Loewen to DL, Torres Recalled

[dkdc]

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=mlb/news/news.aspx?id=4146472


Chicago, IL (Sports Network) - The Baltimore Orioles placed pitcher Adam Loewen on the 15-day disabled list Friday with left elbow soreness.

The left-hander exited his start against Seattle on Thursday after allowing five runs on four hits in just 2 2/3 innings.

Loewen is 0-1 with a 7.85 earned run average in four starts this season after missing most of 2007 with a stress fracture in his left elbow.

To replace Loewen on the roster, the O's selected the contract of infielder Eider Torres from Triple-A Norfolk.

[tywright]

Ok that's good that the FO moved quickly with this, but why Torres?

[furryburres]

Wait, isn't Torres a 2B/SS? If so, why not just call up Cintron?

[Sports Guy]

So now we have Torres, Fahey and LH on the roster?

What a poor decision that is...At least we don't have 13 pitchers anymore.

[orioles77]

This makes no sense, why have Fahey, Hernandez, and Torres on the same roster.

[ChaosLex]

Ugh. One step forward and two steps back.

[NewMarketSean]

So now we have Torres, Fahey and LH on the roster?

What a poor decision that is...At least we don't have 13 pitchers anymore.

Pretty freaking sad. But Torres getting some time at SS could spell the end of at least one of LH or Fahey.

[Cokeman]

This makes no sense, why have Fahey, Hernandez, and Torres on the same roster.

I wonder if they will find a way to add Bynum to that mix when he's ready to come back. ;)

[tywright]

Torres for pinchrunner duties??

Torres is hitting well though
http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=Eider%20Torres&pos=2B&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=462855

[NewMarketSean]

They should send down Fahey or LH and call up Terrero for another bat off the bench.

[baseballnelie]

It does not make any sense to now have 3 guys other than Roberts for SS/2B. I mentioned this last night in the game thread that they should put Loewen on the DL, but instead of bringing up Torres I would have like to see them bring up Garrett Olson to make some starts for us up here.

[Mad Mark]

The good news here is that the FO was proactive and quick with Loewen. It looks like either Albers or Johnson will take his next start...unless other moves lurk over the horizon.

[Bronco634]

So now we have Torres, Fahey and LH on the roster?

What a poor decision that is...

No doubt. However (and hopefully), there will be a corresponding move involving Fahey--do you wait for Bynum or bring up (another) 13th pitcher.

[vatech1994]

Make no mistake, this Torres move is a shot over the bow to Fahey and LH. If Torres looks worth a darn, one of them will be DFA when Moore is eligible for return.

[NewMarketSean]

Make no mistake, this Torres move is a shot over the bow to Fahey and LH. If Torres looks worth a darn, one of them will be DFA when Moore is eligible for return.

You mean Bynum, right?

[vatech1994]

You mean Bynum, right?

No, unless Moore continues to struggle (which I doubt), I believe that we will see Moore, Bynum, and whoever is playing the best among Torres, Cintron, LH, and Fahey occupying those three spots. I don't believe Moore is quite eligible to be recalled due to the option rules, but maybe the required days have passed.

[Mark Carver]

No, unless Moore continues to struggle (which I doubt), I believe that we will see Moore, Bynum, and whoever is playing the best among Torres, Cintron, LH, and Fahey occupying those three spots. I don't believe Moore is quite eligible to be recalled due to the option rules, but maybe the required days have passed.

Moore was optioned to Norfolk on 4/11/2008 and according to the rules, must spend 10 days down before being recalled, so he was eligible to recalled. Lowen placed on the DL, could have negated the mandatory 10 day wait also.


However, a player optioned to the minor leagues may not be recalled for at least 10 days, unless the club places a Major League player on the disabled list during the 10-day window.


Another tid-bit...



If a player’s optional assignment(s) to the minors total less than 20 days in one season, an option is not used.


So, if Scott does not stay down for 20-days in one season, than the option is not used.

Source = Cots (http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2003/01/transactions-glossary.html)

[baltimorebirds]

Torres is a pretty good player. Better than Fahey. I'm sure Garret Olson will be taking Loewen's spot in the rotation and when we call up Olson, we will send down Fahey. I'd rather have torres than fahey

[O's Nut]

They should send down Fahey or LH and call up Terrero for another bat off the bench.

I'm guessing another move is in the works.

[clapdiddy]

So...has Torres even played shortstop? I thought he was a second baseman?

Sometimes I just don't understand the logic in these moves. If we were sending down Fahey or Hernandez, I could understand the rationale. Having three weak hitting middle infielders doesn't make ANY sense.

[tanner88]

I don't mind this move. Torres played well in spring training, and was hitting well at AAA. Also, we have no one with speed on the bench. He can come in and be an effective pinch runner. Also, LH, Fahey and Torres are not going to be on the roster all year.

[OttoNoveDieci]

With an 800-ish OPS in Norfolk and only one error in 18 games, I'm all for giving Torres a look.....If he carries himself well, then you make a move with Fahey or Hernandez.

Hopefully, Loewen will be alright and perhaps can be sent on a couple of rehab assignments to work out some of his location issues.

[Hank Scorpio]

There has got to be another move pending. There's no way we can justify having LH, Fahey and Torres all on the 25 man roster.

So do we call up a starter or a reliever when we ship Fahey or LH back down?

[McLovin]

Torres was already on the 40-man. Maybe they'll just keep him until they need a starter again.

[JohnnyK27]

Didn't we have 13 pitchers on the roster before this move???

While I agree another move is coming ... I would have to agree its probably more like Terrero with LH being optioned or DFA'd.

[El Gordo]

No, unless Moore continues to struggle (which I doubt), I believe that we will see Moore, Bynum, and whoever is playing the best among Torres, Cintron, LH, and Fahey occupying those three spots. I don't believe Moore is quite eligible to be recalled due to the option rules, but maybe the required days have passed.I get the feelling we are in for a lot of roster moves. Bynum will be back soon, Albers IMO will take Loewen's slot, we still need 2 long men, and Aquino's situation needs to be resolved, as well as sorting out the SS mess. I don't see the point of having Bynum on the bench if he is not a MI UT guy. In that case then you are probably right, it's one of Torres, LH or Fahey at SS.

[clapdiddy]

Torres was already on the 40-man. Maybe they'll just keep him until they need a starter again.

Wow...what a sad state of affairs when you have Fahey, Hernandez, AND Torres on your 40-man!

Something must be right about it...we're in second place! :D

[Cokeman]

With Loewen gone for a while, hopefully there won't be a need for that 13th pitcher. Albers can take his spot in the rotation, and we would still have Johnson as the long reliever. If Torres works out, then either L Hernandez or Fahey goes when Bynum is ready...my guess would be Hernandez, since Fahey is a little better overall, and is more versatile. Then, if Moore starts hitting again, Fahey may be gone as well.

[DrungoHazewood]

This certainly is a curious move. Torres, despite his hot two weeks with the bat at Norfolk, is not substantially different than Hernandez or Fahey. From what I can tell he's not quite their equal with the glove, but he might be a tiny bit better with the bat.

This has the look of a move based on 50 at bats, instead of calling up whoever is really the best hitter (Moore).

When I pleaded for a more useful bench I didn't really mean "let's have three guys duke it out for the title of Kiko Garcia II."

[NewMarketSean]

Torres has played 90 games at SS. .955 FP. Not great, but he's still worth a shot if he can at least hit his weight.

[stef]

Torres was already on the 40-man. Maybe they'll just keep him until they need a starter again.

Actually, I don't think he was on the 40-man (he was outrighted 10/18). But he can easily be added to the 40-man since there is room.

It is a strange choice given he wasn't hitting any better than Heintz, Terrero or Roberson. Maybe there are just sending a signal to Luis and Fahey?

With DT's love of the 13-man staff, I agree with you, there may be another move when Loewen's turn comes up.

[AnythingO's]

There has got to be another move pending. There's no way we can justify having LH, Fahey and Torres all on the 25 man roster.

So do we call up a starter or a reliever when we ship Fahey or LH back down?

Albers or Johnson probably get the next start and we see Torres at SS. This buys time to look at Torres, more time to fix Aquino, more time for Moore to start hitting, and Olson gets to make his regular turn in AAA. By the second trip through the rotation Olson up for Aquino if he still is struggling or repeat Albers/Johnson if the pen is rested. Moore comes up for the odd man out of the 3 middle infielders. Lots of flexibility for DT.

[Cokeman]

Torres was already on the 40-man. Maybe they'll just keep him until they need a starter again.

Are you sure about that? I'm not seeing him...

[wildcard]

Actually, I don't think he was on the 40-man (he was outrighted 10/18). But he can easily be added to the 40-man since there is room.

It is a strange choice given he wasn't hitting any better than Heintz, Terrero or Roberson. Maybe there are just sending a signal to Luis and Fahey?

With DT's love of the 13-man staff, I agree with you, there may be another move when Loewen's turn comes up.

Agreed. Not on the 40-man roster according to Orioles.com.
http://baltimore.orioles.mlb.com/team/roster_40man.jsp?c_id=bal

[Mike B]

Wait, isn't Torres a 2B/SS? If so, why not just call up Cintron?

Torres is hitting .338, so he has earned it. I might be wrong but I have a hunch we will see Garret Olson in 4 days at the expense of Fahey. They are still going with a 8 man BP but will not need a 5th starter until Tuesday.

[NCRaven]

Torres is a pretty good player. Better than Fahey. I'm sure Garret Olson will be taking Loewen's spot in the rotation and when we call up Olson, we will send down Fahey. I'd rather have torres than fahey

Beat me to it. Unless someone here has talked to MacPhail or Trembley so that they might at least try to understand the reasoning, it's ridiculous of them to just outright slam the move here. Torres is hitting much better than Terrero who has gone into a major funk and seen his average drop over 100 points in the last couple of weeks. We have a right handed fourth outfielder, in Payton - who has performed exceptionally well in that role, by the way - but our only utility infielder, Fahey, is a lefty. So, bringing up a right handed utility infielder makes much more sense than a career AAAA outfielder. Especially when the infielder is hitting better than the outfielder. And, if Roberts is traded, Torres could become our starting second baseman for the rest of the season, so this gives the brain trust a chance to see him more before that happens. And, since Loewen's spot in the rotation doesn't come up for four days, they have plenty of time to make a move related to pitching.

All the doom and gloomers should take a deep breath and realize that who the 25th man on the roster is will not be a make or break decision this season and move on.

[Crazysilver03]

Make no mistake, this Torres move is a shot over the bow to Fahey and LH. If Torres looks worth a darn, one of them will be DFA when Moore is eligible for return.

Moore has been eligible for a return to the majors for 3 days now.

[Ruzious]

I expect both Fahey and LH won't be in Baltimore very long.

[Crazysilver03]

Torres was already on the 40-man. Maybe they'll just keep him until they need a starter again.

Torres was outrighted in October, when we had the burn fest that sent nearly 15 players off the roster and out of the organization.

They had to re-add him. He has 2 options remaining.

[NewMarketSean]

Torres is hitting much better than Terrero who has gone into a major funk and seen his average drop over 100 points in the last couple of weeks.

Woah. Terrero is a career .784 OPS MiL player. Torres .674.

These last few weeks of their hitting performance being reversed doesn't outweigh thousands of AB's that prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that Terrero is the better hitter.

It's good that Torres is hitting well. Maybe he can come up here and take over SS. But chances are he'll revert back into the player he always has been and become another redundant SS candidate.

[Welcome_Home]

Shortstop By commitee.


BRILLIENT:rolleyes:

[Maverick2143]

My bet

Olson makes his start tonight (shortened) at Richmond and then the O's move him up for LH or Fahey sometime on Monday or Tuesday.

[Crazysilver03]

Shortstop By commitee.


BRILLIENT:rolleyes:

Almost as brilliant as spelling brilliAnt wrong. :eek:

Anyway, people judge these transactions way to quick.

Fahey's job is probably on the line right now. Or we could see Aquino waived to bring up a starter. One of the reasons we had the 13th pitcher was because Trembley didnt trust Loewen to go deep into games, with that problem resolved I wonder if we lose the 13th pitcher now.

It would be nice.

[Mark Carver]

Almost as brilliant as spelling brilliAnt wrong. :eek:

Anyway, people judge these transactions way to quick.

Fahey's job is probably on the line right now. Or we could see Aquino waived to bring up a starter. One of the reasons we had the 13th pitcher was because Trembley didnt trust Loewen to go deep into games, with that problem resolved I wonder if we lose the 13th pitcher now.

It would be nice.

Exactly. With Loewen placed on a pitch count per start, him on the DL, removes the 13th pitcher.

[Welcome_Home]

[QUOTE=Crazysilver03;1296616]Almost as brilliant as spelling brilliAnt wrong. :eek:

QUOTE]

Sorry.

[Anonymous]

Torres is a pretty good player. Better than Fahey.Do you (and other posters who echo this view) say this because you have seen his play at SS, or at least have read scouting reports on it, or because he has better offensive statistics? I'd like to believe the former, but I suspect in most cases it's the latter.

[DrungoHazewood]

All the doom and gloomers should take a deep breath and realize that who the 25th man on the roster is will not be a make or break decision this season and move on.

No, Torres isn't going to make or break the season. But just once I'd like to see a Baltimore Orioles roster where the 22nd-25th men aren't .575 OPS utility guys and pitchers that can't be trusted with a four-run lead.

I suppose you could look at this as an opportunity to have Payton pinch hit for Hernandez in the 5th, Fahey plays short for the 6th and 7th, Quiroz pinch hits for him in the 8th, and Torres plays short in the 9th. If we can find one more shortstop and an extra roster spot none of them would ever have to bat.

[BillySmith]

I'm thinking Olsen too, because we need Albers in the pen pretty badly. It's one thing to give him a spot start, but a whole other deal to put him in the rotation.

In the meantime, DT gets to pinch hit for both LH and Fahey in the same game and not have to put Melmo at SS.

Maybe Roch will help us with this some time before the game.

[stef]

Beat me to it. Unless someone here has talked to MacPhail or Trembley so that they might at least try to understand the reasoning, it's ridiculous of them to just outright slam the move here. Torres is hitting much better than Terrero who has gone into a major funk and seen his average drop over 100 points in the last couple of weeks. We have a right handed fourth outfielder, in Payton - who has performed exceptionally well in that role, by the way - but our only utility infielder, Fahey, is a lefty. So, bringing up a right handed utility infielder makes much more sense than a career AAAA outfielder. Especially when the infielder is hitting better than the outfielder. And, if Roberts is traded, Torres could become our starting second baseman for the rest of the season, so this gives the brain trust a chance to see him more before that happens. And, since Loewen's spot in the rotation doesn't come up for four days, they have plenty of time to make a move related to pitching.

All the doom and gloomers should take a deep breath and realize that who the 25th man on the roster is will not be a make or break decision this season and move on.

I think this is right on the mark. And, I believe that Torres is a switch-batter (notice I didn't say switch-hitter).

[Mark Carver]

I'm thinking Olsen too, because we need Albers in the pen pretty badly. It's one thing to give him a spot start, but a whole other deal to put him in the rotation.

In the meantime, DT gets to pinch hit for both LH and Fahey in the same game and not have to put Melmo at SS.

Maybe Roch will help us with this some time before the game.

Why do they need Albers in the bullpen and bring up that 13th pitcher? Both Cabrera and Guthrie have been stretching it out and you have Johnson on the team for long relief.

[Anonymous]

Almost as brilliant as spelling brilliAnt wrong. :eek:

Anyway, people judge these transactions way to quick.And too quick to spell toO wrong. :eek: :eek:

[stef]

Torres was outrighted in October, when we had the burn fest that sent nearly 15 players off the roster and out of the organization.

Ha! Beat you to it. You have taught me well, oh CrazySilver.

[Frobby]

Torres was already on the 40-man. Maybe they'll just keep him until they need a starter again.

That's what I think. In three days, another pitcher will be called up and one of Torres, Fahey or Hernandez will be sent down. It's silly to bring up Moore and then send him back 3 days from now - he's better served being in the lineup every day. Terrero isn't on the 40-man and has no options, so once he's up you can't send him down without exposing him to waivers. This move makes all the sense in the world to me, especially since Torres is playing very well right now.

[Welcome_Home]

And too quick to spell toO wrong. :eek: :eek:

thanks...the word police is out to make some collars. Better be careful

[BillySmith]

Why do they need Albers in the bullpen and bring up that 13th pitcher? Both Cabrera and Guthrie have been stretching it out and you have Johnson on the team for long relief.

I consider him to be one of the best relievers we currently have. I hope Johnson has turned a corner in his career and is ready to be part of this pen, but it's still early. And Trax and Brian Burres seem like 5, 6 or 7 inning guys pretty much.

[Crazysilver03]

That's what I think. In three days, another pitcher will be called up and one of Torres, Fahey or Hernandez will be sent down. It's silly to bring up Moore and then send him back 3 days from now - he's better served being in the lineup every day. Terrero isn't on the 40-man and has no options, so once he's up you can't send him down without exposing him to waivers. This move makes all the sense in the world to me, especially since Torres is playing very well right now.

Torres has 2 options remaining, so this probably played a part.

Salazar has 1 option remaining.

Terrero has 0 options as stated.

[stef]

thanks...the word police is out to make some collars. Better be careful

That would be "the word police are out to make some collars." :D

[Roy Firestone]

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=mlb/news/news.aspx?id=4146472
Its obvious they should pick up Olsen. BTW..Did anyone notice that Torres is a shortstop from Maracaibo, Venezuela? Just so happens to be the hometown of another Oriole SS named.....Luis Aparicio...and hes only 25,....HMMMMMMMM....Just wondering if its an omen.

[Anonymous]

One good thing about having Torres around is that it might lead to some days off for Roberts. Of course, Fahey could have given him a breather; but maybe DT will feel more comfortable with Torres in that role.

They also need to find a way to get Mora some rest. I hope Aubrey is taking some ground ball practice.

[Cokeman]

That would be "the word police are out make some collars." :D

And that would be, "the word police are out to make some collars." This could go on and on...;)

[Mark Carver]

I consider him to be one of the best relievers we currently have. I hope Johnson has turned a corner in his career and is ready to be part of this pen, but it's still early. And Trax and Brian Burres seem like 5, 6 or 7 inning guys pretty much.

What needs to be addressed is Greg Aquino... who is this years Scott Williamson. Aquino has been in 5 games for 6 innings so far this year.

[Fan4Life]

Its obvious they should pick up Olson. BTW..Did anyone notice that Torres is a shortstop from Maracaibo, Venezuela? Just so happens to be the hometown of another Oriole SS named.....Luis Aparicio...and hes only 25,....HMMMMMMMM....Just wondering if its an omen.

Fixed that for ya... I hear the word Police are about this afternoon... :)

[byrdz]

I just wanted to be the 1 billionth person to say how crazy it is to have Torres, LH and Fahey on roster at the same time and how curious of a move this is...

Isn't the bigger news here that Loewen is going on the DL? I just hope this is more soreness from not pitching in a year or else I'm starting to think we got a dud in Loewen. He says it isn't serious but it may be wishful thinking on his part.



The Orioles announced today that they have placed left-handed pitcher Adam Loewen on the 15-day disabled list with left elbow soreness. Infielder Eider Torres was called up from Triple-A Norfolk to fill Loewen's spot on the roster.

"It's starting to get worse in the general area of my forearm," said Loewen, visibly distraught as he spoke to reporters. "It just starts off as a dull pain and gets sharper as I get on. I'll probably get it looked at. Hopefully, it's nothing serious, I don't think it is."

...

When he was removed from the game, Loewen complained of forearm discomfort in his pitching arm that he claims is unrelated to the stress fracture in his elbow that required surgery last June.


So is it the elbow or the freaking forearm?

Source (http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-loewen425,0,2604228.story)

[Tank]

Confusing move. There has to be another move or 2 on the horizon.

[Sports Guy]

Beat me to it. Unless someone here has talked to MacPhail or Trembley so that they might at least try to understand the reasoning, it's ridiculous of them to just outright slam the move here. Torres is hitting much better than Terrero who has gone into a major funk and seen his average drop over 100 points in the last couple of weeks. We have a right handed fourth outfielder, in Payton - who has performed exceptionally well in that role, by the way - but our only utility infielder, Fahey, is a lefty. So, bringing up a right handed utility infielder makes much more sense than a career AAAA outfielder. Especially when the infielder is hitting better than the outfielder. And, if Roberts is traded, Torres could become our starting second baseman for the rest of the season, so this gives the brain trust a chance to see him more before that happens. And, since Loewen's spot in the rotation doesn't come up for four days, they have plenty of time to make a move related to pitching.

All the doom and gloomers should take a deep breath and realize that who the 25th man on the roster is will not be a make or break decision this season and move on.

Why is this always the response? Personally, I like it when my team makes smart decisions.

[BillySmith]

What needs to be addressed is Greg Aquino... who is this years Scott Williamson. Aquino has been in 5 games for 6 innings so far this year.

What is up with that? DT just does not go to him. He's basically mop up until a better option comes along. I guess the better option is at AAA right now but since we're trying to bring the young guys along slowly, they are just going to leave Aquino in that role. Maybe by June that will change.

Not to hijack the thread, but if things go as hoped and expected, this staff will be undergoing a major overhaul in the next year. Penn, Olson, Liz, McCrory and maybe Spoone and Hoey could all pitch for the O's by the end of the year. Patton will be here next year. Aquino, Trax and Burres should be losing jobs in a couple of months.

[NewMarketSean]

It's the amount of close games we've been in. DT clearly doesn't trust him. Maybe they are hoping some side sessions improve his control and quality of pitches. But I agree, it is baffling why he is still here if they don't trust him. He's just taking up space.

[byrdz]

Who takes the place of Loewen in the rotation? Albers? Johnson? Olson?

[Mark Carver]

Who takes the place of Loewen in the rotation? Albers? Johnson? Olson?

Won't know that until Monday or Tuesday when he's needed...

[weams]

One good thing about having Torres around is that it might lead to some days off for Roberts. Of course, Fahey could have given him a breather; but maybe DT will feel more comfortable with Torres in that role.

They also need to find a way to get Mora some rest. I hope Aubrey is taking some ground ball practice.

It's obvious...we are too good.


We don't need no stinking bench players.

We obviously are playing with an arm tied behind our back to make it fair. That is is why Millar and Huff keep giving back runs...just so that it stays exciting. We are a team of destiny.

[Crazysilver03]

Who takes the place of Loewen in the rotation? Albers? Johnson? Olson?

We will find out tonight. Olson is supposed to start for Norfolk so if he is scratched before the start or gets pulled after 2-3 innings it is nearly safe to assume that Olson will get the call on Tuesday.

With Trax and Burres going the next 2 days, Albers and Johnson may not be rested by the time Tuesday come.

[El Gordo]

We will find out tonight. Olson is supposed to start for Norfolk so if he is scratched before the start or gets pulled after 2-3 innings it is nearly safe to assume that Olson will get the call on Tuesday.

With Trax and Burres going the next 2 days, Albers and Johnson may not be rested by the time Tuesday come.
This was my thought as well. If Albers is slotted for Tuesday, then he won't be available out of the pen. If both Buress and Trax have melt downs the pen could be burned out fast.

[Lefty0315]

And that would be, "the word police are out to make some collars." This could go on and on...;)

Like that one song that never ends.:D

[bluedog]

Torres is a pretty good player. Better than Fahey. I'm sure Garret Olson will be taking Loewen's spot in the rotation and when we call up Olson, we will send down Fahey. I'd rather have torres than fahey

Agreed. This makes perfect sense if the following is the plan:

1. Use Torres for speed off the bench and give him a couple of looks in the field to see if he's preferable to Fahey / LH moving forward.

2. Call up Olson when Loewen's turn is next due and option either Fahey or LH down.

Calling up Olson immediately would basically be a waste of a roster spot for 4 days (what's a starting pitcher going to do to help the club between starts?).

Torres isn't that great at stealing bases (66% success in 33 attempts last season) but he immediately becomes the best pinch running option on the team. At least he's not total dead weight offensively on the bench like Fahey / LH is when they don't start.

[Dr. FLK]

All the doom and gloomers should take a deep breath and realize that who the 25th man on the roster is will not be a make or break decision this season and move on.

In a related note, AM has decided to go with a 23 man roster to avoid the difficult decision of who to waste the final spots on.

If selected properly, all 25 men can actually contribute to a ball club. Having 3 SS who can't hit isn't a way to do that. Calling up Torres is fine if it's coupled with other moves to remove other dead weight.

[clarence]

I don't understand the rushing to judgment, when this is obviously not the only move that will be made. I think it is safe to assume that AM and DT don't plan on having all 3 of Torres, LH and Fahey on the roster for any real amount of time. We didn't need to replace Loewen, today. Aquino is the pitcher that should be getting replaced today. Moore isn't hitting his weight so why reward him with a call to sit on the bench?

[dan the man]

I don't understand the rushing to judgment, when this is obviously not the only move that will be made. I think it is safe to assume that AM and DT don't plan on having all 3 of Torres, LH and Fahey on the roster for any real amount of time. We didn't need to replace Loewen, today. Aquino is the pitcher that should be getting replaced today. Moore isn't hitting his weight so why reward him with a call to sit on the bench?

Thank you for having rare good judgement on this board.

[RShack]

They're not gonna keep LH, Fahey, and Torres. This is just a momentary roster juggling thing to buy a few days until they do something else. I don't see what people are getting all worked up about.

Look at it this way: Now they can PH for both LH and Fahey, and still have another MI to run in there ;-)

[Dr. FLK]

They're not gonna keep LH, Fahey, and Torres. This is just a momentary roster juggling thing to buy a few days until they do something else. I don't see what people are getting all worked up about.

Look at it this way: Now they can PH for both LH and Fahey, and still have another MI to run in there ;-)

Too bad they don't have anyone else on the bench...and their best hitting pitcher just went on the DL! ;)

[wildcard]

It always freaks me a little bit to see LH, Fahey and Torres on the same team because last year the O's had Bynum and Gomez at the utility IF spot for a long time. That was instead on having a real left fielder.

[Sports Guy]

I don't understand the rushing to judgment, when this is obviously not the only move that will be made. I think it is safe to assume that AM and DT don't plan on having all 3 of Torres, LH and Fahey on the roster for any real amount of time. We didn't need to replace Loewen, today. Aquino is the pitcher that should be getting replaced today. Moore isn't hitting his weight so why reward him with a call to sit on the bench?

Because it is like 35 at bats...A totally meaningless number of at bats when evaluating a player.

Again, he was good enough to make the team out of ST...Judging him on 35 at bats, when he is also trying to play a new position, is just flat out wrong.

[vatech1994]

Moore was optioned to Norfolk on 4/11/2008 and according to the rules, must spend 10 days down before being recalled, so he was eligible to recalled. Lowen placed on the DL, could have negated the mandatory 10 day wait also.




Another tid-bit...



So, if Scott does not stay down for 20-days in one season, than the option is not used.

Source = Cots (http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2003/01/transactions-glossary.html)

Good stuff. I was at work and didn't have time to look it up. I thought it was 10 days, but didn't remember his option date. Also, I had totally forgotten the 20 days thing. Thanks

[RShack]

Because it is like 35 at bats...A totally meaningless number of at bats when evaluating a player.

Again, he was good enough to make the team out of ST...Judging him on 35 at bats, when he is also trying to play a new position, is just flat out wrong.
SG, nobody is "evaluating a player" based on 35 AB's. The only person people are rushing to judgment about based on not-much is LH. (Except for you about Walker.) Nobody is doing that to Moore. The only thing people are saying is that he's not hitting lately, and that they should let him get back to hitting OK before they call him back up. There's no good reason for knee-jerking him back up when he's not doing well lately. It's not the end of the world to let him play some, rather than having him sit on the bench up here. Jeez.

[El Gordo]

Because it is like 35 at bats...A totally meaningless number of at bats when evaluating a player.

Again, he was good enough to make the team out of ST...Judging him on 35 at bats, when he is also trying to play a new position, is just flat out wrong.Since this is a temporary mave, why not use the opportunity to take a look at Torres at SS. What's the urgency on bringing up Moore. How much playing time is he likely to see between now and Tuesday? We need a RH bat more than another LH bat. And why bring a guy up who is in a slump to sit on the bench?

[DrungoHazewood]

Too bad they don't have anyone else on the bench...and their best hitting pitcher just went on the DL! ;)

Just the other day they mentioned that Trachsel and Loewen were ready to step in as pinch hitters because of the short bench.

Now that Loewen is on the DL who is our 2nd-string emergency pitcher-pinch-hitter?!?! :confused: :)

[NoVaO]

SG, nobody is "evaluating a player" based on 35 AB's. The only person people are rushing to judgment about based on not-much is LH. (Except for you about Walker.) Nobody is doing that to Moore. The only thing people are saying is that he's not hitting lately, and that they should let him get back to hitting OK before they call him back up. There's no good reason for knee-jerking him back up when he's not doing well lately. It's not the end of the world to let him play some, rather than having him sit on the bench up here. Jeez.

Rushing to judgement based on what? If it's defense, then I would say you have a point. If it's offense, nobody is rushing to anything. He is at the level most people thought he would be at for his offense, but in reality he can fall further.

[Crazysilver03]

Because it is like 35 at bats...A totally meaningless number of at bats when evaluating a player.

Again, he was good enough to make the team out of ST...Judging him on 35 at bats, when he is also trying to play a new position, is just flat out wrong.

Moore had 39 at-bats in Spring Training and that was enough for him to earn a spot on the team. Then why isnt 35 enough for him to not earn himself back on the team?

[bluedog]

Just the other day they mentioned that Trachsel and Loewen were ready to step in as pinch hitters because of the short bench.

Now that Loewen is on the DL who is our 2nd-string emergency pitcher-pinch-hitter?!?! :confused: :)

T-bone Shelby! Player coach anyone?

[RShack]

Rushing to judgement based on what? If it's defense, then I would say you have a point.
With LH, that's what DT was bothered about. People here like to rant about his bat, but that's not what the O's have been upset about. DT was quite clear that he wants him for D, and that anything he gets at the plate is a bonus. So, his D is 100% of the recent issue the O's have had with him.

BTW, he appears to be coming out of his little D-funk, at least on my TV anyway. The throw to double-up Ichiro was harder to do than maybe people think. He received a toss from BRob with the runner coming at him with spikes up, and he went in the air while gunning it to get Ichiro anyway... no time to pull his arm back, more like a C's snap-throw while turning his body and going in the air, all at the same time. Got him by a couple feet, it wasn't even that close. That's not the kind of thing that shows up in web gems, but most good-D doesn't... most of it looks ordinary when it's not.

[Crazysilver03]

With LH, that's what DT was bothered about. People here like to rant about his bat, but that's not what the O's have been upset about. DT was quite clear that he wants him for D, and that anything he gets at the plate is a bonus. So, his D is 100% of the recent issue the O's have had with him.

BTW, he appears to be coming out of his little D-funk, at least on my TV anyway.

Oh no, your going to be a new age OldFan, just because the TV didnt exist when he first started watching players. :D

[Sports Guy]

Rushing to judgement based on what? If it's defense, then I would say you have a point. If it's offense, nobody is rushing to anything. He is at the level most people thought he would be at for his offense, but in reality he can fall further.

Rshack saying we are rushing to judgment is beyond absurd...He just doesn't put any weight into stats...Many of us had the same judgement of him when he was "hitting well" last year.

[NCRaven]

Why is this always the response? Personally, I like it when my team makes smart decisions.

Because you don't know why they made the decision so you can't know whether it was good or not. I'm only saying that you have not spoken with MacPhail, to the best of my knowledge, so you are not in a "good" position to judge it, yet.

Now, if they don't do anything else soon that make it more apparent why they made this move, then I would tend to agree with you. I just think you and others are too quick to judge this roster move.

I particularly see no need to promote a RH 5th outfielder when our RH'd 4th outfielder has done an excellent job in that role. Especially when our reserve infielder, Fahey, is left handed. Personally, I'd like to see Moore replace Fahey. Then we'd have a left handed bat on the bench that could play 1st and 3rd, a right handed bat that could play any outfield position and another RH'd bat that can backup at the middle infield positions. But without knowing why this exact move was made, I'm just not ready to judge it, just so I can be first to bash.

[El Gordo]

Rshack saying we are rushing to judgment is beyond absurd...He just doesn't put any weight into stats...Many of us had the same judgement of him when he was "hitting well" last year.

I thought RShack made it pretty clear he was talking about LH's D. Maybe you have some stats to demonstrate his current level of defense?

[Sports Guy]

Moore had 39 at-bats in Spring Training and that was enough for him to earn a spot on the team. Then why isnt 35 enough for him to not earn himself back on the team?

Moore should have made the team irregardless of what he did in ST.

And if he was good enough to make the team out of ST and they were confident in him, then it shouldn't matter that he has struggled, again PLAYING A NEW POSITION, in AAA.

The argument is so completely stupid.

Have you seen him play? How do you know he hasn't had 5 balls that got robbed of base hits. Do you know what would happen then? His average would go up almost 130 points because of 5 lousy hits.

It is just totally meaningless to judge him based off of that tiny amount of at bats.

[Sports Guy]

Because you don't know why they made the decision so you can't know whether it was good or not. I'm only saying that you have not spoken with MacPhail, to the best of my knowledge, so you are not in a "good" position to judge it, yet.

Now, if they don't do anything else soon that make it more apparent why they made this move, then I would tend to agree with you. I just think you and others are too quick to judge this roster move.

I particularly see no need to promote a RH 5th outfielder when our RH'd 4th outfielder has done an excellent job in that role. Especially when our reserve infielder, Fahey, is left handed. Personally, I'd like to see Moore replace Fahey. Then we'd have a left handed bat on the bench that could play 1st and 3rd, a right handed bat that could play any outfield position and another RH'd bat that can backup at the middle infield positions. But without knowing why this exact move was made, I'm just not ready to judge it, just so I can be first to bash.
I don't care if this move is for one day, it is stupid!

[NoVaO]

With LH, that's what DT was bothered about. People here like to rant about his bat, but that's not what the O's have been upset about. DT was quite clear that he wants him for D, and that anything he gets at the plate is a bonus. So, his D is 100% of the recent issue the O's have had with him.

BTW, he appears to be coming out of his little D-funk, at least on my TV anyway. The throw to double-up Ichiro was harder to do than maybe people think. He received a toss from BRob with the runner coming at him with spikes up, and he went in the air while gunning it to get Ichiro anyway... no time to pull his arm back, more like a C's snap-throw while turning his body and going in the air, all at the same time. Got him by a couple feet, it wasn't even that close. That's not the kind of thing that shows up in web gems, but most good-D doesn't... most of it looks ordinary when it's not.

Ok, but there is a limit. Just because Trembley wants a defensive SS doesn't mean he wants a SS that has a bat that is putrid. I haven't seen many plays that Hernandez has made where he would have been the only player capable of making that play.

[Crazysilver03]

I don't care if this move is for one day, it is stupid!

Then majesty, what would you do? :rolleyes:

[Sports Guy]

Then majesty, what would you do? :rolleyes:

I have already said what I would do...Of course, if DT and AM go a different way, then that must mean they are totally right...I forgot, they never have nor never will make a wrong decision. :rolleyes:

[JTrea81]

Torres had been hitting well and we needed another bat that would be able to sub for Roberts and possibly start at SS. I don't think the O's forgot about that hit that saved them from having to go into extra innings before they packed up to head up north on the last game in Fort Lauderdale. This is probably a reward for that and his play in Norfolk.

Moore should be up here anyway but I can see why Torres is here instead but one of the SS duo has to go for his roster spot so Olson can come up and pitch. I've said Moore won't be back until Millar or Mora is gone and I think I'm right on that one. I also wonder if Moore is suffering from Calvin Pickering syndrome...

[Crazysilver03]

I have already said what I would do...Of course, if DT and AM go a different way, then that must mean they are totally right...I forgot, they never have nor never will make a wrong decision. :rolleyes:

Its not that I agree wholeheartedly with AM and DT, I am just not quick to criticize every move.

Torres is the hothand. They were quick to remove Loewen from the roster.

Moore is down in AAA to get consistent at-bats, something he wouldnt be getting up here, and he hasnt done much with them at Norfolk. The organization thinks that Moore can be an everyday player but he cant do that at the ML level right now. That argument makes sense. It isnt some "stupid" bogus argument.

[Sports Guy]

Torres had been hitting well and we needed another bat that would be able to sub for Roberts and possibly start at SS. I don't think the O's forgot about that hit that saved them from having to go into extra innings before they packed up to head up north on the last game in Fort Lauderdale. This is probably a reward for that and his play in Norfolk.

Moore should be up here anyway but I can see why Torres is here but one of the SS duo has to go for his roster spot. I've said Moore won't be back until Millar or Mora is gone and I think I'm right on that one. I also wonder if Moore is suffering from Calvin Pickering syndrome...

Torres is a waste of a spot but if he is playing well enough, fine...The other 2 are a waste of a spot as well, so whatever....But to have all 3 of these guys up here is a joke.

[Crazysilver03]

Torres is a waste of a spot but if he is playing well enough, fine...The other 2 are a waste of a spot as well, so whatever....But to have all 3 of these guys up here is a joke.

One of them will be gone in 3-4 days. Having an extra pitcher or bench player isnt going to cost us any wins over that course.

[Sports Guy]

Its not that I agree wholeheartedly with AM and DT, I am just not quick to criticize every move.

Torres is the hothand. They were quick to remove Loewen from the roster.

Moore is down in AAA to get consistent at-bats, something he wouldnt be getting up here, and he hasnt done much with them at Norfolk. The organization thinks that Moore can be an everyday player but he cant do that at the ML level right now. That argument makes sense. It isnt some "stupid" bogus argument.

It is extremely unlikely that the team looks at Moore as an everyday player...Sorry but that explanation is poor.

He isn't going to replace any of the corner IFers right now and he isn't in their long term plans for the corner IF positions.

Super UTI guy.....

[Sports Guy]

One of them will be gone in 3-4 days. Having an extra pitcher or bench player isnt going to cost us any wins over that course.

If you are going to have an extra bench player, have someone that actually can hit the ball.

[zff4]

And that would be, "the word police are out to make some collars." This could go on and on...;)

should be, "Word. Five-oh."

[RShack]

Oh no, your going to be a new age OldFan, just because the TV didnt exist when he first started watching players. :D
Actually, he's a little bit younger than I am. He's not old, he's just got his FakeCodgerDude shtick, that's all. My dad is almost 89 and even he acts younger than FakeCodgerDude does. You guys just fall for it, that's all ;-)

[JTrea81]

It is extremely unlikely that the team looks at Moore as an everyday player...Sorry but that explanation is poor.

He isn't going to replace any of the corner IFers right now and he isn't in their long term plans for the corner IF positions.

Super UTI guy.....

Well Trembley has said to him he thinks he's an everyday player so unless Trembley lied to him I hope that is the case. But Trembley hasn't played Moore that much since the Orioles acquired him even though he is probably a better player than Mora or Millar at this point. Every team could use a Casey Blake and I think that's who he could be if the team gave him a chance.

Who knows what to think? I just hope Moore's confidence hasn't been shot by having to hit in the Death Valley that is Harbor Park. Who knows how many fly balls died that should have been extra bases...

[Sports Guy]

Well Trembley has said to him he thinks he's an everyday player so unless Trembley lied to him I hope that is the case. But Trembley hasn't played Moore that much since the Orioles acquired him even though he is probably a better player than Mora or Millar at this point. Every team could use a Casey Blake and I think that's who he could be if the team gave him a chance.

Who knows what to think? I just hope Moore's confidence hasn't been shot by having to hit in the Death Valley that is Harbor Park. Who knows how many fly balls died that should have been extra bases...
Right...None of us have watched...We have no idea how he is hitting the ball and really, it doesn't matter...He could have struck 35 times and he should still have been called up.

DT was going to play 3 times in that the one week...the one he got sent down.

He was going to start a few times a week and probably pinch hit in most games..That is plenty of playing time for him.

[El Gordo]

Torres is a waste of a spot but if he is playing well enough, fine...The other 2 are a waste of a spot as well, so whatever....But to have all 3 of these guys up here is a joke.

Loewen on the DL gives you the option of bringing up another RH 4th OF who is currently slumping or a LH 3B/1B who is currently slumping or a SH MI who is currently hot. This is probably just foR 4 days until you bring up a SP to fill Loewen's spot. I don't see how it is stupid to bring up the currently hot bat and also have the opportunithy to evaluate him as a pssible SS upgrade. If you think they intend to keep all three of Fahey, LH, and Torres for any length of time, you are even dumber than you think AM and DT are.:rolleyes:

[PoorMike]

My bet: Torres is the one who goes when Olson is called up to make a start. Unless, of course, Torres blows us away, and then maybe they send down BF....but right now it's Torres himself that will go, I think.

BTW, Moore has not impressed me at all, last year or this year. He seems to swing through alot of very hittable pitches. I want to see him succeed in the end, but I don't feel the need to bring a guy up that was acquired (with others) for a month of Steve Trachsel just because he's 24 and used to be a 1st round draft pick. Let him get his stuff together in the IL, which is much more of a pitcher's league than the PCL.

[Mad Mark]

Actually, he's a little bit younger than I am. He's not old, he's just got his FakeCodgerDude shtick, that's all. My dad is almost 89 and even he acts younger than FakeCodgerDude does. You guys just fall for it, that's all ;-)

FakeCodgerDude busted me up pretty good in one of the Cabrera threads after I called him out on comparing Cabrera to Sidney Ponson, and calling Ponson a "bum". He felt I should man up and agree with his extraordinarily enlightened opinion! :rolleyes:


Well Trembley has said to him he thinks he's an everyday player so unless Trembley lied to him I hope that is the case. But Trembley hasn't played Moore that much since the Orioles acquired him even though he is probably a better player than Mora or Millar at this point. Every team could use a Casey Blake and I think that's who he could be if the team gave him a chance.

Who knows what to think? I just hope Moore's confidence hasn't been shot by having to hit in the Death Valley that is Harbor Park. Who knows how many fly balls died that should have been extra bases...

DT may very well see Moore as a future everyday player. But, having to play the hand he's been dealt means giving Millar, Mora, Payton and Huff maximum playing time to perhaps interest another team. Besides, things are kind of working right now.
Moore may not like hitting in that pitchers paradise in Norfolk, but I would guess he's been made aware of what's going on, and appreciates the fact that he's getting regular playing time, and remains in the team's future plans.

[RShack]

Rshack saying we are rushing to judgment is beyond absurd...He just doesn't put any weight into stats...Many of us had the same judgement of him when he was "hitting well" last year.
Oh, I put a lot of weight on stats. Sometimes more than others. It's just that I think about what they really tell me first.

[NewMarketSean]

Loewen on the DL gives you the option of bringing up another RH 4th OF who is currently slumping or a LH 3B/1B who is currently slumping or a SH MI who is currently hot. This is probably just foR 4 days until you bring up a SP to fill Loewen's spot. I don't see how it is stupid to bring up the currently hot bat and also have the opportunithy to evaluate him as a pssible SS upgrade. If you think they intend to keep all three of Fahey, LH, and Torres for any length of time, you are even dumber than you think AM and DT are.:rolleyes:

When do you think they'll send one of those guys down then?

[NCRaven]

I have already said what I would do...Of course, if DT and AM go a different way, then that must mean they are totally right...I forgot, they never have nor never will make a wrong decision. :rolleyes:

Sure they have. They make lots of decisions every day. Some more important than others. And if they've only made one real world decision concerning a baseball teams roster, that's one more than you or I. Consider the decisions that MacPhail has made since he's been here - Trachsel trade, Tejada trade, Bedard trade, not trading Roberts for a subpar package, Rule 5 draft of Bierd, promotion of James Johnson, dumping of Gibbons. Failures - Aquino, so far. Yeah, you say stupid, MacPhail says do it and I'm going to agree with who?:rolleyes:

[McNulty]

I can't understand why any of you are so upset about this move. You could take the name Torres and Loewen out of this thread and replace it with Johnson and Moore and it would be the exact same thread from April 11th. And that move worked out pretty well, didn't it; even though EVERYONE on this board was up in arms about it (not to say that Moore shouldn't be back up, and soon enough he will be).

I think Trembley and MacPhail have earned the right at this point to be trusted in their roster moves. And I'm all for giving Torres his shot. I'm sure they brought him up as an extra bench player for a few days until they need another arm.

So have a cocktail and relax people; we are in good hands this year.

[Anonymous]

Moore was optioned to Norfolk on 4/11/2008 and ... if Scott does not stay down for 20-days in one season, than the option is not used.

Source = Cots (http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2003/01/transactions-glossary.html)This was the most valuable piece of new information that I picked up from this thread. I had no idea that this was part of the optioning process.

While I have generally advocated that Moore needs to stay in Norfolk to regain both his stroke and confidence, the new info alters my perspective. I now view May 1 as decision day for Moore. On the one hand, I still believe that Moore would benefit most from a longer stretch of every-day playing time in Norfolk rather than being recalled to resume a mostly-on-the-bench role in Baltimore. On the other hand, I hate throwing away a guy's final option if there's a reasonable way to avoid doing so.

Add in the need for Mora especially to get time off somewhere along the way, and secondarily Millar and Huff (I think it's easier to find a way to rest those two without Moore on the roster than it is to rest Mora), and I see May 1 as a possible target date for Moore to return if he has started to turn a corner. I'm not predicting this will happen, nor advocating that it should happen -- only opening the door to the idea that the decision will deserve careful scrutiny on that date. In the event Moore does get recalled that day, that could also turn out to be decision day on one of the three middle infield suspects (with a second such decision day occurring when Bynum is ready to return).

[Anonymous]

Sure they have. They make lots of decisions every day. Some more important than others. And if they've only made one real world decision concerning a baseball teams roster, that's one more than you or I. Consider the decisions that MacPhail has made since he's been here - Trachsel trade, Tejada trade, Bedard trade, not trading Roberts for a subpar package, Rule 5 draft of Bierd, promotion of James Johnson, dumping of Gibbons. Failures - Aquino, so far. Yeah, you say stupid, MacPhail says do it and I'm going to agree with who?:rolleyes:Agreed -- except I don't know why even the Aquino situation would be deemed a failure. Yes, it looks like this one isn't gonna work out. But this was a cost-free acquisition. That's the kind of non-risk that I hope AM keeps taking, even if it's got a one-in-five shot.

[NCRaven]

Agreed -- except I don't know why even the Aquino situation would be deemed a failure. Yes, it looks like this one isn't gonna work out. But this was a cost-free acquisition. That's the kind of non-risk that I hope AM keeps taking, even if it's got a one-in-five shot.

Well, SG seems to think some of us think MacPhail can do no wrong. So I had to throw him a bone with one less than stellar decision.:D

On the plus side, I didn't even mention completion of the Dominican facility, appointment of John Stockstill to international scouting director - heck, creation of an international scouting department, option on Dodgertown to put pressure on Ft. Lauderdale and the FAA, insertion of King Peter into his back pocket on issues like the Tejada and Bedard trades.

MacPhail might make a decision I disagree with, but I'm not going to presume to say that any decision he makes is "stupid."

[Mike B]

Shortstop By commitee.


BRILLIENT:rolleyes:

There is nothing wrong with bringing Torres up. It makes sense for the following reasons.
1. It allows them to take a quick look in an actual ML game(s) to see if he is capable of playing SS.
2. He is a switch hitter.
3. He earned it by hitting.338 at Norfolk.
4. It allows the O's to still have an 8 man BP for a few days while waiting for the need for a starter. Olson could start on Tuesday and Fahey could be sent down. DT has said he likes Johnson and Albers in the pen.
5. We are only using 4 OFers and in a pinch FAhey can play OF.
6. Moore is not hitting.
7. We can bring multiple pitchers up and down if the rain goes crazy on us.

Why must we go crazy over every move the team makes. I am sure the next one will be why Olson or Penn will be called up instead of Albers or JJ.

[Mike B]

That's what I think. In three days, another pitcher will be called up and one of Torres, Fahey or Hernandez will be sent down. It's silly to bring up Moore and then send him back 3 days from now - he's better served being in the lineup every day. Terrero isn't on the 40-man and has no options, so once he's up you can't send him down without exposing him to waivers. This move makes all the sense in the world to me, especially since Torres is playing very well right now.

I think you are right on. Plus Moore is not hitting. People are sold on Moore but I am not sure as to why.

[Anonymous]

There is nothing wrong with bringing Torres up. It makes sense for the following reasons.
1. It allows them to take a quick look in an actual ML game(s) to see if he is capable of playing SS.
2. He is a switch hitter.
3. He earned it by hitting.338 at Norfolk.
4. It allows the O's to still have an 8 man BP for a few days while waiting for the need for a starter. Olson could start on Tuesday and Fahey could be sent down. DT has said he likes Johnson and Albers in the pen.
5. We are only using 4 OFers and in a pinch FAhey can play OF.
6. Moore is not hitting.
7. We can bring multiple pitchers up and down if the rain goes crazy on us.

Why must we go crazy over every move the team makes. I am sure the next one will be why Olson or Penn will be called up instead of Albers or JJ.Hey, stop making fun of our friend Crazysilver, will ya? ;)

[Mike B]

Hey, stop making fun of our friend Crazysilver, will ya? ;)

No attempt was made to make fun of anybody:) BTW, Scott Moore is hitting .156 at Norfolk and Cintron is hitting .227 They could have purchased the contract of Terrero, and that would have made sense if they did not have intentions of sending one of the middle IFers down, shortly.

[Anonymous]

One thing a lot of folks are missing ... there is no way in the world that the Orioles PLAN to option Torres back to Norfolk in the next few days. A few days of his time is certainly not worth the cost of using a 40-man slot (these are valuable) and then spending an option (these are also valuable). Now it may turn out that they option him back, conceivably even within a short time-frame, if the entire set of circumstances at that point indicate that such a move would be best. But to think that this is their PLAN is just inconceivable.

[Mike B]

One thing a lot of folks are missing ... there is no way in the world that the Orioles PLAN to option Torres back to Norfolk in the next few days. A few days of his time is certainly not worth the cost of using a 40-man slot (these are valuable) and then spending an option (these are also valuable). Now it may turn out that they option him back, conceivably even within a short time-frame, if the entire set of circumstances at that point indicate that such a move would be best. But to think that this is their PLAN is just inconceivable.

I do agree that they are more likely to option Fahey but the spot on the 40 man is not as important as it normally would be. We were at 38 and still could move, Ray, Baez and Patton to the 60 day if need be.

[PoorMike]

One thing a lot of folks are missing ... there is no way in the world that the Orioles PLAN to option Torres back to Norfolk in the next few days. A few days of his time is certainly not worth the cost of using a 40-man slot (these are valuable) and then spending an option (these are also valuable). Now it may turn out that they option him back, conceivably even within a short time-frame, if the entire set of circumstances at that point indicate that such a move would be best. But to think that this is their PLAN is just inconceivable.


I think you aren't looking at the big picture. He's like 25 and has 2 options left. He'll be up and down the rest of this year and next year. By then, they should have a pretty good read on what his worth is. Using an option for a week's worth of time is just the short term impact.

This is not like calling up Fio a few years ago. In fact, I think ET is older than Fio.

[El Gordo]

No attempt was made to make fun of anybody:) BTW, Scott Moore is hitting .156 at Norfolk and Cintron is hitting .227 They could have purchased the contract of Terrero, and that would have made sense if they did not have intentions of sending one of the middle IFers down, shortly.No it wouldn't, he is out of options, once he's up he has to stay. So if you want to bring up Moore later you have to waive Terrero. Terrero is here in case we trade Payton.

[Mike B]

No it wouldn't, he is out of options, once he's up he has to stay. So if you want to bring up Moore later you have to waive Terrero. Terrero is here in case we trade Payton.

You are correct. Terrero would have to go through waivers. He would most likely clear but he did not last year.

[blueberryale77]

I think the decision has been made that either Luis or Brandon will be gone within the week. They just needed a couple of extra days to decide which one. That leads me to believe that they're leaning toward jettisoning LH because he would have to be DFA'd whereas Fahey could just be sent down. By the time Loewen's slot in the rotation comes around again I suspect at least two roster moves will have been made and the tale of the three no-hit shortstops will be nothing but a distant, scary memory.

[El Gordo]

I think the decision has been made that either Luis or Brandon will be gone within the week. They just needed a couple of extra days to decide which one. That leads me to believe that they're leaning toward jettisoning LH because he would have to be DFA'd whereas Fahey could just be sent down. By the time Loewen's slot in the rotation comes around again I suspect at least two roster moves will have been made and the tale of the three no-hit shortstops will be nothing but a distant, scary memory.
This would seem to me to be more reason to send down Fahey. Unless Torres can impress them that he should be the starting SS in 4 days. IMO either Torres or Fahey go down when the SP comes up Tuesday (most likely Fahey) and then one of LH or Torres goes when Bynum returns.

[blueberryale77]

This would seem to me to be more reason to send down Fahey. Unless Torres can impress them that he should be the starting SS in 4 days. IMO either Torres or Fahey go down when the SP comes up Tuesday (most likely Fahey) and then one of LH or Torres goes when Bynum returns.

What I meant was that it would be an easier decision to send down Fahey so if that was the way they were leaning they might have just done it already rather than have three non-hitting position players on the roster even for a few days. I've gotten the sense lately that they're really frustrated with Luis either for the much alluded to conditioning issue or for the quality of work he's put in with Samuel on his footwork and they may have given him some sort of ultimatum.

[Anonymous]

I think the decision has been made that either Luis or Brandon will be gone within the week. They just needed a couple of extra days to decide which one. That leads me to believe that they're leaning toward jettisoning LH because he would have to be DFA'd whereas Fahey could just be sent down. By the time Loewen's slot in the rotation comes around again I suspect at least two roster moves will have been made and the tale of the three no-hit shortstops will be nothing but a distant, scary memory.Good analysis here -- except there's no reason why the two moves would necessarily BOTH occur by the time of Loewen's next scheduled start (Tuesday??).

Olson could be brought up to start that game. A decision on whether Moore goes beyond the 20-day limit for his option to "fully vest" would have to be made by Thursday. If Olson is brought up and stays (no certainty, as it could also be a single spot start), and if Moore is recalled on that date (again, far from a certainty, but a possibility), one would think that LH and Aquino, in either order, might be the two players most at risk.

[blueberryale77]

FWIW here's the Sun's explanation of why Torres was called up:


Trembley said he isn't sure how Torres will be used yet, but he was more ready for the call-up then Alex Cintron, who is still recovering from elbow surgery, and Scott Moore, whom the club wants to get regular at-bats. Torres could be in for a short stay in the majors if the Orioles call up a pitcher from Norfolk -- Garrett Olson would be the likely candidate -- to take Loewen's spot.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-loewen425,0,2604228.story

This begs the question: did Cintron have more elbow surgery in between spring training with the Cubs and being activated with Norfolk or are we still talking about the surgery he had before the 2007 season? I've suspected all along there were serious arm issues with him. I doubt he makes it to the majors with us unless we trade Roberts and need someone to play 2B on a semi-regular basis in the second half.

[PoorMike]

I think the decision has been made that either Luis or Brandon will be gone within the week. They just needed a couple of extra days to decide which one. That leads me to believe that they're leaning toward jettisoning LH because he would have to be DFA'd whereas Fahey could just be sent down. By the time Loewen's slot in the rotation comes around again I suspect at least two roster moves will have been made and the tale of the three no-hit shortstops will be nothing but a distant, scary memory.

I think Torres is up here until Monday and then we'll get a starter (or at least another pitcher). Before I said that could change if Torres sets the world on fire, but realistically, he won't even get that many chances to get in the game over the next 3 days.

[blueberryale77]

I think Torres is up here until Monday and then we'll get a starter (or at least another pitcher). Before I said that could change if Torres sets the world on fire, but realistically, he won't even get that many chances to get in the game over the next 3 days.

I think they are fed up enough with Hernandez and Fahey at this point that at least one of them will go before Torres. He and/or the other one of them will probably go when Bynum is activated.