Orioles looking at SS options

[Sports Guy]

http://masnsports.com/2008/10/shortstop-possibilities.html

[Tx Oriole]

I hope so. SG who is your choice at SS for the O's? One the O's could have a chance of signng.

[LookinUp]

My vote is for Jason Donald even though some on here want him to switch positions. He's clearly blocked in Philly unless they move him to third. He loses his value there though.

[Sports Guy]

I hope so. SG who is your choice at SS for the O's? One the O's could have a chance of signng.

I know who isn't my first choice(or 2nd or third or 4th or 5th....) and that is OCab, Furcal or Renteria.

I want a young SS like Wood, Hardy, Escobar, Cedeno, etc.....the same names we always discuss on here.

[TGO]

I think it has to be Furcal or a trade. The other FA options are lame. I would say I prefer a trade to Furcal because I'm sure he will get a substantial deal, especially with no draft picks attached.

[blueberryale77]

If the price doesn't get obscene, I'd like to go after Furcal (no more than 2 years + an option). It's hard to say if his health will rebound fully but if it does he could really provide leadership and stability and he and BRob would make a fun combination up the middle and at the top of the lineup.

[blueberryale77]

I think it has to be Furcal or a trade. The other FA options are lame.

I honestly wouldn't be too upset about Adam Everett... although obviously he's not the offensive SS they're looking for.

[YardBirds13]

1- Furcal (For 3 years or less)




697- Cabrera


763- Renteria

[LookinUp]

I know who isn't my first choice(or 2nd or third or 4th or 5th....) and that is OCab, Furcal or Renteria.

I want a young SS like Wood, Hardy, Escobar, Cedeno, etc.....the same names we always discuss on here.

What's the case for Cedeno again? Is he anything more than a below-average stop gap player? The other three you mention are long-term solutions. Cedeno is a throw-in part of a more meaningful trade, IMO.

[NewMarketSean]

I still think trying to get Khalil Greene is the best way to go for this team. Some people have said Cabrera for Greene would work... I'd even throw in some $$$ to make it so.

[sangar]

I honestly wouldn't be too upset about Adam Everett... although obviously he's not the offensive SS they're looking for.
I have the impression that Trembly's primary concern at SS is defense.

[blueberryale77]

I have the impression that Trembly's primary concern at SS is defense.

Trembley doesn't sign the paychecks. I also think if Trembley were as defense-obsessed as some seem to believe, he would have quit his job before sending Alex Cintron out there night after night for awhile.

[YardBirds13]

I've mentioned this before, but I will be pleasantly shocked if Orlando Cabrera isn't our starting shortstop on OD of 2009.

I just have a feeling he's our guy.

[Black & Orange]

I have the impression that Trembly's primary concern at SS is defense.

After last season, the O's are geared more towards both an offensive and defensive minded shortstop... Trembley included.

[NewMarketSean]

I honestly wouldn't be too upset about Adam Everett... although obviously he's not the offensive SS they're looking for.

We've already got Juan Castro.

[blueberryale77]

We've already got Juan Castro.

Adam Everett can hit over .200. And Castro is really not all that spectacular defensively, he just looked that way to us because he beat the pants off everyone else we stuck out there at SS this year.

[TGO]

We've already got Juan Castro.

Well, we can have him if we want and if he wants to take what we offer. He's a free agent.

[Frobby]

To quote that character on SNL: "Just.....FIX......IT !!!"

I have a gut feeling -- with very little basis -- that Greg Miclat is going to be a very good major league SS, come about 2011 or 2012. In the meantime, we need an answer. Since I like Miclat, I'm a little less focused on getting someone young. But if we do go that route, I'm fine with it. If we sign a veteran guy, I'm OK with that, too.


Just.....FIX.....IT !!!

(Maybe this should be my new tag line, I've been thinking it's time to change it.)

[PaulFolk]

To quote that character on SNL: "Just.....FIX......IT !!!"

I have a gut feeling -- with very little basis -- that Greg Miclat is going to be a very good major league SS, come about 2011 or 2012. In the meantime, we need an answer. Since I like Miclat, I'm a little less focused on getting someone young. But if we do go that route, I'm fine with it. If we sign a veteran guy, I'm OK with that, too.


Just.....FIX.....IT !!!

(Maybe this should be my new tag line, I've been thinking it's time to change it.)
Step one: Fix!!

Step two: It!

Step three: Fix it!

[Frobby]

Adam Everett can hit over .200. And Castro is really not all that spectacular defensively, he just looked that way to us because he beat the pants off everyone else we stuck out there at SS this year.

How many times are we going to watch a guy play well defensively for 2-3 weeks and conclude that he's a great defender, even if he has a longer track record that says he is good but not great? That is what happened with Luis Hernandez in 2007; let's not repeat that mistake with Castro.

Now Adam Everett, there is a great defensive SS. John McDonald of Toronto is a great defensive SS. If you are willing to live with a SS who is all glove and no stick, go get one of them.

[Mark Carver]

Adam Everett can hit over .200. And Castro is really not all that spectacular defensively, he just looked that way to us because he beat the pants off everyone else we stuck out there at SS this year.

Everett 2007 = .599 OPS / 56 OPS+
Everett 2008 = .601 OPS / 64 OPS+

Surely, a wet blanket would be better than Everett offensively, despite what he does defensively.

[Frobby]

Everett 2007 = .599 OPS / 56 OPS+
Everett 2008 = .601 OPS / 64 OPS+

Surely, a wet blanket would be better than Everett offensively, despite what he does defensively.

Castro .541 OPS/43 OPS+
Fahey .601 OPS/57 OPS+
Bynum .443 OPS/18 OPS+
Hernandez .548 OPS/47 OPS+

Of the 5 shortstops we trotted out, 4 were as bad or worse than Everett offensively. Cintron had .683/81, but his defense was the worst of the five, and completely unacceptable. Everett is far superior to anyone we had out there in 2008. I'm not advocating him as the best choice, but he's a lot better than what we had.

[bigbird]

Interesting 1B was not one of those priorities Roch mentioned....

[TGO]

Interesting 1B was not one of those priorities Roch mentioned....

I think you can chalk that up to not wanting to get hopes up this early in the offseason.

[blueberryale77]

Interesting 1B was not one of those priorities Roch mentioned....

And as I mentioned in another thread when Brian Roberts was asked about free agent priorities recently he also talked (while making clear that he was only giving his perspective as a player) about pitching (specifically Burnett) and shortstop (Furcal). Perhaps the Orioles are finally going with the prudent decision on something instead of the flashy one. :excited:

[waroriole]

After seeing the lack of options on the market my vote is to try to get Greene. I don't know if DCab gets him, but we can always pay a little salary and throw in a low level prospect if need be.

BTW, I'm with Frobby, Just....Fix.....It!!!!

[waroriole]

And as I mentioned in another thread when Brian Roberts was asked about free agent priorities recently he also talked (while making clear that he was only giving his perspective as a player) about pitching (specifically Burnett) and shortstop (Furcal). Perhaps the Orioles are finally going with the prudent decision on something instead of the flashy one. :excited:

When was the last time the O's went with a flashy approach. If you don't count Tejada, then we would have to go all the way back to Belle.

[Ruzious]

If we go the free agency route, Furcal is miles and miles ahead of the others. And I like the idea of getting him, because his presence makes it so much easier to trade BRob, because you wouldn't have to worry about who would lead off. And then you can get an offensive guy like Donald to play at 2nd base - rather than him being a liability at SS.

[Sports Guy]

Adam Everett can hit over .200. And Castro is really not all that spectacular defensively, he just looked that way to us because he beat the pants off everyone else we stuck out there at SS this year.

Adam Everett would be a terrible option for us.

I hope that he isn't even remotely on their radar.

[Sports Guy]

Interesting 1B was not one of those priorities Roch mentioned....

But it has been mentioned in other articles.

[Mackus]

I still think trying to get Khalil Greene is the best way to go for this team. Some people have said Cabrera for Greene would work... I'd even throw in some $$$ to make it so.Count me in the group that wants to see Khalil Greene. I wouldn't trade much to get him though, not giving up someone like Reimold for him. Coming off last year and being owed a decent chunk of change, his value is very low, but I'd like to take a gamble on him.

If they can get Jason Donald though, that'd be a great guy to target.

[Sports Guy]

And as I mentioned in another thread when Brian Roberts was asked about free agent priorities recently he also talked (while making clear that he was only giving his perspective as a player) about pitching (specifically Burnett) and shortstop (Furcal). Perhaps the Orioles are finally going with the prudent decision on something instead of the flashy one. :excited:

Tex > Burnett and Furcal

Furcal is going to get a minimum of 3 years and probably more than that.

We can still sign Burnett if we get Tex.

There is absolutely no question that the single best thing we can do this offseason, in terms of player acquisition, is sign Tex.

[PlumOriole]

Who do I think will be our SS in 2009? Cedeno

Who would I like to see?

In order:

Andrus
DeJesus
Cedeno

Furcal looks good on paper. Especially if he doesn't cost a pick but I just think his body is going to crumble in the next year and turn into Albert Belle part 2.

I also want Jason Donald from Phily but for 2B. Trade Mora + an arm and get this guy.

[Sports Guy]

Who do I think will be our SS in 2009? Cedeno

Who would I like to see?

In order:

Andrus
DeJesus
Cedeno

Furcal looks good on paper. Especially if he doesn't cost a pick but I just think his body is going to crumble in the next year and turn into Albert Belle part 2.

I also want Jason Donald from Phily but for 2B. Trade Mora + an arm and get this guy.

DeJesus is also looking like a second baseman. I think Donald may have a better chance at being at SS to be honest...either way, give me Donald for either positon...He has more power.

It would be so nice if we could deal Mora for Donald.

[JTrea81]

DeJesus is also looking like a second baseman. I think Donald may have a better chance at being at SS to be honest...either way, give me Donald for either positon...He has more power.

It would be so nice if we could deal Mora for Donald.

DeJesus has been flat out terrible defensively in the AFL at SS thus far.

Joaquin Arias is still my top target in trade. He won't cost much and could have a .725-.750 OPS with great defense at the position.

[BrettMeister86]

I have been an advocate of Greene for a long time. He is on a team that is looking to offload his 6 million dollar salary, he has much better road stats than home stats and would almost certainly benefit from playing at OPACY, he is from the East Coast, and he wouldn't take much to acquire. I would trade Cabrera or Reimold for Greene without batting an eye. Greene could be just as good as Hardy for a fraction of the price. Kahlil Greene is the way to go.

Just look at this lineup!

2B Roberts
CF Jones
RF Markakis
1B Tex
DH Huff
LF Scott
3B Mora
C Wieters
SS Greene

[Fairfax Bird]

If we are unable to get a top young SS in a trade I would rather sign Nick Punto to play SS than anyone else on the market. Furcal, yes, but really I would rather those resources go to pitching. Here is Punto's numbers the last 3 years:

.290/.352/.373
.210/.291/.271
.284/.344/.382

Not sure how he is defensively, but just off first impressions he is decent. I think that would be an upgrade over what we already have.

[Sanfran327]

And as I mentioned in another thread when Brian Roberts was asked about free agent priorities recently he also talked (while making clear that he was only giving his perspective as a player) about pitching (specifically Burnett) and shortstop (Furcal). Perhaps the Orioles are finally going with the prudent decision on something instead of the flashy one. :excited:

I would be beside myself if we landed Tex, Burnett, Furcal, and Garland. I'd spend an entire draft class on these 4 FAs... it's better than spacing it out over two or more years of free agents and subsequent drafts.

[ChaosLex]

Step one: Fix!!

Step two: It!

Step three: Fix it!

1. Fix it.

2. ???

3. Profit!

[dedwretched]

1. Fix it.

2. ???

3. Profit!

I love that! A friend of mine keeps reminding me of it.

If I can figure out how to give rep, some will be headed your way!

[ChaosLex]

I love that! A friend of mine keeps reminding me of it.

If I can figure out how to give rep, some will be headed your way!

Thank you. :)

Happy Halloween to you kind sir. :D

[dedwretched]

You too!

(letters)

[Anonymous]

Interesting 1B was not one of those priorities Roch mentioned....For folks who want Tex, I hear ya'. But let's not pretend it has anything to do with needing a 1B next season. There are some real holes on this team, which Roch's blog accurately listed. 1B isn't one of them.

[orioles119]

Of the FA choices, I would sign Furcal first, then Cabrera. Stay away from Renteria.

As for trades, I would still try to pry away one of the Milwaukee shortstops -- either Hardy or Escobar.

[Sports Guy]

For folks who want Tex, I hear ya'. But let's not pretend it has anything to do with needing a 1B next season. There are some real holes on this team, which Roch's blog accurately listed. 1B isn't one of them.

Yes it is.

[Frobby]

Let's just look at the 3 expensive FA options:

Furcal: 31 years old, .286/.352/.412 career hitter, excellent range but erratic arm. Coming off surgery.
Cabrera: 34 years old, .274/.322/.399 career hitter, average range but very steady arm and glove. .705 OPS this year.
Renteria: 33 years old, .290/.347/.405 career hitter, below average range but pretty steady arm and glove. .699 OPS this year.

Furcal has the most upside but Cabrera is the safest bet. A lot would depend on what each one would cost and how long a contract they'd require.

[Singleton]

I know who isn't my first choice(or 2nd or third or 4th or 5th....) and that is OCab, Furcal or Renteria.

I want a young SS like Wood, Hardy, Escobar, Cedeno, etc.....the same names we always discuss on here.

I think everyone would prefer young to old. The question is -- how much does it cost us and what do we have to give? Realistically, most of these guys -- minus Cedeno -- will cost us serious prospects. Are we prepared to give up one of our top prospects to get one of these guys? I'm not. If I can grab a young guy on the cheap -- Cedeno, Elvis, etc -- then i go for it. If not, i wouldn't balk at signing a FA ss for a 2 yr deal or so. And if that's not working -- i'd go for a stop gap.

[Oriole4Life]

I still think trying to get Khalil Greene is the best way to go for this team. Some people have said Cabrera for Greene would work... I'd even throw in some $$$ to make it so.

If that trade has any real chance of going down, I would pull it in a second. Greene isn't young anymore but he can field and hit. He'd be the best shortstop we've had in years. Really I just wish we had a SS prospect, I can't believe there isn't anyone that we can give a shot to. What about Ed Rogers? ;)

[RFisthaMan]

For folks who want Tex, I hear ya'. But let's not pretend it has anything to do with needing a 1B next season. There are some real holes on this team, which Roch's blog accurately listed. 1B isn't one of them.

It may not be a hole for next year... I think Huff could fill in nicely. But thinking long-term, Tex fills a big hole and fits everything the Orioles could possibly hope for. A cornerstone, franchise player who would fit perfectly for the next 6-8 years, especially sandwiched around Markakis and Weiters.

It gives me chills thinking about the potential the O's lineup has when adding a guy like Tex and a serviceable SS. As everyone says it's not about next year. Get Tex, sign Roberts, lock up Markakis, trade for a shortstop, and we have CF, RF, 2B, 1B, and C being manned by potential all-stars, with the rest of the positions filled with solid major leaguers.

Get the starting rotation together (I believe the bullpen will be a strength in the next year or two, especially if the rotation doesn't lean on them for 5 innings a game) I have extremely high hopes for this team in '10.

[Moose Milligan]

If it's down to those three names, I pick Furcal.

I think we have zippy chance at getting any of the names we kick around on here, Hardy, Greene, etc....we don't even know if those guys are on the block. It's nice to dream up trades...

I know I'll get creamed for this, but I can live with another year of Castro or whoever at SS. I'd rather get Tex and/or Burnett first.

Furcal or any of those other FA SS's wouldn't be a long term solution anyway. Just masking the problem...

[RFisthaMan]

If it's down to those three names, I pick Furcal.

I think we have zippy chance at getting any of the names we kick around on here, Hardy, Greene, etc....we don't even know if those guys are on the block. It's nice to dream up trades...

I know I'll get creamed for this, but I can live with another year of Castro or whoever at SS. I'd rather get Tex and/or Burnett first.
Furcal or any of those other FA SS's wouldn't be a long term solution anyway. Just masking the problem...

I don't think you'll get creamed for this... I'd gladly trade getting both Tex and Burnett for putting up with Castro for another year.

I just don't see the Orioles dealing with Castro if/when the Orioles get those guys.

Too many options that would be an upgrade over Castro regardless who the Orioles sign in FA.

[Omega]

I like the idea of getting Khalil Greene. He just turned 29 on Oct 21st, not old by any means. Out of Petco, into Camden Yards could do wonders for his production. He is more of a modern day SS with pretty good defense and a potent bat. A very nice addition to the lower end of the line-up He is also expendable to the Padres, and from what I've read, he's a good clubhouse guy and a hard worker. I think he would be a good fit for the O's for the next few years.

[Sports Guy]

I think everyone would prefer young to old. The question is -- how much does it cost us and what do we have to give? Realistically, most of these guys -- minus Cedeno -- will cost us serious prospects. Are we prepared to give up one of our top prospects to get one of these guys? I'm not. If I can grab a young guy on the cheap -- Cedeno, Elvis, etc -- then i go for it. If not, i wouldn't balk at signing a FA ss for a 2 yr deal or so. And if that's not working -- i'd go for a stop gap.

Unlikely...You don't see prospect for prospect trades.

[Sports Guy]

If it's down to those three names, I pick Furcal.

I think we have zippy chance at getting any of the names we kick around on here, Hardy, Greene, etc....we don't even know if those guys are on the block. It's nice to dream up trades...

I know I'll get creamed for this, but I can live with another year of Castro or whoever at SS. I'd rather get Tex and/or Burnett first.

Furcal or any of those other FA SS's wouldn't be a long term solution anyway. Just masking the problem...I don't see how we have a zippy chance at getting Greene.

[wildcard]

Who is the most likely starting SS for the O's in 2009? Here is my opinion after looking at age, ability, salary, cost to acquire, and availability.

Ages are as of April 1, 2009

1. Alex Gonzalez - (32) Cinny is rebuilding. They have Keppinger. They need OFers. I would offer Montanez and Penn. Gonzalez has to be healthy though. $5.375M in '09, option on '10.

2. Ronny Cedeno - (26) The O's need young, with potential. Even with Gonzalez, Cedeno would be a nice addition with potential to grow into the SS position. Without a more experienced SS he might start for the O's. $407K salary in 2008.

3. Joaquin Arias - (24) Sleeper, I had this guy at #15 when I started this analysis. When I compared him with what the O's need, his availability and the cost of getting him, he shot to the top. I have to say I have not followed him. Don't know his fielding ability well. Squeezed in Texas. Young and Kinsler ahead of him and they are signed through 2013. Andrus who is the Rangers SS of the future at AA. Hit the same at AAA and in the majors. 290ish average, 750 OPS. Small sample in majors. 27 SB. $400K

4. Jack Wilson - (31) Experienced, probably available, one year left on his contract. His $7.25M salary in 2009 should be his top end if he is extended.

5. Caesar Izturis - (29) Glove man. FA. Hits a little better than Everett which means he doesn't hit much. $2.85M in 2008

6. Adam Everett - (32) He is a FA, great glove. No bat. Good Backup if Cedeno cost too much. $2.8 in 2008.

7. Rafael Furcal - (31) FA, Expensive. Back surgery, shoulder problems in the past. Likes LA. Best SS in the FA market but very risky. $13M in 2008.

8. JJ Hardy - (26) Available in trade. Will cost a lot in players. O's probably do not match up because ML pitchers will be desired by Brewers. Best available SS for the money. $2.65M in 2008. Will increase in 2009. 4 years of ML service.

9. Edgar Renteria - (33) FA, Normally good bat but bad year in 2008. Declining glove. '09 option declined by Tigers. Will cost a draft choice. $9M+ bonus in 2008.

10. Orlando Cabrera (34) - FA, Decent glove and bat. Will cost a draft choice. Not going back to the White Sox. 34 year old SS probably not in the building plan. $9M in 2008.

11. Brandon Wood - (24) Lots of hurdles in the way of this acquisition. Angels need very little if they sign Tex. No real reason to trade Wood. If the O's get Tex and if the Angels like Huff they may trade Wood for him. Long shot. 400K

12. Erick Aybar - (25) See Wood. $415K

13. Khalil Greene - (29) May be leaving Padres. Wild swings in offensive performance. Padres need to trade for SS in return. Another hard one.

14. Jason Donald - (24) Good developing bat. Questions about range at SS. Phillies need 3B of the future. He is likely best candidate. World Champs can be cautious in trading. Minor league salary.

15. Chin-lung Hu - (25) If Furcal is signed he may become available. Great glove. Probably will not hit much. Singles hitter. If the O's want a bat at SS he is not a match. But if they chance their mind to a good glove so-so bat then maybe. $400K

16. Brent Lillibridge - (25) Probably available. Floundered last year. Could improve. minor league salary. Not as good a glove as Hu. $400K

17. Juan Castro - (36) Last resort, Good glove. No hit. Stop gap. $975K 2008 salary. DFA O's paid prorate $390k.

18. Julio Lugo - (33) Terrible contract. 2/18 plus a $9M vesting option.

19. Elvis Andrus - (20) Probably no available. Texas SS of the future. The guy that is to move Young off SS.

20. Ivan DeJesus - (21) Probably not available. Dodgers are probably the hardest organization to get young talent from until they reach the majors and don't fit.

21. Alcides Escobar - (22) Probably not available. Brewers SS of the future. Everything I read says the Brewers keep him and move Hardy.

What do you think?

[Moose Milligan]

I don't see how we have a zippy chance at getting Greene.

Other than the typical banter on here about how we should get him, where has any speculation been that the O's are in the running for Greene?

Please don't show me anything from mlbtraderumors either.

[mikezpen]

Don't sign somebody who costs them a draft choice or trade much to get an established one.The ideal move would be to trade Huff for players that include a topnotch shortstop prospect.

The most important attribute is the glove.

[PaulBako]

7. Rafael Furcal - (31) FA, Expensive. Back surgery, shoulder problems in the past. Likes LA. Best SS in the FA market but very risky. Will cost a draft choice. $13M in 2008.


He will not cost draft picks.

[davearm]

Other than the typical banter on here about how we should get him, where has any speculation been that the O's are in the running for Greene?

Please don't show me anything from mlbtraderumors either.
If a desire to shed large chunks of payroll (allegedly due to owner Moores' divorce) has the Padres shopping Jake Peavy, wouldn't you imagine that Khalil Greene is also available?

[wildcard]

He will not cost draft picks.

Right, I knew that. Forgot. I will chance it. Thanks.

[Satyr3206]

Considering the way Angelos goes over medical records I don't think there is a snowballs chance the Orioles sign Furcal. I'm firmly on the Greene bandwagon.

[Moose Milligan]

If a desire to shed large chunks of payroll (allegedly due to owner Moores' divorce) has the Padres shopping Jake Peavy, wouldn't you imagine that Khalil Greene is also available?

Having Greene available and having Greene available and the O's being interested are two totally different things.

[Sports Guy]

Other than the typical banter on here about how we should get him, where has any speculation been that the O's are in the running for Greene?

Please don't show me anything from mlbtraderumors either.

Its common sense...He wants to play on the east coast...Wants to be near his home in PA. The Padres have a desire to shed payroll and we have a need at SS.

Its not difficult to put 2 and 2 together and figure out that he could be a target.

[Moose Milligan]

Its common sense...He wants to play on the east coast...Wants to be near his home in PA. The Padres have a desire to shed payroll and we have a need at SS.

Its not difficult to put 2 and 2 together and figure out that he could be a target.

You think that would be the case and I'm inclined to agree with you as you've provided good logic.

Yet do you bank on the O's front office as identifying him as a target? My whole argument is that we all agree that he should be a target on here, but are there any reports anywhere of us being interested in him? Even the article you linked to in the OP has us looking at Furcal, Renteria and Cabrera. No mention of Greene ANYWHERE.

You've routinely criticized AM for not being able to multi-task. If he's working on extensions with Nick and Roberts and then trying to land Tex at the winter meetings, I guess he hopes that Greene is available in January so he can work on that trade for the entire month...right?

[Fairfax Bird]

I'll throw this out again. If no young SS's are available through trade, I would much rather sign Nick Punto to play SS than the other big-name FA SSs. He would be much, much cheaper enabling us to go and get SP that we need.

[Sports Guy]

You think that would be the case and I'm inclined to agree with you as you've provided good logic.

Yet do you bank on the O's front office as identifying him as a target?

You've routinely criticized AM for not being able to multi-task. If he's working on extensions with Nick and Roberts and then trying to land Tex at the winter meetings, I guess he hopes that Greene is available in January so he can work on that trade for the entire month...right?
I have no idea if they are interested...My issue with you is that you said there is zippy chance of that happening. That is just a ridiculous comment.

[Sports Guy]

I'll throw this out again. If no young SS's are available through trade, I would much rather sign Nick Punto to play SS than the other big-name FA SSs. He would be much, much cheaper enabling us to go and get SP that we need.

Why not just stay with Castro?

Punto is a terrible hitter.

[Fairfax Bird]

Why not just stay with Castro?

Punto is a terrible hitter.

Two of the last three years Punto has had an OPS at .725 and this year he hit .284/.335. Not great, but not terrible.

[Moose Milligan]

I have no idea if they are interested...My issue with you is that you said there is zippy chance of that happening. That is just a ridiculous comment.

There's a chance of Ray Lewis walking in my door and wanting to watch the Ravens game with me today.

Doesn't mean its gonna happen.

[wildcard]

The Padres have been most interested in trading Greene to places where they get a SS in return. At least that is what I have read. The Orioles can not play if those are the rules. There would need to do a three way trade. If SG was the GM that would be more likely, but MacPhail has shown little to support the idea that a three way trade is likely.

[css0285]

The Padres have been most interested in trading Greene to places where they get a SS in return. At least that is what I have read. The Orioles can not play if those are the rules. There would need to do a three way trade. If SG was the GM that would be more likely, but MacPhail has shown little to support the idea that a three way trade is likely.

Yeah, a three way trade or the Pads would have to know they would be getting back a SS in a Peavy trade. I would be happy with Greene if the price was right, but I really don't think we have a SS to give them. I am curious but how do most of you value Luke Scott relative to Greene? I know many have suggested Reimold for Greene, but not Scott.

[wickedwitch]

Yeah, a three way trade or the Pads would have to know they would be getting back a SS in a Peavy trade. I would be happy with Greene if the price was right, but I really don't think we have a SS to give them. I am curious but how do most of you value Luke Scott relative to Greene? I know many have suggested Reimold for Greene, but not Scott.

I'd do neither. And I'm not even that big a fan of Reimold.

[El Gordo]

Yeah, a three way trade or the Pads would have to know they would be getting back a SS in a Peavy trade. I would be happy with Greene if the price was right, but I really don't think we have a SS to give them. I am curious but how do most of you value Luke Scott relative to Greene? I know many have suggested Reimold for Greene, but not Scott.Why would you give up a guy(Scott) who will likely put up the same if not better numbers whom you control for 4 years and is cheap for a one year question mark who costs $6.5 MM and a prospect? I think we should sign Cesar Itzuris and draft a top SS prospect.

[LookinUp]

Scott >>>>> Greene after this season.

[css0285]

I should clarify. I was not advocating that we trade Scott for Greene. I just know that many have talked about swapping Reimold for Greene and I consider Reimold and Scott fairly similar players. Reimold is younger, has no service time, and probably has a higher ceiling, whereas Scott is still very cheap himself and is already a darn good hitter and established MLer. In my opinion, they have similar value and I would not be interested in trading either straight up for Greene.

[Cubsfan]

Yeah, a three way trade or the Pads would have to know they would be getting back a SS in a Peavy trade. I would be happy with Greene if the price was right, but I really don't think we have a SS to give them. I am curious but how do most of you value Luke Scott relative to Greene? I know many have suggested Reimold for Greene, but not Scott.

How about:
Cubs get: Peavy
O's get: Greene
Padres get: Cedeno, Marshall, Pie, top prospect from O's (?), lower level prospect from Cubs or O's (?)

I'm not sure who the two prospects shoud be to make it work out, but it looks like a possibility.

[waroriole]

Why would you give up a guy(Scott) who will likely put up the same if not better numbers whom you control for 4 years and is cheap for a one year question mark who costs $6.5 MM and a prospect? I think we should sign Cesar Itzuris and draft a top SS prospect.

Good post, no way would I give up Scott for Greene. If they want Cabrera plus salary or a lower level prospect then I would be more open to Greene.

[Sports Guy]

How about:
Cubs get: Peavy
O's get: Greene
Padres get: Cedeno, Marshall, Pie, top prospect from O's (?), lower level prospect from Cubs or O's (?)

I'm not sure who the two prospects shoud be to make it work out, but it looks like a possibility.
LOL...You want the Orioles to give up a top prospect for a guy who had a sub 600 OPS, that is on the last year of his contract and is making 7 million next year? And on top of that, we may have to give up ANOTHER player?

Horrible idea.

Greene isn't much more than a salary dump right now.

[waroriole]

How about:
Cubs get: Peavy
O's get: Greene
Padres get: Cedeno, Marshall, Pie, top prospect from O's (?), lower level prospect from Cubs or O's (?)

I'm not sure who the two prospects shoud be to make it work out, but it looks like a possibility.

I'm not giving up a top prospect for Greene. No way the Padres do that deal either, all they get from the Cubs are guys who didn't pan out, and then Marshall who may be decent.

[JohnnyK27]

I'm not giving up a top prospect for Greene. No way the Padres do that deal either, all they get from the Cubs are guys who didn't pan out, and then Marshall who may be decent.

I agree on this point .... Only way I would is if Greene would agree to a extension.

[Sports Guy]

I agree on this point .... Only way I would is if Greene would agree to a extension.

You still couldn't give up a top prospect for him.

He doesn't warrant that type of return.

[JTrea81]

You still couldn't give up a top prospect for him.

He doesn't warrant that type of return.

It's tough to say because unlike a Julio Lugo, his contract isn't horrible for a SS, and with good SS's in short supply and their lack of a replacement, he could very well cost a good prospect.

[Intimidator301]

How about:
Cubs get: Peavy
O's get: Greene
Padres get: Cedeno, Marshall, Pie, top prospect from O's (?), lower level prospect from Cubs or O's (?)

I'm not sure who the two prospects shoud be to make it work out, but it looks like a possibility.

So basically, you want the O's to give up a top prospect, a lower level prospect ( Further depleting our farm system) so the Cubs can get Peavy.

If the O's are sending top prospects to SD, its to get Peavy for themselves.

I might send Penn and Luis Hernandez for Greene. He's a salary dump for the Padres at this point.

[davearm]

How about:
Cubs get: Peavy
O's get: Greene
Padres get: Cedeno, Marshall, Pie, top prospect from O's (?), lower level prospect from Cubs or O's (?)

I'm not sure who the two prospects shoud be to make it work out, but it looks like a possibility.
The O's don't really fit in this three-way deal very well. As has been made clear, they won't give anything for Greene.

If the O's wanted Cedeno and Marquis for some young pitcher the Pads would want as 1/5th of a Peavy deal, then that could possibly work. Then the Cubs could send Theriot to SD, and keep Greene to replace him.

Conceivably Theriot could land in BAL and Cedeno in SD, but the O's aren't going to pay what Theriot's worth, since they're not in a mode of trading any of their top prospects.

BAL: Cedeno, Marquis
SD: Theriot, Pie, Marshall, Ceda, Liz
Cubs: Peavy

Something like that. But really, the Cubs could come up with a Liz type themselves as the last piece, so the O's aren't really necessary.

[bigbird]

I have a feeling we're going to put a contract out there for 2 or 3 shortstops and the first one to bite gets it.

[Sports Guy]

I have a feeling we're going to put a contract out there for 2 or 3 shortstops and the first one to bite gets it.

Yea....I have said for a while that I fully expect us to sign OCab and Garland this offseason.

What a horrible decision that would be.

[bigbird]

Yea....I have said for a while that I fully expect us to sign OCab and Garland this offseason.

What a horrible decision that would be.

I don't think Garland is on the radar at this time.

[Sports Guy]

I don't think Garland is on the radar at this time.

Hopefully not...Now, if that radar would just get rid of the 3 FA SS, things would be looking up.

[BRob51]

I don't think Garland is on the radar at this time.

I hope you're right.

[BRob51]

Hopefully not...Now, if that radar would just get rid of the 3 FA SS, things would be looking up.

Would you be against Furcal?

[Sports Guy]

Would you be against Furcal?

Yes because of the contract it would take.

We aren't getting him for a 2-3 year deal for 10 million or less, which is all he should get.

[BRob51]

Yes because of the contract it would take.

We aren't getting him for a 2-3 year deal for 10 million or less, which is all he should get.

Fair enough. Do you think we can grab Hu from LAD? He and Greene would be the guys I'd target.

[Sports Guy]

Fair enough. Do you think we can grab Hu from LAD? He and Greene would be the guys I'd target.

There are plenty of guys out there that we can get IMO.

AM just may not want to get rid of some of the guys(huff and scott for example) that could net us these guys.

He is like some of the people on here...They want a long term solution but don't want to give up anything to get it.

So, what do you do? You foolishly throw money at some aging vet that isn't all that good just so you can say, well we fixed a hole in the offense.

[Moose Milligan]

SG, you against Furcal because of his recent injury problems?

[Sports Guy]

SG, you against Furcal because of his recent injury problems?

No, I am against him because if he doesn't re-sign in LA, it is going to be because some team gives him 4-5 years at 10+ million a year.

[24fps]

Fair enough. Do you think we can grab Hu from LAD? He and Greene would be the guys I'd target.

Hu's major league OPS+ last year over 116 AB's was 29. Based on the several times I saw him play, it was fully earned. IMO the Orioles should be setting their sights quite a bit higher.

Furcal, when he's healthy, has always been fun to watch. Admittedly his health is a concern and that's going to be on a lot of peoples minds, as it should. IMO he's a player whose reputation slightly outweighs his talent. He's also someone who was significantly overpaid on his last contract and everybody knows it. This year's off season market has yet to show itself, but I wouldn't be surprised if Furcal could be had at around 3/24-4/30.

He's a solid player when he's on the field. The Orioles should kicking the tires, especially if he can be had for three years.

[BRob51]

Hu's major league OPS+ last year over 116 AB's was 29. Based on the several times I saw him play, it was fully earned. IMO the Orioles should be setting their sights quite a bit higher.

While I can't argue with that, I do know that he is supposedly the best defensive SS in the minors according to Baseball Prospectus, and that in 2007 he was pretty good offensively in AAA. I would say that because of his 2008 struggles he could be had cheaply and we could hope he turns into the 2007 Hu. He would essentially be a project.

[24fps]

While I can't argue with that, I do know that he is supposedly the best defensive SS in the minors according to Baseball Prospectus, and that in 2007 he was pretty good offensively in AAA. I would say that because of his 2008 struggles he could be had cheaply and we could hope he turns into the 2007 Hu. He would essentially be a project.

Agreed he would be a project. So far he hasn't made a case that he deserves a starting job any more than the 5 we trotted out last year. Actually less, unless he significantly improved during his September call-up - I didn't do the comparisons after the AS break.

My preference at SS is spend for a solution rather than gamble on a project. In the end, I'm just not a believer in Hu.

If we're going to take a chance on an unproven SS, I'd rather try to pry Ronny Cedeño loose from the Cubs.

[JTrea81]

From the Sun (http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-sp.orioles03nov03,0,7087365.story):


The San Diego Padres' Khalil Greene, the Milwaukee Brewers' J.J. Hardy and the Pittsburgh Pirates' Jack Wilson are among the shortstops the Orioles are considering pursuing in trades.

[ChaosLex]

From the Sun (http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-sp.orioles03nov03,0,7087365.story):

I'm against Hardy, simply because of the price. I'd be satisfied with Greene or Wilson though.

Also, I think the Angels make a lot of sense. You would have to think that either Aybar or Wood would be on the market. Honestly, I'd be happy with either one.

[bigbird]

I'd do a Cabrera for Wilson trade.

[JohnnyK27]

Hopefully we will take the non freeagent route & AM will not overpay. So lets hope he can manage to get it done.

[JTrea81]

I'd do a Cabrera for Wilson trade.

Absolutely, but I think the Pirates are looking for younger ML ready talent to move Wilson.

Wilson = Mike Bordick.

[CalForPresident]

jason donald looks like a good option but i dont think this would happen i think he is going to play 3rd for philly next year.

[Jules]

I'd do a Cabrera for Wilson trade.

I dont know if I would do that. I am not sold on Wilson and he is already 30 and expensive. I also still think Cabrera will put it together.

I really like Greene's potential hitting outside of Petco and we need his defense.

[BedardisAce]

I'd do a Cabrera for Wilson trade.

What is it about Wilson that this board likes? I admit, i don't know a ton about the guy, but he gets me as a declining player, ala Ocab and Renteria. Is the fact that he only has one year left on his deal the main reason for the attraction?

[Sports Guy]

I'd do a Cabrera for Wilson trade.

Yea, that would be fine but I don't think the Pirates make that deal but we should be looking for a real long term option.

[Dracula]

jason donald looks like a good option but i dont think this would happen i think he is going to play 3rd for philly next year.

Is Feliz gone or do they think Donald is just better?

[wildcard]

Is Feliz gone or do they think Donald is just better?


I don't think Feliz is gone yet. Donald has not even played 3B in the minors yet from what I have seen. Donald will play 3B at AAA this year if that is where the Phillies think his future is.

[sangar]

Trembley doesn't sign the paychecks. I also think if Trembley were as defense-obsessed as some seem to believe, he would have quit his job before sending Alex Cintron out there night after night for awhile.
You are correct. Trembley does not sign the paychecks. I am equally certain that those who do give his opinion credibility. I like your thoughts on Everett.

I doubt that Trembly would actually quit over one marginal player. He doesn't seem like the type to give in to emotional overkill.

[ChaosLex]

Brewers officials are reluctant to trade either Hardy or his projected replacement, Alcides Escobar. One solution would be to move Hardy to second base and trade Rickie Weeks, but Hardy has more value than Weeks and possibly could bring a starting pitcher in return.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8754648/Brewers-not-likely-to-part-ways-with-Fielder?CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=49

[NewMarketSean]

I wouldn't be opposed to trading for Weeks if Roberts is traded.

[JTrea81]

The Orioles have contacted the Padres about Greene according to the San Diego Tribune (http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2008/nov/03/padres-greene-latest-one-padres-discuss/?padres):


“We've had nibbles,” said General Manager Kevin Towers, who has met with other GMs the last three days at a coastal resort in Orange County.

The Orioles, Reds and Tigers are among those interested. The Nationals and Padres discussed a Greene trade this past summer, but the Nats aren't in play this time around.

[Black & Orange]

The Orioles have contacted the Padres about Greene according to the San Diego Tribune (http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2008/nov/03/padres-greene-latest-one-padres-discuss/?padres):

No thanks. Weren't we supposed to be targeting a long-term shorstop that can not only defend, but hit too?

Would rather us go after Donald, Cedeno, Wood or Lillibridge if we are going to trade for a SS.

[JTrea81]

No thanks. Weren't we supposed to be targeting a long-term shorstop that can not only defend, but hit too?

Would rather us go after Donald, Cedeno, Wood or Lillibridge if we are going to trade for a SS.

Those players might not be available. And last year was likely an abberation for Greene who has consistently hit well for a SS when he was away from PETCO.

You could buy low on him and then extend him relatively cheaply IMO.

[Absltgreek]

What's the consensus on hardy? Is he young/good enough to be a long term replacement. And though the price may be more than others, would it be worth trading say an Arrieta+ to get him? Those numbers would look great in this lineup.

[NewMarketSean]

What's the consensus on hardy? Is he young/good enough to be a long term replacement. And though the price may be more than others, would it be worth trading say an Arrieta+ to get him? Those numbers would look great in this lineup.

IMO, it'll take something like Arrieta, Tillman and a lower-tier pitching prospect like Hernandez or Berken for the Brewers to bite.

[ChaosLex]

The Orioles have contacted the Padres about Greene according to the San Diego Tribune (http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2008/nov/03/padres-greene-latest-one-padres-discuss/?padres):

Crap. If that's true, we're probably not getting any of Tampa's shortstops for Bradford.

[ChaosLex]

IMO, it'll take something like Arrieta, Tillman and a lower-tier pitching prospect like Hernandez or Berken for the Brewers to bite.

Then the Brewers were never serious about trading Hardy. No team is going to offer them their two top pitching prospects for Hardy. He's good but he's not THAT good.

[Sports Guy]

The Orioles have contacted the Padres about Greene according to the San Diego Tribune (http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2008/nov/03/padres-greene-latest-one-padres-discuss/?padres):

Go get him but don't give up much to get him.

[clapdiddy]

Go get him but don't give up much to get him.

Exactly...he should be a salary dump for them. He'd be a guy we could extend for a couple of seasons as well. Maybe we tear up his contract and offer him a 3 year deal.

I get the feeling if we go after Greene, then we're likely to keep Roberts and extend him.

[nadecir]

Go get him but don't give up much to get him.Looks like we will have to outbid at least the Reds and Tigers if we are serious about Greene.

[YardBirds13]

Then the Brewers were never serious about trading Hardy. No team is going to offer them their two top pitching prospects for Hardy. He's good but he's not THAT good.

I dunno, Hardy is pretty awesome.

He is one of the better defensive shortstops around, and also puts up very good numbers offensively. He is still relatively young.

There aren't a lot of guys I'd rather have at shortstop than JJ Hardy. Just not willing to give up what the Brewers will really want.

I tend to think it would be more of a Guthrie, Arrieta etc deal they'd be looking for. Basically, a ML starter with a good amount of service time left, and a very good pitching prospect.

As much as I love Hardy, I'd pass on that type of deal.

[BaltimoreGhost]

No thanks. Weren't we supposed to be targeting a long-term shorstop that can not only defend, but hit too?

Would rather us go after Donald, Cedeno, Wood or Lillibridge if we are going to trade for a SS.

I see no problem with Greene. He has carried a .976 career fielding percentage which is about the same as Jeter.

He has hit 27 home runs in a strong pitchers division in '07. He may not be a top-of-lineup guy, but I think he'd be better than most realistic alternatives for his prime years at the right price.

[Sports Guy]

Looks like we will have to outbid at least the Reds and Tigers if we are serious about Greene.

That only matters if they are willing to give up something good or if they want the Pads to eat salary.

[Scrat1]

I see no problem with Greene. He has carried a .976 career fielding percentage which is about the same as Jeter.

He has hit 27 home runs in a strong pitchers division in '07. He may not be a top-of-lineup guy, but I think he'd be better than most realistic alternatives for his prime years at the right price.

Exactly.

I definitely do not want Hardy. I mean, I'd love to have Hardy, but not at what it would cost us. We can't afford to give up any of our major pitching prospects.

Go get Greene or another relatively cheap prospect like Cedeno or Hu that could pan out to be decent enough. We can't afford to have top players at every single position.

[NastyRonald]

That only matters if they are willing to give up something good or if they want the Pads to eat salary.

Excellent point SG. What is a realistic three way trade to net us Greene and the Braves get what they want and the Pads get what they want? I feel as if we are a bit handicapped on the players we can offer in such a deal so the deal is fair and allows us to get better as a team, as apposed to us being basically the same team talent wise and we hinder our growth (young players).

[JohnnyK27]

What's the consensus on hardy? Is he young/good enough to be a long term replacement. And though the price may be more than others, would it be worth trading say an Arrieta+ to get him? Those numbers would look great in this lineup.

I'd say the cost would be higher than just Arrieta & probably too much.

[wickedwitch]

I see no problem with Greene. He has carried a .976 career fielding percentage which is about the same as Jeter.

Is that supposed to be a positive?

[bmorebirds_24]

personally i would like to go after a free agent.maybe a R.Furcal or E.Renteria.i understand these guys are a little older then the names i have been reading but i am not sure i wanna give up some of this young talent in the orioles organization.


i like that we are rebuilding and trying to start from the bottom and working our way up.id like to see a 2 or 3 year deal and get a good/solid defenzive SS with average offensive numbers.i am tired of seeing us throw guys off of washington blvd. in there.

[YardBirds13]

personally i would like to go after a free agent.maybe a R.Furcal or E.Renteria.i understand these guys are a little older then the names i have been reading but i am not sure i wanna give up some of this young talent in the orioles organization.


i like that we are rebuilding and trying to start from the bottom and working our way up.id like to see a 2 or 3 year deal and get a good/solid defenzive SS with average offensive numbers.i am tired of seeing us throw guys off of washington blvd. in there.

A good way to keep the young talent in organization from continuing to improve would be to sign Edgar Renteria to a multi-year deal, thus costing us our second round pick in next years draft, and locking us in a multi-million dollar, multi-year deal to a declining player that won't put us over the top, basically the same mistake we've made the past 7 or 8 years.

[bmorebirds_24]

A good way to keep the young talent in organization from continuing to improve would be to sign Edgar Renteria to a multi-year deal, thus costing us our second round pick in next years draft, and locking us in a multi-million dollar, multi-year deal to a declining player that won't put us over the top, basically the same mistake we've made the past 7 or 8 years.



i understand your point but maybe you wanna take a look at mine.when was the lasttime(before AM)this team has drafted top talent through the draft.i am no GM nor do i know every in and outs to making a free agent signing.


i dont see this team as far off as most people do.renteria is only ONE option there are others out there that we could take a look at but i am guessing you got tired and really didnt feel like reading my entire post.

[DrungoHazewood]

I see no problem with Greene. He has carried a .976 career fielding percentage which is about the same as Jeter.

That's kind of like saying that Kevin Millar must be a good hitter because he had about the same number of singles as Ryan Howard.

It's somewhere between misleading and irrelevant.

[YardBirds13]

i understand your point but maybe you wanna take a look at mine.when was the lasttime(before AM)this team has drafted top talent through the draft.i am no GM nor do i know every in and outs to making a free agent signing.


i dont see this team as far off as most people do.renteria is only ONE option there are others out there that we could take a look at but i am guessing you got tired and really didnt feel like reading my entire post.

Whoa.

Let's see. First off, when was the last time we drafted top talent in the draft? Well, we have the best position prospect in all of baseball ready to get to the majors, so there is a start. We have perhaps the best righty-lefty punch in the minors in all of baseball (although we traded for Tillman, not drafted). Our current right fielder (who is pretty good) was drafted long before AM was in charge.

Basically, my point is don't give away draft picks unless you are getting an elite player. Teixeira, Burnett? Sure, I don't mind losing a pick. Edgar Renteria, who is in rapid decline? No thanks.

I also disagree that we are that close to competing. I strongly doubt we are going to compete next year even with some solid production out of the shortstop position.

I do agree that there are other options out there, but the FA options just aren't that good. Renteria and Cabrera would cost a pick, and are both declining and not really even good offensive players anymore. Furcal has a rough injury history and will be very expensive.

The way to go is to either get a guy who had a down year as a buy-low candidate (Greene) or acquire a young guy who may be blocked (Arias, Hu etc.)

[bmorebirds_24]

Whoa.

Let's see. First off, when was the last time we drafted top talent in the draft? Well, we have the best position prospect in all of baseball ready to get to the majors, so there is a start. We have perhaps the best righty-lefty punch in the minors in all of baseball (although we traded for Tillman, not drafted). Our current right fielder (who is pretty good) was drafted long before AM was in charge.

Basically, my point is don't give away draft picks unless you are getting an elite player. Teixeira, Burnett? Sure, I don't mind losing a pick. Edgar Renteria, who is in rapid decline? No thanks.

I also disagree that we are that close to competing. I strongly doubt we are going to compete next year even with some solid production out of the shortstop position.

I do agree that there are other options out there, but the FA options just aren't that good. Renteria and Cabrera would cost a pick, and are both declining and not really even good offensive players anymore. Furcal has a rough injury history and will be very expensive.

The way to go is to either get a guy who had a down year as a buy-low candidate (Greene) or acquire a young guy who may be blocked (Arias, Hu etc.)



not being an ass here but was wondering if you could tell me how it works when signing a free agent?i have heard of it a few times but how does it work?


you are right about markakis.there is no denying his talent.but thank AM for wieters if it wasnt for him peter the ass would have never made it happen to get him.

[Black & Orange]

That's kind of like saying that Kevin Millar must be a good hitter because he had about the same number of singles as Ryan Howard.

It's somewhere between misleading and irrelevant.

Haha. I agree. Thank you, Jon.

[NewMarketSean]

Then the Brewers were never serious about trading Hardy. No team is going to offer them their two top pitching prospects for Hardy. He's good but he's not THAT good.

I agree, it's too much. But I do think a lot of people on these boards make some pretty weak trade offers for key positon players like Hardy, who is on a path to become the next Tejada. We're not going to get him for nothing.

[NewMarketSean]

That's kind of like saying that Kevin Millar must be a good hitter because he had about the same number of singles as Ryan Howard.

It's somewhere between misleading and irrelevant.

Not to mention, Jeter is known for being a pretty poor defender.

[YardBirds13]

not being an ass here but was wondering if you could tell me how it works when signing a free agent?i have heard of it a few times but how does it work?


you are right about markakis.there is no denying his talent.but thank AM for wieters if it wasnt for him peter the ass would have never made it happen to get him.

Isn't that backwards? I thought AM was the one that was willing to let Wieters go? Maybe I've got it backwards.

Not sure what you are asking about how it works when signing a free agent...could you be more specific?

[bmorebirds_24]

Isn't that backwards? I thought AM was the one that was willing to let Wieters go? Maybe I've got it backwards.

Not sure what you are asking about how it works when signing a free agent...could you be more specific?

im sure i read that AM was the one who made things happen for weiters...but i could be wrong.who cares he is an Oriole now.


sorry bout not being specific i was in a rush earlier.

how does it work with losing a draft pick when you sign a free agent?

[YardBirds13]

im sure i read that AM was the one who made things happen for weiters...but i could be wrong.who cares he is an Oriole now.


sorry bout not being specific i was in a rush earlier.

how does it work with losing a draft pick when you sign a free agent?

Free Agents are broken down into Type A, Type B, or no type Free Agents, depending on how well you played the past two seasons.

If you sign a Type A Player, you lose your first round draft pick, unless you pick in the first 15. If you pick in the first 15, you lose your second round pick. If you sign two type A's, you'd lose the next pick that you have (second or third round) and so on.

Signing Type A's are the only way you lose picks, but not all Type A's are created equal. For instance, we lost a pick two years ago for signing Danys Baez, which was incredibly dumb.

I hope that at least clears up a little bit of that.

[health55]

From today's MLB Trade Rumors chat:


2:10 [Comment From Rob]
Aubrey Huff for Brandon Wood(if Tex doesn't sign with Angels)
2:11 Tim Dierkes: The Angels could've claimed Huff and possibly gotten him for nothing, and chose not to. So I cant see them giving up a good young player.

http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php?option=com_altcaster&task=viewaltcast&altcast_code=4ea932434c&width=470&height=550&replay=y

[Sports Guy]

From today's MLB Trade Rumors chat:



http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php?option=com_altcaster&task=viewaltcast&altcast_code=4ea932434c&width=470&height=550&replay=y

That was from me.

His answer makes sense except now Huff is owed less money, got through a whole season playing at a high level, we know Scoiscia isn't a big fan of Wood's and if they lose Tex, they need a power bat for first.

That seems to make more sense than Figgins for Konerko, as has been thrown around(unless the Angels love Wood, which doesn't seem to be the case).

One thing I would say is that maybe they would try to move Wood for something better and more long term, like Peavy.

[bmorebirds_24]

Free Agents are broken down into Type A, Type B, or no type Free Agents, depending on how well you played the past two seasons.

If you sign a Type A Player, you lose your first round draft pick, unless you pick in the first 15. If you pick in the first 15, you lose your second round pick. If you sign two type A's, you'd lose the next pick that you have (second or third round) and so on.

Signing Type A's are the only way you lose picks, but not all Type A's are created equal. For instance, we lost a pick two years ago for signing Danys Baez, which was incredibly dumb.

I hope that at least clears up a little bit of that.




ok i gotcha.thanks again!!!

[PaulBako]

From today's MLB Trade Rumors chat:



http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php?option=com_altcaster&task=viewaltcast&altcast_code=4ea932434c&width=470&height=550&replay=y

I really want Wood! So how about we add Sherrill and they add another player to be fair.

[BaltimoreGhost]

That's kind of like saying that Kevin Millar must be a good hitter because he had about the same number of singles as Ryan Howard.

It's somewhere between misleading and irrelevant.

Well here's Baseball Prospectus' take on him, far from disheartening.

"Khalil Greene is an intriguing player. The Padres shortstop is capable of hitting for some power at a difficult defensive position, but he lacks discipline at the plate, cannot seem to hit in his home park, and developed something of an injury bug during his time in the majors. Entering his age-27 season this year, PECOTA expects him to be solidly above average for his position the next five years, and it seems as if the scouting reports and advanced fielding metrics finally agree on Greene's place in the defensive shortstop hierarchy (hint: it's lofty)."

[Crazysilver03]

From today's MLB Trade Rumors chat:



http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php?option=com_altcaster&task=viewaltcast&altcast_code=4ea932434c&width=470&height=550&replay=y

There is no way the Angels could have claimed him and just taken him on without trading something for him.

[laxtonto]

Got a couple of quickies for the SS pile from one of the Rangers blogs...


3. Rangers farm director Scott Servais will go see Joaquin Arias at the club’s academy in the Dominican Republic next week. Indications right now are that Arias is ready to start making throws from shortstop in games and could begin playing in the Dominican Winter League as soon as Servais watches his workout.

4. Lot of shortstop news bubbling out of the Dominican: The Rangers are planning on having INF Jose Vallejo, previously juist a second baseman, work at shortstop. Right now, it doesn’t sound as if it will be a full-time move, but could eventually become one.

Needless to say, if Arias is healthy he is a great defensive SS and decent offensively.


SEASON G AB AVG OBP SLG OPS
2008 Tex 32 110 .291 .345 .409 .754


The other question to ask is "If Arias and now Vallejo are viable SS options, does that mean Andrus could be in play?"

[JTrea81]

Got a couple of quickies for the SS pile from one of the Rangers blogs...



Needless to say, if Arias is healthy he is a great defensive SS and decent offensively.


SEASON G AB AVG OBP SLG OPS
2008 Tex 32 110 .291 .345 .409 .754


The other question to ask is "If Arias and now Vallejo are viable SS options, does that mean Andrus could be in play?"

I see them trading Arias before Andrus. Arias is a utility player right now and probably could be had for very little. He's one of my top SS targets...

[Baltimoron]

Well here's Baseball Prospectus' take on him, far from disheartening.

"Khalil Greene is an intriguing player. The Padres shortstop is capable of hitting for some power at a difficult defensive position, but he lacks discipline at the plate, cannot seem to hit in his home park, and developed something of an injury bug during his time in the majors. Entering his age-27 season this year, PECOTA expects him to be solidly above average for his position the next five years, and it seems as if the scouting reports and advanced fielding metrics finally agree on Greene's place in the defensive shortstop hierarchy (hint: it's lofty)."

The point was more that fielding percentage is quite unhelpful (and not an advanced fielding metric) and Jeter is a really bad SS.

[bigbird]

Free Agents are broken down into Type A, Type B, or no type Free Agents, depending on how well you played the past two seasons.

If you sign a Type A Player, you lose your first round draft pick, unless you pick in the first 15. If you pick in the first 15, you lose your second round pick. If you sign two type A's, you'd lose the next pick that you have (second or third round) and so on.

Signing Type A's are the only way you lose picks, but not all Type A's are created equal. For instance, we lost a pick two years ago for signing Danys Baez, which was incredibly dumb.

I hope that at least clears up a little bit of that.

Keep in mind the players 2008 team must offer arbitration in order to receive draft pick compensation.

[JTrea81]

Jimmy Rollins might available according to the San Jose Mercury News:


–Another Phillie name with local ties: Alameda’s Jimmy Rollins. There have been rumors that Philadelphia will listen to offers for the 2007 MVP. Even if true, the price would be prohibitively high. He’d look great in a Giants uniform, but I don’t see him being a realistic target for them.

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/extrabaggs/2008/11/05/hot-stove-thoughts-furcal-a-sensible-target-for-giants/

This would make sense given Donald's success. Philly could get a ton for Rollins...