L. Hernandez Experiment Coming to an End?

[BRobinsonfan]

Forget his bat, what level defensive production is Hernadnez gonna put up this year. He's looked pretty pedestrian to me so far, and clearly the team isn't happy with his defense.

I understand... I'm just curious about what kind of line OldFan projects for LH at the plate.

[Mackus]

I understand... I'm just curious about what kind of line OldFan projects for LH at the plate.

Have fun getting that projection out of him!

[BRobinsonfan]

A few defensive stats are pretty revealing:

2007: 139 innings, 43 balls in zone, 40 plays made, .930 RZR, 7 outs outside of zone
2008: 118 innings, 42 balls in zone, 31 plays made, .738 RZR, 3 outs outside of zone

That, my friends, is the problem with relying on a small sample size.

Or... the problem with lugging 25 extra pounds around.

[Frobby]

Or... the problem with lugging 25 extra pounds around.

I have to say, although I heard DT say this, just looking at the guy I doubt he has gained that much. 25 pounds on a small guy is pretty noticeable. I'd have a hard time believing he weighs more than 10-15 pounds more than last year, if that. Maybe he's lost some since spring training began.

[Sports Guy]

I have to say, although I heard DT say this, just looking at the guy I doubt he has gained that much. 25 pounds on a small guy is pretty noticeable. I'd have a hard time believing he weighs more than 10-15 pounds more than last year, if that. Maybe he's lost some since spring training began.

I agree with this and to be honest, I am shocked that DT would still start him if he came in that out of shape.

[BRobinsonfan]

I have to say, although I heard DT say this, just looking at the guy I doubt he has gained that much. 25 pounds on a small guy is pretty noticeable. I'd have a hard time believing he weighs more than 10-15 pounds more than last year, if that. Maybe he's lost some since spring training began.

Good point... I've only seen him a couple of times... but he doesn't look like he's put on that kind of weight.

[NewMarketSean]

Right. But that has nothing to do with them changing what they expect from a SS. It's all about SS-D.

Not so sure about that. Cintron has a career OPS oveer .700 and LH will never come close to that. If Cintron can get back to his 2006 performance level and be an average defender, he will be a huge upgrade over LH.

For whatever reasons, LH has been choking some, and goofing up basic things that he used to do right.

Maybe thats because people were overrating his defense all along. People really only had a look at him during his short stint in Baltimore last year and this year. Maybe he's just not that good a defender.

That doesn't mean that they all-the-sudden changed their criteria, or that they want Cintron playing everyday. Cintron is just a spare part, and I bet they hope they never have to use him.

If anyone is a spare part it's LH. He's actually less than a spare part. He's the gum that you have to shove in the dam when it starts leaking. Cintron may be a flimsy piece of plastic that won't hold the dam for much longer, but he has the ability to out hit LH by 150 OPS points and field the SS position at least as good, or better than LH now.

With Cintron back in baseball shape, there isn't a MLB team that would go with LH over Cintron, and the Orioles shouldn't be the team to buck this trend.

This isn't about Cintron, or about some "experiment". It's about whether LH chokes and plays himself out of a job. I'm sure they're working with him to max the chance that he doesn't, but it's basically up to LH to play like did before. LH's problem isn't Cintron, and it certainly is not the hitting numbers that Spencer Fordin focused on. LH's problem is 100% about how LH has been playing in the field.

Now sure why they would lose sleep over a weak hitting, and now a poor fielding SS in the first place. He's expendable if Cintron is ready to go. Of course LH can be a back-up to Cintron and a late inning defensive replacement (if he can get his fielding under control again), but it's not like the O's had these high hopes for LH. They wanted him to not butcher defense in SS and now that he's doing that, they are ready to jettison him, as well they should.

[NewMarketSean]

Just read the rest of the thread. If LH is 25 lbs overweight, then there is no chance he can equal his defense from last year, which is the only reason he is on the team. That makes him even more expendable. And I have to wonder what kind of head is on this kid's shoulders. Also, you'd think that with 25 extra lbs, he'd be able to slug more than .265.

It's basically like getting hired at a job just because you date the boss's daughter and then breaking up with her the day after you've been hired.

[vatech1994]

He didn't look "out of shape" really in ST. He looked a bit soft but, to be honest, he didn't have any muscle tone last year either IMO. You can see that his face has thickened a bit so I do believe that he gained some weight. How much is anyone's guess. My opinion is that LH is a 24ish year old guy whose metabolism is slowing down (as most do) at the same time he has pocket money for the first time in his life. Imagine how much more that major league minimum from last year was than the minor league money he had been getting.

LH played winter ball so he clearly didn't sit around doing nothing. My guess is he put on some weight because he started eating more good meals in restaurants and he is losing the ability to burn off whatever extra he consumes. It probably shocked him too. I know I put on pounds in my mid-twenties without even realizing it until after the fact.

The most worrisome point about all of this to me is that 10 or so extra pounds has made that much difference in his agility. He has clearly been much less capable of being nimble and quick in the field this year. I thought it was nerves in ST, but I don't think so anymore. I think the extra weight (however much it is) has lowered his capabilities. If LH is no better athlete than that, he isn't going to play this game much longer at this level. This guy's only chance to survive in the majors is to be a defensive wizard who doesn't kill you offensively. If he can't maintain that defensive standing due to one year of aging and a bit of extra weight, he will struggle to stay in the minors for two more years.

BTW, I have the same concern about Fahey. As he ages and thickens a bit, he looks less fluid than he used to look to me. This is where athleticism comes into play. It seems to me that Fahey and LH just aren't spectacular athletes. Few of us are, but they can't afford not to be with their other limitations.

[NewMarketSean]

BTW, I have the same concern about Fahey. As he ages and thickens a bit, he looks less fluid than he used to look to me. This is where athleticism comes into play. It seems to me that Fahey and LH just aren't spectacular athletes. Few of us are, but they can't afford not to be with their other limitations.

Why anyone is worried about either of these players is beyond me. If the Orioles are doing the right things, neither of these players will be on the roster, or in the system, by year's end.

[DrungoHazewood]

The problem here is obviously 100% about how Luis Hernandez fields. The only debate we've had over the past year is whether Hernandez is Omar Vizquel with the glove, or Felix Fermin (or insert random slightly-above average fielding shortstop here). If he's Vizquel he's arguably worth a major league job despite his woeful bat. If he's Felix Fermin he's not.

[DrungoHazewood]

Why anyone is worried about either of these players is beyond me. If the Orioles are doing the right things, neither of these players will be on the roster, or in the system, by year's end.

I'm not worried about them, as there are lots of Faheys and Hernandezes in the world. But at their best they're decent spare parts to have around in a pinch. If they're at 90% of their best they're on the ways to non-playing careers.

[NewMarketSean]

I'm not worried about them, as there are lots of Faheys and Hernandezes in the world. [/b]But at their best they're decent spare parts to have around in a pinch. If they're at 90% of their best they're on the ways to non-playing careers.

There are? Apparently some people on this board think these guys are diamonds in the rough.

[The Wedge]

There are? Apparently some people on this board think these guys are diamonds in the rough.

Some people on this board might think they're Moses, too. Doesn't mean they are.

[vatech1994]

There are? Apparently some people on this board think these guys are diamonds in the rough.

You probably aren't trying to be offensive with these last few comments, but they sure are coming across that way. I don't believe LH and BF are critical players to the Orioles future success. However, the point of this thread was to discuss LH and BF. So I did so by offering my viewpoint on what is going on with them, as did others. It appears that there are several schools of thought on these guys, but isn't that the point of this place?

I'm not sure why you feel the need to criticize people for discussing LH in a thread where he was the topic. If you don't think they are worth discussing, feel free to move on to another thread.