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interloper

Connolly/Elias interview: Dominican facility upgrades, etc

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3 minutes ago, weams said:

I think 20 million a year is a lot to spend on international youth players, staff, and facilities. Let alone just in the DR. 

I think it is an issue of properly framing the expenditure.

For less than the cost of a -3 win player you can have international youth players, staff, and facilities.

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3 hours ago, atomic said:

The real sad thing is it probably costs next to nothing to set up a decent facility in the Dominican Republic.  

You may be right about that. I'm 

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6 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think it is an issue of properly framing the expenditure.

For less than the cost of a -3 win player you can have international youth players, staff, and facilities.

I see Davis found his way into this thread finally.

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Just now, interloper said:

I see Davis found his way into this thread finally.

I never gave a name.

I could have been talking about any number of players putting up -3 win seasons while making in excess of 20M annually.

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2 hours ago, atomic said:

They haven't spent money to upgrade the facilities. They are talking nickle and dime stuff and they still will have the worst facility in DR in baseball. If they announce they are spending 5 million dollars plus on a new facility that is spending. Installing trackman to the worst facility in baseball? Give me a freaking break.  That is $30,000.  

Come on now. This won't be done overnight. 

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1 hour ago, eddie83 said:

The Orioles should not spend money for the sake of spending it, not like they can’t reuse it elsewhere or later.

I wanted to highlight this ^^^ point. The international spending cap will go away, but the money would be there to spend later. It's important for a team that's competing with the ultra rich Yankees and Red Sox (and Jays), and the ultra efficient Rays, to also be efficient with their spending. The more they spend poorly now, the fewer options they have later. Poor spending will come back to bite us over time because it adds up. No doubt.

I also think it's worth at least acknowledging that there is some merit to the goal of hitting this market now when most of the rest of the ML teams aren't competing with you. If Florida drives up the price for a decent prospect, just imagine what could happen with 30 teams in the market for that prospect. In that sense, the option might be an overpay now or a significant overpay for similar talents when the international pools are reset.

In the end, it all comes down to our valuation of the player though. We need to compete for this talent, and our valuations need to be realistic to allow us to do so. 

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2 hours ago, TonySoprano said:

Not exactly what one would assign to the title of VP, Baseball Operations.  It’s more like he should be the store manager of a GNC or run a health club, instead of a 7-figure salary job. He was pretty vague beyond that as to what use is Brady in the Front Office 

That's a lot of money for Brady

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22 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I never gave a name.

I could have been talking about any number of players putting up -3 win seasons while making in excess of 20M annually.

I was going to see if there was some convoluted way to trip you up, using 100 years of inflation and the like.  But what I figured out was that the combined salaries of the entire 1894 NL was in the ballpark of $525,000.   Adjust for inflation and that's something like $15M.  So in real terms Davis is making more than all 264 players of the 1894 National League.

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42 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think it is an issue of properly framing the expenditure.

For less than the cost of a -3 win player you can have international youth players, staff, and facilities.

Oh, sure, like all that’s worth it compared to all the slugging Davis could do.

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52 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think it is an issue of properly framing the expenditure.

For less than the cost of a -3 win player you can have international youth players, staff, and facilities.

Could you go back and mention that to Jim Beattie, circa 2003?  You know, back when there were no limits or regulations on signing international talent or draft picks.  Or at least MacPhail in 2008 when he would go on about how the ROI on all the methods to acquire talent was way too low so they shouldn't bother.

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Really going down a rabbit hole here, pal. 

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LOL. I am losing the argument?  Good one when you have nothing valid in an argue you just tell the other person they are losing the argument. 

I don't think you read the content above telling you that you lost the argument. So we'll move past this. 

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So other teams are so stupid they want to sign him for $2 million.  Marlins are acquiring more money to sign him. 

"Other teams are doing it" is not an argument. You're really pointing to the Marlins of all franchises as one we should hold on high for organizational decision-making? If other franchises are well ahead of the Orioles as far as international infrastructure, they have more money to allocate to talent acquisition. I'm not going to purchase a new 60-inch top-of-the-line TV if the rest of my living room is torn down to the studs. If Elias has a set budget to spend on international scouting, development and talent acquisition, it makes sense for that money to go toward infrastructure first. Throwing money at marginal talents is one reason we were awful for a decade. 

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I haven't seen the guy play but all you guys do is make up excuses for everything the Orioles are not doing to improve the club.  Neither one of us has seen Sanchez play but my point is valid.

No, your point is not valid.

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If a guy is worth $1.75 million at 21 that means you expect him to contribute at the major league level.  If he can contribute at the major league level even if it is 1 WAR he is worth 2.5 million. 

Now you're applying WAR and ML value to a hypothetical number thrown out by Luke. You're really chasing here. There is nothing that we know right now to say he is ready to play in the majors. The Orioles just picked up Richie Martin and Drew Jackson in Rule 5 who play the same position and scouting reports project similar types of players. Both of those players need to be on the ML roster all season or we give them back. This means Sanchez would likely spend the entire season in the minors, so.... this part of your argument is also invalid. 

Your argument comes down to the concept that the Orioles should spend money to make you feel better. You are losing it over the team signing a guy who would likely rank low on a Top 20 prospect rankings in a weak farm system. If Elias' team places a valuation on the player and his demands are beyond their comfort level, you don't sign him.  

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1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think it is an issue of properly framing the expenditure.

For less than the cost of a -3 win player you can have international youth players, staff, and facilities.

I think you can sign one for 10 million. 

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24 minutes ago, Tx Oriole said:

 Come on now. This won't be done overnight. 

No one said it would be. My p

 

12 minutes ago, WalkWithElias said:

Really going down a rabbit hole here, pal. 

I don't think you read the content above telling you that you lost the argument. So we'll move past this. 

"Other teams are doing it" is not an argument. You're really pointing to the Marlins of all franchises as one we should hold on high for organizational decision-making? If other franchises are well ahead of the Orioles as far as international infrastructure, they have more money to allocate to talent acquisition. I'm not going to purchase a new 60-inch top-of-the-line TV if the rest of my living room is torn down to the studs. If Elias has a set budget to spend on international scouting, development and talent acquisition, it makes sense for that money to go toward infrastructure first. Throwing money at marginal talents is one reason we were awful for a decade. 

No, your point is not valid.

Now you're applying WAR and ML value to a hypothetical number thrown out by Luke. You're really chasing here. There is nothing that we know right now to say he is ready to play in the majors. The Orioles just picked up Richie Martin and Drew Jackson in Rule 5 who play the same position and scouting reports project similar types of players. Both of those players need to be on the ML roster all season or we give them back. This means Sanchez would likely spend the entire season in the minors, so.... this part of your argument is also invalid. 

Your argument comes down to the concept that the Orioles should spend money to make you feel better. You are losing it over the team signing a guy who would likely rank low on a Top 20 prospect rankings in a weak farm system. If Elias' team places a valuation on the player and his demands are beyond their comfort level, you don't sign him.  

If this guy is so lowly rated why would Elias fly down to the Dominican to check him out.  Why would be teams be offering 2 million signing bonuses.  Also what does it matter if he has to spend 1 year in the minors?  I am saying if he is going to play in the majors and offer better than replacement value he is worth $2.5 million.   How am I losing it?  You seem to be the one losing it.  You haven't made a coherent thought yet. 

All I said is the Orioles have enough money to sign Sanchez even with spending a little bit of money upgrading their equipment in the Dominican Republic.   You do know the 16 year olds they sign in 2 years won't be ready until around the 2027 at earliest.  While the process has to start sometime they can't ignore the near future.  

 

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Also if as you say Sanchez is seen as equivalent to a second round pick, the slot values for a guy picked at the top of the second round is $1.5 million.  Would you pay 1 million dollars for another second round pick if you could buy one? 

The Braves paid $3 million dollars for the Orioles competitive Round B pick which is between 2nd and 3rd round.  Dodgers paid Orioles $2.5 million dollars for a similar pick.  And they also had to pay signing bonuses to those guys.  

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