Sat July 26 LAA @ BAL

[porterhouse]

O's lineup (via Roch):

Brian Roberts - 2B
Adam Jones - CF
Nick Markakis - RF
Aubrey Huff - DH
Melvin Mora - 3B
Luke Scott - LF
Kevin Millar - 1B
Ramon Hernandez - C
Juan Castro - SS

Radhames Liz - P

[The Rick]

THAT'S what i'm talking about!!! Starting a game thread an hour before the game, hells yeah!

We're going to win tonight and rock the socks off of Garland. Let's go O's!!!

[Zanetheo'sfan]

I have a good feeling about Liz tonight.

Seriously, if he bombs, feel free to neg rep me.:o

[Big Mac]

I'm gonna say 4 IP, 6 ER for Liz tonight.

Hope I'm wrong

[Saintbird]

I'm gonna say 4 IP, 6 ER for Liz tonight.

Hope I'm wrong

I'll go with 5IP, 3ER. I hope I'm right

[Saintbird]

I'm watching on gameday so if anything remarkable happens tell me.

[Saintbird]

Why is Izturis batting third?

[Big Mac]

I'll go with 5IP, 3ER. I hope I'm right

I hope you're right too.

[Big Mac]

Ramon should have gone out to talk to Liz after he threw 5 straight balls.:(

[Saintbird]

So far i'm not liking it

[PaulFolk]

I'm watching on gameday so if anything remarkable happens tell me.
Ramon made a terrible throw to second on the SB attempt. That's probably not remarkable, though.

[Big Mac]

Ramon made a terrible throw to second on the SB attempt. That's probably not remarkable, though.

I think that was pretty much a given when he saw they had a stolen base attempt.

[Moose Milligan]

Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeere we go again...

[Saintbird]

Ramon made a terrible throw to second on the SB attempt. That's probably not remarkable, though.

Man! I so wish we had orioles games in (classified)!

[Saintbird]

well... i'm going to try my own lucky o's cap

[Big Mac]

Nice rip by Jones!

[Saintbird]

A glimpse of hope!

[Big Mac]

Now would be a great time for Huff's 20th bomb.

[Saintbird]

I think I'll keep my hat on

[Big Mac]

I totally called that!

[Fist Bump]

Yes 3-2 O's! :gallden:

[JTrea81]

Huff Daddy is on fire!

[MurphDogg]

Man, I am listening to the game on the radio, but hearing the crack of the bat on that homerun it sounded pretty sweet.

[brvn52]

Wood and Adenhart here we come! :D

:clap3:

[Saintbird]

I totally called that!

Man, ok will I get married?:pray:

[JTrea81]

Wood and Adenhart here we come! :D

:clap3:

I don't want either.

I'd rather have the two first round picks...

[Big Mac]

Man, ok will I get married?:pray:

I don't know man, I'm not cupid!:D

[Saintbird]

I don't know man, I'm not cupid!:D

That's ok I got a long while to wait anyway

[MurphDogg]

Montanez and Reimold homered back-to-back in the first inning for Bowie. It was their 22nd and 18th of the year respectively.

[Big Mac]

Montanez and Reimold homered back-to-back in the first inning for Bowie. It was their 22nd and 18th of the year respectively.

They're good.

[MurphDogg]

They're good.

If we ever have strong enough starting pitching to have a 12-man staff, I would like Montanez as the 25th man. Regardless, both should see some time in September. It's sort of amazing that we haven't had any injuries among our regulars that have necessitated bringing either of these guys up (knock on wood).

[Big Mac]

Man, he's almost got Kendrick.

[Big Mac]

6-4-3 double play!

[mrbig1]

Just got home. just in time for a DP.

[Saintbird]

Way to go Castro...hey that rhymes! Nice Dp!:clap3:

[JTrea81]

Nice inning for Liz. Hopefully he can keep that up...

[Big Mac]

Nice inning for Liz. Hopefully he can keep that up...

As long as Liz stays ahead of hitters he'll be fine.

The only time he gets hit is when he is behind in the count.

[Big Mac]

Nice shot by Ramon!

[Saintbird]

As long as Liz stays ahead of hitters he'll be fine.

The only time he gets hit is when he is behind in the count.

and in case you guys haven't noticed, that's a lot

[mrbig1]

well... i'm going to try my own lucky o's cap

Yes please use yours. Mine been sent to the minors.

[MurphDogg]

Mathis overestimates Ramon's speed and Ramon successfully pulled the maneuver that Brian Roberts got lambasted for about a month ago, reversing course halfway when he knew he would have been thrown out.

[The Rick]

It's pretty sad, I haven't gotten upset about our SS position since LH had the job coming out of ST. In fact, whenever one of our SS's does something I refer to it as the SS position.

The SS position just grounded into an inning ending double play, figure that one out.

[Saintbird]

Mathis overestimates Ramon's speed and Ramon successfully pulled the maneuver that Brian Roberts got lambasted for about a month ago, reversing course halfway when he knew he would have been thrown out.

Well it's not like he really thought he could steal...did he?

[Saintbird]

Ok, I know it happens to everyone, but I think it's official, Castro is 36 and he's horrible.

[MurphDogg]

Well it's not like he really thought he could steal...did he?

No, and I made this point on the Roberts play, on a blown hit and run, it is not a terrible idea to reverse course as the baserunner in the hopes that the throw will go through to second base immediately which it does most of the time.

[The Rick]

Ok, I know it happens to everyone, but I think it's official, Castro is 36 and he's horrible.

Our SS position is horrible, regardless of who mans it.

[MurphDogg]

Figgins, the Orioles killer returns...

[The Rick]

Yeah, it's time for Liz to go down. He isn't growing AT ALL up here.

He sucks.

You can almost see the logic behind Steve Trachsel now, though I didn't agree with it and still don't on principle. But you cannot count your chickens before they hatch.

It's not that Liz & Olson won't be decent big leaguers, but they're not ready and they're showing no signs of improving.

[cbm5042]

How horrible is Liz. The answer? Really horrible.

[Burg]

Liz is showing that his astronomical ERA in Norfolk was no fluke.

How bad is our staff?

I know that they are young and it goes with the territory but man is it frustrating to watch.

[Burg]

Wow.

This is like a beer league softball game.

[Moose Milligan]

This is f'ing painful.

Hang Liz out there to dry, the bullpen is tired enough.

[cbm5042]

It absolutely cannot continue. Our offense is very good and it doesn't matter because our starters throw batting practice. Bergesen, Hernandez, Berken, and Penn should all get try outs AND we need to start trading for pitchers like Reyes who was acquired for a high A ball reliever? We can't give that up?! Seriously. Unacceptable. If I was the offensive players on the O's I would start organizing a blanket party, full metal jacket style for Liz.

[Big Mac]

I really don't think Liz can stay in the rotation anymore.

He didn't pitch well in Norfolk this year, let him go down and start there for the rest of the year.

Replace Liz and Burres in the rotation with Penn and Bergesen.

I'd still leave Olson in because he dominated in AAA, unlike Liz. Sending Olson to AAA wouldn't do him any good.

[The Rick]

This is f'ing painful.

Hang Liz out there to dry, the bullpen is tired enough.

I dunno, I think they should leave Liz out there myself. Give the BP as much rest as it can get.

[cbm5042]

Does anybody else just want to shake Liz and scream "Stop It!" I know I do.

[Balmer Bomber]

The Liz experiment needs to come to a close. I hate seeing the O's have to score 8+ runs to win games in which he starts.

And for all of those people who say that the O's don't need starting pitching in the off season:

Exhibit A. Brian Burres last night
Exhibit B. Radhames Liz tonight

I know we have pitching prospects in the farm system, but wasn't Liz one of our best pitching prospects.

[cbm5042]

Andy Mac just said that we're going to have to fix the rotation internally and externally and its going to happen soon.

[Big Mac]

That was a nice pitch by Liz.

[MurphDogg]

Liz strikes out Kendrick, he's fantastic!!!

OVERREACTIONS!!!!!!

[mrbig1]

Welcome to the 11th annual 2nd half nose dive. Welcome my old friend. I thought this might be the year you leave us alone.

[Saintbird]

Man I took off my hat so I could take a shower and look what happens.

[cbm5042]

Thats an odd sentence. You "took your hat off" so you could take a shower? Well, alright I mean I guess its true that shouldn't shower with a hat on but does that prevent you from taking one? And was that the only thing necessary before a shower was possible? Its just a very strange comment.

Its like "Man I took off my mittens before mowing the lawn and look what happens"

[Bleed Orange]

sounds like he was sitting around naked watching the game wearing his lucky hat.

[Saintbird]

sounds like he was sitting around naked watching the game wearing his lucky hat.

I just meant I went to take a shower so I took off my hat... whatever it doesn't matter we're still losing:angryfire:

[porterhouse]

Table set for Ramon to pop one.

[cbm5042]

Haha it still doesn't make sense lol as far as relevant information goes but its hilarious.
I mean I understand I went to take a shower or I went to take off my hat (although that implies its a time consuming event) but why combine the two together? lol

[Big Mac]

Table set for Ramon to pop one.

If I were the Angels I'd walk him to get to Castro.

[Balmer Bomber]

Table set for Ramon to pop one.

Do you mean pop one to the 2B.

(I hate to be the negative nancy, but it's been a rough day at the Bomber Mansion.)

[Saintbird]

Haha it still doesn't make sense lol as far as relevant information goes but its hilarious.
I mean I understand I went to take a shower or I went to take off my hat (although that implies its a time consuming event) but why combine the two together? lol

Ok please, I'm laughing to hard to watch the game!

[mrbig1]

What a let down.:angryfire:

[Saintbird]

Wieters is looking so good right now.

[The Rick]

The other thing that blows about this mess is that we're in game #10 out of 14 in a row. How screwed up is that? MLB hands us a cool 14 games in a row without a day off following the All-Star break. That's pretty ridiculous, especially considering we were one of just 8 teams to have a 3 day All-Star break, instead of a 4 day break.

[millartime15]

I wonder why Nick always wears long sleeve under armour.

[Bleed Orange]

I wonder why Nick always wears long sleeve under armour.

cause he gets PAIDDD.

[Big Mac]

Man, Kendrick was OUT!:cussing:

[Bleed Orange]

when it rains it pours.

[Col. Claypool]

Man, Kendrick was OUT!:cussing:

I am surprised that no one challenged that call.

[cbm5042]

Yeah they should have thrown the red flag... oh wait. UPDATE - Liz is an idiot.

[Col. Claypool]

Why the heck is the pitcher even anywhere near that ball?

[Moose Milligan]

Liz dude, WTF?

[Balmer Bomber]

And the problems compound.

Hopefully Cormier can put out the fire and not just fan the flames.

[cbm5042]

I'd bet money that Liz is sent down and this is his last start of the season.

[Moose Milligan]

It was inevitable that he was going to walk him after that.

Great, now he loads the bases for the reliever. Who's coming in? I didn't see.

Anyway, he made it past the 5th. Unbelievable.

[MurphDogg]

Just saw the Kendrick call on Gameday video, it was pretty bad...

[Col. Claypool]

Yeah they should have thrown the red flag... oh wait. UPDATE - Liz is an idiot.

Yeah, I obviously meant to argue the call. It just seemed a bit odd that Millar didn't even question it.

[PaulFolk]

It was inevitable that he was going to walk him after that.

Great, now he loads the bases for the reliever. Who's coming in? I didn't see.

Anyway, he made it past the 5th. Unbelievable.
Cormier is in.

[Big Mac]

I feel really bad for Liz.

[Moose Milligan]

C'mon Cormier.....

[Big Mac]

He took care of that easy

[Moose Milligan]

Glad to see the bullpen wipes another starters arse.

Let's get some runs.

[Col. Claypool]

I feel really bad for Liz.

I feel worse for you and your injury situation. I think Liz needs to go back down.

[Saintbird]

Finally something I feel good talking about,and strangely that happend as soon as I put my hat on...:scratchchinhmm:

[Scrat1]

I feel really bad for Liz.

I just keep telling myself he's just learning and it will pay off later. Hopefully I'm not deluding myself. It'd be fantastic if he could become a decent starter, but really I'd take a reliever, or someone that has a functioning labrum.

Good job by Cormier.

[Scrat1]

I am in love with Aubrey Huff.

That should be a t-shirt. "I'm in Luff with Aubrey Huff."

[Col. Claypool]

I just keep telling myself he's just learning and it will pay off later. Hopefully I'm not deluding myself. It'd be fantastic if he could become a decent starter, but really I'd take a reliever, or someone that has a functioning labrum.

Good job by Cormier.

He may someday become a decent SP, though I have always thought he should have come into the ML as a reliever first.

[Balmer Bomber]

I feel really bad for Liz.

I would feel more sorry for the offense who I'm sure feels like they need to score 8 runs to win with him on the mound.

Or you could feel bad for the bullpen who has to work 4-6 innings every game he pitches.

But I wouldn't feel sorry for a guy who was given his opportunity in the bigs to show what he could do and not execute.

[Saintbird]

:notworthy: We all love you aubrey.

[Col. Claypool]

That was an absolute bomb. Great job, Luke!

[Big Mac]

Luuuuuuuuuuuukkkkkkkkkeee!

[Balmer Bomber]

Luke Scott is my home boy.

[Moose Milligan]

I hope LUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUKE stays here for a long time.

[Scrat1]

Haha. Wow. Luke Scott. What a monster.

[cbm5042]

I'd like to say one thing... BOOM. If we had anything resembling a respectable pitching staff we would be a scary team this year thats why I hate our starters so much (except Guthrie)

[jamessemaj]

Alright! NO COMING UP SHORT TONIGHT -- I WANT A "W"!!

[porterhouse]

Lucius!!!!

[Saintbird]

Luuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuke!, nice job, don't 4 get about the hat guys.

[Col. Claypool]

Haha. Luke puts Garland in the book twice.

[Big Mac]

I would feel more sorry for the offense who I'm sure feels like they need to score 8 runs to win with him on the mound.

Or you could feel bad for the bullpen who has to work 4-6 innings every game he pitches.

But I wouldn't feel sorry for a guy who was given his opportunity in the bigs to show what he could do and not execute.

You make it seem like he isn't trying.

I feel sorry for him because it has become clear that he is being asked to do something he just isn't ready to.

Liz had terrible command and mechanics in the minors. I don't know why people expected him to come up here and get big league hitters out when he couldn't throw strikes in the minors.

[MurphDogg]

So does this mean Garland shouldn't get another start this season?

[Saintbird]

You make it seem like he isn't trying.

I feel sorry for him because it has become clear that he is being asked to do something he just isn't ready to.

Liz had terrible command and mechanics in the minors. I don't know why people expected him to come up here and get big league hitters out when he couldn't throw strikes in the minors.

Perfectly said, he needs to prove himself in the minors, heck every pitcher should prove himself in the minors before he gets called up to the bigs.

[cbm5042]

Why didn't he swing at that?!

[scOtt]

You make it seem like he isn't trying.

I feel sorry for him because it has become clear that he is being asked to do something he just isn't ready to.

Liz had terrible command and mechanics in the minors. I don't know why people expected him to come up here and get big league hitters out when he couldn't throw strikes in the minors.
I noticed that just tonight! Liz' mechanics are a LOT better now. Last year he was falling off towards 1st so bad that he'd lose his balance. Tonight, he still falls off, but not near as bad. He's still balanced. If there is such a thing, I'd say he's at least ML average.

His command was good at times tonight... just horrendous at other times. Don't let the bonehead popup play sway your judgement. It's meaningless.

[JTrea81]

LUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUKE!

<img src=http://thebigo.mvpmods.com/luke.jpg></img>

[cbm5042]

Oh thank god, Castro is coming up our prayers have been answered. Yep he is OFFICIALLY awful.

[JTrea81]

Chipping away at the lead. These guys don't give up, but we've got to score next inning because Shields and K-Rod are tough...

[Saintbird]

Perfectly said, he needs to prove himself in the minors, heck every pitcher should prove himself in the minors before he gets called up to the bigs.

Castro though I think he should go to the minors and stay!:angryfire::cussing:

[MurphDogg]

Haha, Joe Angel calling Arredondo the player to be named later as he used to be known as Francisco De La Cruz.

[Scrat1]

I missed the last couple of games. Was Fahey injured or something? I don't see why this guy is playing over Fahey unless it's a late game defensive replacement. I'm actually coming around on Fahey. He's nothing fantastic, but he is less frustrating to watch than the others.

[Big Mac]

I noticed that just tonight! Liz' mechanics are a LOT better now. Last year he was falling off towards 1st so bad that he'd lose his balance. Tonight, he still falls off, but not near as bad. He's still balanced. If there is such a thing, I'd say he's at least ML average.

His command was good at times tonight... just horrendous at other times. Don't let the bonehead popup play sway your judgement. It's meaningless.

Yeah, his mechanics are better, but he's still git a ways to go, IMO.

I think that people forget that this is a guy who had a walk rate of 4.5 BB/9 in his minor league career. if you are overpowering, you can get away with that in the minors, not so much in the majors.

the fact that Liz has struggled in the majors should come as a surprise to no one.

[Balmer Bomber]

You make it seem like he isn't trying.

I feel sorry for him because it has become clear that he is being asked to do something he just isn't ready to.

Liz had terrible command and mechanics in the minors. I don't know why people expected him to come up here and get big league hitters out when he couldn't throw strikes in the minors.

I'm sure he is trying, and it might be that he is trying too much. Many young pitchers are accused of trying to much.

But when a guy is called up into the rotation and pitches to a 7.47 era and walks 32 guys in 47 innings, that is quite disconcerting. Don't forget he walked 23 in 24.2 inning last season.

[Big Mac]

I missed the last couple of games. Was Fahey injured or something? I don't see why this guy is playing over Fahey unless it's a late game defensive replacement. I'm actually coming around on Fahey. He's nothing fantastic, but he is less frustrating to watch than the others.

He's not hurt, at least not that I know of.

Trembley seems to love Juan Castro for some reason.:confused:

[Saintbird]

I missed the last couple of games. Was Fahey injured or something? I don't see why this guy is playing over Fahey unless it's a late game defensive replacement. I'm actually coming around on Fahey. He's nothing fantastic, but he is less frustrating to watch than the others.

No it's just the Birdland tradition... you don't know it?... Well basicially we make stupid mistakes.

[Saintbird]

Ramon!!!!!!!!!!:clap3:

[Big Mac]

I'm sure he is trying, and it might be that he is trying too much. Many young pitchers are accused of trying to much.

But when a guy is called up into the rotation and pitches to a 7.47 era and walks 32 guys in 47 innings, that is quite disconcerting. Don't forget he walked 23 in 24.2 inning last season.

Yeah, but he had an unimpressive 4.05 ERA in Norfolk, an environment that heavily favors pitchers.

He walked a ton of guys in the minors, and pitchers walk rates generally increase when they first go to the majors, so I don't really get what you were expecting?

I didn't expect much more from Liz, why would he all of a sudden be able to throw strikes in the Majors when he couldn't in the minors?:confused:

[Balmer Bomber]

Yeah, but he had an unimpressive 4.05 ERA in Norfolk, an environment that heavily favors pitchers.

He walked a ton of guys in the minors, and pitchers walk rates generally increase when they first go to the majors, so I don't really get what you were expecting?

I didn't expect much more from Liz, why would he all of a sudden be able to throw strikes in the Majors when he couldn't in the minors?:confused:

Well you kind of answered your own question. If he couldn't throw strikes in the minors, why was he called up in the first place?

This will be my last say on the matter. I don't want to hi-jack the game thread. Someone (it might have been you) said that it's okay to have a high walk rate if the K rate is up there as well, but if he has only struck out one more guy than he has walked this season, he needs to go down and work on something. I think the guy has pitched his last game as an O for this season baring catastrophe.

[porterhouse]

Well now we'll have to do it off Shields or K-Rod.

[Scrat1]

Well now we'll have to do it off Shields or K-Rod.

You mean Shields will have to do it against Huff and Scott.

[Scrat1]

Cormier, I love you, but I think it may be time for Bradford. Is he available?

[Saintbird]

No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!:eek:

[Big Mac]

Well you kind of answered your own question. If he couldn't throw strikes in the minors, why was he called up in the first place?

This will be my last say on the matter. I don't want to hi-jack the game thread. Someone (it might have been you) said that it's okay to have a high walk rate if the K rate is up there as well, but if he has only struck out one more guy than he has walked this season, he needs to go down and work on something. I think the guy has pitched his last game as an O for this season baring catastrophe.

I'm pretty sure it wasn't me who made the comments about walks and K rate.

Anyway, I was just making the point that people are getting really upset and talking about how he didn't take advantage of his opportunity.

My response to that was, based on his wildness in the minor league, what did you expect?

I completely agree with you his K:BB ratio is terrible

I would send Liz down to start at Norfolk and would not call him up until he had his BB/9 below 3.5.

In fact, if I had it my way, I would do this with all of our Mil pitchers before I brought them up.

[Big Mac]

F-Cab has nasty off-speed stuff!

[Saintbird]

:angryfire:as I said before no!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

[porterhouse]

..Ballgame..

[Scrat1]

That was unpleasant.

[Scrat1]

Need some serious Orioles Magic here.

[Saintbird]

I just relized I took off my hat, don't ask me why

[Scrat1]

At least it isn't Shields.

[Col. Claypool]

That looked and sounded pretty painful.

[Balmer Bomber]

As hot as his bat has been, I really hope Mora is good. I would take him out for the rest of the game.

[Saintbird]

c'mon Millar!

[cindyluvsbrady]

My Poor Melvin!!!!!!!!:002_scry::old5fan:
cindydoesntluvdarren:angryfire:

[Fist Bump]

Nice play by Hunter....ughhhhh

[Scrat1]

So who pinch hits for Castro?

[Saintbird]

so close!!!!!!!!:cussing:

[Saintbird]

So who pinch hits for Castro?

Payton maybe.

[Peace21]

They should have pinch hit for Castro long ago.

[cindyluvsbrady]

WHY are we not throwing at their players?:angryfire:
They hurt My Melvin:angryfire::cussing::old5fan::002_scry:

[Scrat1]

Was that really necessary? Let me open up my cut so Torii Hunter can spit a salty loogy into it.

[cbm5042]

I'm calling it. Trembley is going to rip his pitchers hardcore and announce changes AND this team is sooo close to an offensive mutiny, they play their hearts out but thats the point when the pitching is just terrible?

[NuOriolesNation]

Two observations from this half inning:

1) The rule seems to apply 80% of the time that when a guy makes a great defensive play, he hits a home run a half inning later.

2) It is official, Torii Hunter owns the Orioles more than Peter Angelos does.

[mrbig1]

I will stand by my birds win or lose, but this is sad. Our pitching has gone straight to hell.

[Saintbird]

WHY are we not throwing at their players?:angryfire:
They hurt My Melvin:angryfire::cussing::old5fan::002_scry:

Sorry bout you're Melvin, but we can't sink to thier level.

[Saintbird]

Two observations from this half inning:

1) The rule seems to apply 80% of the time that when a guy makes a great defensive play, he hits a home run a half inning later.

2) It is official, Torii Hunter owns the Orioles more than Peter Angelos does.

I think I'd take Hunter over Angelos

[Big Mac]

well, we didn't pinch hit for Castro so we've obviously thrown in the towel.:rolleyes:

[OK_Os_Fan]

WoW.. just WoW.

The Os are sliding as expected, but it is hard to watch.

[mrbig1]

Maybe we can win on Sunday.:laughlol:

[mrbig1]

We only need 5 more runs with 2 out in the 9th.

[Saintbird]

well, we didn't pinch hit for Castro so we've obviously thrown in the towel.:rolleyes:

:laughlol: well I'm sorry guys but it doesn't look like our night

[Scrat1]

Maybe we can win on Sunday.:laughlol:

What're you, a sadist?

[Saintbird]

Maybe we can win on Sunday.:laughlol:

Let's all pray:pray:

[mrbig1]

I will see you cats tomorrow 1:35pm.

[WEAVERMAN]

Will we lose 90 ballgames? With Burres, Liz and Olson, we have a real shot.