Enough of this Bart Scott dropping back in coverage stuff

[Sports Guy]

He needs to be rushing the passer.....This team has got to generate a pass rush and he is a big part of that.

I know he has to drop back some and that is fine but this team isn't being creative enough on defense right now...Some blame has to come down on Ryan.

[Camden_yardbird]

Actually if you look at it Ryan is just trying to do what he did last year with AD. Last year AD would drop in coverage and Scott would rush the passer. This year since Johnson isn't great in coverage they are dropping Scott in coverage and rushing Johnson. Johnson acutally looked good last night and is on pace for 5 or so sacks. Unfortunately that is drop off from Scotts 9.5 last year, but because Johnson is not as skilled in coverage it has to happen until they can get a OLB who can cover better.

I agree I would rather see Scott rushing because that is what he is better at. But with this personel I don't know if that is possible.

[Miller192]

He needs to be rushing the passer.....This team has got to generate a pass rush and he is a big part of that.

I know he has to drop back some and that is fine but this team isn't being creative enough on defense right now...Some blame has to come down on Ryan.

I think this is more injury related than anything else. With Pryce injured that really hurt our pass rush. Not to mention leaving guys like Pittman, Ivy and Martin on man coverage. We saw how effective that was last night.

[biggsy]

At this point I think its time for Ryan to just start selling out. The offense is so bad that if McGahee doesn't break one were not getting a TD. So screw it, let the defense force it. Start sending 6,7 or even 8 every down, if the other team happens to get a big play, so be it. Were 4-4 and don't look like were a 9-7 or even an 8-8 team at this point so you might as well try something different and try to force the opposing offenses to make mistakes so the defense can put the offense in FG range or even score for the offense.

[Camden_yardbird]

Can't send 6,7 if your starting CB's are out.

[biggsy]

Can't send 6,7 if your starting CB's are out.


Yeah you can. Obviously dropping everyone in coverage didn't help them any. If anything rushing 6 or 7 or even 8 guys will at least cause the QB to throw short passes and doesn't allow WR's such as Holmes to take advantage of they're speed and just flat out burn our back-up CBs 40 yards downfield.

[BaltimoreTerp]

Yeah you can. Obviously dropping everyone in coverage didn't help them any. If anything rushing 6 or 7 or even 8 guys will at least cause the QB to throw short passes and doesn't allow WR's such as Holmes to take advantage of they're speed and just flat out burn our back-up CBs 40 yards downfield.

Right.

Even the best receivers won't be able to shake the worst corners in that little bit of time (unless I'm that corner).

That's what we should have started to do after the third TD or so. Bring all linebackers, or two and Reed, on every play.

[Camden_yardbird]

I think your wrong. You send 7 players then you only have 2CB's and 2S back. That means the middle of the field is wide open. A good TE gets that and goes for huge yards. If you pinch the safeties then they throw fade routes and go to the house. If you play your safeties out then they run slants and go for the house. Good teams can do that on you.

Blitzing even 7 does not mean someone is absolutely getting to the QB. Good lines can pick up 7 guys. A good line + a TE + a RB pick up a 7 man blitz man on man.

Most of the rest of the teams we play can do this on you too:

Anderson to Edwards
Phillips to Gates
Manning to Harrison
Brady to Welker/Moss/ or (my pick) Stallworth (one man can not take this guy down)

I think the best thing for the Ravens to do is rely on Pryce, Suggs, Ngata, Buddy Lee + a disguised blitz to get to the QB.

[biggsy]

I think your wrong. You send 7 players then you only have 2CB's and 2S back. That means the middle of the field is wide open. A good TE gets that and goes for huge yards. If you pinch the safeties then they throw fade routes and go to the house. If you play your safeties out then they run slants and go for the house. Good teams can do that on you..

In theory that sounds like the perfect gameplan for the offense against a rush like that. But if you bring 7 they can't just block with they're O-line, they HAVE to keep a TE or RB or in the case of a 7 man blitz both to help or someones getting through clean. And even if that QB gets the ball off he's taking a shot from a defensive player. If a team is constantly bringing that kind of pressure the offense will be forced to keep people in to help with the blitz therefore taking options away from the QB. Then, at that point, you bring your saftey's up, and take away as much of the short stuff across the middle as you can, then press the WRs to keep them from getting a clean release on those slants and messing the timing of them up. It's an easy gameplan, will you get beat from time to time, sure but with the kind of defense I saw against the Steelers thats going to happen either way so you might as well take your shots at they're QB and try to get into his head that way.





Blitzing even 7 does not mean someone is absolutely getting to the QB. Good lines can pick up 7 guys. A good line + a TE + a RB pick up a 7 man blitz man on man. ..

And you know what, I'll take my chances with a one on one match-up with, Suggs, Ray, Scott, Pryce, Gregg, Ngata, and Johnson. Especially if two of those match-ups are Suggs, Ray, Scott or Pryce one on one with a RB or TE. They win that one on one 80% of the time if not 90% of the time. Plus, as I said, keeping a RB and a TE in to block takes away passing Options for the QB, you press the two outside WR's and mess they're timing up then your in good shape.



Most of the rest of the teams we play can do this on you too:

Anderson to Edwards
Phillips to Gates
Manning to Harrison
Brady to Welker/Moss/ or (my pick) Stallworth (one man can not take this guy down)..

If there is one knock on Anderson it is his play under pressure and his accuracy on short passes. If anything a constant blitz is the perfect strategy against the Browns. It keeps Edwards from getting deep and keeps Winslow in blocking instead of out running by Landry. Rivers could hurt us but he is also prone to making mistakes under pressure. Manning and Brady are the only ones that could kill us with that strategy. Brady not so much, the Colts last week have shown that if you hit Brady a couple times and get into his head by putting constant pressure on him he'll make a couple mistakes. Manning however is probably the only QB in this league I would change this strategy against. You blitz Manning your asking for him to pick you apart 5-10yards at time.



I think the best thing for the Ravens to do is rely on Pryce, Suggs, Ngata, Buddy Lee + a disguised blitz to get to the QB.


Thats what they've been doing and it hasn't worked. Granted they haven't had Pryce but Ngata and Gregg are not top line pass rushers. Both are great against the run but Suggs and Pryce getting around the outside does nothing if theres no push up the middle. Plus that gives the QB that options of the RB out in the flat and the TE up the middle and exposes our CBs deep.

[Camden_yardbird]

After getting beaten up in the past two weeks in the pass I think the D has shown it can't all out blitz.

They have also shown that only 6 in the box can handle even the best running games. There is no way this team should blitz more than 1 maybe 2 guys a down.

If blitzing like you are saying is as effective as you say then why isn't every team doing it. I think your argument is beginning to swallow itself. Empirical example owns your logic.


And you know what, I'll take my chances with a one on one match-up with, Suggs, Ray, Scott, Pryce, Gregg, Ngata, and Johnson. Especially if two of those match-ups are Suggs, Ray, Scott or Pryce one on one with a RB or TE. They win that one on one 80% of the time if not 90% of the time. Plus, as I said, keeping a RB and a TE in to block takes away passing Options for the QB, you press the two outside WR's and mess they're timing up then your in good shape.


Being picked up and winning are two different things. If a guy is picked up then it adds 2-3 seconds to the time it takes to get to the QB. These are world class runners at WR in 2-3 seconds they are 15-25 yards down field. Add in hangtime and a guy can be 40-50 yards down field and past our slow or injured CB's. Case in point Chris Henry...

The fact is the Ravens don't have the personel right now to do this. No team can be effective on D with their starting CB's out, especially not in an all out blitz.

[biggsy]

After getting beaten up in the past two weeks in the pass I think the D has shown it can't all out blitz. .

It hasn't sent all out blitzes. They're putting people back in coverage and bringing only one person most of the time with they're safteys playing 20-25 yards off the LOS to stop the deep pass.


They have also shown that only 6 in the box can handle even the best running games. There is no way this team should blitz more than 1 maybe 2 guys a down..

1, its they're front 7 that can stop the run. 2, it's not blitzing to stop the run, its blitzing to get to the QB and take away the deep ball. If Ryan brings only 4 or 5 and gives the QB 6 or more seconds to throw the ball your going to be in more trouble then you are if you bring 6 or 7 people and have it picked up for a second or two before getting to the QB. Giving the QB even 5 or more seconds allows for these world class athletes you speak of to do double moves and spin our CBs around and have them run wide open 50 Yds down field. You bring a blitz a guy has to take off right away in a dead out sprint to get deep downfield which in turn makes it really easy to cover him. Bringing 4 or 5 allows WR's to do double moves and really burn our back-ups.




If blitzing like you are saying is as effective as you say then why isn't every team doing it. I think your argument is beginning to swallow itself. Empirical example owns your logic. .

Thats a horrible argument. Why isn't every team throwing bombs into double coverage like Tom Brady is to Randy Moss ? Why isn't every team throwing screens to they're RB's 70% of the time like Philly does with Westbrook ? Why isn't every team running the spread offenses like Indy, St. Loius, NO and NE ?
Thats a very weak argument. It's all about the players you have. The Ravens have the players to get to the QB and dropping them into coverage is killing them.



Being picked up and winning are two different things. If a guy is picked up then it adds 2-3 seconds to the time it takes to get to the QB. These are world class runners at WR in 2-3 seconds they are 15-25 yards down field. Add in hangtime and a guy can be 40-50 yards down field and past our slow or injured CB's. Case in point Chris Henry....

But as I said, to get that far down field they WR has to take off in a dead out sprint and when a guy takes off in a dead out sprint its alot easier to cover him as long as your just as fast or playing far enough off of him.



The fact is the Ravens don't have the personel right now to do this. No team can be effective on D with their starting CB's out, especially not in an all out blitz.

No, thats where your wrong. Right now the Ravens don't have the personel right now to cover anyone and allow the QB to have 5 or more seconds to throw the ball because they're only bringing 4 or 5 people. Watch the game, Suggs and Scott, two of our best pass rushers were back in coverage way too much and we saw what that got us. Palmer picked they're soft zone and man coverages apart. You can't just bring 4 or 5 and allow a QB to pick you apart like that, especially when your CBs get burned on a regular basis like Derrick Martin.