I think the other shoe is falling (Guthrie)

[bgfield]

I don't mean to sound reactionary, but this is now the third start in a row Guthrie's had that's been anywhere from OK to Bad.

Jul 1: 8 IP 4ER
Jul 6: 6 IP 3ER (it's nice that we can say this is a bad outting for Guthrie, isn't it?)
Jul 12: 3.2, 6R, 5ER

I know you can make a case that he would have given up less if we had an adequate fielding left fielder, but he still pitched poorly. During his great run, I noticed with Guthrie that when he'd miss his locations, he'd miss down a lot. I think that led to the low HR totals, the low amount of base hits, and thus, the low ERA. He's started missing up lately, which means he's gonna start getting hit harder.

So at this point, what do you think of Guthrie? Do you still think he's the real deal and he's just going through a dead arm period? Do you think this is just regression to reflect his true talent? Just a rough game, nothing else?

I think the next few starts are going to tell a lot about what we have in Guthrie. If he can rebound and pitch some good games, then he should be able to have a lasting spot in our rotation in the future. If he continues to bomb, well, maybe he'll just turn out to be the pitching version of David Newhan in 2004.

[sector7g]

This was always going to happen sooner or later. The key is how he bounces back and we might as well find that out now as later.

His next start will be the first time where he might have doubts or be lacking confidence in his stuff. Should tell us a lot.

[brooksie05]

I think we wait and see. I believe in him and it appears he was out of rhythm.

[oriofan8]

If you tossed out every pitcher who's thrown 3 bad games in a row....you sure would go through a TON of pitchers !!!

[JayGibbons31]

Extra day of rest could be an explanation. We all know about the problems that other guy from Stanford had with the extra day of rest.

[bgfield]

Extra day of rest could be an explanation. We all know about the problems that other guy from Stanford had with the extra day of rest.

Definitely something to consider. I don't know why it makes a difference but it does seem to affect some pitchers. Here's hoping that's the case.

[makoman]

If you tossed out every pitcher who's thrown 3 bad games in a row....you sure would go through a TON of pitchers !!!

And that's if you consider the other two before tonight bad.

I'll take 4 hits and no walks in 8 innings, even if it results in 4 runs. Even our offense averages over 4 runs a game; we had a chance to win both of those...

[Camden_yardbird]

It was likely. I have been saying it all along. But I think he will still rebound to a decent #3, and if he rebounds well maybe a #2. But this was going to happen.

[Rex Thunder]

I don't mean to sound reactionary, but this is now the third start in a row Guthrie's had that's been anywhere from OK to Bad.

Jul 1: 8 IP 4ER
Jul 6: 6 IP 3ER (it's nice that we can say this is a bad outting for Guthrie, isn't it?)
Jul 12: 3.2, 6R, 5ER

I know you can make a case that he would have given up less if we had an adequate fielding left fielder, but he still pitched poorly. During his great run, I noticed with Guthrie that when he'd miss his locations, he'd miss down a lot. I think that led to the low HR totals, the low amount of base hits, and thus, the low ERA. He's started missing up lately, which means he's gonna start getting hit harder.

So at this point, what do you think of Guthrie? Do you still think he's the real deal and he's just going through a dead arm period? Do you think this is just regression to reflect his true talent? Just a rough game, nothing else?

I think the next few starts are going to tell a lot about what we have in Guthrie. If he can rebound and pitch some good games, then he should be able to have a lasting spot in our rotation in the future. If he continues to bomb, well, maybe he'll just turn out to be the pitching version of David Newhan in 2004.

Yeah, while it's nice to throw stats from the past 3 games and say they've been "OK to bad"- the stats don't always tell the whole story. The Angels game he missed on 2 pitches- and the balls just sailed out for HRs. Next game, same thing. This game, if he gets ONE play out of 3 from Gibbons, maybe he recovers and holds off a couple of those runs. He's taken a lot of inept offense in the past, not to mention bullpen collpases, so now add piss poor defense and maybe it just got to him today.

After that first, he did appear to struggle, and they were hitting him hard- although I still can't believe Thome's went out for a HR. That ball just kept going and going! If he continues to get banged up in his next few starts, then bring this up, but it's a bit premature right now.

Remember, Bedard started the season this way- giving up HR's and his era was awful the first 3-4 weeks. Pitchers will go thru patches like this where they just don't get any breaks (i.e. hitters missing an occasional pitch that gets away)... but I think he'll recover. He has been entirely too dominating to not continue to learn and excel. Batters will adjust, but I think he will as well.

[BirdMan]

For whatever reason he was missing his spots tonight. Of course I have no idea what his velocity was because MASN decided for tonights game not to divulge pitch speed. I wish we had three more guys just like him to go with him and Bedard.

[The Wedge]

For whatever reason he was missing his spots tonight. Of course I have no idea what his velocity was because MASN decided for tonights game not to divulge pitch speed. I wish we had three more guys just like him to go with him and Bedard.

Manfra and Maleski (filling in for Angel til Monday) commented that Guthrie was about 5-7 MPH slower than usual, on average.

[olehippi]

I don't mean to sound reactionary......

In the 50+ years I've been following baseball, I've never seen a pitcher who had a good start every time out. IMO, Gutherie's last 2 starts were not bad starts.

I think you are sounding reactionary......and maybe conspiratorial....

[bryanman8]

It's the beginning of the end for Guthrie. The other shoe IS falling.

Guthrie is a mediore 4-5 starter. That's all. Dice-K will pass him in R.O.Y. voting as Guthrie proves he is just okay.

[NewMarketSean]

One bad start doesn't mean the end of the world. But people have been worried about him from the start. It'll be interesting to see how he bounces back from this.

And whats up with the White Sox? I thought they were a worse offensive team than us but they've totally been kicking our azzes in the run department in our games against them.

[tywright]

Guts didn't have the stuff tonight, but he sure could have used an average LF tonight as well