Nats sign Detwiler, implications for Weiters? [Archive]

RVAbird

07-05-2007, 06:44 PM

The Nats signed their 1st round, #6 overall pick Ross Detwiler today. I'm still trying to figure out the details of the deal. Should this speed up the process for Weiters who was the #5 pick? If anyone knows what his deal was like relative to his slot, please chime in.

http://washington.nationals.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070705&content_id=2068621&vkey=news_was&fext=.jsp&c_id=was

RVAbird

07-05-2007, 06:51 PM

Update: The terms are currently undisclosed.

No doubt Detwiler was a much easier sign than Weiters, but I'm still surprised the 6th overall pick got signed so quickly. Hopefully he signed for below slot money, but I doubt it.

It'd be nice if the Orioles could get Weiters signed in July and get him in some baseball action asap, but I have a feeling it's going to come down to the wire no matter what.

geschinger

07-05-2007, 07:18 PM

Signing bonus was $2.15 million according to the Nationals Journal (http://blog.washingtonpost.com/nationalsjournal/)entry from today.

ChrisP

07-05-2007, 08:16 PM

I bet Matt gets at least double that.

RayFink1e

07-05-2007, 08:35 PM

he will get triple that

geschinger

07-05-2007, 08:51 PM

he will get triple that

Only if the Orioles panic and overpay. If the Orioles handle things the right way he should get a signing bonus in the 4.5m range on the high end.

Chollie Eckman

07-05-2007, 08:56 PM

Paying Detweiler is like flushing money down the toilet.

geschinger

07-05-2007, 08:58 PM

Paying Detweiler is like flushing money down the toilet.

He is one of the safer choices. Getting him at 2.15m will be money well spent for the Nats.

Sports Guy

07-05-2007, 09:01 PM

#4 pick has also signed i think.

Chollie Eckman

07-05-2007, 09:13 PM

He is one of the safer choices. Getting him at 2.15m will be money well spent for the Nats.

Let's revisit this thread in 5 years.

geschinger

07-05-2007, 09:16 PM

Let's revisit this thread in 5 years.

We won't need to wait that long. Detwiler will be contributing for the Nats years before that. He may not end up being the best possible choice the Nats could have made but it certainly won't be money flushed down the toilet.

geschinger

07-05-2007, 09:18 PM

#4 pick has also signed i think.

Are you thinking of LaPorta (#7 overall)? I don't think Moskos has signed yet.

Chollie Eckman

07-05-2007, 09:23 PM

We won't need to wait that long. Detwiler will be contributing for the Nats years before that. He may not end up being the best possible choice the Nats could have made but it certainly won't be money flushed down the toilet.
I have some contempt for his exalted status that most seem to have bought into. WE shall soon see.

RVAbird

07-05-2007, 10:14 PM

I have some contempt for his exalted status that most seem to have bought into. WE shall soon see.

I was one of the members arguing against the O's picking Detwiler, but I have to say that I think he was underrated if anything. He's a polished pitcher, likely to progress quickly. He can be a solid #3 and a 2.15 mil signing bonus is a pretty good deal for the nats, who need to boost their farm system.

I simply think Weiters was a better choice for the O's, being the best all around positional prospect in the draft. 2.15 for Detwiler was actually less than I expected, and if the O's can snag Weiters for around 5 mil I think it will be a good deal.

Chollie Eckman

07-05-2007, 10:58 PM

I was one of the members arguing against the O's picking Detwiler, but I have to say that I think he was underrated if anything. He's a polished pitcher, likely to progress quickly. He can be a solid #3 and a 2.15 mil signing bonus is a pretty good deal for the nats, who need to boost their farm system.

I simply think Weiters was a better choice for the O's, being the best all around positional prospect in the draft. 2.15 for Detwiler was actually less than I expected, and if the O's can snag Weiters for around 5 mil I think it will be a good deal.
We'll see. Check back in August.

RVAbird

07-05-2007, 11:04 PM

We'll see. Check back in August.

That's cool. Not trying to challenge you or anything, just saying I think it's a pretty low-risk signing.

Chollie Eckman

07-05-2007, 11:10 PM

That's cool. Not trying to challenge you or anything, just saying I think it's a pretty low-risk signing.
Let's face it. They had to sign him or risk losing him. I think he WAAAy overrated. We'll see.

markpolis

07-06-2007, 01:11 AM

Let's face it. They had to sign him or risk losing him. I think he WAAAy overrated. We'll see.

What are you basing this on? A hunch? Educated guess? Knowledge?

Have you seen him pitch? Do you know something most scouts don't know about Detwiler? Who do you think the Nat's should have taken at #6 overall that would have been a much better pick?

RVAbird

07-06-2007, 05:40 AM

Are you thinking of LaPorta (#7 overall)? I don't think Moskos has signed yet.

LaPorta indeed signed:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/baseball/mlb/wires/06/25/2010.ap.bbn.brewers.laporta.0128/

For about 2 mil, which is in line with Detwiler's slot.

Moskos is still unsigned.

I'm starting to think that Weiters shouldn't require any more than 5 mil.

Chollie Eckman

07-06-2007, 09:14 AM

What are you basing this on? A hunch? Educated guess? Knowledge?

Have you seen him pitch? Do you know something most scouts don't know about Detwiler? Who do you think the Nat's should have taken at #6 overall that would have been a much better pick?
6'-4" 175. A build only you could love. Who did he beat this year Mark that has any significance in your eyes? Didn't we have this debate about a month ago?

geschinger

07-06-2007, 09:14 AM

LaPorta indeed signed:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/baseball/mlb/wires/06/25/2010.ap.bbn.brewers.laporta.0128/

For about 2 mil, which is in line with Detwiler's slot.

Moskos is still unsigned.

I'm starting to think that Weiters shouldn't require any more than 5 mil.

If we're willing to wait until the deadline he can be had for <= 5 mil. If push comes to shove I think even Boras would concede that a 5m package and getting his career started means more money in the long run compared to waiting another year and repeating the draft process.

TGO

07-06-2007, 09:22 AM

6'-4" 175. A build only you could love. Who did he beat this year Mark that has any significance in your eyes? Didn't we have this debate about a month ago?

If you don't think he'll pan out, fine, just be glad we didn't take him and leave the guy alone. There's no reason to disparage him.

rolliefingers

07-06-2007, 09:33 AM

6'-4" 175. A build only you could love. Who did he beat this year Mark that has any significance in your eyes? Didn't we have this debate about a month ago?Right, because no skinny pitchers have ever succeeded in the Majors, and every man is as built as he's going to be at age 21.

You still haven't answered the question, which is: Are you saying this out of actual knowledge, or are you pulling it directly out of your ass?

I don't have an opinion on Detwiler one way or another, but if you're going to have an opinion, make sure it's based on more than what your local tarot card reader told you at 3 am while drunk and stoned.

That said, Weiters should sign for around $4.5 mil. Just get it done, for Godsakes! When you pay $4.5 mil/yr for a stiff like Jay Payton, why wouldn't you pay the same for a guy who has a great chance to be the next Varitek?

geschinger

07-06-2007, 09:37 AM

That said, Weiters should sign for around $4.5 mil. Just get it done, for Godsakes! When you pay $4.5 mil/yr for a stiff like Jay Payton, why wouldn't you pay the same for a guy who has a great chance to be the next Varitek?

I think w/Boras you can't just get it done. You have to push things until the last minute as right now he's probably demanding double that.

rolliefingers

07-06-2007, 09:43 AM

I think w/Boras you can't just get it done. You have to push things until the last minute as right now he's probably demanding double that.

Very true. I just hope the O's know that they'll have to go way over slot to get this done (I can't imagine they would have drafted him otherwise). And he's worth it.

orioole28

07-06-2007, 10:20 AM

Right, because no skinny pitchers have ever succeeded in the Majors, and every man is as built as he's going to be at age 21.

You still haven't answered the question, which is: Are you saying this out of actual knowledge, or are you pulling it directly out of your ass?

I don't have an opinion on Detwiler one way or another, but if you're going to have an opinion, make sure it's based on more than what your local tarot card reader told you at 3 am while drunk and stoned.

That said, Weiters should sign for around $4.5 mil. Just get it done, for Godsakes! When you pay $4.5 mil/yr for a stiff like Jay Payton, why wouldn't you pay the same for a guy who has a great chance to be the next Varitek?

Hey you're hurtin' my feelings, I'm his local tarot card reader and I'm damn good!!!:D :mad: :D

markpolis

07-06-2007, 11:54 AM

Hey you're hurtin' my feelings, I'm his local tarot card reader and I'm damn good!!!:D :mad: :D

So, you are the one who gave Chollie this brilliant inside information?! ;)

Hey, Detwiler was arguably the second best college pitcher available (behind the #1 overall pick David Price) and ranked the #2 pitcher on most teams draft boards. The Nats were looking for pitching in the draft and many teams shy away from high school pitchers. Detwiler was dominant in the Cape Cod League and for Team USA last summer, which usually is a very good indication of well a player will perform at the next level.

Yes, his numbers were down a bit in college this year, but he played for a weak Missouri State team that blew a lot of his games this year. (maybe you don't think Eric Bedard is any good either?)

I'm very glad the Orioles passed him over and selected Wieters, but he was a very reasonable selection for the Nationals to take at #6. He very well may end up being a bust, as we all know the baseball draft is a very inexact science. But to say he was a bad pick for the Nationals is simply wrong.

markpolis

07-06-2007, 12:01 PM

Chollie Eckman

07-06-2007, 12:06 PM

You still haven't answered the question, which is: Are you saying this out of actual knowledge, or are you pulling it directly out of your ass?

I don't have an opinion on Detwiler one way or another, but if you're going to have an opinion, make sure it's based on more than what your local tarot card reader told you at 3 am while drunk and stoned.

What are you? The "Official Hangout Message Board" police? I'm still trying to figure out why you even piped in? You've never had an original thought in your life. If you did your head would probably explode because your not programmed thay way. Your shallow opinions are what you've heard or read from other people.

Leave the debates to people that can spar without insults.

In the meantime....go shave your back or something.

Chollie Eckman

07-06-2007, 12:11 PM

So, you are the one who gave Chollie this brilliant inside information?! ;)

Hey, Detwiler was arguably the second best college pitcher available (behind the #1 overall pick David Price) and ranked the #2 pitcher on most teams draft boards. The Nats were looking for pitching in the draft and many teams shy away from high school pitchers. Detwiler was dominant in the Cape Cod League and for Team USA last summer, which usually is a very good indication of well a player will perform at the next level.

Yes, his numbers were down a bit in college this year, but he played for a weak Missouri State team that blew a lot of his games this year. (maybe you don't think Eric Bedard is any good either?)

I'm very glad the Orioles passed him over and selected Wieters, but he was a very reasonable selection for the Nationals to take at #6. He very well may end up being a bust, as we all know the baseball draft is a very inexact science. But to say he was a bad pick for the Nationals is simply wrong.
Porcello will probably wind up being better. OK Mark, when he's struggling to throw strikes in A ball you'll probably blame his overwork at Missouri State? That MVC power. Let's hope his ligaments hold up.

markpolis

07-06-2007, 01:04 PM

Porcello will probably wind up being better. OK Mark, when he's struggling to throw strikes in A ball you'll probably blame his overwork at Missouri State? That MVC power. Let's hope his ligaments hold up.

You seem to be basing your flawed argument on the inferior competition Detwiler faced in college. Last time I checked, MVC teams Wichita State and Creighton were pretty good baseball programs. Last year Missouri State played against University of Minnesota, Kansas, Missouri, Arkansas, Bradley as well Creighton and Wichita State. All pretty good baseball programs.

Also, Detwiler pitched for the world champion Team USA team in the summer of 2006, recording a 2-0 record and 0.95 ERA. His last five starts from 2006, six appearances with Team USA and two starts for the Falmouth Commodores of the Cape Cod league, Detwiler has put together a 7-1 record and 1.01 ERA with 80 strikeouts in 71 innings of work over his last 13 competitive appearances.

Would you prefer Detwiler compile great statistics against high school teams such as "Our Lady of the Poor who can't afford bats" and "The Fellows who are Blind"? I'm sure Rich Porcello had more games against those types of teams rather than Wichita State and Creighton baseball programs.

rolliefingers

07-06-2007, 01:35 PM

Leave the debates to people that can spar without insults.

6'-4" 175. A build only you could love. Who did he beat this year Mark that has any significance in your eyes? Didn't we have this debate about a month ago?

Excuse me? All you DO is insult people. You still have nothing to back up your opinion. As long as you make inane, derogatory posts without any facts behind them, I will continue to call you out. Come with facts or shut the hell up.

And as I said, I have nothing to contribute to this thread re: Detwiler. But at least I have the intelligence not to pretend that I do.

rolliefingers

07-06-2007, 01:37 PM

I'm still trying to figure out why you even piped in?

Because you're an idiot. How's that Dice-K racial insult thread coming along?

Idiot.

RayFink1e

07-06-2007, 01:38 PM

He get close to what Price gets, IMO

geschinger

07-06-2007, 04:13 PM

From today's Sun:

"Scouting director Joe Jordan said that the club has started talks with first-round draft pick Matt Wieters, but nothing is expected to be finished for several weeks."

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-sp.osnotes06jul06,0,786719.story?coll=bal-sports-baseball

I actually think Wieters will get closer to $5.5-$6mil. I also think the Orioles were very aware of his asking price prior to the draft and are committed to getting this deal done. It will get done, but with Boras involved it's going to take some time.

It'll be interesting. I could see 5.5-6m if it is a major league contract but if the Orioles handle things correctly a straight singing bonus should not crack $5m. There is no reason to even contemplate going higher than around 4.5m.