Building Around a Core

I pose a question: Who constitutes the core of the Orioles team going forward?

The Veterans:

Jones, Hardy, Wieters, Davis, Tillman, Jimenez, Chen, Britton, O'Day?

The Youth:

Machado, Schoop, Gausman?

The choice is not black and white, in fact, its surely a blend of both groups. Instead, this is a question of priorities. In a win now (2016) world, you keep as many of these guys as possible and add free agent talent.

In a long view, it may be better to start trading the veterans to bolster the youth movement.

From the veteran group Wieters, Davis, Chen, and O'Day can just walk and Orioles get draft picks. That leaves Jones, Hardy, Tillman, Britton and Jimenez as trade bait. One could argue its time to "blow it up" and build around the youth. Start trading for a combination of Major League ready talent with some prospects mixed in.

One could also argue the window isn't closed with the veterans so lets resign Davis and few pitchers plus some other free agents (its a strong group) and get after it in 2016. Its an expensive choice but the team has very little payroll tied up long term, so it is doable.

I pose a question: Who constitutes the core of the Orioles team going forward?

The Veterans:

Jones, Hardy, Wieters, Davis, Tillman, Jimenez, Chen, Britton, O'Day?

The Youth:

Machado, Schoop, Gausman?

The choice is not black and white, in fact, its surely a blend of both groups. Instead, this is a question of priorities. In a win now (2016) world, you keep as many of these guys as possible and add free agent talent.

In a long view, it may be better to start trading the veterans to bolster the youth movement.

From the veteran group Wieters, Davis, Chen, and O'Day can just walk and Orioles get draft picks. That leaves Jones, Hardy, Tillman, Britton and Jimenez as trade bait. One could argue its time to "blow it up" and build around the youth. Start trading for a combination of Major League ready talent with some prospects mixed in.

One could also argue the window isn't closed with the veterans so lets resign Davis and few pitchers plus some other free agents (its a strong group) and get after it in 2016. Its an expensive choice but the team has very little payroll tied up long term, so it is doable.

Jones, machado, schoop, and Gausman.

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Gonzo should be on your list. I think he is a tradeable asset but also part of our veteran core as a guy who has been in our rotation since the 2012 run and still under team control. I do think it would make sense to trade Gonzo or Tillman. I think we have enough talent at AA and AAA, guys that deserve a shot at the majors and could end up producing just as well at a much lower cost. Use the dollars saved to sign Chen or a replacement (Kazmir?) at the top of the rotation.

Nobody will take Hardy or Jimenez at this point, plus Hardy can veto any trade. See how they perform during the first half and reconsider at the trade deadline.

I'd like to keep Britton now in a retooling scenario, but he could get a nice return at the trade deadline if we are forced into a full rebuild.

Prefer to keep Jones at least through 2017 as he will still be able to command top prospects at that time. No need to trade him now.

My preferred solution is "yes". You sign or otherwise acquire pieces to try to build a reasonably competitive team whilst building the farm team. This requires careful consideration, and avoiding signing players who'll cost you draft picks. I would sacrifice some MLB payroll to acquire more international talent, if that's what it takes. I vote against a full rebuild - I couch this in the terms of my old Corvette. I enjoy driving the car/baseball too much to tear the whole thing down and hope that I have the resources and time and patience and support to build it all back up in some number of painful years. Let's keep the thing on the road while we're still doing some restoration and mods.

Extricating myself from this strained metaphor, I'd keep Jones, Hardy, and certainly Machado, Schoop, Gausman (and try to extend several of them). Only trade Britton, Tillman if it fits this plan. No deals for guys in A ball unless they're high-ceiling, fast-track players. Let Davis, Chen, O'Day, Wieters walk unless you get team-friendly, low-risk deals, but offer QOs to all of them and take the picks.

Jones, machado, schoop, and Gausman.

I can see that, but I'd also include Britton and Tillman.

My preferred solution is "yes". You sign or otherwise acquire pieces to try to build a reasonably competitive team whilst building the farm team. This requires careful consideration, and avoiding signing players who'll cost you draft picks. I would sacrifice some MLB payroll to acquire more international talent, if that's what it takes. I vote against a full rebuild - I couch this in the terms of my old Corvette. I enjoy driving the car/baseball too much to tear the whole thing down and hope that I have the resources and time and patience and support to build it all back up in some number of painful years. Let's keep the thing on the road while we're still doing some restoration and mods.

Extricating myself from this strained metaphor, I'd keep Jones, Hardy, and certainly Machado, Schoop, Gausman (and try to extend several of them). Only trade Britton, Tillman if it fits this plan. No deals for guys in A ball unless they're high-ceiling, fast-track players. Let Davis, Chen, O'Day, Wieters walk unless you get team-friendly, low-risk deals, but offer QOs to all of them and take the picks.

You would offer a QO to O'Day?

Core? The franchise considers relief pitching to be funglible so while the fans may consider O'Day and Britton to be core, the front office does not.

Machado is the only player who is All Star caliber and young enough to last through a rebuild. Schoop is a quality everyday player, fingers crossed.

As a few have pointed out the Orioles didnt win with Markakis and Cruz, so they can surely keep losing with Jones. Quality player, good guy, too streaky for me to consider core. He can carry a team for a month, and disappear for a month. And that happens too regularly so I dont consider him 'core'.

Pitching? no one has proven themselves to be so good and dependable to be a fixture. You can say all you want about potential and ceilings, but Gausman is unproven. Bundy is 2 years away from pitching 180-200 innings in a season.

I'd say blow it up and start from scratch. Its impossible to say whihc was a fluke, 2014 or 2015? But Davis, Jones, Machado are all having solid years and the team is not competing for a playoff spot in September.

Make qo to everyone and get the draft choices. Wieters will be a very good player for someone, why not us?

Core? The franchise considers relief pitching to be funglible so while the fans may consider O'Day and Britton to be core, the front office does not.

As a few have pointed out the Orioles didnt win with Markakis and Cruz, so they can surely keep losing with Jones. Quality player, good guy, too streaky for me to consider core. He can carry a team for a month, and disappear for a month. And that happens too regularly so I dont consider him 'core'.

Why are you speaking on behalf of the FO, and how do you know this?

Braves are the worst team in Baseball, so glad to see Markakis has had an impact with them.

How exactly is Cruz leading the Mariners into the playoffs?

You would offer a QO to O'Day?

Oops, no. Relievers are exempt from most of the laws of the universe.

Why are you speaking on behalf of the FO, and how do you know this?

Braves are the worst team in Baseball, so glad to see Markakis has had an impact with them.

How exactly is Cruz leading the Mariners into the playoffs?

How did the Orioles do with Cruz and Markakis? I beleive they won the AL East. How did the Orioles do without Cruz and Markakis? I beleive the have a losing record going into Septmber and are 12 games out of their consescutive division title?

How did the Orioles do with Davis being one of the top sluggers in the league and Manny being one of the best players in the league? Closer to last place than second place.

Markakis' inuries this year? I think he's on pace for nearly 600 plate appearances and over 150 games played?

Look, you think and the FO thinks they were too expensive to re-sgn, thats a valid analysis. Did you replace them with quality youn players that can develop into regulars or were they replaced with replacement value players?

If Miller was too expensive, why won't O'Day be as well?

How did the Orioles do with Cruz and Markakis? I beleive they won the AL East. How did the Orioles do without Cruz and Markakis? I beleive the have a losing record going into Septmber and are 12 games out of their consescutive division title?

How did the Orioles do with Davis being one of the top sluggers in the league and Manny being one of the best players in the league? Closer to last place than second place.

Markakis' inuries this year? I think he's on pace for nearly 600 plate appearances and over 150 games played?

Look, you think and the FO thinks they were too expensive to re-sgn, thats a valid analysis. Did you replace them with quality youn players that can develop into regulars or were they replaced with replacement value players?

If Miller was too expensive, why won't O'Day be as well?

I never said Markakis was injured? Where did you get that from.

The Orioles won with Cruz and Markakis, but their SP was so much better. I think its been posted in OH, that the offense production from last to this year, is the same.

There is a void of quality CoF, and thats why the Braves overpaid for Markakis, and why it didn't help them much.

I can't answer about the question about $$$ between Miller and O'Day, but I don't believe O'Day is expected to bring in that type of money.

Jones, machado, schoop, and Gausman.

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Jones is the key.

He is under contract for 3 more years at a reasonable(team friendly even) contract. His production is consistently above average at a premium position.

On the other hand, he peak trade value is THIS off season. He returns the biggest haul. And going into age 30, it is possible all the little injuries he has played through will start to diminish his ability to play CF. His offensive production as a corner outfielder/DH is still okay, but not stellar. Also he was displeased with Nick and Cruz leaving so if other guys are let go his desire to remain an Orioles may go with it.

All in all, I think the risk with keeping him is small and I for one would love to keep Adam Jones until he retires. However, for the right deal, trading Adam might bring back too much talent to ignore.

Jones is the key.

He is under contract for 3 more years at a reasonable(team friendly even) contract. His production is consistently above average at a premium position.

On the other hand, he peak trade value is THIS off season. He returns the biggest haul. And going into age 30, it is possible all the little injuries he has played through will start to diminish his ability to play CF. His offensive production as a corner outfielder/DH is still okay, but not stellar. Also he was displeased with Nick and Cruz leaving so if other guys are let go his desire to remain an Orioles may go with it.

All in all, I think the risk with keeping him is small and I for one would love to keep Adam Jones until he retires. However, for the right deal, trading Adam might bring back too much talent to ignore.

I am not against the idea of trading Jones, but I don't think we should be talking about something that we know will never happen.

I am not against the idea of trading Jones, but I don't think we should be talking about something that we know will never happen.

Jones is a stud and elite CF, and I doubt the goods received back, would be high enough to justify the action.

Jones is a stud and elite CF, and I doubt the goods received back, would be high enough to justify the action.

He's an very good durable player - not a player who I'd project greatness to as he reaches the other side O 30. Obviously you don't give away a player like that, but if you get a great offer, you have to consider it - and they could get a great offer. Really, anyone's available for the right price when you're a sub 500 team.