2nd Round - Jason Esposito - 3B - Vanderbilt University

[Stotle]

The opportunity to go to school does not go away when you play minor league ball. I understand if you have the opportunity to go to a premium college-the opportunity to go to that same college may not be there after a few years of minor league ball-but they will still have the opportunity to go to a good college and they will have much more knowledge about whether they can cut it in pro ball or not. I agree with Tony in that if a high schooler turns down an offer of a million or more-the odds are that they are making a mistake. This is because they will never have more leverage than they have out of high school-especially if they choose to go to a 4 year college.

Again, you are correct for the majority of HS kids. I disagree pretty stongly that the statement is true as a blanket matter. It is certainly possible that someone like Esposito is completely justified in thinking along the lines that his signing bonus is not the best chance he'll ever have to make money.

[Tony-OH]

Just a small point -- a lot of kids are "smart enough" to handle themselves at Stanford, Vanderbilt, UNC or UVA, but that doesn't mean they are reserved a spot in that school once they are no longer offering up their baseball services. Once you leave a school, you have to apply for readmission, which may or may not be available. Let's not forget that these kids, for the most part, are getting partial scholarships to come play baseball. Were they not playing baseball, there is no guarantee they would be admitted, regardless of smarts. Competition for spots in these schools is high.

In any event, I would think it's generally in a players interest to take seven figures and go play baseball. But opportunities afforded by schools like Stanford or Vandy sort of negate that. Keep in mind, he didn't turn down $1.5 MM, he turned down $1.5 MM less about 40% from taxes and another 5% (likely) to his advisor. So, around $825K (as opposed to around $330K now). Thats some nice cash, but isn't life changing. In fact, it's probably around 3-5 years of work if he's a solid student and gets a solid job out of Vandy.

I don't really disagree with your points, and you certainly make some valid pones, but I would disagree a bit that $850K is not life changing for a 18-year old. It may not be "I don't ever have to work again in my life" money, but $850K could allow him to buy his house, a nice car, and still have enough money for an education or to start a business. Going to a top school like Vandy or Stanford is certainly worth a lot, but even they know they are most likely leaving after three years, most without any degree.

Obviously each kid has to make his own decision and I agree that it's not so black and white. Some kids have always dreamed of playing baseball in college and you really can't put a price tag on remaining a kid for three more years instead of becoming a professional adult at 18. With the wash out rates of even the top prospects, making more money after that initial bonus is certainly not guaranteed, so it's understandable if a kid wants to go to college even after being offered a million or more.

Esposito's case where he lost $900K by going to college doesn't look good now if you look just at the dollars and cents. But as you mentioned, his Vandy education will hopefully give him more earning power over his lifetime if he washes out before reaching the majors and chooses to go back and finish his education.

Regardless, he left $900K on the table by going to college instead of signing out of high school while also losing out on about 1200-1500 professional at bats. I guess at the end of the day if a player thinks he's good enough to be a major league baseball player and he's offered a million or more, he should think long and hard about turning that down for college in my opinion.

[baseball777]

You also have to take into account that at best Vandy was giving him a 50% scholarship. It may have been more but 50% for a position player is pretty good considering D1 schools only have 11.7 scholarships to spread around among approximately 35 players and the lowest amount that can be granted is 25%.

With tutition at $55K a year at Vandy and if Esposito received a 1/2 scholarship, his family had to come up with approximately $80K in some manner to have him attend school for 3 years. Not a bad deal for a great education but still not a small sum and he now has to come up with the full $55K if he wants to complete his degree if it only takes him one year.

So that is another factor he and his family had to consider when he turned down KC's money. If he make the ML and has a decent career this is all a moot point.

[Stotle]

You also have to take into account that at best Vandy was giving him a 50% scholarship. It may have been more but 50% for a position player is pretty good considering D1 schools only have 11.7 scholarships to spread around among approximately 35 players and the lowest amount that can be granted is 25%.

With tutition at $55K a year Esposito and he received a 1/2 scholarship his family had to come up with approximately $80K in some manner to have him attend school for 3 years. Not a bad deal for a great education but still not a small sum and he now has to come up with the full $55K if he wants to complete his degree if it only takes him one year.

So that is another factor he and his family had to consider when he turned down KC's money. If he make the ML and has a decent career this is all a moot point.

Right. But the kids going to these schools are not generally coming from faimilies hard up for money. If the family cannot afford college, there is no question the kid should be turning pro, and the vast majority of kids in that situation do just that.

[baseball777]

Right. But the kids going to these schools are not generally coming from faimilies hard up for money. If the family cannot afford college, there is no question the kid should be turning pro, and the vast majority of kids in that situation do just that.

Agreed! Corbin and his staff have a lot to consider in recruiting. Grades, ability, and financial situation. So the job they have done is pretty remarkable when you consider how the program has improved.

[Stotle]

Agreed! Corbin and his staff have a lot to consider in recruiting. Grades, ability, and financial situation. So the job they have done is pretty remarkable when you consider how the program has improved.

A good friend of mine heads up recruiting at a small catholic D-I school. I'm always shocked at how difficult it is for him to find players that fit into the required profile of the program:

• strong academics
• baseball talent good enough for D-I comp but can't be so good that a more prestigious program is interested
• family must have some money
• usually, only catholic families are interested in going to school there

[jcarm]

Again, you are correct for the majority of HS kids. I disagree pretty stongly that the statement is true as a blanket matter. It is certainly possible that someone like Esposito is completely justified in thinking along the lines that his signing bonus is not the best chance he'll ever have to make money.

As you say-I really don't think we disagree much on this. Money is definitely not the end all of life. If Esposito's family is well off-he may not miss the bonus money that he lost by going to college. I do have to wonder, if money was not that important though-why did he hold out until 8/15? It is entirely possible, though, that he did not feel he was ready to turn pro(maturity wise) out of high school. It is definitely possible that 3 years of college, though it cost him in terms of bonus-may help him baseball wise in the long term. If he was not ready(again maturity wise) out of high school-he may have simply washed out in the minors. While if he is ready now-he will have a better chance of enduring the grind that is minor league ball. Obviously-these players are people too and life is about much more than money. So-I should not have made a blanket statement(even if the statement is true for most players-as we agree). This discussion will be largely irrelevant if he has a substantial Major League career.

[TakebackOPACY]

I'll bet and get 50-50 odds or better that Esposito will finish his degree at/through Vanderbilt. Price has done so... not sure if he has the degree yet. I'm guessing he'll graduate this winter. I believe Ryan Flaherty did so.

From a May 2011 article:

“He was going to take it,” Michael Esposito said. “But the more he sat on it, two or three days later, he was kind of quiet. He said, ‘I don’t want to sign, I want to go to school. I’m too young to make this a job.’”

Indeed, Esposito was still just 17. He wanted a college education, and didn’t want to have to go back to school as a 24, 25-year-old freshman if things didn’t work out in baseball.

“It wasn’t tough to pass up the money,” he insisted. “I had never really had money like that, so I didn’t know what I’d be missing if I didn’t have it. I just wanted an education, wanted to play for Coach Corbin, play at Vanderbilt, get my degree and have a fallback plan as far as school went. I was too young. I felt like I wanted to mature myself a little more.”

[baltfan]

If he makes it in the big leagues there is no doubt he will be thankful he went to college for the experience. If he doesn't make it, he will have a degree dorm a school that he may never have been able to get into hadhe failed in the minors.

[rickyrozay]

Right. But the kids going to these schools are not generally coming from faimilies hard up for money. If the family cannot afford college, there is no question the kid should be turning pro, and the vast majority of kids in that situation do just that.

ya. i suspect Tyler Beede's family is loaded since he comes from private school and he turned down 2.5M, ....but i could be wrong.

[rickyrozay]

If he makes it in the big leagues there is no doubt he will be thankful he went to college for the experience. If he doesn't make it, he will have a degree dorm a school that he may never have been able to get into hadhe failed in the minors.

that's a good way to look at it.
plus it's very difficult from a social standpoint to go back to college at age 24-25

[rickyrozay]

Agreed! Corbin and his staff have a lot to consider in recruiting. Grades, ability, and financial situation. So the job they have done is pretty remarkable when you consider how the program has improved.

are you sure Vanderbilt's not giving these kids full rides? if they only get like 11 full baseball scholarships, maybe they give one to Tyler Beede and another 3-4 recruits, no?

[Stotle]

are you sure Vanderbilt's not giving these kids full rides? if they only get like 11 full baseball scholarships, maybe they give one to Tyler Beede and another 3-4 recruits, no?

I believe current rules for D-I are 11.7 total scholarships and a max of 27 scholarship players, each of whom must receive at least 1/4 of a scholarship (6.75 total). The remaining 4.95 scholarships can be divided up as the coach sees fit, so technically there can be a few full rides if you limit a bulk of the players to the 1/4 minimum.

[Stotle]

ya. i suspect Tyler Beede's family is loaded since he comes from private school and he turned down 2.5M, ....but i could be wrong.

I don't think he has to be loaded. My family was far from loaded, but we were able to make college work for me and for my brother. I do not know Jason, but I'd assume it was a combination of factors, including his desire to go to college, and perhaps his desire not to start his pro career just yet. But I'm just guessing.

[mark_beckens]

You also have to take into account that at best Vandy was giving him a 50% scholarship. It may have been more but 50% for a position player is pretty good considering D1 schools only have 11.7 scholarships to spread around among approximately 35 players and the lowest amount that can be granted is 25%.

With tutition at $55K a year at Vandy and if Esposito received a 1/2 scholarship, his family had to come up with approximately $80K in some manner to have him attend school for 3 years. Not a bad deal for a great education but still not a small sum and he now has to come up with the full $55K if he wants to complete his degree if it only takes him one year.

So that is another factor he and his family had to consider when he turned down KC's money. If he make the ML and has a decent career this is all a moot point.

Curious, I know things have changed in the 20+ years since I played college ball, where are you getting this info? I got a full ride and most of my team had scholarships, not all full rides.