View Full Version : LeBron stays in Cleveland next year if....
Sports Guy
05-11-2010, 11:03 PM
..there is a new head coach...Mike Borwn isn't cutting it.
The name I am thinking? Phil Jackson.
Jeannie Buss believes he will be coaching somewhere next year and it may not be LA...If he isn't LA, going wherever LeBron does makes the most sense.
What has been said about Phil recently is that if he coaches next year it will be for the Lakers. That was to refute the Bulls rumors. Maybe you've heard something more recently.
ccbird
05-12-2010, 02:44 AM
Not that Brown isn't a bad coach but there is always an excuse for Lebron's failures in the playoffs.
Sports Guy
05-12-2010, 08:42 AM
What has been said about Phil recently is that if he coaches next year it will be for the Lakers. That was to refute the Bulls rumors. Maybe you've heard something more recently.
As I said, last week Jeannie Buss said she believes Phil will be coaching somewhere next year...LA or not.
As I said, last week Jeannie Buss said she believes Phil will be coaching somewhere next year...LA or not.
Well more recently it's been said if he'll coach, it will be in LA.
Not that Brown isn't a bad coach but there is always an excuse for Lebron's failures in the playoffs.
He sucked last night, but lets not act like he's had the best team in previous years.
ccbird
05-12-2010, 09:39 PM
He sucked last night, but lets not act like he's had the best team in previous years.
His team had the best reg season record the last two years and it looks like he's not going to get out of the Eastern Conference either year. Sure, there is some validity to the excuses I constantly hear for the guy but at what point do people start pointing a finger at Lebron too.
Sports Guy
05-12-2010, 10:15 PM
His team had the best reg season record the last two years and it looks like he's not going to get out of the Eastern Conference either year. Sure, there is some validity to the excuses I constantly hear for the guy but at what point do people start pointing a finger at Lebron too.
Yep...for the supposed best player in the league, he needs to get his team to the finals.
His team had the best reg season record the last two years and it looks like he's not going to get out of the Eastern Conference either year. Sure, there is some validity to the excuses I constantly hear for the guy but at what point do people start pointing a finger at Lebron too.
This year.
And just because his team has had the best regular season record doesn't mean they've been the best team. He's just so good that the team wins a ton of games even though the supporting cast hasn't always been that good.
I don't know what to tell you if want to blame a guy for losing a series to a very good Magic team that presented matchup problems for them when this is what he did that series:
38.5 ppg, 8 asts, 8.3 reb on 49% shooting.
Yep...for the supposed best player in the league, he needs to get his team to the finals.
He has done that before. It's also a team sport. I just showed what he did last year against the Magic, it's hard to blame him for that. Last night was awful though.
Dr. FLK
05-13-2010, 09:07 AM
When I heard Queen James say that he "spoils people with his play", has only had 3 bad games in his career, and feels bad for himself...I ramped up my hatred of him. What a whiny $&@#! he is...
Dr. FLK
05-13-2010, 09:08 AM
He has done that before. It's also a team sport. I just showed what he did last year against the Magic, it's hard to blame him for that. Last night was awful though.
The NBA is much less of a "team sport" than any other major sport. One great player can carry a team, because it's basically been reduced to one-on-one street ball.
Sports Guy
05-13-2010, 11:45 AM
You can have LeBron..Come playoff time, give me Kobe every day of the week.
AgentOrange
05-13-2010, 11:46 AM
You can have LeBron..Come playoff time, give me Kobe every day of the week.
I will take LeBron right now and moving forward.
Sports Guy
05-13-2010, 11:49 AM
I will take LeBron right now and moving forward.
I think I would prefer to have Kobe for this playoffs and probably next year as well...By then, LeBron will have a better understanding for the game come playoff time and will be a smarter and better player.
It took MJ a while to get that point and MJ came out of college.
LeBron is great and is probably better than Kobe now but in a pressure situation and things like that, I want the ball in Kobe's hand..either to take the shot or to make the smart decision.
AgentOrange
05-13-2010, 11:58 AM
It is hard to argue with what you are saying. I think LeBron will be fine tonight and I still think they can come out of the east. I like Kobe's team better than LeBron's, which is nice for Kobe because he usually knows when to shoot and when to pass.
Sports Guy
05-13-2010, 12:37 PM
It is hard to argue with what you are saying. I think LeBron will be fine tonight and I still think they can come out of the east. I like Kobe's team better than LeBron's, which is nice for Kobe because he usually knows when to shoot and when to pass.
Yea, I think those kicking the dirt on the Cavs are a little premature.
That being said, Brown isn't a good coach and if they are having chemistry issues, then they could be in trouble.
The NBA is much less of a "team sport" than any other major sport. One great player can carry a team, because it's basically been reduced to one-on-one street ball.
It hasn't been reduced to that and look at my post that shows what he did vs the Magic last year. You really want to put that series on James?
I will take LeBron right now and moving forward.
I would too. He's much better than Kobe. He's actually played better than Kobe this postseason and last as well.
But his supporting cast isn't nearly as good and he's facing a team that causes more problems for them than the Jazz did for the Lakers. The Jazz were the perfect matchup for the Lakers. Gasol has also been at least as good as Kobe these playoffs and should be the focal point against the Suns as well.
It is hard to argue with what you are saying. I think LeBron will be fine tonight and I still think they can come out of the east. I like Kobe's team better than LeBron's, which is nice for Kobe because he usually knows when to shoot and when to pass.
There's been a couple games where he shot way too much this postseason considering the advantage the Laker bigs have had so far and how he's played in some games. There was also the Kobe screw you game where he basically refused to shoot for the much of the first half and wasn't even trying to be a decoy. He was told to pass it more to Gasol most likely, and that was his rather childish response. The next game he basically did what he should have done in game 4.
waroriole
05-13-2010, 02:06 PM
Yea, I think those kicking the dirt on the Cavs are a little premature.
That being said, Brown isn't a good coach and if they are having chemistry issues, then they could be in trouble.
Absolutely. I'm a Celtics fan, and I'm pretty worried about losing this series, especially with everyone saying it's over.
ChaosLex
05-13-2010, 11:06 PM
Yea, I think those kicking the dirt on the Cavs are a little premature.
That being said, Brown isn't a good coach and if they are having chemistry issues, then they could be in trouble.
How about now? :D
This is Lebron James in a nutshell.
http://thehoopdoctors.com/online2/2010/04/lebron-james-degrades-chicago-ballboy/
Have fun watching the Finals from the comfort of your own home again, LBJ. :clap3:
Let's go Suns!
beaner
05-13-2010, 11:17 PM
Why is NO ONE calling out Danny Ferry for putting this crap roster together with the greatest player on the planet?
He had 27,19, and 10..and people are calling him out. Just plain stupid.
waroriole
05-13-2010, 11:19 PM
Why is NO ONE calling out Danny Ferry for putting this crap roster together with the greatest player on the planet?
He had 27,19, and 10..and people are calling him out. Just plain stupid.
The crap roster had the best record in the NBA.
Also, people are giving the C's no credit. Maybe the better team won.
beaner
05-13-2010, 11:20 PM
The crap roster had the best record in the NBA.
Regular season means little in the NBA, but point taken..
Credit to the Celtics, I agree, but man, Bron didn't get much help tonight in the second half.
waroriole
05-13-2010, 11:22 PM
I fully expect to get handled by Orlando, but if Garnett can play like he did against Cleveland they have a shot.
beaner
05-13-2010, 11:24 PM
I fully expect to get handled by Orlando, but if Garnett can play like he did against Cleveland they have a shot.
Rasheed played really well tonight as well, he could be a key guy against Orlando. Go get 'em. Make sure they knock Vince around a little, he avoids contact as soon as he's hit one time.
So, since everyone's going to start speculating where he ends up...
I think a dark horse signs him. I don't think he goes to NY. What about the Clippers? Assuming they're sufficiently under cap (I think they will be).
Good young nucleus. Could totally put his stamp on that franchise. They play in LA. He'd have an instant rivalry with Kobe. He'd be close to Nike. He'd be insanely marketable there. Makes just as much sense as NY or New Jersey if not more.
beaner
05-13-2010, 11:39 PM
So, since everyone's going to start speculating where he ends up...
I think a dark horse signs him. I don't think he goes to NY. What about the Clippers? Assuming they're sufficiently under cap (I think they will be).
Good young nucleus. Could totally put his stamp on that franchise. They play in LA. He'd have an instant rivalry with Kobe. He'd be close to Nike. He'd be insanely marketable there. Makes just as much sense as NY or New Jersey if not more.
They should have the space, and I like the rivalry with Kobe angle too..nice call.
I still say he stays if I had to bet on it.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 12:08 AM
Clev or Chicago.
I have always thought Chicago made the most sense and according to reports out now, chicago is the leader if Clev doesn't keep him.
If LeBron leaves, I think it is kind of cowardly to be honest.
They have tried to put a team around him...They have brought in enough talent to augment him.
The bottom line is coaching...That's why I made this thread...The Cavs should go all out and try to get Phil to Clev...That will be the difference.
Pedro Cerrano
05-14-2010, 12:10 AM
For the first time in a while I'm speechless. I can't believe that the Cavs have been eliminated.
The title is the Lakers' to lose now. The Suns are good but they lack the length and athleticism in the front court to keep up with Gasol and Bynum. We did a decent job against Deron Williams who is the superior point guard to Steve Nash at this point in each of their careers and I'm still not sold on this unreal bench depth.
The Lakers would also have home court against either Eastern Conference team.
They gotta be the favorites to win it all, which, along with $1 will get you a Bolt Bus ticket. They need to perform.
As for LBJ, I think he goes to the Knicks.
Pedro Cerrano
05-14-2010, 12:12 AM
Clev or Chicago.
I have always thought Chicago made the most sense and according to reports out now, chicago is the leader if Clev doesn't keep him.
If LeBron leaves, I think it is kind of cowardly to be honest.
They have tried to put a team around him...They have brought in enough talent to augment him.
The bottom line is coaching...That's why I made this thread...The Cavs should go all out and try to get Phil to Clev...That will be the difference.
Yes my goodness Mike Brown is just an awful awful coach. Putting Shaq on Garnett? Really? I know Jamison stinks defensively but Shaq is too, well, "fat" to effectively guard KG. They needed him to be on Perkins.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 12:14 AM
For the first time in a while I'm speechless. I can't believe that the Cavs have been eliminated.
The title is the Lakers' to lose now. The Suns are good but they lack the length and athleticism in the front court to keep up with Gasol and Bynum. We did a decent job against Deron Williams who is the superior point guard to Steve Nash at this point in each of their careers and I'm still not sold on this unreal bench depth.
The Lakers would also have home court against either Eastern Conference team.
They gotta be the favorites to win it all, which, along with $1 will get you a Bolt Bus ticket. They need to perform.
As for LBJ, I think he goes to the Knicks.
It always was...It was amusing the way people were acting like the Lakers were dead.
Pedro Cerrano
05-14-2010, 12:14 AM
Clev or Chicago.
I have always thought Chicago made the most sense and according to reports out now, chicago is the leader if Clev doesn't keep him.
If LeBron leaves, I think it is kind of cowardly to be honest.
They have tried to put a team around him...They have brought in enough talent to augment him.
The bottom line is coaching...That's why I made this thread...The Cavs should go all out and try to get Phil to Clev...That will be the difference.
If he wants to play for Phil so bad he should just sign with the Lakers!:D
Pedro Cerrano
05-14-2010, 12:18 AM
It always was...It was amusing the way people were acting like the Lakers were dead.
Did you watch 95% of their games this year? I did.
The team you're watching now is not the team that sleepwalked into the playoffs. I believe they had a below .500 record over their last 16 games or whatever.
Now, this obviously doesn't mean they were dead but it definitely raised some eyebrows, especially with how well Phoenix and other teams played out their seasons.
The bottom line is the Lakers obviously can turn it on and off unlike any team I can remember. When the future of the season is on the line they are extremely tough to beat and it appears to me that they dogged the end of the regular season because they could. Similar to the first round against Oklahoma City. Once the Lakers realized they needed to take that series seriously they went out and whipped them by 25 in game 5.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 12:24 AM
Did you watch 95% of their games this year? I did.
The team you're watching now is not the team that sleepwalked into the playoffs. I believe they had a below .500 record over their last 16 games or whatever.
Now, this obviously doesn't mean they were dead but it definitely raised some eyebrows, especially with how well Phoenix and other teams played out their seasons.
The bottom line is the Lakers obviously can turn it on and off unlike any team I can remember. When the future of the season is on the line they are extremely tough to beat and it appears to me that they dogged the end of the regular season because they could. Similar to the first round against Oklahoma City. Once the Lakers realized they needed to take that series seriously they went out and whipped them by 25 in game 5.
Bynum was hurt down the stretch and Kobe was probably holding back some to try and get healthy.
There are too talented and too well coached not to be the favorite IMO..with or without Cle in there.
Clev or Chicago.
I have always thought Chicago made the most sense and according to reports out now, chicago is the leader if Clev doesn't keep him.
If LeBron leaves, I think it is kind of cowardly to be honest.
They have tried to put a team around him...They have brought in enough talent to augment him.
The bottom line is coaching...That's why I made this thread...The Cavs should go all out and try to get Phil to Clev...That will be the difference.
They TRIED to put a team around him, but they didn't do a very good job of it. Mo Williams is about the next best thing they have going. Shaq's reanimated corpse and Jamison's warm body isn't exactly surrounding him with, say, the level of talent that Kobe has around him for example.
The thing for me, though, is that he'd be going from a bad situation in Cleveland to a much worse roster in New York or New Jersey. New York can afford two max guys, but they're not a contender with James/Bosh or James/Wade or James/Boozer and the rest of that roster. I know it makes sense marketing wise, but not really anywhere else.
If he's serious about winning, Chicago or the Clippers are probably his best choices, with Cleveland just behind them.
Why is NO ONE calling out Danny Ferry for putting this crap roster together with the greatest player on the planet?
He had 27,19, and 10..and people are calling him out. Just plain stupid.
Yeah, well the roster looks pretty good on paper, however your boy Jameson has been disappointing and Mo Williams rarely plays like an AS caliber PG. He was great in the first half tonight though.
For the first time in a while I'm speechless. I can't believe that the Cavs have been eliminated.
The title is the Lakers' to lose now. The Suns are good but they lack the length and athleticism in the front court to keep up with Gasol and Bynum. We did a decent job against Deron Williams who is the superior point guard to Steve Nash at this point in each of their careers and I'm still not sold on this unreal bench depth.
The Lakers would also have home court against either Eastern Conference team.
They gotta be the favorites to win it all, which, along with $1 will get you a Bolt Bus ticket. They need to perform.
As for LBJ, I think he goes to the Knicks.
Sure about that? Magic won 2 more games during the season.
The Lakers should be able to beat the Suns, but I'm not so confident in them vs the Magic or even the Celtics, but they'd certainly have a good shot.
Bynum was hurt down the stretch and Kobe was probably holding back some to try and get healthy.
There are too talented and too well coached not to be the favorite IMO..with or without Cle in there.
I also watched the vast majority of the games this year and there were very good reasons to think they weren't the favorites this year.
Kobe just wasn't himself this year, especially after the injuries. He's been losing some of his athleticism even going back to the previous few years, but it got much worse in the second half of this year. I think it's funny that the media just started picking up on this somewhat recently, and even a lot of them don't say it now.
Plus Kobe was awful for much of the late part of the season.
Artest wasn't as good this season as Ariza was last year. Plus the bench has been rather poor other than Odom. Fisher also continued his decline and really wasn't a starting caliber player this year.
Other than all that, the Cavs swept them and Denver beat them 3 out of 4 times. As impressive as their sweep of the Jazz was, you have to realize that they were the perfect matchup for the Lakers. OKC was also a great matchup for them and they struggled to win that series. They've been lucky that they get to avoid the Nuggets, Mavs, Spurs, and now the Cavs because those are team they would have had trouble with imo.
But even now, the Magic and Celtics are playing at least as good basketball, so I'm not confident in the Lakers. This team is not as good as last year's version imo.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 09:06 AM
Yeah, well the roster looks pretty good on paper, however your boy Jameson has been disappointing and Mo Williams rarely plays like an AS caliber PG. He was great in the first half tonight though.
Their roster wins with a better coach.
Pedro Cerrano
05-14-2010, 10:51 AM
Sure about that? Magic won 2 more games during the season.
The Lakers should be able to beat the Suns, but I'm not so confident in them vs the Magic or even the Celtics, but they'd certainly have a good shot.
Brain fart on my part.
I'll be extremely disappointed if the Lakers lose in the NBA finals to the Celtics, given they have homecourt and are, in my opinion, the superior team both coaching-wise and talent-wise.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 11:05 AM
The Lakers started the playoffs with the best chance to win and are still the team to beat.
Orlando and Boston are playing well but Orlando hasn't played anyone and Clev looked like they gave up in those last 2 games for what I saw and from what I have heard.
The Lakers still have Kobe and Phil and those 2 are better than anything any other team has.
The Lakers started the playoffs with the best chance to win and are still the team to beat.
Orlando and Boston are playing well but Orlando hasn't played anyone and Clev looked like they gave up in those last 2 games for what I saw and from what I have heard.
The Lakers still have Kobe and Phil and those 2 are better than anything any other team has.
That looks a lot better now, but I think it was hard to argue this going into the playoffs for reasons I already stated.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 01:40 PM
That looks a lot better now, but I think it was hard to argue this going into the playoffs for reasons I already stated.
I disagree...Kobe and Phil were still on the Lakers before the playoffs started...That's why I had them winning.
The west also wasn't as tough as people thought.
Pedro Cerrano
05-14-2010, 02:01 PM
Mike Brown has been fired....
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/basketball/nba/05/14/brown/
I disagree...Kobe and Phil were still on the Lakers before the playoffs started...That's why I had them winning.
The west also wasn't as tough as people thought.
Well I doubt you watched much of Kobe in the last two-thirds of the year then. He just wasn't even close to being as good as he used to be. He's still not as good, but has recently gotten healthier and better. There's still some talk about him in the best player discussion, well he was a borderline top 10 player since January and often not the best player on his own team. He was more of a reason for concern coming into the playoffs than a reason to inspire a great deal of confidence.
The west was plenty tough, the Lakers have been lucky with who they've played though. I think a lot of people are being tricked into thinking this Lakers team is at the level it was last year based on them sweeping a team that was a perfect match-up for them.
But of course I hope they win, but I think Orlando would have a good shot and Boston would have a respectable chance as well.
tvz1997
05-14-2010, 02:19 PM
Mike Brown has been fired....
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/basketball/nba/05/14/brown/
I was yelling at the TV last night when the Cavs were rendered catatonic in the last minute of that game. I know that the odds of them coming back in 60 seconds were beyond slim, but to see a team just roll over like that was so hard to watch. JoePoz chimed in on that last minute today too: http://joeposnanski.com/JoeBlog/2010/05/14/one-last-bitter-moment/
Even when the Cavs would go on runs in games 5 and 6, their faces showed that they had already lost in their minds. At the peak of Mo Williams' offensive surge last night, the camera zoomed in for a closeup of his face as he backpedalled down the court after scoring and EVEN THEN, he looked like he had just gotten really bad news from the doctor.
I love it when JoePoz points out how Brown said that they had fought to the end. :rolleyestf:
tvz1997
05-14-2010, 03:08 PM
Mike Brown has been fired....
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/basketball/nba/05/14/brown/
The Cavs owner just had a press conference and said that Brown is not fired ... yet.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 03:43 PM
Well I doubt you watched much of Kobe in the last two-thirds of the year
then. He just wasn't even close to being as good as he used to be. He's still not as good, but has recently gotten healthier and better. There's still some talk about him in the best player discussion, well he was a borderline top 10 player since January and often not the best player on his own team. He was more of a reason for concern coming into the playoffs than a reason to inspire a great deal of confidence. None of that mattered...Playoffs were/are a different story...as he is proving.
The west was plenty tough, the Lakers have been lucky with who they've played though. I think a lot of people are being tricked into thinking this Lakers team is at the level it was last year based on them sweeping a team that was a perfect match-up for them.OKC was as good as any team they were going to play...The West had a bunch of good but not great teams and the better teams haven't proven it in the playoffs, had coaching issues and/or injury issues.
But of course I hope they win, but I think Orlando would have a good shot and Boston would have a respectable chance as well.
Sure they both have a chance...But LA should beat either.
Of course it mattered. This wasn't a case of Kobe struggling because the games weren't important enough, it was a case of him struggling because of what he was dealing with physically and there was no way of knowing how much better, if any, those issues would get.
He's still not the Kobe of old either. Gasol has been at least as valuable as Kobe these playoffs.
OKC was obviously not the best team they could have played and clearly not one of the potential bad match-ups for them.
Lakers-Magic would be pretty close to a toss up.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 05:50 PM
Of course it mattered. This wasn't a case of Kobe struggling because the games weren't important enough, it was a case of him struggling because of what he was dealing with physically and there was no way of knowing how much better, if any, those issues would get.
He's still not the Kobe of old either. Gasol has been at least as valuable as Kobe these playoffs.
OKC was obviously not the best team they could have played and clearly not one of the potential bad match-ups for them.
Lakers-Magic would be pretty close to a toss up.
In the west..yes they were and they were clearly a bad matchup for them because of their athleticism and youth.
In the west..yes they were and they were clearly a bad matchup for them because of their athleticism and youth.
OKC has no good bigs, only two real scorers, their best player was a good match up for Artest, and they had very little outside shooting other than Durant. Plus, they have no playoff experience. I, as a Laker fan, was much happier to have them play the Thunder rather than the Spurs. If Kobe was as good in that series as he was against the Jazz and he let Gasol and Bynum have their way inside more, they Lakers would have cruised in that series.
Otherwise, I guess there's no point in continuing to discuss this since you're ignoring many of my points and this is just a hindsight discussion anyway.
Sports Guy
05-14-2010, 09:38 PM
OKC has no good bigs, only two real scorers, their best player was a good match up for Artest, and they had very little outside shooting other than Durant. Plus, they have no playoff experience. I, as a Laker fan, was much happier to have them play the Thunder rather than the Spurs. If Kobe was as good in that series as he was against the Jazz and he let Gasol and Bynum have their way inside more, they Lakers would have cruised in that series.
Otherwise, I guess there's no point in continuing to discuss this since you're ignoring many of my points and this is just a hindsight discussion anyway.
I'm not ignoring your points...I just don't care about them....Your points are, IMO, pointless.
The only legit thing was how bad was Kobe hurt. That's it.
Nothing else mattered whatsoever and as he has showed, he can get through the injuries and still perform at a high level.
And OKC represented other matchup issues for the Lakers.
I would have rather played teams like Dallas than OKC...All of those western conference teams were within like 5 games of each other...No one really stood out...Everyone was all over Dallas but what the hell have they proven? Nothing...They have shown they can be a good REGULAR SEASON team...Same as Cleveland.
The NBA is about the playoffs...Come talk to me when any of those teams make a bit of a difference in the playoffs.
RipkenWay
05-15-2010, 12:03 AM
LeBron stays in Cleveland if they trade Delonte West.
This story is almost unbelievable so I honestly don't believe it. However, if it is true this has to be one of the greatest stories I have ever read. You guys take a look and decide. :laughlol:
http://wcwpsports.blogspot.com/2010/05/west-sleeping-with-lebrons-mom-reason.html
I'm not ignoring your points...I just don't care about them....Your points are, IMO, pointless.
The only legit thing was how bad was Kobe hurt. That's it.
Nothing else mattered whatsoever and as he has showed, he can get through the injuries and still perform at a high level.
And OKC represented other matchup issues for the Lakers.
I would have rather played teams like Dallas than OKC...All of those western conference teams were within like 5 games of each other...No one really stood out...Everyone was all over Dallas but what the hell have they proven? Nothing...They have shown they can be a good REGULAR SEASON team...Same as Cleveland.
The NBA is about the playoffs...Come talk to me when any of those teams make a bit of a difference in the playoffs.
Very legit and you were ignoring it. My points are far from pointless, but you go on and continue to think that and that OKC was the tied for the toughest match-up for the Lakers. As someone who watches the Lakers consistently, I know that's not the case at all and I know this team wasn't as good as last years going into the playoffs.
These playoffs have also setup perfectly for the Lakers so far. I guess playing Portland may have been better in the first round only due to Roy being out, but otherwise I couldn't have asked for anything better than OKC, Utah, and now the Suns. Much better for them than the Spurs, Nuggets, and Mavs. That should be clear to anyone who watches the Lakers often and knows how well they match-up vs other teams. I'm not saying any of them would have been favorites against the Lakers, but they would have had decent shots while the Thunder and Jazz did not and I don't think the Suns have as good of a shot as the other 3 either. It's a lot harder to get through 3 rounds when you're a 60/40 bet in each series compared to a 90/10.
Not sure why you threw that last comment in. You're the one saying OKC was as tough a match-up as any other west team, and they never even made the playoffs before, yet you're knocking the Cavs and Mavs, two teams who have made it to the Finals somewhat recently for not being good playoff teams. So I'm not sure what you mean by a bit of a difference, but I'd say that's already happened. Then there's the Spurs, who apparently would have been no more difficult a matchup for the Lakers and there's the Celtics, who the have already beat the Lakers in the finals, yet the Lakers should beat them according to you.
Besides, every champ was not a champ at some point. Plus, with the logic you're using, the Spurs should have beat the Suns.
Sports Guy
05-15-2010, 09:04 AM
Very legit and you were ignoring it. My points are far from pointless, but you go on and continue to think that and that OKC was the tied for the toughest match-up for the Lakers. As someone who watches the Lakers consistently, I know that's not the case at all and I know this team wasn't as good as last years going into the playoffs. You can watch them all you want...But OKC was able to expose them with their speed, athleticism and youth...They were obviously a difficult matchup for them.
These playoffs have also setup perfectly for the Lakers so far. I guess playing Portland may have been better in the first round only due to Roy being out, but otherwise I couldn't have asked for anything better than OKC, Utah, and now the Suns. Much better for them than the Spurs, Nuggets, and Mavs. That should be clear to anyone who watches the Lakers often and nows how well they match-up vs other teams. I'm not saying any of them would have been favorites against the Lakers, but they would have had decent shots while the Thunder and Jazz did not and I don't think the Suns have as good of a shot as the other 3 either. It's a lot harder to get through 3 rounds when you're a 60/40 bet in each series compared to a 90/10.The Spurs were probably the other tough matchup for them...The difference is SA was older but their experience factor made them tougher.
Not sure why you threw that last comment in. You're the one saying OKC was as tough a match-up as any other west team, and they never even made the playoffs beforeOne has nothing to do with the other....We are talking one series, not the whole playoffs.
For an entire playoffs, obviously OKC wouldn't be a team you take over some of the other teams....BUT for one series, they were as dangerous as any other team LA could have faced.
I don't think anyone thought OKC was one of the toughest matchups for the Lakers going into it other than Beaner.:D They only gave the Lakers a good series because Kobe was poor the first 3 games and didn't give the ball to Gasol and Bynum enough where they had a huge advantage (big reason why all the series' have been good match-ups for them) and then he pulled the good old Kobe protest game out in game 4.
So yeah, when the guy you point to as the biggest reason they'll win plays bad/stupid, especially by design, they'll be challenged by any playoff team. So not a match-up problem, but a Kobe problem.
Sure they presented some difficulties as any team would, but they had more of an advantage against them than they would the Spurs, Nugs, or Mavs. Those teams all can defend the Lakers bigs significantly better which is a huge deal, they have much more playoff experience, are actually at least slightly better teams, have many more scorers, and Artest isn't as good of a defensive matchup on any of their stars as he was on Durant. Ron is good against Melo, but not as effective as he was with Durant, but he doesn't really present much of a defensive issue for the other two.
But when they decided to play the right way and Kobe got healthier with extra rest, they dominated game 5 and won on the road in game 6. Having Kobe on Westbrook also eliminated what was the biggest match-up issue of the series. If Kobe was more healthy from the start, played good and smart ball, and was on Westbrook more from the start, they would have won easily.
There is no plan for them to win easily against the other 3 teams, it can happen, but isn't likely at all.
Sports Guy
05-15-2010, 02:08 PM
I don't think anyone thought OKC was one of the toughest matchups for the Lakers going into it other than Beaner.:D You must not have listened to many of the ESPN guys...A lot of people felt that way.
You must not have listened to many of the ESPN guys...A lot of people felt that way.
I listened to and read plenty. I think you're confusing talk of them being able to cause some problems for the Lakers with them being as tough a matchup as possible for the Lakers. Again, I'm not saying they were pushovers, but the Spurs would have been the toughest 1st round opponent followed by the Nugs and then the Mavs. They're fortunate that they've gotten better matchups for themselves. Oh, and most of the concern from the media over the Lakers-Thunder series was due to how Kobe looked physically leading up to the playoffs.
I guess we'll have to do what anyone would have been able to foresee when this started, and that's to agree to disagree.:D
Birds of B'more
05-16-2010, 05:26 PM
Further proof that things can change in a heartbeat when the playoffs begin: the Boston Celtics. They looked completely disinterested as they slogged through the 2nd half of the season, and some media-types were saying they could get bounced in the 1st Round by Miami. And next thing you know, here they are pounding Orlando in Game 1 of the Conference Finals. Looks like we could be in for yet another Celtics-Lakers Finals.
Pedro Cerrano
05-16-2010, 09:08 PM
God I wish the Celtics would just go away.
Birds of B'more
05-16-2010, 09:19 PM
If Rondo continues to play as out-of-his-mind as he did in the Cleveland series, they aren't going away anytime soon.
waroriole
05-17-2010, 11:51 AM
Question for the NBA guys on here. All season long, including the playoffs, the Celtics have got out to big leads early in games, only to have it slip away late. What is it about this team that they just can't finish teams off. I know the NBA is a "comeback league," but this is ridiculous.
Pedro Cerrano
05-17-2010, 11:53 AM
Question for the NBA guys on here. All season long, including the playoffs, the Celtics have got out to big leads early in games, only to have it slip away late. What is it about this team that they just can't finish teams off. I know the NBA is a "comeback league," but this is ridiculous.
My theory is that when you're trying to hold a lead your offense tends to stall.
Combine that with playing a team that can score a boatload of points in a short time and you have a quasi-answer.
waroriole
05-17-2010, 11:57 AM
My theory is that when you're trying to hold a lead your offense tends to stall.
Combine that with playing a team that can score a boatload of points in a short time and you have a quasi-answer.
I guess that makes sense in college, but in the NBA you have a 24 second shot clock, so you can't stall too much anyway. I wonder why the Celtics give away big leads almost nightly. It is a pattern with them, and I don't know if it's age, or there is something different about them.
Dr. FLK
05-17-2010, 02:11 PM
It hasn't been reduced to that and look at my post that shows what he did vs the Magic last year. You really want to put that series on James?
If he had won would he be getting all the credit?
Pedro Cerrano
05-17-2010, 02:19 PM
If he had won would he be getting all the credit?
Most of it, IMO.
If he had won would he be getting all the credit?
Considering he put up those type of numbers and there wasn't any other very good players on the team, he should get most of the credit if they had won.
Dr. FLK
05-17-2010, 08:36 PM
Considering he put up those type of numbers and there wasn't any other very good players on the team, he should get most of the credit if they had won.
He had good players this year. He had a 2nd team all-def C. He had Shaq. He had Mo Williams...Jamison...the Gunslinger...not a bad supporting cast.
He had good players this year. He had a 2nd team all-def C. He had Shaq. He had Mo Williams...Jamison...the Gunslinger...not a bad supporting cast.
We were talking about the Magic series last year.
Sure some of those players are good, but Jamison was a late season pick-up, and never really gelled with the team. He was good against the Bulls, but was mediocre against the C's.
Mo Williams is solid, but nothing special and didn't play well against the C's either. Shaq is only a decent player now.
So, ok, not a bad supporting cast, but not a good one either. The C's had the next 4 best players in that series. The Magic have 4 players better than the next best Cav. Kobe has another top 10 caliber player on his team.
But again, I was talking about last year, and no one has been able to say much in response to the numbers LeBron put up against the Magic last year. It just doesn't make sense to blame him for that.
Now he should have been better in those last two games against the C's, especially game 5. I won't argue that. However, he was dealing with a bad elbow, and he didn't get much help, so that shouldn't be dismissed either.
waroriole
05-18-2010, 11:15 PM
Dwight Howard can not make any shot that isn't a dunk. He has ZERO post moves.
waroriole
05-18-2010, 11:25 PM
Should've stayed quiet.
I can't stand Jeff Van Gundy.
Celtics win the first two games at Orlando. Nuts. And certainly makes the Cavs look better.
Boston could be better this year than two years ago, with the development of Perkins and Rondo canceling out the decline of Garnett and Pierce and Allen.
But Lakers are still should win IMO. Another very strong team.
commish
05-18-2010, 11:55 PM
LeBron stays in Cleveland if:
he handpicks the coach and GM once Brown and Ferry are fired
they sign-and-trade for Bosh or Johnson or Stoudemire (for Hickson, West, draft pick)
he values owning a city as much as winning titles (Chicago, the best title-winning option, will always be Jordan's city)
It's not that far-fetched...