Heads up: I'll be on WNST with trade news

[Moose Milligan]

I just got home a little while ago and read a good chunk of this thread, the first 7 pages or so.

This has to be one of the saddest days of all time for me when it comes to being a fan of this franchise.

I'm really at a loss for words.

The good people of Baltimore as well as others who are fans deserve so much better than this. This is really heartbreaking.

I don't see how anyone can remain an Angelos apologist after this. Any good businessman is accessible and returns calls in a prompt manner.

I live in Northern VA, I'd love to be at the protest in September. I hope I can get there.

[Moose Milligan]

Hey, I'm here, and I don't mind you asking; it's a LONG-a** thread to read.

I'm not going to respond to Sapper and his crew, except to note that despite having him on ignore, I was able to see his post through the magic of quotes, and so it will be duly reported, and I hope that other will do the same.

As for this thread, there are only two words available.

I'm pissed.

Wow, I never thought I'd see this!

Where's Silent James and his eternally optimistic self? I'd like to see how he can spin todays events...

[BaltimoreTerp]

Kool, then join the rest of us and go to Nestor's link and sign up.

Read the latest thread on the subject and see that I have a thought that might actually work, unlike Nestor's "let's give money to the out-of-touch guy who won't listen to the fans or the media anyway" "protest".

Don't support two idiots at once

[Fan4Life]

I just got home a little while ago and read a good chunk of this thread, the first 7 pages or so.

This has to be one of the saddest days of all time for me when it comes to being a fan of this franchise.

I'm really at a loss for words.

The good people of Baltimore as well as others who are fans deserve so much better than this. This is really heartbreaking.

I don't see how anyone can remain an Angelos apologist after this. Any good businessman is accessible and returns calls in a prompt manner.

I live in Northern VA, I'd love to be at the protest in September. I hope I can get there.

Hey Moose.... thanks for the sentiments... somehow feels a little better having brothers to share this pain with.... and just a suggestion... I am in South Carolina and probably won't be able to make the protest game.... but, I will be more than happy to buy a minimum of 2 tickets to have proxies there on my behalf, maybe you can consider a similar option.

[Moose Milligan]

Read the latest thread on the subject and see that I have a thought that might actually work, unlike Nestor's "let's give money to the out-of-touch guy who won't listen to the fans or the media anyway" "protest".

Don't support two idiots at once

The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

[Fan4Life]

Read the latest thread on the subject and see that I have a thought that might actually work, unlike Nestor's "let's give money to the out-of-touch guy who won't listen to the fans or the media anyway" "protest".

Don't support two idiots at once

Can you provide a suggestion that will accomplish the goal without it requiring everyone to act individually? We need someone to spearhead this movement... are you volunteering yourself for that position?

[Moose Milligan]

Hey Moose.... thanks for the sentiments... somehow feels a little better having brothers to share this pain with.... and just a suggestion... I am in South Carolina and probably won't be able to make the protest game.... but, I will be more than happy to buy a minimum of 2 tickets to have proxies there on my behalf, maybe you can consider a similar option.

September 21st is a Thursday...I might be able to make it up, we'll see. I thought it was on a weekend that'd interfere with work...

[BaltimoreTerp]

Can you provide a suggestion that will accomplish the goal without it requiring everyone to act individually? We need someone to spearhead this movement... are you volunteering yourself for that position?

I've got other stuff to do that is more pressing then sports. I'm sure others do as well.

However, I'm just ashamed to see all these people allow their intellegence to be insulted and work for an idea that has no hope of success, instead of putting their energies towards the change they actually want to see.

[frankpembleton]

As an aside, Moneyball is interesting and so is the approach but it is not the lost book of the New Testament. Beane hasn't won anything since he rode the pine as a player for the A's.

I certainly don't want to turn this into sabermetric/moneyball argument, but it has nothing to do with Beane and everything to do with bad luck that he hasn't won a world series title yet His teams win 90+ games year in and year out. I would give anything for Angelos to set a budget and give the reigns to a guy as intelligent as Bilily Beane.

[Delduck]

1. People are blaming Angelos for not being available at a moment's notice or not making a snap decision regarding trades and other transactions. Well, GMs don't make snap decisions either. They posture and negotiate and misinform and pit teams against each other to increase trade offers etc. Otherwise, why is it that most trades don't happen until right before the trade deadline? So when a trade is reached between 2 GMs in principle, why is it not ok for the owner to take 1-2 days to decide. Why would the trade be pulled off the table by that time? If I were the GM of another team, I'm not going to pull the deal after 1-2 extra days if I think it will help my team. That makes no sense to me. Now if someone can say that Angelos is waiting 1-2 weeks to approve a trade, that would be a different story.

Well IMHO this time of year the owner HAS to be available any any time of the day 24 - 7

Because that is what he pays the GM the big bucks for, to do all the homework for him. He needs to trust his guys to do the best for the team, and accept thier word that this is a good deal for the team.

[Mark Carver]

And there have been multiple people to blame, including Edward Bennett Williams, Pat Gillick, Frank Wren and Syd Thrift.

What did Pat Gillick do wrong except not be able to do his job and be vetoed by Angelos on moves he tried to do? He had to take Syd Thrift as his Director of Player Developement (Angelos boy). Pat Gillick left the ballclub on his own desire after his contract was up.

Frank Wren wasn't around long enough (1 year) and with Syd Thrift (Special Assistant to GM, Angelos' eyes and ears) bad-mouthing him to Angelos I'm surprised he lasted as long as he did.

Angelos and Syd Thrift did more damage to the Orioles than anybody of recent years.

[Aurelius]

I need more info before I can make a judgement here.

That's true. If other teams really are frustrated to the point of not dealing with the O's wouldn't there be media reports of teams calling out their frustration? I have no reason not to believe this one, but if this is true there should be other media reports to corroborate it. I'll wait for the Sun, WP, ESPN etc using their sources around baseball and reporting this claim before I can accept it.

[Delduck]

That's true. If other teams really are frustrated to the point of not dealing with the O's wouldn't there be media reports of teams calling out their frustration? I have no reason not to believe this one, but if this is true there should be other media reports to corroborate it. I'll wait for the Sun, WP, ESPN etc using their sources around baseball and reporting this claim before I can accept it.

But they have said it on baseball tonight, for the past couple of years. they did not say there was 6 teams that wont deal with us , but have said that some teams are reluctant to deal with us because of PA.

[Fan4Life]

I've got other stuff to do that is more pressing then sports. I'm sure others do as well.

However, I'm just ashamed to see all these people allow their intellegence to be insulted and work for an idea that has no hope of success, instead of putting their energies towards the change they actually want to see.

A couple of things..

1) Sometimes people take their sports so seriusly because they do work hard and when they have time to relax they want it to matter

2) I was hoping to get an answer to my question as to your providing some alternatives since you seem to have such disgust for this one

3) Why do you invest so much emotion into a siutation you think is worthless? If you love the O's as we do, then I would expect your support on whatever level you can provide it, otherwise, you appear to be commenting on behalf of the enemy.

Ok.. that was more than a couple....

[BaltimoreTerp]

A coupe of things..

1) Sometimes people take their sports so seriusly because they do work hard and when they have time to relax they want it to matter

2) I was hoping to get an answer to my question as to your providing some alternatives since you seem to have such disgust for this one

3) Why do you invest so much emotion into a siutation you think is worthless? If you love the O's as we do, then I would expect your support on whatever level you can provide it, otherwise, you appear to be commenting on behalf of the enemy.

Ok.. that was more than a couple....

Like I said, I gave my idea in the other thread.

The problem is, thie "protest" only makes fans fell warm and fuzzy that they "did something" while not forcing any change.

Don't complain about no change when you won't show a desire to do something about it that will work.