Ken Rosenthal's take on where Soriono will go?!?!

[mweb]

You keep implying that the O's have to take risks and overpay to get back to respectability. Who did the Tigers vastly overpay for last off season to go from losing more games than the Orioles in 2005 to appearing in the World Series in 2006?

Yeah, I still don't get how the Tigers great big moves of the last few years are so different than the O's or so much better. Lets compare:

Tigers O's

Maggs Miggy
Pudge Javy/Ramon
Rogers Ponson/Benson

What am I missing here??? Obviously Rogers has worked out better than our 2 starters, but at the time of the moves, I'm not sure most would take Rogers over Ponson or Benson.

Oh wait, I know what we're missing, the development of the best pitching staff in baseball, which had little to do with making big splashes on the FA market.

[geschinger]

Did you really just say that? Camden yards means that the O's don't have to be as careful as a small market team like Oakland or Minnesota. How could you misinterpret that so badly?

They don't have to be, but they should be. In a perfect world, the O's would mimic the A's/Twins from a player development perspective and use their largese to resign the homegrown players when they reach free agency. Coincidentally, that is a similar model used by the Yankees back when they were actually winning championships.

Why did Orioles executives claim that you would see the MASN effect "immediately"????

They have said a lot of things in the recent past which have no basis in reality.

What about the fact that the O's have been spending about 15 million less per year on salary for the past 8 years? Shouldn't that equal to 120 million in unaccounted revnue?????

Nope, that is not how it works. Where are you getting 15m less for the past 8 years from?

[Boca Bird]

They don't have to be, but they should be. In a perfect world, the O's would mimic the A's/Twins from a player development perspective and use their largese to resign the homegrown players when they reach free agency. Coincidentally, that is a similar model used by the Yankees back when they were actually winning championships.

Since when do we live in a perfect world????

That would be both ideal and completely unrealistic. ??

They have said a lot of things in the recent past which have no basis in reality.

Yeah, but this deal is harder to lie about since the whole world knows what a sweet deal Petey got

Nope, that is not how it works. Where are you getting 15m less for the past 8 years from?

You mean besides that I'm taking the fact that we spent 89 mil on payroll in 1998. Yet, SInce then, ticket prices, parking, and concessions, and the tv deal have been raised, all the while, the payroll has gone down to an avg of 72 mil per yr?. The o's are generating more and more revenue while spending significantly less on payroll. For some strange reason, people who call themselves orioles fans are not only ok with this, they don't even wonder why or question it ????


Again Gesch, I ask you now what I asked when I first came here, are you related to Angelos or not ?

[geschinger]

Since when do we live in a perfect world????
That would be both ideal and completely unrealistic. ??

In the world we do live in, there is no reason Baltimore can't follow a similar blueprint to that of Oak or Minnesota or dare I say the championship winning Yankee teams of the mid/late 90s.

Yeah, but this deal is harder to lie about since the whole world knows what a sweet deal Petey got

I think it'll end up being a boon to the O's, but in the short term how sweet is it? Unless you've seen something I haven't we're in the dark on what the revenue implications are. I think it'll potentially be great but I wouldn't be surprised if it was very little right now. It's gotta be a huge hit to the bottom line not being able to get the biggest cable provider online until after the halfway point in the season.

You mean besides that I'm taking the fact that we spent 89 mil on payroll in 1998. Yet, SInce then, ticket prices, parking, and concessions, and the tv deal have been raised, all the while, the payroll has gone down to an avg of 72 mil per yr?. The o's are generating more and more revenue while spending significantly less on payroll. For some strange reason, people who call themselves orioles fans are not only ok with this, they don't even wonder why or question it ????

How much if any net profit did the team make in 1998? While I don't believe him he has claimed in the past that there were years where the team had significant cash flow. But I do think it's ridiculous to assume that $89m is the break even point and that every dollar in payroll less than that is a dollar in additional profits.

Again Gesch, I ask you now what I asked when I first came here, are you related to Angelos or not ?

If only the Orioles were so lucky to have someone of my brilliance to inherit the team.

[NoVaO]

You know, even though Soriano likely won't be worth what he'll get paid, I would still be happy if he signed with us. He'll improve our team a great deal. Just make sure there is enough money left over to fill other holes.

[davearm]

Ok, let's talk about some things here.....

I posted this a while ago about our payroll for next year:



1st-???
2nd- BRob
SS- Tejada
3rd- Mora
LF-???
CF- CPat
RF-Markakis
DH- Gibbons
C- Hernandez

Bedard
Benson
DCab
Loewen


Ray
Penn
Britton
Hoey

Looks like that is the payroll as of right now. Maybe give or take a million or a few hundred thousand but it will be right around 57 million for those 15 players.

Ok, so let's go with the assumption, for arguments sake, that the above is the what we are looking at right now, so that leaves 10 players.

Bigbird has mentioned in the past that his contact has told him that a 90 million dollar payroll is possible for this year, if we can sign the right guys.

Let's assume(this is a big assumption but it applies to the thread) that we give Soriano this 6/94 contract. Let's also assume the contract is backloaded and Soriano makes 13 million for 2007.

So, that brings the payroll to 70 million for 16 players.

So, with the 9 players left, we need the following:

1) 3 more relievers...Assuming we go with a 12 man staff
2) back up catcher
3) starting pitcher
4) first baseman
5) 3 other bench players

That would leave us with a 25 man team.

So, can we get those things for 20 million?

Sign Cruz Jr...1 million or so.
Back up catcher....2-3 million.
3 relievers....say we spend 6 million on those guys
2 other bench players....4 million there

So, that leaves 13-14 million spent, bringing us to a 84 million dollar payroll or so.

So, that leaves 6 million for a starter and first baseman....If we are smart and obtain a young first baseman, we wouldn't have to pay much.

Not going to sign much of a starter for 5 million, so we could just go with a Penn/Rlo competition in ST, with the loser going to the pen, which would be fine with me.

So, if we signed Soriano to a big contract, we could be smart and get a very good, young first baseman, some good depth throughout the team and be a much stronger team.

We can open things up a little more if the moved Gibbons and/or Benson.

You're going to be hurting if you've got $6M to spend on a starting pitcher and an everyday 1B. For that $$$, say hello to Millar + Chen.

Getting a young hotshot 1B like Huber or whatever instead is either going to open a hole someplace else (almost certainly on the pitching staff), or cost you a prospect or two that's going to hurt (Erbe, Reimold caliber).

[Boca Bird]

In the world we do live in, there is no reason Baltimore can't follow a similar blueprint to that of Oak or Minnesota or dare I say the championship winning Yankee teams of the mid/late 90s.



I think it'll end up being a boon to the O's, but in the short term how sweet is it? Unless you've seen something I haven't we're in the dark on what the revenue implications are. I think it'll potentially be great but I wouldn't be surprised if it was very little right now. It's gotta be a huge hit to the bottom line not being able to get the biggest cable provider online until after the halfway point in the season.



How much if any net profit did the team make in 1998?

Who knows ? Your boy won't open the books ?

While I don't believe him he has claimed in the past that there were years where the team had significant cash flow. But I do think it's ridiculous to assume that $89m is the break even point and that every dollar in payroll less than that is a dollar in additional profits.

Why would you think that its ridiculous ???? Who among us is actuallly making less than 8 years ago? SHeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet, the O's still were selling out every game every at that point. You just refuse to believe any facts that suggest that the O's actually make money. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, Gesch. Poor Gesch. He believes the warehouse

If only the Orioles were so lucky to have someone of my brilliance to inherit the team.

Yep, that was a good call on the Tigers

[NoVaO]

You're going to be hurting if you've got $6M to spend on a starting pitcher and an everyday 1B. For that $$$, say hello to Millar + Chen.

Getting a young hotshot 1B like Huber or whatever instead is either going to open a hole someplace else (almost certainly on the pitching staff), or cost you a prospect or two that's going to hurt (Erbe, Reimold caliber).

Huber, Carter, etc. won't command an Erbe or Reimold type prospect. More likely an Olson/Liz type prospect.

[Mark Carver]

Who knows ? Your boy won't open the books ?

Name the last MLB owner to open the books...

[Boca Bird]

Name the last MLB owner to open the books...

Name the last owner who promised to open the books like Petey did


Then again, since I'm an Orioles fan, why would I care what other owners do, especially those that re-invest back in their team ?

[Sports Guy]

You're going to be hurting if you've got $6M to spend on a starting pitcher and an everyday 1B. For that $$$, say hello to Millar + Chen.

Getting a young hotshot 1B like Huber or whatever instead is either going to open a hole someplace else (almost certainly on the pitching staff), or cost you a prospect or two that's going to hurt (Erbe, Reimold caliber).

We should be able to get one of those young first baseman in a deal for someone like Liz or Olson.

[rolliefingers]

Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, Gesch.

Of all people to mock other posters for not being funny...

[Boca Bird]

Of all people to mock other posters for not being funny...

Yep, Of all people to mock other posters for not being funny...


Hey, shouldn't you be out in that white van repossessing furniture ?

I noiticed that you had a cup in your hands, do you have a squeegee and a corner on falls road, too?

[rolliefingers]

Yep, Of all people to mock other posters for not being funny...


Hey, shouldn't you be out in that white van repossessing furniture ?

I noiticed that you had a cup in your hands, do you have a squeegee and a corner on falls road, too?

Looks like you'll be at 500 posts soon. You gonna ante up for the privilege of annoying everyone here for the next year?

[davearm]

We should be able to get one of those young first baseman in a deal for someone like Liz or Olson.

JMHO, but you're overvaluing your prospects again.

Neither one of those guys would net you a quality young ML-ready player.