Vince Young (as reported) and other possible QB Targets (POLL)

**Sports Guy** · 05-08-2011 12:17 PM

Originally Posted by allstar1579

The veteran will be Grossman, no question. He knows the system really well and he and little Shan are good friends. Much worse backups out there. The 3rd QB should absolutely be someone to compete with Beck, with the loser being 3rd QB.

Ok, that's fine.

So, bring in Young to compete...But I will say this...Bruce Gradkowski may be the sleeper of that entire group.

**OrioleMagic** · 05-08-2011 08:21 PM

ESPN Rumors doubts Young coming to the Skins via trade, and says signing him as an FA is not a high priority.

ESPN Blogger says Denver radio stations are saying they heard of a Haynesworth for Orton trade. This is likely due to Denver not selecting a DT, a huge need, and Washington not selecting a QB, another huge need.

The soap opera continues...

**allstar1579** · 05-08-2011 08:42 PM

Originally Posted by OrioleMagic

ESPN Rumors doubts Young coming to the Skins via trade, and says signing him as an FA is not a high priority.

ESPN Blogger says Denver radio stations are saying they heard of a Haynesworth for Orton trade. This is likely due to Denver not selecting a DT, a huge need, and Washington not selecting a QB, another huge need.

The soap opera continues...

This I could deal with. Mostly from addition by subtraction.

**JDubs** · 05-09-2011 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by OrioleMagic

ESPN Rumors doubts Young coming to the Skins via trade, and says signing him as an FA is not a high priority.

ESPN Blogger says Denver radio stations are saying they heard of a Haynesworth for Orton trade. This is likely due to Denver not selecting a DT, a huge need, and Washington not selecting a QB, another huge need.

The soap opera continues...

I don't understand why we would trade for a guy that we could likely get in FA at a reduced contract.

If we are trading for the guy, it better be for a bag of footballs. We can't trade players until the CBA is hashed out, so it means the trade would likely involve only picks (NOOOOO) or will not be finalized until there is a new CBA. If we trade anything higher than a 6 rounder for him, I'll be furious.

If on the other hand, we trade Malcolm Kelly and Haynesworth for him, then I'd be fine.

**OrioleMagic** · 05-09-2011 08:37 PM

Originally Posted by JDubs

I don't understand why we would trade for a guy that we could likely get in FA at a reduced contract.

If we are trading for the guy, it better be for a bag of footballs. We can't trade players until the CBA is hashed out, so it means the trade would likely involve only picks (NOOOOO) or will not be finalized until there is a new CBA. If we trade anything higher than a 6 rounder for him, I'll be furious.

If on the other hand, we trade Malcolm Kelly and Haynesworth for him, then I'd be fine.

I don't know where you get a pick being involved. The blog I read said the RUMOR was Haynesworth for Orton straight up.

**Sports Guy** · 05-09-2011 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by OrioleMagic

ESPN Rumors doubts Young coming to the Skins via trade, and says signing him as an FA is not a high priority.

ESPN Blogger says Denver radio stations are saying they heard of a Haynesworth for Orton trade. This is likely due to Denver not selecting a DT, a huge need, and Washington not selecting a QB, another huge need.

The soap opera continues...

Zero chance Denver does that deal, at least straight up.

**JDubs** · 05-09-2011 11:09 PM

Originally Posted by OrioleMagic

I don't know where you get a pick being involved. The blog I read said the RUMOR was Haynesworth for Orton straight up.

Ah, sorry, misread. I thought it said that VY trade was likely, not unlikely. That's more like it--if we are going to go after VY, it should definitely be through FA.

I like Orton, but clearly, a straight up Orton/Haynesworth deal is a fantasy. It would have to include picks or another player. In fact, the other player would have to be the centerpiece because AH is virtually valueless at the moment.

**OrioleMagic** · 05-10-2011 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by JDubs

Ah, sorry, misread. I thought it said that VY trade was likely, not unlikely. That's more like it--if we are going to go after VY, it should definitely be through FA.

I like Orton, but clearly, a straight up Orton/Haynesworth deal is a fantasy. It would have to include picks or another player. In fact, the other player would have to be the centerpiece because AH is virtually valueless at the moment.

I disagree with this. I think his value is diminished from a top 3 DT in the NFL that he was when Snyder signed him, but he is not valueless. I believe Shanahan will get something for him, but it won't be what he would be worth if he hadn't been a crybaby all year.

**Sports Guy** · 05-10-2011 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by OrioleMagic

I disagree with this. I think his value is diminished from a top 3 DT in the NFL that he was when Snyder signed him, but he is not valueless. I believe Shanahan will get something for him, but it won't be what he would be worth if he hadn't been a crybaby all year.

Do you have Burgundy colored sunglasses on?

With that contract and the headache he has been, there is no way AH has any value unless you are dealing with a moron. He is worse than TO ever was.

**JDubs** · 05-10-2011 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by OrioleMagic

I disagree with this. I think his value is diminished from a top 3 DT in the NFL that he was when Snyder signed him, but he is not valueless. I believe Shanahan will get something for him, but it won't be what he would be worth if he hadn't been a crybaby all year.

Yeah, I mean, I want to be with you here...but as much as it would be nice to get a good return for AH, he has so many strikes against him.

Most importantly, everyone knows that we are done with him, so regardless of whether he will do well elsewhere, he won't do well here...and everyone knows it. I think we are secretly (or not so much) desperate to get rid of AH. That alone makes his value plummet--like a distressed property that is for sale. It doesn't matter what the property is worth, only that its seller needs to get rid of it immediately.

Then, add in all of his legal troubles and corresponding likelihood that he will be suspended in the not too distant future. He has been indicted and placed on probation for driving 103 mph in a traffic incident from last March. Then he was cited for misdemeanor reckless driving and driving without registration. He did not tell his probation officer about the latter incident. He was later indicted for assault (road rage). And most recently, indicted with sexual abuse for assaulting a waitress. ALL while on probation. He is the defendant in a high-profile and pricey paternity suit. That's off the top of my head. I feel like there is more.

Oh, and the guy can play darn good football when properly motivated. So could Pacman Jones.

Like I said, I'm with you on AH. Let's get the most that we possibly can for him, but I'm trying to have realistic expectations. If we get a 6 rounder or better, then I will be ok with it. Unfortunately, the time to sell on AH was just a few minutes after we signed him. Since then, his value has been plummeting.

Also, while I believe in Shanny's trading prowess (or perhaps Bruce Allen's), Shanahan values high character and hard work above all else. I think he would cut AH without a second thought before keeping him on the roster. I don't believe that he'll turn down a lowball offer if it is the only one on the table, because I believe that he is planning on cutting AH as a last resort anyways.

**JDubs** · 05-10-2011 02:16 PM

It is very interesting to me that the Grossbeck option is the leading choice so far. I voted Orton in the somewhat remote possibility that John Fox and the Broncos have fallen in love with AH, but I know that is unlikely. My second choice would have been Grossbeck too. So, perhaps, Shanahan & Son know what they are doing here.

It is nice to see the Redskins taking the Amy Winehouse approach to building a football team. Make as many unsexy moves as possible and buy the Ferrari only after you have build your franchise. We've been taking the Britney Spears approach for way too long. Sure the sexy moves were fun at the time, but eventually, you are going to have a bald Albert Haynesworth standing outside of your facility screaming and swinging an umbrella at everyone.

**allstar1579** · 05-10-2011 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by Sports Guy

Do you have Burgundy colored sunglasses on?

With that contract and the headache he has been, there is no way AH has any value unless you are dealing with a moron. He is worse than TO ever was.

His contract is very team friendly now. It was SEVERELY front loaded with that balloon bonus he got last year. I think it comes out to like 2-3 years at like $4-5m per year for the rest of it. I can't remember the exact numbers, and I have to go mow the lawn so I really don't feel like looking them up again

**JDubs** · 05-10-2011 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by allstar1579

His contract is very team friendly now. It was SEVERELY front loaded with that balloon bonus he got last year. I think it comes out to like 2-3 years at like $4-5m per year for the rest of it. I can't remember the exact numbers, and I have to go mow the lawn so I really don't feel like looking them up again

Ah, yes. I meant to bring this up. And I agree, the most overlooked factor of desirability for AH is his contract moving forward. Still, I tend to be of two minds on this. It is great to get a player of AH's ability (assuming he chooses to use it) for that price tag; however, a player such as AH needs to be motivated somehow. He has demonstrated so far in his career that the most effective way to do that is with money. If you don't owe him any money, then you cannot hold it over him. He is basically free to do as he chooses until he is in a contract year again...which would be the 2015-16 season by my math.

**allstar1579** · 05-10-2011 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by JDubs

Ah, yes. I meant to bring this up. And I agree, the most overlooked factor of desirability for AH is his contract moving forward. Still, I tend to be of two minds on this. It is great to get a player of AH's ability (assuming he chooses to use it) for that price tag; however, a player such as AH needs to be motivated somehow. He has demonstrated so far in his career that the most effective way to do that is with money. If you don't owe him any money, then you cannot hold it over him. He is basically free to do as he chooses until he is in a contract year again...which would be the 2015-16 season by my math.

Pretty sure there are a couple options on the end that no team will pick up (good sized options and bonuses that are not guaranteed). For all intents and purposes there is 1 year and $5.4m left on his deal. The option for next year is like $7.2m and then after that there is a $20m bonus no one is going to pay, and some option salaries for 13-15, all non-guaranteed. 2012 isn't even guaranteed. So really, if he doesn't perform well and gets let go, he's not going to get paid on that next contract. If he does perform well this year, a team could keep him for an avg. salary and let him go year after, which he will ALSO need to perform to make sure he gets paid on THAT contract. He's basically year to year until he signs a new deal.

**Sports Guy** · 05-10-2011 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by allstar1579

His contract is very team friendly now. It was SEVERELY front loaded with that balloon bonus he got last year. I think it comes out to like 2-3 years at like $4-5m per year for the rest of it. I can't remember the exact numbers, and I have to go mow the lawn so I really don't feel like looking them up again

That helps...But 4-5 million for that walking pile of poop is still too much when you consider the baggage he brings.

TO at his worse was 100 times better to have on your team than this guy.

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Thread: Vince Young (as reported) and other possible QB Targets (POLL)

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