Is JP Ricciardi losing it?

[GeorgiaBird]

Nothing like trashing a player and yelling at a fan on a radio call in show to prove to the world the pressure is not getting to you. Thanks to FJM for the heads up...


Ricciardi slammed Dunn on his Wednesday night phone-in show on The Fan 590, a Toronto radio station. His comments came after a caller suggested the Jays acquire Dunn, who is hitting .227 with 18 homers and 43 RBIs with the Reds.

“Do you know the guy doesn’t really like baseball that much?” Ricciardi said to the caller. “Do you know the guy doesn’t have a passion to play the game that much? How much do you know about the player?

“There’s a reason why you’re attracted to some players and there’s a reason why you’re not attracted to some players. I don’t think you’d be very happy if we brought Adam Dunn here …

“We’ve done our homework on guys like Adam Dunn and there’s a reason why we don’t want Adam Dunn. I don’t want to get into specifics.”

Source (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/postedsports/archive/2008/06/19/jays-notebook-ricciardi-trashes-adam-dunn-on-radio-show.aspx)

[TGO]

Should have said the last thing he said first. And then stopped.

[J.D.]

That's funny. Everything I've ever read or seen about Dunn says completely the opposite regarding his drive and desire.

Riccardi's losing it. Yipes.

[twoBshorty]

Ricciardi has a history of this. He's publicly trashed Frank Thomas, Shea Hillenbrand (who probably deserved it), and AJ Burnett. He tells bold-faced lies about injuries. He doesn't seem to be able to control his mouth in an adult fashion. It will probably come back to bite him in the future.

"I don't want to get into specifics?" Too late!

[blueberryale77]

Ricciardi has a history of this. He's publicly trashed Frank Thomas, Shea Hillenbrand (who probably deserved it), and AJ Burnett. He tells bold-faced lies about injuries. He doesn't seem to be able to control his mouth in an adult fashion. It will probably come back to bite him in the future.

"I don't want to get into specifics?" Too late!

I can't imagine why it hasn't yet. The guy has no class. Neither does John Gibbons, for that matter.

[GeorgiaBird]

I should have linked to the FJM response for some good thoughts on those comments. For example...


You say he's a .230, .240 hitter (it's actually .247) -- I say he's a career .382 OBP hitter. Compare that to, I don't know, the quintessential table setter, the most professional hitter in bat sports, my nomination for first man to walk on Mars, Derek Sanderson Jeter -- career .386 OBP hitter.

Yes, Dunn hits home runs. He has 18 this year. Your Toronto Blue Jay home run leader this year: Matt Stairs, with 8.

Dude, again, I'm not saying you should definitely trade for Adam Dunn. He's not a savior by any means. But your current leader in OPS is Rod Barajas, at .821.

...

Current Adam Dunn, despite his piss-poor .227 BA, would lead your team in R, HR, RBI, OBP, SLG, and (of course) OPS. But you're not "attracted" to him, naturally, because he's such a passionless ----.

Source again (http://www.firejoemorgan.com/)

[GeorgiaBird]

Ricciardi has a history of this. He's publicly trashed Frank Thomas, Shea Hillenbrand (who probably deserved it), and AJ Burnett. He tells bold-faced lies about injuries. He doesn't seem to be able to control his mouth in an adult fashion. It will probably come back to bite him in the future.

"I don't want to get into specifics?" Too late!


Hillenbrand is a unique case. By most accounts he is a jerk, but what Ricciardi went off on him for -- leaving the team to be with his wife for the birth of their child -- was more than a little off. Surely Ricciardi would have said nothing had it been his wife delivering the child. I don't see why an adoption should be any different.

[backwardsk]

"The ship is sinking" --Shea Hillenbrand

[ChaosLex]

In light of Ricciardi's comments, Dunn said he could completely rule out a trade north of the border.

"If anything happens, I ain't going to Toronto," Dunn said. "I can eliminate one team. I'm not converting my dollars to loonies and toonies just yet."


http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080619&content_id=2962515&vkey=news_tor&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

[J.D.]

Ladies and Gentlemen... my impression of J.P. Ricciardi attempting to evaluate talent:

:drek:

That is all.

[RShack]

Much like ballplayers, GM's should practice their cliches and stick to them.
People say they want to hear something else, but we really don't.
It turns out bad every time it happens.
Whenever a reporter asks what a baseball person really thinks, they should never, ever tell the truth... unless the truth is cliche-compatible...

[blueberryale77]

Much like ballplayers, GM's should practice their cliches and stick to them.
People say they want to hear something else, but we really don't.
It turns out bad every time it happens.
Whenever a reporter asks what a baseball person really thinks, they should never, ever tell the truth... unless the truth is cliche-compatible...

There is no need to personally insult someone's character, period. You don't want to sign him, fine. Just explain it in a way that's not demeaning him as a human being. It's not Adam Dunn's fault JP Ricciardi didn't like the question he was asked as part of his job. Professional people in every field handle questions about why they didn't want to hire somebody every day, whether in private conversations or in public. Most of them manage to come up with a polite answer about how that person just didn't fit with their company. If you don't have something nice to say... maybe you should just use a cliche.

[BaltBird 24]

All he said was Adam Dunn doesn't like baseball that much. It's very possible, especially considering he had signed a LOI to play QB at Texas. I'd say it's very likely that there are quite a few mulit-sport athletes playing today who don't particularly care for the game they play, they just happen to play it because it's what they stood they best chance of making a career out of.

I don't see this as a sign that Ricciardi is 'losing it' by any means.

[TyCobb]

I thought your not allowed to talk about an other teams player? Couldn't the Reds make a case that this hurt Dunn's trade value and get the Blue Jays fined?

[Lt Melmo]

I thought your not allowed to talk about an other teams player? Couldn't the Reds make a case that this hurt Dunn's trade value and get the Blue Jays fined?
I was about to ask why the players' union hasn't spoken up yet.

[Hank Scorpio]

Adam Dunn is my new favorite baseball player.

[hoosiers]

Ricciardi is living on borrowed time and should have been let go three years ago. His drafting has been awful, his FA signings mediocre and his trades mediocre. He has benefited from ownership ramping up the payroll more than a lot of teams and his teams are very top-heavy. If any of his top five or six guys get hurt, the team has so much invested in those guys that it folds like a house of cards.

I'm surprised he still has his GM job. Someone will have to do the research, but I believe several of the very best players on that team were in the organization before JP was hired. He was supposedly one of the "young guy" GMs, but he will leave Toronto worse off than when he arrived.

[HeatherC12]

You should read Adam Dunn's response, LOL ;) He was understandably not happy and I love him for telling it like it is. Dunn is a very laid back guy but to say he doesn't care about baseball or his team is completely untrue. Here's the link to Adam's response along with a few other details.

http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080507&content_id=2655965&vkey=news_cin&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin


"I know nothing about this clown. I have no idea who he is," Dunn said. "I don't really care what one guy thinks, to be honest with you. If I'm a GM, I don't know if I would go out of my way to kind of discredit a player."

After talking for a few more minutes, Dunn showed he really did care about Ricciardi's comments.

"It [ticks] me off, to be honest with you," Dunn said. "He doesn't even know me. If he knew me, fine, say what you want. This guy doesn't know anything about me, other than what he sees on whatever 'SportsCenter' they have up there. That's it."

[furryburres]

All he said was Adam Dunn doesn't like baseball that much. It's very possible, especially considering he had signed a LOI to play QB at Texas. I'd say it's very likely that there are quite a few mulit-sport athletes playing today who don't particularly care for the game they play, they just happen to play it because it's what they stood they best chance of making a career out of.

I don't see this as a sign that Ricciardi is 'losing it' by any means.

The guy questioned his drive, said he's only an all-or-nothing hitter (not a TTO hitter, which is what he is), his love for the game, and said the fans would dislike him. That's an insult. Dunn happens to be someone who works at what he plays. And with your right field situation in the same little mess as the O's SS situation, you can't be a chooser, because you are definitely a begger.

The fact is, people like JP Ricciardi should just shut up, or say all the cliches, before they get themselves utterly embarrased. Or manage to piss off the utterly worst organization to piss off, the PO. He should just leave the non-cliche talking to players like Brian Bannister, who sometimes know what heck they're vomiting out of their mouth.

It's okay. He can ruin his team from the inside, or deliberately ignore trading for someone who can help his team in two of their most pressing areas, RF and a power hitter. His team is in our division, and it's crumbling under his own eyes. If he wants to ignore it, then he can be my guest.

[bryanman8]

JP Riccardi is an idiot. None of his moves for like the past 3-4 years have made any sense.

I used to group him in with the "Moneyball" GMs too but when a guy comes out and complains about not getting a .900-.950ish OPS player because he has a low BA, strikes out a ton, and doesn't have passion (which appears almost completely made up), it makes me wonder what the hell is wrong with this guy. Somebody in Toronto needs to convince the owner to stop listening to him because he has no idea what he's doing.

[furryburres]

JP Riccardi is an idiot. None of his moves for like the past 3-4 years have made any sense.

I used to group him in with the "Moneyball" GMs too but when a guy comes out and complains about not getting a .900-.950ish OPS player because he has a low BA, strikes out a ton, and doesn't have passion (which appears almost completely made up), it makes me wonder what the hell is wrong with this guy. Somebody in Toronto needs to convince the owner to stop listening to him because he has no idea what he's doing.

Unfortunately, I think Rogers Company has no interest in the game...

[whatdoiget000]

He just rode Billy Beane's coattails to this job...and he going to be figured out soon.

[blueberryale77]

JP Riccardi is an idiot. None of his moves for like the past 3-4 years have made any sense.

I used to group him in with the "Moneyball" GMs too but when a guy comes out and complains about not getting a .900-.950ish OPS player because he has a low BA, strikes out a ton, and doesn't have passion (which appears almost completely made up), it makes me wonder what the hell is wrong with this guy. Somebody in Toronto needs to convince the owner to stop listening to him because he has no idea what he's doing.

That 47 million $ contract to a free agent closer wasn't very "money ball" either.

[Roy Firestone]

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080619&content_id=2962515&vkey=news_tor&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor
Allow me to throw my hat in the ring for a consideration. A ton of K's. No doubt. But he walks alot and hits a sick number of HR's. DH? i can think of alot worse choices. Adam Dunn(assuming there is no Tex) would not be the worst signing. He could hit .220 for me and strike out. But if he crashes 40 again and 110 RBI'S..at 28 years old...Id gladly take him.

[bryanman8]

That 47 million $ contract to a free agent closer wasn't very "money ball" either.
Yeah, signing David Eckstein, releasing Frank Thomas basically 'cus he was fat...He's been almost the Anti-Moneyball.

[scOtt]

Nothing like trashing a player and yelling at a fan on a radio call in show to prove to the world the pressure is not getting to you. Thanks to FJM for the heads up...



Source (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/postedsports/archive/2008/06/19/jays-notebook-ricciardi-trashes-adam-dunn-on-radio-show.aspx)
Very similar situation to that Seattle GM... trashing Bedard, after a very suspect tenureof his own...

And y'all saw what happened to Bavasi. ;)

[Mackus]

Allow me to throw my hat in the ring for a consideration. A ton of K's. No doubt. But he walks alot and hits a sick number of HR's. DH? i can think of alot worse choices. Adam Dunn(assuming there is no Tex) would not be the worst signing. He could hit .220 for me and strike out. But if he crashes 40 again and 110 RBI'S..at 28 years old...Id gladly take him.The only thing that scares me about Dunn is that he doesn't strike me as someone who is going to age very gracefully. Tex seems like a safer bet over a long-term deal.

Dunn will be 29 next year. I think he's probably got another 3-4 years of maintaining his very high level, but I'd be dubious of him remaining that great much beyond that. Of course I could be wrong and he could keep hitting well into his late 30's, but I definitely do think that Tex is a safer investment for big money. I think both will get similar deal, Tex probably gets an extra year and a couple extra million per year though. But Tex plays a GG 1B, Dunn would be a DH for us.

[davearm]

The guy questioned his drive, said he's only an all-or-nothing hitter (not a TTO hitter, which is what he is), his love for the game, and said the fans would dislike him. That's an insult. Dunn happens to be someone who works at what he plays. And with your right field situation in the same little mess as the O's SS situation, you can't be a chooser, because you are definitely a begger.

The fact is, people like JP Ricciardi should just shut up, or say all the cliches, before they get themselves utterly embarrased. Or manage to piss off the utterly worst organization to piss off, the PO. He should just leave the non-cliche talking to players like Brian Bannister, who sometimes know what heck they're vomiting out of their mouth.

It's okay. He can ruin his team from the inside, or deliberately ignore trading for someone who can help his team in two of their most pressing areas, RF and a power hitter. His team is in our division, and it's crumbling under his own eyes. If he wants to ignore it, then he can be my guest.
JMHO of course, but what seems to be getting lost because Ricciardi shouldn't have said what he said here is, what he said is probably accurate.

The Jays have a whole staff of folks (scouts, coaches, etc) spread throughout baseball standing next to batting cages, hanging around clubhouses, and chatting in hotel bars, whose collective job is to gather just this sort of information on players.

I'd say Ricciardi and the Jays' FO know a whole lot more about Adam Dunn than any of us do, so if he/they question the guy's drive, I'm inclined to think there's something to it.

[Mad Mark]

Just repeat after me, Mr GM-on-the-radio:

"We're always looking for players who can upgrade our club, if the price is right. In this case, we didn't think the price was right. Next question?"

[HeatherC12]

I'd say Ricciardi and the Jays' FO know a whole lot more about Adam Dunn than any of us do, so if he/they question the guy's drive, I'm inclined to think there's something to it.

And I'd say that Reds fans who have watched Dunn play 150-160 games pretty much every year since he came up, watched him play through major and minor injuries, and who have seen him always give it his all in LF (even if sometimes that's not very pretty) know more about him and his character than the Blue Jays front office. The last thing I would ever say about Adam Dunn is that he doesn't care or that he has no drive to play baseball. This guy is a professional and always does what he can to help the team. He's the guy several of the rookie players all credit with helping them make the adjustment to the big leagues. Adam is a very laid back person but that doesn't mean that he doesn't care and I don't think that guy should have said anything at all.

BTW-JP did apologize to the Reds for everything. Not that it makes it totally better but at least he realizes now that he sounded like an idiot.

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20080620/SPT04/806200426/

[furryburres]

JMHO of course, but what seems to be getting lost because Ricciardi shouldn't have said what he said here is, what he said is probably accurate.

The Jays have a whole staff of folks (scouts, coaches, etc) spread throughout baseball standing next to batting cages, hanging around clubhouses, and chatting in hotel bars, whose collective job is to gather just this sort of information on players.

I'd say Ricciardi and the Jays' FO know a whole lot more about Adam Dunn than any of us do, so if he/they question the guy's drive, I'm inclined to think there's something to it.

At the time I made my post, Dunn had already totally rejected his arguments, stating "Who is this clown?" The one who knows best Dunn's capabilities and incapabilities is him himself.

Ricciardi then apoologized today, effectively confirming that he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Besides, scouts can't tell you if a player likes the game he plays. They grade physical performance, it's not like they know what a player himself is thinking. Gathering information on hearsay is a ridiculous way to go about judging a player.

[davearm]

At the time I made my post, Dunn had already totally rejected his arguments, stating "Who is this clown?" The one who knows best Dunn's capabilities and incapabilities is him himself.

Ricciardi then apoologized today, effectively confirming that he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Besides, scouts can't tell you if a player likes the game he plays. They grade physical performance, it's not like they know what a player himself is thinking. Gathering information on hearsay is a ridiculous way to go about judging a player.
The bolded is complete nonsense. Ricciardi still believes all the things he said about Dunn, and I'm sure his confidence in his information is unchanged.

Now he shouldn't have opened his mouth and shared his feelings on the subject with the world, that much is clear, and for that he was right to apologize.

And scouts absolutely do make judgements on things like character, makeup, attitude, coachability, etc. That stuff is well within the scope of their evaluation.

Now maybe the Jays are dead wrong about Dunn. That's obviously possible. But don't think for a moment that their collective opinion has changed one bit.

[Mad Mark]

Now maybe the Jays are dead wrong about Dunn. That's obviously possible. But don't think for a moment that their collective opinion has changed one bit.

My guess is it has...it now includes: "would likely retire rather than play for us." :rofl:

[blueberryale77]

Maybe Ricciardi has gone so far off the deep end after firing John Gibbons to distract the press from his own gaffe that he's hearing voices (although more likely this was just a prankster somewhere in the Reds organization):

Reds' Dunn says he never called Jays GM Ricciardi to bury hatchet (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3459660)


Ricciardi believes he may have been the victim of a prank.

"I got a call from someone who identified himself as Adam Dunn," Ricciardi said. "It's extremely disappointing if that's not an accurate phone call. I apologized to the person on the phone."

[HeatherC12]

Maybe Ricciardi has gone so far off the deep end after firing John Gibbons to distract the press from his own gaffe that he's hearing voices (although more likely this was just a prankster somewhere in the Reds organization):

Reds' Dunn says he never called Jays GM Ricciardi to bury hatchet (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3459660)

The problem with it potentially being someone in the Reds organization is that the area code of the call was 519 which is NOT a US area code (our Reds beat writer reported the area code last night). That's a code to Ontario, Canada and it's not even in the Toronto area either. I'm thinking someone in Canada played a prank on Riccardi and not anyone in the Reds organization. They have enough to worry about right now without dealing with Riccardi, LOL ;)