch?

Is Tillman AWFUL or does he have a decent spring but Britton much better?

If Tillman pitches even just reasonably ok, I give him the spot.

The only ways Tillman shouldn't make the rotation(IMO) is if he is either hurt or is completely awful in ST.

[waroriole]

Over 14 full seasons, Vlad has missed "significant" time in 2 of them...Meanwhile, Roberts only played in 59 games last year, Derrek Lee is coming off of thumb surgery, and Hardy has been injured each of the last two seasons. You're just failing Vlad on the old "eye test." If you're judging him by what you saw in San Francisco last year, it's not like we plan to play him in the field...

I'm judging him by the fact that he can't play the field, and had a bad 2nd half. He's not going to hold up, and he won't be much of an improvement on Reimold/Pie (if at all). Plus, we don't get to build on the improvements that Reimold/Pie may have made in 2012.

[Hank Scorpio]

The most Hardy ever played was 151 games back in 2007.

Last year he only played in 101 games. It's not a stretch to think Izzy is going to get a lot of playing time in 2011...

Vlad's played in 140+ games for 5 out of the past 6 years and played in 152 last year.

Harold Baines had knee issues as well and played until he was 42.

In 1999 at age 40 in 107 games for the Orioles he put up a .322/.395/.583/.977 line.

Baines would be a good argument, but Vlad isn't Harold Baines. Not even close. He's a significantly bigger human being (50 pounds heavier) and he's 6 years younger than 42 and slower than creeping death.

It's not a stretch to think Vlad's due for a DL stint or worse.

[scOtt]

Until Roberts, Lee or Hardy go down with an injury...
That doesn't affect Vlad or vice versa. No matter how many times you say it!

[scOtt]

Wonder what those discussions are? For who?
Probably just different ways to structure it. Different bases, different incentives.


EDIT: NM. I read Britt's tweet wrong.

[Hank Scorpio]

Well, how does Tillman pitch?

Is Tillman AWFUL or does he have a decent spring but Britton much better?

If Tillman pitches even just reasonably ok, I give him the spot.

The only ways Tillman shouldn't make the rotation(IMO) is if he is either hurt or is completely awful in ST.

I think we probably agree on this. I was more or less just seeing how willing you'd be to put Britton in that 5th spot. Ideally, Tillman would win it and Britton would come up whenever someone goes down.

Your rotation assuming we don't sign a vet?

[olehippi]

Until Roberts, Lee or Hardy go down with an injury...


You keep bringing the injury to other players up as a reason to sign Guerrero. But the truth is that given Guerrero's recent track record of injuries, he is just as likely to get injured. His knees, shoulder, and back have been problematic for the last 3-4 years and now prevent him from playing in the field at all. Unlike the others, he is a one dimensional player who can only DH, and I don't think the Orioles need a DH-only type player....especially only for one year. He creates a problem rather than solving one. Luke Scott can play the OF and 1B in addition to DH.

[Sports Guy]

I think we probably agree on this. I was more or less just seeing how willing you'd be to put Britton in that 5th spot. Ideally, Tillman would win it and Britton would come up whenever someone goes down.

Your rotation assuming we don't sign a vet?

I personally would make Matusz the OD starter but I know that's not happening.

Matusz, Guthrie, BB, Arrieta and Tillman would be my order..I assume the Orioles will switch Guthrie and Matusz.

I wouldn't have a problem switching Arrieta and BB but it doesn't really matter.

[scOtt]

You keep bringing the injury to other players up as a reason to sign Guerrero. But the truth is that given Guerrero's recent track record of injuries, he is just as likely to get injured. His knees, shoulder, and back have been problematic for the last 3-4 years and now prevent him from playing in the field at all. Unlike the others, he is a one dimensional player who can only DH, and I don't think the Orioles need a DH-only type player....especially only for one year. He creates a problem rather than solving one. Luke Scott can play the OF and 1B in addition to DH.
Also, even if we sign Vlad and he plays well... if Roberts goes down we're still screwed. Vlad is not some magic panacea.

[hendu]

I'm 70/30 on my preference for Vlad signing here. I found this interesting though...I honestly had a dream last night that he was throwing me batting practice....the kicker, he was wearing an O's hat and t-shirt. I obviously have problems.

[Dagger420]

Also, even if we sign Vlad and he plays well... if Roberts goes down we're still screwed. Vlad is not some magic panacea.

I think the magic in bringing in Vlad is that you can cut down on Pie and Luke Scott's ab's against lefties (under .800 OPS), and you have the depth to keep a bunch of older players fresher.

You give Lee some days off (which he'll need), then you put Scott at 1b and Pie/Reimold whoever in LF.

Wieters can DH, then you can give Vlad/Scott days off. I mean there is just so many options.

I see the magic of having another good player in the mix as being more preventative of injuries and overuse, not as contingencies.

We are also deep enough where we don't need to play Vlad for 600 Pa's which was what wore him down so badly last season IMO.

[JTrea81]

Also, even if we sign Vlad and he plays well... if Roberts goes down we're still screwed. Vlad is not some magic panacea.

We are better off with him in that case than without him.

[olehippi]

I think the magic in bringing in Vlad is that you can cut down on Pie and Luke Scott's ab's against lefties (under .800 OPS), and you have the depth to keep a bunch of older players fresher.

This would be Reimold's role....and IMO it's important that we find out if he can do it. Having Vlad here essentially prevents that from happening since Nolan is likely to be the odd man out.

The only way signing Guerrero would work is that you go with a 6-man bench and drop a reliever - which isn't going to happen - or you drop Tatum and keep Fox as your backup catcher

Pie
Reimold
Izturis
Fox
Guerrero

....or ship Reimold off to Norfolk, which means you will have a LH hitter playing in LF no matter what because Guerrero can not longer effectively play in the OF.

Pie
Tatum
Izturis
Fox
Guerrero

[scOtt]

We are better off with him in that case than without him.
Trea, I'm convinced on Vlad too. I want him. I'm just tired of you spouting this :bs: that it has anything to do with Hardy, Lee, Roberts or anyone else. It doesn't. It's NOT an added reason to get Vlad that we might have an injury elsewhere. It's apples and oranges. Hell, it's apples and a crankshaft.

[scOtt]

I think the magic in bringing in Vlad is that you can cut down on Pie and Luke Scott's ab's against lefties (under .800 OPS), and you have the depth to keep a bunch of older players fresher.

You give Lee some days off (which he'll need), then you put Scott at 1b and Pie/Reimold whoever in LF.

Wieters can DH, then you can give Vlad/Scott days off. I mean there is just so many options.

I see the magic of having another good player in the mix as being more preventative of injuries and overuse, not as contingencies.

We are also deep enough where we don't need to play Vlad for 600 Pa's which was what wore him down so badly last season IMO.
Now that's a valid reason.

[Brendan25]

I personally would make Matusz the OD starter but I know that's not happening.

Matusz, Guthrie, BB, Arrieta and Tillman would be my order..I assume the Orioles will switch Guthrie and Matusz.

I wouldn't have a problem switching Arrieta and BB but it doesn't really matter.

1. Jeremy Guthrie
2. Brian Matusz
3. Brad Bergesen
4. Justin Duscherer
5. Jake Arrieta

[ilbm88]

1. Jeremy Guthrie
2. Brian Matusz
3. Brad Bergesen
4. Justin Duscherer
5. Jake Arrieta


Matusz should be opening day starter, the kid earned it. Bergesen is no 3rd pitcher.

[Brendan25]

Matusz should be opening day starter, the kid earned it. Bergesen is no 3rd pitcher.

When you say opening day are you talking at Tampa or the 1st game at Baltimore?

[jiminnj]

I'm judging him by the fact that he can't play the field, and had a bad 2nd half. He's not going to hold up, and he won't be much of an improvement on Reimold/Pie (if at all). Plus, we don't get to build on the improvements that Reimold/Pie may have made in 2012.

Bingo, echo's my feelings.

I would add that we probably have only a slim chance to contend this year, why sign a player who is here for 1 year and is blocking the development of players who could be a big part of our future in the OF.

[tntoriole]

I would go to 5.5 or even 6 for Vlad....he gives us tons of flexibility...he lights a fire under Reimold to actually demonstrate that he can get his act back together and if Reimold can't, then it answers another question for us. He allows Scott and Pie to be more valuable pieces if you decide to move them later in the year as Scott would have more value playing left if you wanted to send him to an NL team. I think Vlad would also be an outstanding support/model for Pie in particular...

Vlad made 5.5 last year and had by all measures a fine year...bumping him a little bit (given that also by all accounts he is a fantastic clubhouse presence) would certainly be fine with me.

If Buck wants him, go get him.

And for those who feel 4.5 is the number for Vlad and nothing higher...I have two words....Garrett Atkins....4.5 as Macphail's answer for power in 2010....I think Vlad is worth a little bit more than that don't you?

[wildcard]

Matusz should be opening day starter, the kid earned it. Bergesen is no 3rd pitcher.

Bergy ranking is yet to be determined. There are some positives. 3.43 ERA in 2009. 2.78 ERA last two months of 2010.

[Lateralus]

Bergy ranking is yet to be determined. There are some positives. 3.43 ERA in 2009. 2.78 ERA last two months of 2010.

His ERA for the rest of the 2010 counts too, though, right?

To quote Homer, “Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything. 14% of people know that.”

So why cherry pick some stats that help your argument and leave the full stats hidden?

[sdmarkakis]

His ERA for the rest of the 2010 counts too, though, right?

To quote Homer, “Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything. 14% of people know that.”

So why cherry pick some stats that help your argument and leave the full stats hidden?

True, but it's pretty obvious what issues Bergy had coming to the season relative to the injury he had. He changed his mechanics for the worse and spent most of the season getting back to the proper mechanics. I would expect on any given season he could be a 4.5 ERA guy or better, which is fine for the backend of the rotation.

[waroriole]

His ERA for the rest of the 2010 counts too, though, right?

To quote Homer, “Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything. 14% of people know that.”

So why cherry pick some stats that help your argument and leave the full stats hidden?

You must have missed the first part of that post when he said that Bergy's ranking is yet to be determined. And when he said that the stats he cited were something positive, and not a complete picture.

[Peace21]

Zrebiec: #Orioles' budget for offseason acquisitions is not set in stone. Flexible if they want to add a player like Vladimir Guerrero.

Looks like the O's have room in the wallet for Vlad.

[scOtt]

BTW, Roch talked to him today. Brad says he's very healthy and far ahead of last year at this time.


http://www.masnsports.com/school_of_roch/2011/01/bergesen-optimistic-about-the-2011-season.html

[JTrea81]

Looks like the O's have room in the wallet for Vlad.

Especially with Angelos pushing them to be aggressive and not to stop making improvements to the roster...

[raypetty]

Especially with Angelos pushing them to be aggressive and not to stop making improvements to the roster...

PA's got the money to spend now that he lost out on his bid for the track.

[scOtt]

PA's got the money to spend now that he lost out on his bid for the track.

He's not spending his money tho. It's Peter Angelos, CEO of the Orioles, spending the Orioles' money. There's a difference.

[Hayden2004]

SI_JonHeyman Jon Heyman
#angels seem focused on leadoff and bench, not vladdy. #baltimoreorbust?

[TheBee]

SI_JonHeyman Jon Heyman
#angels seem focused on leadoff and bench, not vladdy. #baltimoreorbust?

I hope he's actually right this time.

[mikezpen]

Forget the Orioles "budget" nonsense.Angelos has scrimped this team to the bottom of the American League. He owes us, period.

Look at it this way. The Orioles supposedly "offered" VMart $48 million for 4 years-or $12 million per year (ha ha).If Vlad indeed wants 8 million for one year, that shouldn't be a problem for a one-year contract-you think? That's a lot cheaper than VMart.

There is absolutely no excuse for not bringing him here and piddling around over chicken feed pocket change.If he goes elsewhere simply because of a couple of million dollars you can blame in on our useless owner...again.

[cindyluvsbrady]

So I guess he's not standing behind the curtain, huh?

LOL!!!!!:laughlol:

[cindyluvsbrady]

Until Roberts, Lee or Hardy go down with an injury...

MY PERFECT ONE:hearts: will be fine:):clap3:


:pray:
BELIEVE Trea!!!
K?

[Dipper9]

Just got back from FanFest. There was a lot of Vladdy talk during the fan forums. The players want him. Buck wants him. And whil MacPhail didn't come out and say it's likely, he certainly didn't say anything to make us think he won't be an Oriole.

Time will tell, but Buck made mention of "hopefully having to erase his potential lineup again sometime this week." Lets hope MacPhail wraps this up.

[Frobby]

Just got back from FanFest. There was a lot of Vladdy talk during the fan forums. The players want him. Buck wants him. And whil MacPhail didn't come out and say it's likely, he certainly didn't say anything to make us think he won't be an Oriole.

I got the same impression. Matusz was asked who the toughest hitter he had faced was, and said Vlad, then made reference to a change-up he threw him that almost hit the plate and Vlad golfed it for a homer, and the ball he hit on a bounce from Tillman. There were a couple of jokes about taking up a collection to sign him.

[Dipper9]

I got the same impression. Matusz was asked who the toughest hitter he had faced was, and said Vlad, then made reference to a change-up he threw him that almost hit the plate and Vlad golfed it for a homer, and the ball he hit on a bounce from Tillman. There were a couple of jokes about taking up a collection to sign him.

How about when Manfra says to MacPhail in the afternoon sesssion, "what's the latest on Vlad?" and Buck leans over real close to Andy so he could hear the answer. Good stuff. The guys were all real loose when talking about Vlad, so either they think they have him, or else they have a big surprise coming if he goes elsewhere.

[cindyluvsbrady]

Just got back from FanFest. There was a lot of Vladdy talk during the fan forums. The players want him. Buck wants him. And whil MacPhail didn't come out and say it's likely, he certainly didn't say anything to make us think he won't be an Oriole.

Time will tell, but Buck made mention of "hopefully having to erase his potential lineup again sometime this week." Lets hope MacPhail wraps this up.

Who did you see?
Did you get autographs??
I am jealous:(

[TheBee]

I got the same impression. Matusz was asked who the toughest hitter he had faced was, and said Vlad, then made reference to a change-up he threw him that almost hit the plate and Vlad golfed it for a homer, and the ball he hit on a bounce from Tillman. There were a couple of jokes about taking up a collection to sign him.

This is what I've always said about Vlad. He can take a pitcher's pitch and rip it like it was a mistake. Soriano used to be able to do that too, but Vlad made it an art. It's like the opposite of effective wildness for a pitcher. :laughlol: As a pitcher it's got to be hard because you can't even feel comfortable if you've got your best stuff and are hitting your spots.

See now, you guys are getting me all excited again...

[Crazysilver03]

Forget the Orioles "budget" nonsense.Angelos has scrimped this team to the bottom of the American League. He owes us, period.

Look at it this way. The Orioles supposedly "offered" VMart $48 million for 4 years-or $12 million per year (ha ha).If Vlad indeed wants 8 million for one year, that shouldn't be a problem for a one-year contract-you think? That's a lot cheaper than VMart.

There is absolutely no excuse for not bringing him here and piddling around over chicken feed pocket change.If he goes elsewhere simply because of a couple of million dollars you can blame in on our useless owner...again.

But how differently would the off-season have played out had the Orioles signed V-Mart to start the off-season?

But at the same time, Vlad + Lee would equal what V-Mart did get.

[Crazysilver03]

Especially with Angelos pushing them to be aggressive and not to stop making improvements to the roster...

As much as you want to think it, MacPhail was always looking to make improvements to the roster. To think otherwise is just plain silly.

[Orioles West]

I'm still trying to get excited about the idea of Vlad. If he signs, I hope has another great production year left in him, or at least a strong enough performance to draw trade interest if the O's are not in a race by the break.



-Don

[section18]

I think it's going to happen and Andy and Buck just wanted to make sure the fans were onboard with it if they sign him. They said on Tom Davis's show this morning that Vlad's mother is close with Vlad and she cooks for any team he's on. The players really like him. He's a good guy and doesn't have any baggage. If he was 30 and could still run he would be getting a ton of money but he's not so he has to take what the market gives him. He can still hit and could really make things interesting this summer for the Orioles. I like our lineup better than most teams in baseball and it's definitely better than the Rangers or Giants who made it to the World Series last year. Next up will be a starter, back up catcher and lefty reliever. If AM is sussessful the OH will be humming and the Birds will be flying. Peter has the money and it's time to spend it.

[sangar]

I think it's going to happen and Andy and Buck just wanted to make sure the fans were onboard with it if they sign him. They said on Tom Davis's show this morning that Vlad's mother is close with Vlad and she cooks for any team he's on. The players really like him. He's a good guy and doesn't have any baggage. If he was 30 and could still run he would be getting a ton of money but he's not so he has to take what the market gives him. He can still hit and could really make things interesting this summer for the Orioles. I like our lineup better than most teams in baseball and it's definitely better than the Rangers or Giants who made it to the World Series last year. Next up will be a starter, back up catcher and lefty reliever. If AM is sussessful the OH will be humming and the Birds will be flying. Peter has the money and it's time to spend it.Her food is as popular with his teammates as his golfing.


http://angels.ocregister.com/2010/02/26/vlad-leaves-hunger-in-his-wake/46757/

[MatthewW]

Heard this...

Nothing is even CLOSE...

Was given the impression that the Orioles have just thrown around the idea of Vlad, but with no offer.

[clapdiddy]

Heard this...

Nothing is even CLOSE...

Was given the impression that the Orioles have just thrown around the idea of Vlad, but with no offer.
Thanks, Matthew!

I'm wondering what all the noise is about then? :scratchchinhmm:

[BRob411]

Heard this...

Nothing is even CLOSE...

Was given the impression that the Orioles have just thrown around the idea of Vlad, but with no offer.

So I'm guessing this isn't going to happen now. Good job Matthew

[raypetty]

If what you are saying is legit, Matthew then our FO is being a bunch of arses about this.

[BRob411]

Vlad won't be an Oriole and we just have to move on. I would love to be wrong about this but I believe I'll be right when it's all said and done unfortunately.

[sdmarkakis]

Vlad won't be an Oriole and we just have to move on. I would love to be wrong about this but I believe I'll be right when it's all said and done unfortunately.

Because some guy on a forum said it? lol

[BRob411]

Because some guy on a forum said it? lol

I just have a feeling that he will spurn the O's again and I'm not going to get my hopes up. Nobody doesn't have to believe me, I'm just saying what I feel. You can feel anyway you like about this topic.

[MatthewW]

Vlad won't be an Oriole and we just have to move on. I would love to be wrong about this but I believe I'll be right when it's all said and done unfortunately.

There are so many reports out right now that the Orioles have given theie 'final' offer, or that they are making 'progress' or that they are 'close'.

I am not saying that for 100% sure Vlad WILL NOT sign here... but as of this point nothing is remotely as close as the reports seem to make it sound.

[BRob411]

There are so many reports out right now that the Orioles have given theie 'final' offer, or that they are making 'progress' or that they are 'close'.

I am not saying that for 100% sure Vlad WILL NOT sign here... but as of this point nothing is remotely as close as the reports seem to make it sound.

Ok, but I'm just getting a bad feeling about this, I just want this to end soon.

[sdmarkakis]

There are so many reports out right now that the Orioles have given theie 'final' offer, or that they are making 'progress' or that they are 'close'.

I am not saying that for 100% sure Vlad WILL NOT sign here... but as of this point nothing is remotely as close as the reports seem to make it sound.

Why is your say on this matter any more worthwhile than a bunch of well respected writers?

[Chevytrckman3]

Vlad is a luxary to me. Like to have him, but he's not the difference between a playoff team or a WS contender. It's not like he's the Vlad we wanted 6 years ago. Make for a more interesting lineup, but im ok with a Reimold/Pie platoon also. I'm more interested in seeing if adding a bat like Reynolds helps Markakis, and if Wieters takes the next step, or if Matusz shows he is a true #1 starter. And I think 2011 is most important for Adam Jones, and his longterm future with the O's. And as for Vlad, his options are limited. I see the Angels, Rangers, Blue Jays and O's. If it's between the O's and Tor and money is close, i think he picks the O's. But, i think he's holding out in hopes of the Angels or Texas coming up with some dough. I personally feel he'd be a Yankee already if they hadn't signed Jones.

[BRob411]

Why is your say on this matter any more worthwhile than a bunch of well respected writers?

He broke the Derrek Lee story the night before it was announced that Lee and Orioles came to an agreement.

[BRob411]

Vlad is a luxary to me. Like to have him, but he's not the difference between a playoff team or a WS contender. It's not like he's the Vlad we wanted 6 years ago. Make for a more interesting lineup, but im ok with a Reimold/Pie platoon also. I'm more interested in seeing if adding a bat like Reynolds helps Markakis, and if Wieters takes the next step, or if Matusz shows he is a true #1 starter. And I think 2011 is most important for Adam Jones, and his longterm future with the O's. And as for Vlad, his options are limited. I see the Angels, Rangers, Blue Jays and O's. If it's between the O's and Tor and money is close, i think he picks the O's. But, i think he's holding out in hopes of the Angels or Texas coming up with some dough. I personally feel he'd be a Yankee already if they hadn't signed Jones.

Some old guy (a fan) said on 105.7 the fan that he heard Vlad was close to signing with the Yankees, then again it sounded like he was just another bitter O's fan whining about how the O's always get used by high profile players and agents during negotiations and that the O's wouldn't be able to outbid the Yankees.

[Peace21]

Some old guy (a fan) said on 105.7 the fan that he heard Vlad was close to signing with the Yankees, then again it sounded like he was just another bitter O's fan whining about how the O's always get used by high profile players and agents during negotiations and that the O's wouldn't be able to outbid the Yankees.

Where would he play or hit for the Yankees? Then again I could see the Yanks offering Vlad 8mill.

[BRob411]

Where would he play or hit for the Yankees? Then again I could see the Yanks offering Vlad 8mill.

They could (or have offererd) offer him 8mil and find some way to get him into the lineup regularly.

[Crazysilver03]

They could (or have offererd) offer him 8mil and find some way to get him into the lineup regularly.

Not unless there are going to put Posada behind the plate or have him spell Teixeira at 1B.

[BRob411]

Not unless there are going to put Posada behind the plate or have him spell Teixeira at 1B.

They did sign Russell Martin which I just remembered LOL, so that would eliminate the Vlad scenario. I just want this to come to an end and for something to be finalized, the rumors are getting on my nerves lol.

[MatthewW]

Why is your say on this matter any more worthwhile than a bunch of well respected writers?

Because Andy MacPhail isn't speaking to the press and basically has the whole wharehouse on lockdown when it comes to knowledge about roster moves... he wants NOTHING going to the press.

If I had to choose between my source and a writer... i'll take my source 1,000 times out of 1,000 times.

[Pasadena Paul]

I'm on board with everyone else. I was not comfortable with the reported 2m offer, but like most have been saying 5m seems like it fits. Ihave been for signing him all along. Those against I don't understand. Pie and Reimold have way more question marks then Vlad. I don't see a down side. We owe Pie and Reimold nothing. I think they both can be assets as role players.

[BRob411]

I'm on board with everyone else. I was not comfortable with the reported 2m offer, but like most have been saying 5m seems like it fits. Ihave been for signing him all along. Those against I don't understand. Pie and Reimold have way more question marks then Vlad. I don't see a down side. We owe Pie and Reimold nothing. I think they both can be assets as role players.

We really don't know what is going on and how much the O's are truly willing to offer. One day it's 2mil, next day it's 3mil, another day it's 3-5mil, as of this morning Buster Olney reported the O's final offer was $4.5-5mil. We'll just have to keep waiting this out and see how this will get resolved.

[Chevytrckman3]

I'm on board with everyone else. I was not comfortable with the reported 2m offer, but like most have been saying 5m seems like it fits. Ihave been for signing him all along. Those against I don't understand. Pie and Reimold have way more question marks then Vlad. I don't see a down side. We owe Pie and Reimold nothing. I think they both can be assets as role players.

I think the O's view Reimold as more then a role player at this point. They refused several trades involving him. Unless, they are working on a bigger deal involving him for a SP. And with Adam Jones not showing he can finish an entire 162 game season without some type of injury, I don't feel comfortable trading Pie just yet. I just wonder if the O's are entertaining the idea of putting Pie in CF, and trading Jones for a starting pitcher?

[Pasadena Paul]

I guess I stated my last line wrong about Reimold as role player. I was meaning this year IF Vlad is signed. I still believe he can be productive every day player. Having that one more option hurts him for this year if O's choose to use it, but may be best thing for him in long run.

[Aloe]

Vlad is actually a good player coming off of a good season. This is not the kind of move the Orioles make. They only sign good players coming off of injuries or once great players coming off of bad seasons.

[sdmarkakis]

Vlad is actually a good player coming off of a good season. This is not the kind of move the Orioles make. They only sign good players coming off of injuries or once great players coming off of bad seasons.

Thank you for the wonderful insight. Have you checked out the Baltimore Sun's Orioles forum? You'd fit in well.

[Aloe]

Thank you for the wonderful insight. Have you checked out the Baltimore Sun's Orioles forum? You'd fit in well.

The truth hurts doesn't it?

[Lateralus]

Thank you for the wonderful insight. Have you checked out the Baltimore Sun's Orioles forum? You'd fit in well.

Boy howdy, we got ourselves a bonafide comedian.

[sdmarkakis]

The truth hurts doesn't it?

It doesn't hurt me - as a regular reader of the Sun forum I read far more inflammatory opinions every day. People like you are boring, tbh.

[baltfan]

Because Andy MacPhail isn't speaking to the press and basically has the whole wharehouse on lockdown when it comes to knowledge about roster moves... he wants NOTHING going to the press.

If I had to choose between my source and a writer... i'll take my source 1,000 times out of 1,000 times.

AM said in an interview on the MLB channel that they have interest in Vlad and indicated there had been negotiations. When asked if the reports that a deal is close were true, he said that was a newsflash to him.

[Ransom]

Vlad is actually a good player coming off of a good season. This is not the kind of move the Orioles make. They only sign good players coming off of injuries or once great players coming off of bad seasons.

Why all the hate?

AM has done a very good job this off season, and frankly I am glad he is not over paying for a 36 year old who can't play the field. The guy can hit and might be worht the risk, but it is a risk.

If we get him great, if not that is fine as well.

[nerdlinger]

I think as long as they keep Pie and Reimold in the system (with Nolan being at AAA to start), I love the idea of signing Guerrero. It makes our lineup that much better and it will help the young pitchers by (hopefully) giving them plenty of runs to work with.

I haven't seen him play recently but is Vladimir THAT bad in the OF that he couldn't start occasionally?

[OFFNY]

Why all the hate?

AM has done a very good job this off season, and frankly I am glad he is not over paying for a 36 year old who can't play the field. The guy can hit and might be worht the risk, but it is a risk.

If we get him great, if not that is fine as well.

Absolutely. We have Nick Markakis, Adam Jones, Felix Pie, and a healthy Nolan Reimold in the outfield right now. Plus, Luke Scott could even occasionally play a game or so in both the outfield and at first base when he isn't DH-ing. No reason for a mid-market team that is on the rise with a lot of good YOUNG starting pitching and plenty of outfielders to overpay for Guerrero, who is in the twilight of his career.


.

[BRob411]

A friend of mine said heard that David Ortiz guaranteed that Vlad would resign with the Rangers. I know they both are good friends and are from the Dominican Republic so Ortiz must know sense something from talking to Vlad. I'm not going to use Ortiz's guarantee as a precursor to things to come, however I just get the sense that Vlad will resign with Texas and the Rangers will move/trade someone to make room for him (Michael Young?).

[Crazysilver03]

A friend of mine said heard that David Ortiz guaranteed that Vlad would resign with the Rangers. I know they both are good friends and are from the Dominican Republic so Ortiz must know sense something from talking to Vlad. I'm not going to use Ortiz's guarantee as a precursor to things to come, however I just get the sense that Vlad will resign with Texas and the Rangers will move/trade someone to make room for him (Michael Young?).

Trading Michael Young would result in very poor P.R. for the Rangers.

From this morning (http://www.dallasnews.com/incoming/20110128-nolan-ryan-says-rangers-won_t-trade-michael-young.ece):


Rangers president Nolan Ryan says Michael Young isn’t going anywhere.

“He is going to be our DH on opening day,” Ryan said at a luncheon for the Round Rock Express on Thursday.

Besides that, Young has a limited NTC to 8 teams until May, when he gets 10-5 rights.

[Chevytrckman3]

A friend of mine said heard that David Ortiz guaranteed that Vlad would resign with the Rangers. I know they both are good friends and are from the Dominican Republic so Ortiz must know sense something from talking to Vlad. I'm not going to use Ortiz's guarantee as a precursor to things to come, however I just get the sense that Vlad will resign with Texas and the Rangers will move/trade someone to make room for him (Michael Young?).

I just do'nt see the need for Vlad in Texas. They need pitching, and at Michael Young's salary, i'd say he's un-tradeable at this point, unless they eat most of his salary. And, i think they owe Michael Young a little more respect than that. I don't take anything to heart right now. If true, that could be a friend (Ortiz) just trying to stir the pot a little for another friend (Vlad).

[Snutchy]

Baines would be a good argument, but Vlad isn't Harold Baines. Not even close. He's a significantly bigger human being (50 pounds heavier) and he's 6 years younger than 42 and slower than creeping death.

It's not a stretch to think Vlad's due for a DL stint or worse.


So let it be written
So let it be done
I'm sent here by the chosen one
So let it be written
So let it be done
To kill the first born pharaoh's son
I'm creeping death

Metallica.

[BRob411]

I just do'nt see the need for Vlad in Texas. They need pitching, and at Michael Young's salary, i'd say he's un-tradeable at this point, unless they eat most of his salary. And, i think they owe Michael Young a little more respect than that. I don't take anything to heart right now. If true, that could be a friend (Ortiz) just trying to stir the pot a little for another friend (Vlad).

You could be right about Ortiz stirring the pot and about the Rangers not trading Young. I'm just tired of all the rumors and speculation, one person says Vlad and O's are close to an agreement (Bowden) and others are saying it's nowhere near being close to being done (obviously this is more accurate at this point), enough is enough LOL. It truly has become "As the Vlady Turns" LOL.

[Chevytrckman3]

You could be right about Ortiz stirring the pot and about the Rangers not trading Young. I'm just tired of all the rumors and speculation, one person says Vlad and O's are close to an agreement (Bowden) and others are saying it's nowhere near being close to being done (obviously this is more accurate at this point), enough is enough LOL. It truly has become "As the Vlady Turns" LOL.

Yeah. I'd be a little more nervous, if we needed Vlad. It wouldn't hurt my feelings to see the O's kick the tires a little, then leave Vlad out to dry. Kind of like he did us 7 years ago. Then again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings to see him batting 5th on OD either lol.

[BRob411]

Yeah. I'd be a little more nervous, if we needed Vlad. It wouldn't hurt my feelings to see the O's kick the tires a little, then leave Vlad out to dry. Kind of like he did us 7 years ago. Then again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings to see him batting 5th on OD either lol.

At the end of the day I would still feel good about the O's if they didn't sign Vlad. I know I unfairly criticized Andy MacPhail this week (I was having a bad couple of days) but I truly believe that he has done a good job this offseason. Adding a starting pitcher (Duch, Millwood?) would offset the potential non-signing of Vlad for me. Buck Showalter being here for a full season has me really excited about the O's, so while I have greatly warmed up to the idea of Vlad being an Oriole if it doesn't happen it would be no big deal in the end.

[Snutchy]

Thank you for the wonderful insight. Have you checked out the Baltimore Sun's Orioles forum? You'd fit in well.

He is entitiled to his opinion. I don't see where he is trolling or anything stupid like that.

How often do you see big time posters around here say the same thing? I can copy and paste for you about 100 posts from just today alone.

[boog26]

Yeah. I'd be a little more nervous, if we needed Vlad. It wouldn't hurt my feelings to see the O's kick the tires a little, then leave Vlad out to dry. Kind of like he did us 7 years ago. Then again, it wouldn't hurt my feelings to see him batting 5th on OD either lol.

I really wanted to get him back then. Now, I hope we bid him down to a Garret Adkins type deal. I'm afraid that's all he he worth at this point.

[Brotha J]

The only drama in this situation is created by O's fans. After weeks of getting a tidbit here and a tidbit there, we can safely assume that the O's have made a fair offer and are unwilling to stray too much from that offer.

If Vlad wants to play everyday for 4-5mil, then he will be an Oriole. If he wants to play for a 'better team' or a more 'hispanic friendly or familiar city' then he will play elsewhere. The drama is created by those of us who realize we are a better team with Vlad.

The reason some of those in the know say nothing is imminent is because nobody but Vlad knows how close he is to signing. At this point he knows what his options are. It's up to him to decide what he wants to do. I don't believe that MacPhail or any other GM is going to have an epiphany and offer him a completely different offer from what's already on the table.

Make no mistake Vlad will make our team better. People can talk about Pie or Reimold's develpoment all they want. But they aren't really prospects anymore. We should have a good idea of their celings by now. People will get injured and they will have a good chance to prove they belong. Have faith that Buck will be able to work out the details.

I'm much more interested in Arrieta, Tillman, Matusz, BB and Britton's development!!! That's our future much more than a LFer. Vlad would help them considerably. You can look at WAR and fWAR all you want. But there's much more to it than that. It's about protection in the lineup and slotting players where they can excel.

I whole-heartedly believe Vlad is worth more than 2-3 wins for this team. He would bat cleanup and make our players, including pitchers, more effective. Our young staff will be effected much more than Pie or Reimold.

I wouldn't overpay him to the point he's untradable, but for 4-5 mil he's worth every penny. From Buck's reaction at fanfest, seems he agrees.

[JanJaap]

We have tried that line of negotiating with him ones before and it wasn’t a success, I expect him to sign with an WC team soon.

[Aloe]

Why all the hate?

AM has done a very good job this off season, and frankly I am glad he is not over paying for a 36 year old who can't play the field. The guy can hit and might be worht the risk, but it is a risk.

If we get him great, if not that is fine as well.

There is no hate on my part I'm just telling the truth as I see it.

Mark Reynolds hit for his worst average ever and he struck out over 200 times again.

JJ Hardy's power numbers have dropped considerably in the last two seasons.

Derrek Lee is 35 years old and coming off of his worst season statistically since 2006 and in that year he was hurt and only played 50 games.

Now I actually like all three moves for what they are. Cheap, low risk, high reward moves. I really like the Reynolds trade as a matter of fact.
Hopefully these moves will work out. We'll see won't we.

AM has been neither a good nor a bold GM for the Orioles, that's just a fact. His record speaks for itself. If the Orioles have over a 500 record this season it will be in large part because of the moves he's made this off season and that will be the first time I can actually say that.

[Sports Guy]

Thank you for the wonderful insight. Have you checked out the Baltimore Sun's Orioles forum? You'd fit in well.

As opposed to the wonderful insight you normally bring?

[Sports Guy]

There is no hate on my part I'm just telling the truth as I see it.

Mark Reynolds hit for his worst average ever and he struck out over 200 times again.

JJ Hardy's power numbers have dropped considerably in the last two seasons.

Derrek Lee is 35 years old and coming off of his worst season statistically since 2006 and in that year he was hurt and only played 50 games.

Now I actually like all three moves for what they are. Cheap, low risk, high reward moves. I really like the Reynolds trade as a matter of fact.
Hopefully these moves will work out. We'll see won't we.

AM has been neither a good nor a bold GM for the Orioles, that's just a fact. His record speaks for itself. If the Orioles have over a 500 record this season it will be in large part because of the moves he's made this off season and that will be the first time I can actually say that.

Well AM likes to go after bargains. Anyone who has looked at his GM history should be able to see that.

Its a method that is good and bad. Its good because you identify players that have been very good but just had an off year. Those guys are likely to bounce back but sometimes, they are just in a decline.

I remember after Konerko had a poor year(2003?), i was in favor of trading for him when it was being said that the WS wanted to get rid of his salary. Many people didn't want to do that because of that one horrendous year.

Sometimes, those risks will greatly pay off for you..sometimes they won't.

Its not a bad strategy at all..the problem with the strategy is what do you do when those players don't pan out? Some teams can just dip down into their system and call someone up. Maybe its a little earlier than they would like but at least the talent is there...the Orioles can't do that and that's the big problem.

[bandy75]

AM has been neither a good nor a bold GM for the Orioles, that's just a fact. His record speaks for itself. If the Orioles have over a 500 record this season it will be in large part because of the moves he's made this off season and that will be the first time I can actually say that.

So are you saying you would rather have this roster over the current one?

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BAL/2007.shtml

If MacPhail has done a poor job, the team must be worse off then when he took over.

[SilentJames]

Agreed, if we get him, that's cool...if we don't, thats fine as well.

Concur. Vlad would be fun to watch and would probably net us a draft pick if he plays well enough but not a big deal if we don't

[sdmarkakis]

As opposed to the wonderful insight you normally bring?

Somebody's salty today. ;)

[Sports Guy]

Somebody's salty today. ;)

Nope..just pointing out the truth.

[connja]

I think people are losing perspective when thinking about his age. Vlad hit .300 with 29 homers and 115 RBI last year!! A one year deal for him is a no brainer. The lineup could be one of the best in the AL, and if we can pitch anywhere near where we did in the second half of the year, this team can compete. They may not win a playoff spot, but having meaningful games in Aug and Sep will be critical to the franchise getting attendance and viewership where it needs to be in order to support a higher payroll in future years.

[TheBee]

Why is your say on this matter any more worthwhile than a bunch of well respected writers?

Well, this is a discussion that's been had on here many times. Obviously, Bowden appears to have been wrong about a signing being close at that time. I'm disappointed to hear this from Matthew W. because he was accurate on the signing of Lee and deserved respect for that. As someone that wants Vlad here, I will just hope that we hear something more positive from Matthew W's connection soon since I would infer they have knowledge about things that are actually close to happening - sign on the dotted line time. I say this because Matthew W broke the Lee signing right before the press, but didn't mention anything about it for the ten days prior to the signing except when he hypothesized that Lee was being used to break an impasse with LaRoche. Maybe the discussions AM admits to having are gaining momentum and we'll here something more positive about something being actually close soon.

[ThatGuy]

Heard this...

Nothing is even CLOSE...

Was given the impression that the Orioles have just thrown around the idea of Vlad, but with no offer.

Pardon me because Im relatively new here... If someone could explain why I should believe this guy over people like Heyman and Olney, it would be much appreciated.

[BRob411]

Pardon me because Im relatively new here... If someone could explain why I should believe this guy over people like Heyman and Olney, it would be much appreciated.

MatthewW did report that he heard a rumor that the Orioles and Derrek Lee came to an agreement. He broke the story the night before it was announced on the afternoon of December 31st (New Years' Eve).

[sangar]

Pardon me because Im relatively new here... If someone could explain why I should believe this guy over people like Heyman and Olney, it would be much appreciated.There appears to be legitimacy in his assertion of having access to 'inside' information, albeit from a singular event.

[Sports Guy]

There appears to be legitimacy in his assertion of having access to 'inside' information, albeit from a singular event.

Right...No offense to Matthew but you have to be right more than once.

Not saying anything about him or his source but thus far, we are talking about a one time yes.

We have had a lot of one timers on here.

[MatthewW]

Pardon me because Im relatively new here... If someone could explain why I should believe this guy over people like Heyman and Olney, it would be much appreciated.


MatthewW did report that he heard a rumor that the Orioles and Derrek Lee came to an agreement. He broke the story the night before it was announced on the afternoon of December 31st (New Years' Eve).


There appears to be legitimacy in his assertion of having access to 'inside' information, albeit from a singular event.


Right...No offense to Matthew but you have to be right more than once.

Not saying anything about him or his source but thus far, we are talking about a one time yes.

We have had a lot of one timers on here.

Fair enough... take it or leave it.

My point was that a lot of media was saying that Orioles were 'close' or that the talks were 'progessing'. Not that they weren't interested. Vlad could very well end up signing, but the way some of the news was coming out about this closeness to signing was wrong as of the other day.

There have been zero reports on this, but I did mention close to a week ago that the Orioles were receiving a lot of calls on Luke Scott all of the sudden. Now, that doesn't mean the Orioles are shopping him or are even ready to trade him. But this leads me to believe that the industry believes that the Orioles will ultimately sign Vlad.

If people want to wait for a national writer to break every single 'leak', then go for it...

I'll continue to pass a long what it is I hear... and I'll reiterate, take it or leave it.

[TheBee]

Right...No offense to Matthew but you have to be right more than once.

Not saying anything about him or his source but thus far, we are talking about a one time yes.

We have had a lot of one timers on here.

We have. His source was undoubtedly right about the agreement with Lee being reached, but Matthew W. didn't post anything about the negotiations in the ten days before the signing except to say he felt it (Lee talks) was probably a strategy to get LaRoche to lower his demands. Sounds like his source mainly gets involved at the very end of the process.? Why else would he have not given us any info during the negotiations. This time he is saying nothing is close with Vlad yet, so I take that to mean they aren't in the final stages. That doesn't mean talks haven't been progressing. I haven't seen evidence that his source is involved in the negotiations end of things.

[TheBee]

Fair enough... take it or leave it.

My point was that a lot of media was saying that Orioles were 'close' or that the talks were 'progessing'. Not that they weren't interested. Vlad could very well end up signing, but the way some of the news was coming out about this closeness to signing was wrong as of the other day.

There have been zero reports on this, but I did mention close to a week ago that the Orioles were receiving a lot of calls on Luke Scott all of the sudden. Now, that doesn't mean the Orioles are shopping him or are even ready to trade him. But this leads me to believe that the industry believes that the Orioles will ultimately sign Vlad.

If people want to wait for a national writer to break every single 'leak', then go for it...
I'll continue to pass a long what it is I hear... and I'll reiterate, take it or leave it.

I personally will take it. Thanks for passing on what you hear here. I hope you hear about a done deal soon.

[Chevytrckman3]

Fair enough... take it or leave it.

My point was that a lot of media was saying that Orioles were 'close' or that the talks were 'progessing'. Not that they weren't interested. Vlad could very well end up signing, but the way some of the news was coming out about this closeness to signing was wrong as of the other day.

There have been zero reports on this, but I did mention close to a week ago that the Orioles were receiving a lot of calls on Luke Scott all of the sudden. Now, that doesn't mean the Orioles are shopping him or are even ready to trade him. But this leads me to believe that the industry believes that the Orioles will ultimately sign Vlad.

If people want to wait for a national writer to break every single 'leak', then go for it...

I'll continue to pass a long what it is I hear... and I'll reiterate, take it or leave it.


Well, obviously it hasn't happened yet, and may or may not. But, could it be that the O's and Vlad were close, and something happened that caused it to fall apart? I'm not ragging on you. But, ive read this site for years, and if i believed everyone that had a "source", Tex would be our starting 1B, and AJ Burnett our overpaid mess of a contract. I think alot of people became weary of the "insiders" after the Tex drama.

[Sports Guy]

Fair enough... take it or leave it.

My point was that a lot of media was saying that Orioles were 'close' or that the talks were 'progessing'. Not that they weren't interested. Vlad could very well end up signing, but the way some of the news was coming out about this closeness to signing was wrong as of the other day.

There have been zero reports on this, but I did mention close to a week ago that the Orioles were receiving a lot of calls on Luke Scott all of the sudden. Now, that doesn't mean the Orioles are shopping him or are even ready to trade him. But this leads me to believe that the industry believes that the Orioles will ultimately sign Vlad.

If people want to wait for a national writer to break every single 'leak', then go for it...

I'll continue to pass a long what it is I hear... and I'll reiterate, take it or leave it.I don't want you to think I don't appreciate anything you pass along. That's not true at all.

[Frobby]

My point was that a lot of media was saying that Orioles were 'close' or that the talks were 'progessing'. Not that they weren't interested. Vlad could very well end up signing, but the way some of the news was coming out about this closeness to signing was wrong as of the other day.

The local media reports are in line with this....they say there is no sense that Vlad is in any hurry.

[sangar]

I don't want you to think I don't appreciate anything you pass along. That's not true at all.Agreed. Mathew's information appears legitimate and is appreciated. Thanks Matt. :)

[grimed1]

Fair enough... take it or leave it.

My point was that a lot of media was saying that Orioles were 'close' or that the talks were 'progessing'. Not that they weren't interested. Vlad could very well end up signing, but the way some of the news was coming out about this closeness to signing was wrong as of the other day.

There have been zero reports on this, but I did mention close to a week ago that the Orioles were receiving a lot of calls on Luke Scott all of the sudden. Now, that doesn't mean the Orioles are shopping him or are even ready to trade him. But this leads me to believe that the industry believes that the Orioles will ultimately sign Vlad.

If people want to wait for a national writer to break every single 'leak', then go for it...

I'll continue to pass a long what it is I hear... and I'll reiterate, take it or leave it.

Have you heard anything about Scott being traded for a pitcher? Does signing Duchscherer change anything? Don't you think the O's are in a good position to get Vlad,he has perhaps one other suitor? Are you hearing any pitchers we might trade for? Does the lefty minor league contract talks involve Hendrickson, Schoeneweis or Mahay?

[clapdiddy]

Have you heard anything about Scott being traded for a pitcher? Does signing Duchscherer change anything? Don't you think the O's are in a good position to get Vlad,he has perhaps one other suitor? Are you hearing any pitchers we might trade for? Does the lefty minor league contract talks involve Hendrickson, Schoeneweis or Mahay?

Are you hearing we are going after a big name pitcher? I'm assuming you are talking about another starter.

Any of those lefties would be fine with me if we're definitely looking at getting one.

[El Gordo]

Just a Vlad related update: Roy was on XM just now, doing a terrific Howard Cosell introducing our new IF. He started interviewing Bowden, and really held his feet to the fire over Bowden's Vlad tweet, and AM "ego getting in the way" remark. Bowden squirmed, but couldn't weasle his way out. Great stuff Roy!:rofl::smile11::2yay-thumb::beerchug1:

[cindyluvsbrady]

Just a Vlad related update: Roy was on XM just now, doing a terrific Howard Cosell introducing our new IF. He started interviewing Bowden, and really held his feet to the fire over Bowden's Vlad tweet, and AM "ego getting in the way" remark. Bowden squirmed, but couldn't weasle his way out. Great stuff Roy!:rofl::smile11::2yay-thumb::beerchug1:

LOL!!!:laughlol:
GO ROY!:clap3:

[Bradysburns]

Well AM likes to go after bargains. Anyone who has looked at his GM history should be able to see that.

Its a method that is good and bad. Its good because you identify players that have been very good but just had an off year. Those guys are likely to bounce back but sometimes, they are just in a decline.

I remember after Konerko had a poor year(2003?), i was in favor of trading for him when it was being said that the WS wanted to get rid of his salary. Many people didn't want to do that because of that one horrendous year.

Sometimes, those risks will greatly pay off for you..sometimes they won't.

Its not a bad strategy at all..the problem with the strategy is what do you do when those players don't pan out? Some teams can just dip down into their system and call someone up. Maybe its a little earlier than they would like but at least the talent is there...the Orioles can't do that and that's the big problem.

The problem with "value" moves in baseball is the same as it is in investing. "Value" plays have a frustrating tendency to become even deeper values after you buy them... In other words, supposedly cheap stocks often see their prices drop even further, because the flaws that were priced into them were actual flaws... In other words, the market is usually right.

The other problem is, you can wait and wait for something to skyrocket - like some Microsoft stock, or Felix Pie - and you're losing money the whole way because of something called opportunity cost. You've tied up your money, hopes, or roster spots in a position that really should be performing much better - it SHOULD be, but it's not. But you hold on, and you never cut your losses until it's way too late. (Not that I think we should cut Pie, by the way... just using this for the sake of argument.)

This is why I'm very meh on this whole bargain-obsessed approach.

[Mike Devo]

Just a Vlad related update: Roy was on XM just now, doing a terrific Howard Cosell introducing our new IF. He started interviewing Bowden, and really held his feet to the fire over Bowden's Vlad tweet, and AM "ego getting in the way" remark. Bowden squirmed, but couldn't weasle his way out. Great stuff Roy!:rofl::smile11::2yay-thumb::beerchug1:

Whether you like AM or not, it's hard to look at Bowden's "ego" comment as anything else then misplaced and rude. Thanks Roy, for keeping Bowden's ego in check.

[4TheO's]

really don't understand what Vlad is waiting around for.......appears he doesn't want to play here in Bmore I guess huh :scratchchinhmm: (like we all don't realize that right?)

[Mt. Holly]

really don't understand what Vlad is waiting around for.......appears he doesn't want to play here in Bmore I guess huh :scratchchinhmm: (like we all don't realize that right?)

I think he may want to wait until a couple of weeks into Spring Training to see if any other teams have injuries or a change of heart.

[Peace21]

Do you really think Vlad dreads the thought of having to sign here?

[ChrisAF79]

Do you really think Vlad dreads the thought of having to sign here?
I think it's pretty obvious that he really doesn't want to play here. If he did, he would be signed by this point. Simple as that.

I honestly think Vlad views playing for the Orioles as an absolute last resort.

[Hank Scorpio]

I think it's pretty obvious that he really doesn't want to play here. If he did, he would be signed by this point. Simple as that.

I honestly think Vlad views playing for the Orioles as an absolute last resort.

I hope he says that in his press conference. That'd be gold.

[ChrisAF79]

I hope he says that in his press conference. That'd be gold.
"While I can't say that I'm happy to be here in Baltimore, I'm grateful for the opportunity nonetheless. This may be a last resort, but I suppose it beats chllin' in the Dominican and doing nothing." ~Vladimir Guerrero

[cindyluvsbrady]

I hope he says that in his press conference. That'd be gold.

LOL:D
He had better run...............fast:mad:

[RVAbird]

In all seriousness, if Vlad does end up signing here for around 4-5 MM after this long holdout, it's going to be at least a little awkward for a bit.

[RZNJ]

In all seriousness, if Vlad does end up signing here for around 4-5 MM after this long holdout, it's going to be at least a little awkward for a bit.

Yeah, for about 2 minutes. Everyone will be happy and Vlad will say the right things about how he's happy to be here.

[RVAbird]

Yeah, for about 2 minutes. Everyone will be happy and Vlad will say the right things about how he's happy to be here.

Hah, yeah. I'm sure.

[TheBee]

Yeah, for about 2 minutes. Everyone will be happy and Vlad will say the right things about how he's happy to be here.

I agree with you. I can't believe anybody wants Vlad here more than I do. However, I just don't see the big deal about this. Negotiations drag all the time. I just hope it works out in the end and he signs here. Once they are Orioles I want them to give their blood sweat and tears for the organization. Until they are Orioles I understand it is business.

[BRob411]

Vlad won't be an Oriole so we can stop with all the talk, he's not coming here. It's time to throw in the towel, it's over.

[Sanfran327]

Vlad won't be an Oriole so we can stop with all the talk, he's not coming here. It's time to throw in the towel, it's over.

What do you mean by this?

[PaulFolk]

Vlad won't be an Oriole so we can stop with all the talk, he's not coming here. It's time to throw in the towel, it's over.
Enough. Please stop posting this over and over in every thread. We get it.

[BRob411]

Enough. Please stop posting this over and over in every thread. We get it.

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.

[Sanfran327]

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.

I bet you won't get that opportunity.

[RVAbird]

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.

Where is this hostile attitude coming from, exactly? Why are you so worked up?

[ChaosLex]

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.

Uh, Paul is one of the mods, so you best do what he asks.

http://thegurglingcod.typepad.com/thegurglingcod/images/2008/02/12/the_more_you_know2.jpg

[Sports Guy]

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.

Judging by the quality of your posts on this site, I have a feeling that you will not be able to say I told you so very often.

I think its 60-40 that Vlad comes here at this point.

[ChaosLex]

Where is this hostile attitude coming from, exactly? Why are you so worked up?

I think he's trying to do a reverse jinx. That said, it does get a little tiring after awhile.

[waroriole]

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.

This should be fun.

[sakata_catching]

I won't stop until you guys start to grasp reality, when he doesn't sign here I'll say my "I told you so" and move on.
When you do, make sure you add some original, clever flourishes, like spelling "MacPhail" "MacFail" and "Angelos" "Angeloser." I expect nothing less.

[BRob411]

I said Duch would sign with the Nats and now he's an Oriole, I've been saying Vlad will sign with another team, see the reverse negative/positive karma I'm stirring up. I'm doing this on purpose because I want Vlad to sign here, I'm weird that way. I'm trying not to get my hopes up so I'm thinking negatively so that something positive will happen. I know it's weird but it worked with Duch maybe it will work with Vlad.

[RVAbird]

I think he's trying to do a reverse jinx. That said, it does get a little tiring after awhile.

I know what he's doing, and every time anyone does it on this site he just comes across looking like a petulant child. It's really tiring.

[BRob411]

I think he's trying to do a reverse jinx. That said, it does get a little tiring after awhile.

Finally someone gets what I'm trying to do and I will stop doing that since someone finally figured out why I've been writing these negative posts regarding Vlad.

[BRob411]

i know what he's doing, and every time anyone does it on this site he just comes across looking like a petulant child. It's really tiring.

i will stop, everyone i will stop.

[LookinUp]

I know what he's doing, and every time anyone does it on this site he just comes across looking like a petulant child. It's really tiring.

Well, I'm bothered less by it knowing that he's just playing a game, not being a jerk.

[BRob411]

Well, I'm bothered less by it knowing that he's just playing a game, not being a jerk.

I'm not trying to be mean but I'll stop playing this game since it's annoying. I'm tired of waiting and dealing with all the rumors as I'm sure you guys feel the same way. I just wish Vlad would just sign already so that we all can celebrate.

[Dipper9]

I hope he says that in his press conference. That'd be gold.

MacPhail: ".....and so without further ado, we welcome our newest Oriole, Vlad Guerrero."

Vlad: "Thanks. Huff told me this was a horsepoop town, and there are no Latin's here. So I did everything in my power to sign somewhere else. ANYwhere else really. But in the end, I had only one deal on the table, so here I am."

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/08VIc4bdpf5u2/340x.jpg

[Peace21]

I said Duch would sign with the Nats and now he's an Oriole, I've been saying Vlad will sign with another team, see the reverse negative/positive karma I'm stirring up. I'm doing this on purpose because I want Vlad to sign here, I'm weird that way. I'm trying not to get my hopes up so I'm thinking negatively so that something positive will happen. I know it's weird but it worked with Duch maybe it will work with Vlad.

Maybe you should keep your thoughts and reverse jinx stuff to yourself. Because people don't know that you are doing that and it comes off as if you are a crybaby. And its really immature. Just stay positive and relax. Its not the end of the world if Vlad doesn't sign with the Os.

Oh and don't announce before hand,if vlad doesn't sign here that you will rub it in our faces. Especially after we knew you actually wanted them to sign.

[clapdiddy]

MacPhail: ".....and so without further ado, we welcome our newest Oriole, Vlad Guerrero."

Vlad: "Thanks. Huff told me this was a horsepoop town, and there are no Latin's here. So I did everything in my power to sign somewhere else. ANYwhere else really. But in the end, I had only one deal on the table, so here I am."

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/08VIc4bdpf5u2/340x.jpg

Only ONE problem with that statement. It's in English. :D

[BRob411]

Maybe you should keep your thoughts and reverse jinx stuff to yourself. Because people don't know that you are doing that and it comes off as if you are a crybaby. And its really immature. Just stay positive and relax. Its not the end of the world if Vlad doesn't sign with the Os.

Oh and don't announce before hand,if vlad doesn't sign here that you will rub it in our faces. Especially after we knew you actually wanted them to sign.

Fine I get it, can we move on from this?

[El Gordo]

I don't know, if you had to choose between playing for the O's and going back to the DR to fish, roast goats in your back yard, and father some more children.....:scratchchinhmm:

[Moose Milligan]

I said Duch would sign with the Nats and now he's an Oriole, I've been saying Vlad will sign with another team, see the reverse negative/positive karma I'm stirring up. I'm doing this on purpose because I want Vlad to sign here, I'm weird that way. I'm trying not to get my hopes up so I'm thinking negatively so that something positive will happen. I know it's weird but it worked with Duch maybe it will work with Vlad.

Well now you've done up and ruined it. Way to go.

[RichmondVA Orio]

Well now you've done up and ruined it. Way to go.

Vlad will not sign here. lol.

[TheBee]

My opinion. This guy has played the game the way it is meant to be played. He keeps his mouth shut, plays hard, rakes the ball, and has had a brilliant overall career. To my knowledge he has never said anything negative about the Orioles organization or the city of Baltimore. He is entitled to try to get the best deal he can. None of us know anything about the inner workings of these negotiations. Nobody is criticizing D. Lee for admitting Baltimore was not on his radar at the beginning of the offseason, and didn't he spurn (if you want to call it that) us once before as well? Now, he's a Baltimorean through and through, right? He accepted the deal here...eventually, because it ended up being his best choice. And I have no doubt he'll play with passion for us now that he is an Oriole. If we are lucky enough to sign Vlad Guerrero, it will be no different. He will play with class and represent himself and the city well.

[ChaosLex]

Despite reports last week that that free agent DH Vladimir Guerrero and the Baltimore Orioles were nearing a deal, there has been little movement toward an agreement, according to The Baltimore Sun.

An industry source told the newspaper that the two sides have had "no significant conversations" recently.

http://www.sportingnews.com/mlb/story/2011-02-01/orioles-vlad-guerrero-no-closer-to-a-deal

[clapdiddy]

Sheesh! I can't wait until pitchers and catchers report. I'm sick of this "drama"!:drek:

[paulcoates]

I am starting to hope we put a deadline on the deal with him. We need to sign him or just move on

[BRob411]

Sheesh! I can't wait until pitchers and catchers report. I'm sick of this "drama"!:drek:

I'm sick of it too, I'm tired of waiting. I'm not as excited as I was last week about Vlad coming here although that could change if he decides to come here.

[statman]

The silence is a bit eerie, isn't it? I just think there should be more chatter between a free agent and *seemingly* the only club that can offer him an everyday spot in their lineup. Is it Vlad's ego? Is it AM trying to lowball him believing that we are bidding against ourselves? If the reports were correct, then we have offered him a 1 year deal that would make him the highest paid free agent DH of the 2011 offseason...so why hasn't he accepted it yet?

Even if we don't sign him, I hope we get more insight into how these negotiations unraveled.

[NCRaven]

I am starting to hope we put a deadline on the deal with him. We need to sign him or just move on

Why cut off your nose to spite your face. How does that change or improve our position? Also, that's really not MacPhail's style. You are talking about Mr. Percolate here. :) He has consistently been more about taking as long as it takes to get it right than making the fast move that looks better to the fans.

The answer is to stop hitting the refresh button every five minutes!

[RVAbird]

The silence is a bit eerie, isn't it? I just think there should be more chatter between a free agent and *seemingly* the only club that can offer him an everyday spot in their lineup. Is it Vlad's ego? Is it AM trying to lowball him believing that we are bidding against ourselves? If the reports were correct, then we have offered him a 1 year deal that would make him the highest paid free agent DH of the 2011 offseason...so why hasn't he accepted it yet?

Even if we don't sign him, I hope we get more insight into how these negotiations unraveled.

I think it's pretty obvious. A while ago, AM told Vlad's agent we were interested on a one year deal for a very low base salary around what the other mid-30s DH's got (~2 MM). To this, Vlad's camp said "um, no thanks."

Vlad waited around for a while without any other serious offers and saw almost all of his suitors move in other directions.

AM came back and said "We're still interested if the price is right. We're still not going to match your demands, but we can make a final offer of 1 year/4.5 MM. Feel free to think it over, we are not imposing a deadline, but we won't increase the deal."

Now Vlad is waiting for a Deus Ex Machina from another organization. There's no need for him to accept the deal immediately, since BAL has not imposed a deadline, but he knows the offer's not getting raised. There's no need for the two sides to be in communication until Vlad accepts or rejects the offer.

[BRob411]

The silence is a bit eerie, isn't it? I just think there should be more chatter between a free agent and *seemingly* the only club that can offer him an everyday spot in their lineup. Is it Vlad's ego? Is it AM trying to lowball him believing that we are bidding against ourselves? If the reports were correct, then we have offered him a 1 year deal that would make him the highest paid free agent DH of the 2011 offseason...so why hasn't he accepted it yet?

Even if we don't sign him, I hope we get more insight into how these negotiations unraveled.

I think his ego is getting in the way but from his perspective he's coming off a year where he hit .300 29hrs and drove in 115 RBIs. He thinks he deserves more money but the market is not dictating that and he may be having a hard time accepting that at the moment.

[paulcoates]

Why cut off your nose to spite your face. How does that change or improve our position? Also, that's really not MacPhail's style. You are talking about Mr. Percolate here. :) He has consistently been more about taking as long as it takes to get it right than making the fast move that looks better to the fans.

The answer is to stop hitting the refresh button every five minutes!

Because I have a feeling he is shopping our offer, which means he doesn't really want to be here.

So make him decide. Besides, if Andy has a plan B, and Plan B signs elsewhere, then we could be out in the cold.

[Dipper9]

Because I have a feeling he is shopping our offer, which means he doesn't really want to be here.

So make him decide. Besides, if Andy has a plan B, and Plan B signs elsewhere, then we could be out in the cold.

Plan B is Reimold/Pie platoon with Scott at DH, and I'm sure AM let Vlad's agent know we are more than happy to break camp with that situation. If Vlad wants to play, its our deal or nothing. The ball is in his court.

[El Gordo]

He's waiting to see how close, if at all LAAA, will come to the O's offer. They are the only other possible option, IMO, and then only as a part time DH. But I bet if they offer $3MM or so, he'd take it rather than play here.

[EtotheKallday17]

A lot of people are saying Vlad doesn't want to play here. I don't think its the fact that he doesn't want to play here, its just that he's waiting for offers from other teams that he would rather play for. So yes, while there are other teams that he would probably rather play for, I don't think he doesn't want to play here.

[El Gordo]

A lot of people are saying Vlad doesn't want to play here. I don't think its the fact that he doesn't want to play here, its just that he's waiting for offers from other teams that he would rather play for. So yes, while there are other teams that he would probably rather play for, I don't think he doesn't want to play here.He isn't going to get any offers that are more than the$ 3-5 MM we have made. So if he goes elsewhere, it will be for less money and less playing time. That tells me he really doedsn't want to play here.

[EtotheKallday17]

He isn't going to get any offers that are more than the$ 3-5 MM we have made. So if he goes elsewhere, it will be for less money and less playing time. That tells me he really doedsn't want to play here.

Or that he would rather play somewhere else. Baltimore still may be high on his list, but he wants his first choice to come through. I know it seems unlikely because he hasn't signed here yet, but its possible.

[El Gordo]

Or that he would rather play somewhere else. Baltimore still may be high on his list, but he wants his first choice to come through. I know it seems unlikely because he hasn't signed here yet, but its possible. High on his list? What are you smoking? What list? There are no teams that have a place for him. At one time he could have signed with Texas or LAAA but he was asking too much and they have moved on. The question is does he want to play at all or play here. The fact that he has to think about it ought to tell you something.

[EtotheKallday17]

High on his list? What are you smoking? What list? There are no teams that have a place for him. At one time he could have signed with Texas or LAAA but he was asking too much and they have moved on. The question is does he want to play at all or play here. The fact that he has to think about it ought to tell you something.

Not the list of teams that want him. The list of teams he would like to play for. Which is not very long, but I'm sure the Orioles are still on there because it beats Japan or retirement.

[El Gordo]

Not the list of teams that want him. The list of teams he would like to play for. Which is not very long, but I'm sure the Orioles are still on there because it beats Japan or retirement.Vlads "list" at the beginning of the winter were contending teams with Latin friendly clubhouses and communities. Baltimore was and is not on that list. Vlad is a guy who is set in his ways and doesn't like change. He is very attached to his mother and has her live with him during home stands. If she does not feel comfortable living in Baltimore that's a big deal for him. He could very well retire.

[BRob411]

Vlads "list" at the beginning of the winter were contending teams with Latin friendly clubhouses and communities. Baltimore was and is not on that list. Vlad is a guy who is set in his ways and soesn't like change. He is very attached to his mother and has her live with him during home stands. If she does not feel comfortable living in Baltimore that's a big deal for him. He could very well retire.

I could actually see him retire and it wouldn't shock me. As much as I would like him here I'm starting to sense that he doesn't feel good about coming here. I'm ready to focus on the idea of Nolan Reimold becoming the player most of us believe he can be and accepting that Vlad may not be an Oriole.

[crawjo]

He would be silly to retire, because he really has more to offer the sport. If worse comes to worse, just take the Orioles offer, get the ABs for one year, work hard to put up good numbers, and then lower your demands for the next offseason and see if you can get a gig with a more "Latin friendly" club. We're just talking about being an Orioles player for six months here. It's not like he's being asked to move his family to Kabul Afghanistan for the next three years.

[Arthur_Bryant]

I think it's pretty obvious. A while ago, AM told Vlad's agent we were interested on a one year deal for a very low base salary around what the other mid-30s DH's got (~2 MM). To this, Vlad's camp said "um, no thanks."

Vlad waited around for a while without any other serious offers and saw almost all of his suitors move in other directions.

AM came back and said "We're still interested if the price is right. We're still not going to match your demands, but we can make a final offer of 1 year/4.5 MM. Feel free to think it over, we are not imposing a deadline, but we won't increase the deal."

Now Vlad is waiting for a Deus Ex Machina from another organization. There's no need for him to accept the deal immediately, since BAL has not imposed a deadline, but he knows the offer's not getting raised. There's no need for the two sides to be in communication until Vlad accepts or rejects the offer.

I think this nails it exactly. There is far more urgency on OH than the actual situation merits. I doubt that either AM or Vlad and his agent are sitting around hitting F5 while going slowly crazy with impatience.

[El Gordo]

He would be silly to retire, because he really has more to offer the sport. If worse comes to worse, just take the Orioles offer, get the ABs for one year, work hard to put up good numbers, and then lower your demands for the next offseason and see if you can get a gig with a more "Latin friendly" club. We're just talking about being an Orioles player for six months here. It's not like he's being asked to move his family to Kabul Afghanistan for the next three years.The guy can't play the game the way he could when he was in his prime. He was once a 5 tool guy and now he is just a bat. And the bat isn't as good as it used to be. He doesn't need more money. How much fun is it for him any more? If it's still fun, it comes, IMO, from the competition, the chance at a ring, his mom's home cooking, and the clubhouse commaraderie. How much of that does he get in Baltimore?

[El Gordo]

I think this nails it exactly. There is far more urgency on OH than the actual situation merits. I doubt that either AM or Vlad and his agent are sitting around hitting F5 while going slowly crazy with impatience.Yep. There is still an outside chance Texas will trade Young, and LAA might make an offer close to the O's $4.5MM. Why not wait until the very last minute.

[crawjo]

The guy can't play the game the way he could when he was in his prime. He was once a 5 tool guy and now he is just a bat. And the bat isn't as good as it used to be. He doesn't need more money. How much fun is it for him any more? If it's still fun, it comes, IMO, from the competition, the chance at a ring, his mom's home cooking, and the clubhouse commaraderie. How much of that does he get in Baltimore?

Right, my point is you take a less than ideal contract to keep yourself in the game for one year, then try to sign with a contender next offseason. He turns 36 years old next week. If he plays out the string as a DH, maybe he wins a title, maybe he gets to 500 home runs, maybe he gets to 3000 hits. If he had no plans on retiring coming into this offseason, it would be stupid to retire just because he would have to play with Baltimore for one season. By all reports he was looking for a 2-year deal at the start of the offseason, so I don't think he should let his limited options in Jan. 2011 determine that he doesn't need to play baseball anymore. As others have pointed out, it's not like Latinos are unheard of in Baltimore. I'm sure his Mom can do just fine in the city for a few months. He has the money to make himself as comfortable as he needs to be.

[El Gordo]

Right, my point is you take a less than ideal contract to keep yourself in the game for one year, then try to sign with a contender next offseason. He turns 36 years old next week. If he plays out the string as a DH, maybe he wins a title, maybe he gets to 500 home runs, maybe he gets to 3000 hits. If he had no plans on retiring coming into this offseason, it would be stupid to retire just because he would have to play with Baltimore for one season. By all reports he was looking for a 2-year deal at the start of the offseason, so I don't think he should let his limited options in Jan. 2011 determine that he doesn't need to play baseball anymore. As others have pointed out, it's not like Latinos are unheard of in Baltimore. I'm sure his Mom can do just fine in the city for a few months. He has the money to make himself as comfortable as he needs to be.

Yes, but the fact that he expected to get 2/16 from Texas, and he is being offered 1/4? from Baltimore, is a big dose of reality for a proud guy to have to face. I bet he's asking himself how much is it really worth to keep playing.

[Birds08]

Can someone provide the link?

[Chevytrckman3]

Have fun eating moms cooking during the season Vlad. You want to play in a city with a latin influence? You want a team with a latin influenced clubhouse? Well, good luck. Those teams that can provide that don't want you, and now you may be down to Toronto or retirement. Atleast if you retire, you can go back to the DR full time. If i'm the Orioles, i'd wait it out and if he comes running back to AM, i'd say the best we can do now is a minor league deal with an invite to ST.

[palmer22]

No Detroit for Vlad, according to MLB Trade Rumors...

[Chevytrckman3]

No Detroit for Vlad, according to MLB Trade Rumors...

I never saw them as a possibilty, since they basically have a Vlad in Magglio Ordonez already. His options really aren't that great, unless he wants to go to a NL team and just be a PH off the bench. And he isn't getting 5 mil a year to do that. This whole situation is aggrivating me. At this point, if i'm AM, i publicly pull the offer, and tell Vlad to take a hike and good luck getting much of aq deal now. We don't need him bad enough to allow him to hold out this long and shop our offer.

[NCRaven]

Vlads "list" at the beginning of the winter were contending teams with Latin friendly clubhouses and communities. Baltimore was and is not on that list.

How can you say that we're not a "Latin friendly clubhouse?" Didn't we re-sign Izturis to be our Hispanic outreach coach-on-the-field? That is actually the best and probably only reason that I could think of for bringing him back.:)

[BRob411]

No Detroit for Vlad, according to MLB Trade Rumors...

I know Sports Illustrated baseball insider Joe Sheehan said Detroit was a possibility and would be a good fit last week. I think he was just throwing that out there though. Vlad needs to accept the Orioles deal now.

[BRob411]

http://www.detnews.com/article/20110201/SPORTS0104/102010430/Tigers--Dombrowski--We-won-t-sign-Bonderman--Guerrero-not-a-good-fit

[crawjo]

Yes, but the fact that he expected to get 2/16 from Texas, and he is being offered 1/4? from Baltimore, is a big dose of reality for a proud guy to have to face. I bet he's asking himself how much is it really worth to keep playing.

He may very well be asking himself that question, as you say. My point is that it would be foolish for him to retire for this reason. Retire because you don't feel you have anything more to give to the game, or because you need more time with your family, or whatever. But don't retire just because one offseason doesn't produce the lucrative multi-year deal you were hoping for. Give it another shot in 2011 and then try to find a better situation for yourself after that. You only get one chance at having a full Major League career and I just think it would be silly to retire in a huff because of one bad offseason, especially coming off a year when you hit .300 with 29 homers. If there's more left in the tank, let it come out.

[Frobby]

Yes, but the fact that he expected to get 2/16 from Texas, and he is being offered 1/4? from Baltimore, is a big dose of reality for a proud guy to have to face. I bet he's asking himself how much is it really worth to keep playing.

Oh, Vlad will play, I'm sure. It's just a matter of whether he accepts $4.5 mm to go to a city/team where he really prefers not to play, or whether he takes $2 mm or so to go somewhere he finds more desireable. He's made $118 mm playing baseball, so he certainly can afford to take $2-3 mm less to go to a place he prefers.

If he comes to Baltimore, I think what will drive him here is the opportunity to get 500+ at bats, not the money.

[El Gordo]

Oh, Vlad will play, I'm sure. It's just a matter of whether he accepts $4.5 mm to go to a city/team where he really prefers not to play, or whether he takes $2 mm or so to go somewhere he finds more desireable. He's made $118 mm playing baseball, so he certainly can afford to take $2-3 mm less to go to a place he prefers.

If he comes to Baltimore, I think what will drive him here is the opportunity to get 500+ at bats, not the money.I agree with this in that it is not the money. But if he had received an $2MM offer from Texas or LAAA to be a bench guy, I think he would have taken it by now. I think he is still waiting for that, and if he doesn't get it, I wouldn't be surprised if he retired.

[El Gordo]

He may very well be asking himself that question, as you say. My point is that it would be foolish for him to retire for this reason. Retire because you don't feel you have anything more to give to the game, or because you need more time with your family, or whatever. But don't retire just because one offseason doesn't produce the lucrative multi-year deal you were hoping for. Give it another shot in 2011 and then try to find a better situation for yourself after that. You only get one chance at having a full Major League career and I just think it would be silly to retire in a huff because of one bad offseason, especially coming off a year when you hit .300 with 29 homers. If there's more left in the tank, let it come out.You're not looking at it from his perspective.

[ThatGuy]

So its looking like Vlad's Only options are either signing here, or Jermaine Dye-ing himself? Or am I missing something

[tntoriole]

If I were AM, I would goose the offer by a million or so...let's say if its 4.5 now... then 5.5 with a production bonus that might take it to 6....but the proviso would be that Vlad had 24 hours to take it or leave it and then we move on...

That way it might enable closure of the situation and, if he does come to Baltimore, that he saves some face, gets some positive karma going on...

[bluedog]

Oh, Vlad will play, I'm sure. It's just a matter of whether he accepts $4.5 mm to go to a city/team where he really prefers not to play, or whether he takes $2 mm or so to go somewhere he finds more desireable. He's made $118 mm playing baseball, so he certainly can afford to take $2-3 mm less to go to a place he prefers.

If he comes to Baltimore, I think what will drive him here is the opportunity to get 500+ at bats, not the money.

I completely agree.

Free agent contracts almost always come down to Rings, Swings or Cha-Chings! and in Vlad's case I think playing everyday is what's most important to him.

That's not to say the man doesn't want to get paid or have another shot at a World Series - but the fact the O's have any shot at him at all would seem to suggest no one's come close to topping their offer of a full time spot and 4 to 5 million per year. We know a lot of teams can match those dollar figures, which would indicate the sticking point is Swings.

[El Gordo]

If I were AM, I would goose the offer by a million or so...let's say if its 4.5 now... then 5.5 with a production bonus that might take it to 6....but the proviso would be that Vlad had 24 hours to take it or leave it and then we move on...

That way it might enable closure of the situation and, if he does come to Baltimore, that he saves some face, gets some positive karma going on...If I were AM I would wine and dine Vlad's mom at Tio Pepe's. The owners Spanish, but most of the other employees are from El Cibao in the DR.:laughlol:

[tntoriole]

If I were AM I would wine and dine Vlad's mom at Tio Pepe's. The owners Spanish, but most of the other employees are from El Cibao in the DR.:laughlol:

Absolutely....have not been to Tio Pepe's in many years since leaving Baltimore...but it was a classic and THAT would do the trick!!

[crawjo]

You're not looking at it from his perspective.

No, I'm not, and neither is anyone else in this thread. We have no idea what his perspective is on this at all. What I'm saying is that retiring because no one other than Baltimore was interested in your services for 2011 would be short-sighted and stupid. That's my opinion.

[duffaphonic]

Vlad, if Charlie Manuel can learn Japanese Buck could learn Spanish. Ven a Bal'more, hombre.