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  1. 25 points
    The beast is done. https://www.orioleshangout.com/2019/12/11/lukes-2019-rule-5-draft-preference-list/
  2. 16 points
    On a positive note this is the first positive contribution Mark Trumbo has made to the club this year!
  3. 16 points
  4. 15 points
    Cant say I'm thrilled with the offseason "upgrades" but it is what it is, I guess...Instead of lamenting though...I thought I'd share a little holiday cheer with a medley of my favorite singing impressions I performed on LA morning TV. Wishing you and yours a wonderful holiday!
  5. 14 points
    All these posters were in the game thread in the 16th inning. Kudos to them! maybenxtyr 0’s84 spiritof66 Finisher (justified his name) Tony-OH (hey, it’s his job!) Hallas OFFNY Spl51 Enjoy Terror Moose Milligan (but slept through several innings) LA2 (yeah, but it was 5:20 pm in South Korea!) Honorable mention to Chavez Ravine who fell asleep in the 15th inning in front of his TV. Can of corn did a drive-by shortly after the game ended, and I’m not sure if he was actually watching or not. Me? I went to sleep in the middle of the 4th inning with the score tied 1-1.
  6. 12 points
    How about a "letter", signed by all participants here, directed to the appropriate executive in the O's organization (with copies to Mike Elias and any other relevant high-level decision-maker) detailing the rationale for the Orioles organization recognition and support of the Orioles Hangout? I'm confident that there is sufficient talent among the readers and posters of OH to formulate a successful appeal.
  7. 12 points
    Adley, a man of pedigree, a disciple of Pat Casey, from humble Oregon Roots, and by the way, a pretty good ball player. Baltimore, you have been blessed. Embrace him. Oregon's gift to Baltimore.
  8. 11 points
    Well, good for Tom Davis. He's been a steady presence on Orioles broadcasts for years. He's got a job, he does it well. I think I've told this anecdote before, but my favorite Tom Davis memory was back on the HTS days. I had to be about 10 or 11 years old. Anyway, watching the game, it goes to commercial. And Davis was portly back then, certainly not the big man he is now. So they're running the commercials and someone at HTS made an error and threw it back to the studio for about one second when they weren't supposed to, they were supposed to run another commercial. But during that second you could see Tom Davis behind the desk reaching into a bag of what looked to be Roy Rogers, and doing so very excitedly. At age 10 I could spot a Roy Rogers bag from 200 yards. Anyway, it quickly went away and they played the commercial. Then they threw it back to the studio when they were supposed to and Davis was there with a big grin on his face, kinda hoping no one saw that. It's one of the enduring mental images of my childhood.
  9. 9 points
    After a long, gloomy winter in which I have exuded realism about the Orioles’ near term future, spring training has arrived and I am growing more optimistic daily based on the incessantly positive remarks coming from Brandon Hyde, Doug Brocail and a litany of players. Lord it makes me happy! The hell with realism, there will be plenty of time for that later!
  10. 9 points
    Surprised his shadow didn't have him on "Ignore."
  11. 9 points
    His “spin” rate isn’t very good...
  12. 9 points
    We had a dude once named Villar. He was @Roll Tide's favorite star. He hit for the cycle, played 162 But Mike said Easton Lucas would do.
  13. 9 points
    I just wanted to take a moment to wish everyone here a Happy and Blessed Thanksgiving. I am thankful for the opportunity I have been afforded by @Tony-OH and @weams to contribute to the Hangout with my writing. I also am thankful for all of you who have checked on and read the work all season long. As all of the responses to Tony's thoughts on his future and the future of OH show, this is a strong and passionate community of Orioles fans who support the team and value the exchange of opinions and thoughts this site provides and that is something we all should be thankful for. I thank all of you for your support and wish you all a wonderful day spent with family and friends. HAPPY THANKSGIVING!!
  14. 9 points
    The fact that Luke is the only person I've ever allowed to really affect the rankings and allowed him to have his take on every profile speaks to how highly I think of him. I enjoy the back and forth with him and he's been a great add to the site and hopefully for many years to come!
  15. 9 points
    He's 8-for-23... what else do you need? He sooooooooo hot that his average went up 70 points last night. For Jonathan Villar to do that he'd have to go 10-for-6 tonight. That's unpossible! It's good that he turned it all around yesterday, because on Sunday it went down 55 points, and I have to think he was on the verge of being released.
  16. 8 points
    “Surprisingly, I don't miss it. I've come out of retirement two times to fill in for a team that needed a player so bad or they were going to forfeit, but after pulling my hamstring in my last game, it was clear father time had claimed another victim.” When you get to a certain age, you have to learn where the line is to keep you from pulling a hamstring or calf muscle. You can run at a certain speed but if you accelerate too fast, you’re a goner. Despite my inability to hit a hardball, I was (and still am, sort of) a pretty good slow pitch softball player. Once my kids came to watch me play and I came up with the bases loaded and crushed a ball over the LF’s head. That was great, except that I pulled a calf muscle charging out of the batter’s box. I managed to limp my way to 3B on what surely would have been a grand slam. I kept playing, and lo and behold the bases were loaded my next time up. I hit a long liner that perfectly bisected LF and CF and kept rolling. I’m limping along, but my biggest problem is there’s a woman ahead of me on the bases who didn’t know what to do, so I’m having to lag behind her. As she finally heads towards home, I head to third and by now a relay throw is coming in there. It sails over the head of the 3B and I hobble home. Just after I touch home plate and peel off behind the backstop, my 6/7 year old daughter leaps into my arms and says “Daddy, you’re amazing! You’re the best dad in the whole world!!!” If I had died just then, I would have died a very happy man. Of course, at this point I had to keep playing, even though my leg was a wreck. Later in the game I was playing 1B, the other team had a runner on 3B and the hitter hit a slow chopper towards me. I charged it but the catcher had wandered off so the runner headed for home. I raced him there and managed to tag him just before reaching home, but further pulled my calf in the process. For the next three days, I had to use a cane to walk, and for more than a year, I could feel that calf muscle threatening to pull again even when I just chased my kids around the back yard. But it was worth it for that great moment with my daughter — who by the way doesn’t remember it at all.
  17. 8 points
    Nobody wonders why attendance is down right now. It was a point of useful discussion in 2016-17. Since then, the equation is simple: losing —> lower attendance. And guess what? It will continue going down until the team starts winning much more often than it is right now. Elias knows that. The Angelos family knows that. We all know that. And if you don’t want to pay to watch the team as they go through the demolition stage of their rebuild, then don’t. Nobody’s going to take your Oriole fan card away if you don’t want to pay to watch this. For me, I’ve decided to trust the process for at least a couple of years. I like going to baseball games too much to stop going. Will I go to fewer games than I would if they were winning? Sure. But it’s not because I feel betrayed. It’s not because I think the team is being greedy, or disloyal. For me, they’re doing what they think they need to do to turn the team around in the most efficient way possible. It’s not pretty. I hope it works.
  18. 8 points
    Figured I will give it a separate thread. Giving back to the community is nice. Good to see this because many of the new Orioles have little to no attachment to the Baltimore area. Mostly because they are new to the area or are not making the big bucks yet. Orioles first baseman Chris Davis and his wife Jill donated $3 million to the University of Maryland Children’s Hospital on Monday, the largest gift the hospital has received from a Baltimore sports figure. The money will be spent on building a state-of-the-art facility described as a hybrid catheterization and operating room to treat children, according to a release. “This is a cause that is close to our hearts," Chris Davis said in a release. "Everyone at the hospital has inspired our family — from the patients and families who show such courage in the face of overwhelming challenges, to the medical professionals and caregivers who dedicate their careers to saving and improving lives.” The space will be called the Evelyn Kay Davis Congenital Hybrid Catheterization Suite, named after the Davises’ daughter, Evie, who was born with a ventricular septal defect in January 2018. https://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/bs-sp-orioles-chris-davis-donation-maryland-childrens-hospital-20191104-4wcvuuzy3vbb3f7ejwlef63e24-story.html
  19. 8 points
    https://www.wbal.com/article/412178/3/john-angelos-orioles-not-moving
  20. 8 points
    Maybe being drunk brought out that particular outburst, but the reporting is that this guy had a ongoing grudge against a reporter who was holding the team accountable for acquiring a domestic abuser. That's a guy I wouldn't want in an org, even if he remained sober at all times. Let's forget about the acquiring of a domestic abuser for a minute, which I definitely do not condone. Let's just look at this Taubman guy as a cold-blooded asset valuation specialist. Even from that perspective, he is a failure. Here's why. He pushed to acquire a "distressed asset" as he put it. A player whose value was depressed by his off field actions. So the pitch is that you can get this guy for less than fair market value in baseball ability terms. That's true, whether you like it or not. But where Taubman failed was not expecting and being prepared to deal with the predictable blowback from acquiring such an asset. The guy thought that the move was being covered unfairly in the media, how ignorant do you have to be to not predict that outcome? The failure to predict and maturely handle the wide-ranging consequences of such an action is a huge red flag for me, people like that make dangerous decisions because they only see the benefit without seeing all the cost.
  21. 8 points
    I think a lot of the problems would be solved if MLB goes back to a neutral baseball that doesn't turn warning track pop flies into home runs. Home runs are being incentivized and you can't blame teams/players for taking advantage. Launch angle isn't going away, but I'm curious to see how Nunez or little Yaz profiles as a hitter if you make them start hitting baseballs from 2014.
  22. 8 points
    Happy Birthday to my first and really ONLY sports hero. Oh, I loved and admired Ali, but I never wanted to “be” like him. Brooks Robinson, who celebrates his 82nd birthday today, carried himself with grace, dignity, and class. I wanted to be like him, even though I would never have his talent. I wanted to carry myself with dignity and decorum and hoped that if I ever were successful..that those qualities I saw in Brooks, I would try to embody myself, if I could. From the time I was 5 years old, I knew he was the player who would be at the center of my sports universe. By the time I was 18, and he was almost retired, I saw him “Up Close”. I’ve mentioned here that I was batboy for the Baltimore Orioles for a few years during the late 60’s and 70’s. It was a gateway to Brooks Robinson,I thought…. getting to meet him, getting to know him, and maybe, just maybe, becoming a, dare I say “friend” of Brooks’? On my very first day as an Oriole batboy, Brooks Robinson, the first player in the Oriole clubhouse(sometimes ahead of the clubhouse “cubbies”) in the locker room, walks into the tiny dressing room I had. ‘Hey partner’..whats your name’? I looked up from what I was doing…and saw Brooks with his hand extended to me. It took my breath away. Then, after I stammered and remembered my name, he said “Partner…wanna play some pepper”? For those who don’t know…”pepper” is a simple game of hit and field. For the next 30 minutes, a goofy, awkward kid from Miami is playing ball with his only sports hero. “Don’t stab at it partner, look the ball in”, he said. Brooks Robinson was giving ME fielding pointers. I eventually caught my breath again and for the next several months I would ride “shotgun” on the buses going to away games in the Spring with Brooks Robinson. We talked, but he was so friendly and interested in me, I could barely ask say anything at all. He just radiated positiveness and goodness. Brooks NEVER dissed. No gossip. No profanity. He was always the gentleman of the team and the team had a lot of profane, bad mannered types. Brooks lived an authentic perception people have of him. He exuded the best of sportsmanship, cheerfulness, positiveness. I mustv’e watched him field 10,000 ground balls in the spring. He never took time to goof off when he was “working”. Years passed. Then I left the team to go to college. One night the Orioles were playing my college team, Miami, in a Spring exhibition game. I was the baseball play by play announcer on college radio with my buddy Gary Chrisman.(Who is still doing it today and is one of the best in the business) Brooks Robinson comes to the plate and hits a home run… as Gary and I were calling the game. I can say in my lifetime, I called a Brooks Robinson home run on a radio broadcast. More years went by, Brooks went to the Hall of Fame, and we remained close. Brooks had some serious health issues, but thankfully he recovered. One night, when he was ill, he asked ME to fill in for him at a major awards banquet. I couldn’t have said yes fast enough. An undeserved honor for me. Then lets fast forward to 2012. I get a phone call and see on ID…its Brooks. “Partner”(he still only calls me partner) its Brooks Robinson(“…..like I wouldn’t know who Brooks was). They are unveiling my statue at Oriole Park at Camden Yards, and I’d like YOU to introduce me to the fans when I come to podium. I literally looked at the phone like people do in movies with disbelief as to what I just heard. He wanted ME of all people to dedicate his statue with HIM? It made no sense. Then I realized. He didn’t want to pick one teammate or baseball person he was close with…and heres why. Brooks cares about people’s feelings. if he asked Earl Weaver or Frank Robinson to introduce him, maybe someone else who played with him might be hurt. Thats the way Brooks thinks. It is why he is a great and good man. He picked ME. What an honor. The day comes. Thousands of people are there for Brooks’ statue I am introduced by Gary Thorne at the Oriole Park. I walk to the podium, and Im choked up. I almost couldn’t breathe. This isn’t about me, its about my only sports hero. And this is the greatest honor of my public life. After I caught my breath,I got a few minutes to tell my hero…I loved him. And I got to tell everyone there why. That clip is below. Happy Birthday Brooks Robinson…number 81. We could sure use a ton of people like YOU on this planet. I love you Brooks Robinson. You’re the greatest man in sports I ever knew.
  23. 7 points
    There are more than hundreds for me. When I was a young child (5?), I locked myself in the bathroom at my doctor’s office trying to avoid a blood test prick. They had to unhinge the door and remove it and had some assistance from a handsome dude who told my mom he was T-Bone and his kids were brats too. When we got the autograph on a prescription pad, my dad translated it to-John Shelby. I remember standing next to the bullpen for Dylan Bundy’s first career start above Delmarva. He was so focused and so ready to seize his career. He was also pretty chatty and friendly. I told him I’d see him at the World Series. He said ‘you’re damn right you will’ as he took his tosses and got sweaty in a second before sprinting towards the mound. My dad took me to wrestling as a kid to the Baltimore Civic Center. I was probably 5 here too and in our aisle, barely visible through the lights was Johnny U. My dad is quiet and deliberate and measured but he basically left me to mess around with the younger Unitases and kids as he met his all-time hero and talked his ear off. I’ve never seen him act that way ever before or again and it made an impression on me more than any story/legend/30 for 30 could. But the reason why I love the O’s so much and never won’t is outfielder Ken Gerhart. If you know me you’ve heard the story of how good he was to me. My old neighbor was a floor manager for Leaf Candies and he was a great guy-I miss his entire family. He would give out Chunkies, take us to the bus stop and let us stay in his car when it was cold plus didn’t yell when my dog ran down to their lawn. One day he took a piece of paper out of the console from his Chevy Monte Carlo and told me to bring it to my mom. It was a free pass for a dugout tour/bullpen party with an Oriole, Cal Ripken. When we went they told us that Cal wasn’t available and I honestly didn’t care, I wanted to see Eddie Murray in person somehow. I didn’t get that either. Gerhart walked in, saw the situation and told my folks he’d have me back to the desk in a few minutes. He held my hand and took me into the batting cage and I saw Larry Sheets in sweats banging out line drives with the biggest bat I’ve ever seen. Then into the trainers room where I saw guys I don’t know being bent and reading the paper and laughing-there was Cal. Finally, he took me to the field and I got to walk out the dugout onto the grass and see the stadium seats go up to the sky. I remember thinking that he was going to come out the same entrance and how special the dugout was. He told me to never stop watching what happens on the field, even in the dugout and bullpen. Then we walked out there, took a ride in the cart around the outfield and my tour was over. Gerhart didn’t play that game and didn’t make an impact on the field but he was so nice and welcoming. That impact, that lack of separating me from the sights and sounds and putting me in a place where I could witness them locked it up for me forever. Baseball was my life and my favorite activity and how I evaluated people and what I loved to learn more about than anything else. Who knows if I would have turned out this way if there was no Ken Gerhart to do his part and pass it on? Ive had so many interactions with O’s players and people they’re connected to but this is the one that shaped me as a baseball fan and O’s guy for life. Great idea for a thread-thanks. I’m having trouble with no baseball.
  24. 7 points
    I actually don't mind Hunter on the radio. Give me Palmer and Thorne all day. Kind of insulted by the fact that they're using this press release to say that it's a "diverse" team. As someone who doesn't care if my baseball broadcast teams are "diverse" just because you're including a woman here doesn't make it so. Don't pee on my shoes and tell me it's raining.
  25. 7 points
    In other words, an average team should get a 40+ WAR guy about once in 30 years, one other 30+ guy in that timeframe, and a 20+ every 6 or 7 years.
  26. 7 points
    Well, that's good. Two things: 1. No one likes watching pitchers hit. 2. Not many more annoying fans in sports than National League fans who think the double switch is the absolute pinnacle of baseball strategy.
  27. 7 points
  28. 7 points
    The Rays used 9 pitchers in last nights playoff game. The Orioles used 4 pitchers total in winning the 1966 World Series.
  29. 7 points
    Jon Shepherd in Camden Depot insinuates in a Tweet that Surhoff has expressed "old-school" opposition to analytics dating back to when Duquette first started an anlytics department. And in the Athletic article today, when asked if he thought he would be able to complexities of advanced, analytical approach to baseball, Surhoff said: "Well, I"m not Bill Gates. But I think I can pick up on stuff, when it comes to baseball, fairly quickly". His choice of Bill Gates, a "computer guy" with no connection to baseball, probably gives an indication of his attitude towards some of the things that Elias is doing. Bottom line is when someone is fired, they often can tell their side of the story to garner sympathy. The team that fires them, however, often can't comment on a personnel decision for legal reasons, or they won't because even though Surhoff is criticizing them for the firing, they are too polite to publicly list what they believe Surhoff's shortcomings are. So you will only ever hear one side of the story. The other interesting thing is, the two players they quote in the article to defend Surhoff (Mancini and Hays) both note how they first disliked Surhoff the first year they worked with him, but they grew to appreciate the advice and guidance he gave. Basically his two biggest character witnesses led with the fact that they initially didn't like him before they move on to defend him.
  30. 7 points
    As this team limps to the finish line over these next few weeks, there's not much I'm really looking for. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see us get the #1 pick but I don't think we will. I'd like to see Austin Hays play well, Santander to continue to play well, Villar, Hanser, Nunez too...Means to finish strong in two or three more starts. But the Orioles play the Dodgers tonight on Fox in a nationally televised game. And we all know that Fox is not descending on Camden Yards for the Orioles. Tonight's broadcast will cover a baseball game but it will also be more about the narrative of the Dodgers and will this be the year that they can get over the hump and win the World Series? Sure, they might throw us a bone and mention Elias and how he was part of the Houston turnaround and I'm sure they'll mention Rutschman as a reason for future hope. But this broadcast tonight will be focused mainly on the Dodgers, make no mistake. Therefore, the one thing I'd REALLY like to see is the Orioles just absolutely beat the piss out of the Dodgers tonight. We've got Bundy going which means it could be a great performance or he might not make it out of the second inning. Rich Hill, a lefty, is going for the Dodgers so I'm sure Hanser will get two or three hits but I'm not sure about the rest. It stands to be a hard game. But there'd be nothing sweeter than to shut up the broadcast team on Fox tonight and have a laugher against the Dodgers.
  31. 7 points
    He’s just a kid. I feel so old sometimes. True story. One of my students parents doesn’t come pick him up on time. I say to him, “why don’t you call your parents and see where they are?” He answers, “I don’t have my phone.” I take my phone off the hook, hand it to him. ”Here.” He puts it to his ear, looks at me and says, “your phone is broken. It’s making this weird noise.” I take the phone from him, listen, and then give him an incredulous look. “That’s called a dial tone!”
  32. 7 points
    I was fuming the other day about the money the O’s are wasting on Davis, Cobb and Trumbo, and decided to catalogue every deal the O’s have ever done for more than $20 mm. I’ve listed them below, in declining contract value order, with some WAR valuations and comments. There have been a few wins, but overall, it is not a pretty picture. (If I’ve forgotten anyone, let me know.) Chris Davis (2016-22): 7 years, $161 mm ($42 mm deferred) rWAR: -0.5 (3.076 seasons) fWAR: -1.3 (3.076 seasons) Fangraphs value: -$9.0 mm (3.076 seasons) Fangraphs deficit in value: -$89.5 mm (3.076 seasons) Comment: Quite arguably, the worst contract of all time. The -$89.5 mm only accounts for the first half of the contract. If you assume (as I do) that he will never again generate positive WAR and the O’s won’t be able to buy him out, the negative value goes to $170 mm or more. And it was a bad deal the day the ink was dry, though nobody knew it would be this bad. Adam Jones (2013-18): 6 years, $85.5 mm rWAR: 17.0 mm fWAR: 17.2 mm Fangraphs value: $133.4 mm Pre-FA discount: -$7.2 mm Net Fangraphs value: $126.2 mm Fangraphs surplus net value: $41.1 mm Comment: There’s a good case that this is the best long-term deal the O’s ever did. This deal was signed in May 2012, just as Jones was having his first really good season. The “Pre-FA discount” shown above accounts for the fact that Jones would not have been a free agent in 2013, so he would not have earned a FA-level salary that year. The formula I applied was a discount of 20% for his Arb 3 year. Jones went on to be a key leader and player for a team that went to the playoffs 3 times in 5 years. Miguel Tejada (2004-09): 6 years, $72 mm rWAR: 23.9 (20.1 as an Oriole) fWAR: 21.8 (17.5 as an Oriole) Fangraphs value: $107.7 mm ($81.1 mm as an Oriole) Fangraphs surplus value: $35.7 mm ($38.7 mm as an Oriole) Comment: By the numbers, this was almost as good a deal as the Jones deal, and it was pretty obvious the day we signed Tejada that we’d gotten him at a very good price. At the same time, Tejada’s role in the “B-12 episode” in 2005 is a black mark, and ultimately we traded him away. Still, we got decent value in that trade, and on balance, the Tejada signing was a very good one. Nick Markakis (2009-14): 6 years, $66 mm rWAR: 11.6 fWAR: 11.1 Fangraphs value: $75.3 mm Pre-FA discount: -$16.6 mm Net Fangraphs value: $58.7 mm Deficit in Fangraphs net value: -$7.3 mm This deal was signed before Markakis’ Arb-1 season, and so the value he generated in his three arb seasons is discounted by 60, 40 and 20% in my net value calculation. By that measure, this deal was a mild loser. However, I doubt most fans regret this deal, as Markakis was a quiet leader by example and a steadying presence in the lineup. He never became the star player he seemed to be developing into when this deal was made, but he was a very solid pro who posted every day. Albert Belle (1999-2003): 5 years, $65 mm rWAR: 4.0 fWAR: 4.5 Comment: Fangraphs only began putting a dollar value on WAR in 2002, the year after the ARod and Jeter contracts were signed. That value was $4 mm/WAR for 2002, and you can be sure it was significantly lower before that. By any measure, the Belle deal was a big loser for the O’s, as his injuries limited him to two seasons. Apparently insurance defrayed some of the cost, but in any event, Belle came nowhere near earning his contract. Alex Cobb (2018-21): 4 years, $57 mm rWAR: 0.6 (2 seasons) fWAR: 0.8 (2 seasons) Fangraphs value: $6.7 mm (2 seasons) Fangraphs deficit in value: -$21.3 mm (2 seasons) Comment: Cobb is out for the rest of this season, so we can look at his value and cost over two years even though there is a half-season to play. This contract is almost sure to end up underwater even if Cobb is healthy the next two years, and even if he was decent, his contract no longer serves a purpose on this rebuilding team. Unfortunately, his injuries have destroyed any trade value for now, even if we are willing to eat some salary. Better luck next year! Ubaldo Jimenez (2014-17): 4 years, $50 mm rWAR: 0.5 fWAR: 4.5 Fangraphs value: $36.4 mm Fangraphs deficit in value: $13.6 mm Comment: If you ever want an indictment of fWAR, this is it! Jimenez was terrible for 3 of his 4 seasons with us, and just OK the other season (2015). He had several good games, but overall was a huge disappointment. Give me the rWAR valuation here every day and twice on Sundays. JJ Hardy (2015-17): 3 years, $40 mm rWAR: 1.7 fWAR: 1.4 Fangraphs value: $11.4 mm Fangraphs deficit in value: -$28.6 mm Comment: Hardy seemingly started getting old the day he signed this deal. He had injuries all three seasons, particularly in 2015 and 2017, and by his final year was a shadow of his former self on both sides of the ball. He did manage a relatively healthy and productive 2016, and not coincidentally, the O’s made the wild card that year. Brian Roberts (2010-13): 4 years, $40 mm rWAR: 1.0 fWAR: 1.6 Fangraphs value: $10.6 mm Fangraphs deficit in value: -$29.4 mm Comment: This deal covered four free agent seasons and was signed a full year before it took effect, following a winter in which Roberts almost was traded to the Cubs. Roberts had an excellent 2009 (still under his prior contract) after signing this deal, but then a series of injuries and a serious, self-induced concussion kept Roberts off the field for the vast majority of his contract. Mark Trumbo (2017-19): 3 years, $37.5 mm rWAR: -0.2 (2.076 seasons) fWAR: -0.9 (2.076 seasons) Fangraphs value: -$7.2 mm (2.076 seasons) Fangraphs deficit in value: -$44.7 mm (2.076 seasons) Comment: This deal was signed after Trumbo’s 47 HR season that was a key component of the 2016 wild card run. Unfortunately, Trumbo was awful in 2017, had a half-decent 2018 cut short by injuries, and has missed all of 2019 so far. Another guy we might have hoped to trade for some salary relief this year but injuries took away any hypothetical chance of doing that. Scott Erickson (1999-03): 5 years, $31.5 mm rWAR: 0.1 fWAR: 2.8 Comment: Another deal done before Fangraphs started putting a dollar value on WAR, but easily $20mm+ underwater. Erickson missed 2 of the 5 seasons with injuries, and performed poorly in the others. Plus, the deal annoyed Mussina, who had signed a 3-year deal the year before because Angelos told him he didn’t believe in giving pitchers deals longer than 3 years. Darren O’Day (2016-19): 4 years, $31 mm rWAR: 1.9 (3.076 seasons) fWAR: 1.2 (3.076 seasons) Fangraphs value: $9.9 mm (3.076 seasons) Fangraphs deficit: -$21.1 mm (3.076 seasons)(-$7.4 mm as an Oriole) Comment: Another guy who seemingly got old the minute the ink was dry on his deal. O’Day went from being a healthy, consistently top set-up guy to being oft-injured and decent but inconsistent when healthy. While injured in 2018, he was traded as part of the Gausman deal, relieving the Orioles of about $13.7 in current salary and deferred payments, but probably significantly dampening the return for Gausman. A lot of people were upset by that at the time, but with O’Day still on the shelf today and Gausman not performing well at the moment, it doesn’t look nearly as bad as it did a year ago. Cal Ripken (1993-97): 5 years, $30.5 mm rWAR: 17.3 fWAR: 17.8 Comment: This deal was signed about 6 weeks before Cal was due to become a free agent, and at the time, was the biggest deal in baseball history. Cal was very good but not great the next five years, and in hindsight you probably could say it was a mild overpay considering the FA prices at the time, if all you looked at was on the field production. But when you consider Cal’s huge fan appeal, and the publicity generated as Cal chased and broke Lou Gehrig’s streak, there’s little doubt that Cal was worth every penny. Rafael Palmeiro (1994-98): 5 years, $30 mm rWAR: 23.4 fWAR: 24.9 Comment: A comparison between Raffy’s deal and Cal’s one year earlier shows that Raffy was the better on-the-field value. He produced all five years covered by the contract at a high level, and the O’s made the playoffs twice during that run. Certainly a solid winner of a contract. Brady Anderson (1998-2002): 5 years, $29.5 mm rWAR: 8.8 (8.9 as an Oriole) fWAR: 6.8 (7.2 as an Oriole) Comment: Signed a full season after his big 50-homer year, contrary to popular belief. Brady was productive for a couple years of this deal but fell off a cliff as it progressed, causing the O’s to release him with a full season left on the contract. Probably $10 mm underwater at the prices at the time. David Segui (2001-04): 4 years, $27.8 mm rWAR: 2.4 fWAR: 1.9 Comment: Segui hit pretty well when he actually played, but he was continuously hurt. Fangraphs valued his final 3 seasons at $700 k; they didn’t do valuations in 2001 but he arguably was worth $5-7 mm that year based on the 2002 valuation. So, this one was $20 mm underwater. Ramon Hernandez (2006-09): 4 years, $26.5 mm rWAR: 6.4 (7.3 as an Oriole) fWAR: 6.4 (6.4 as an Orioles) Fangraphs value: $32.9 mm ($32.7 mm as an Oriole) Fangraphs surplus value: $6.4 mm ($6.2 mm as an Oriole) Comment: The O’s signed Hernandez even though Javy Lopez had a year to go on his deal, because it was apparent that Lopez had lost his defensive skills. Hernandez had an excellent first year with the O’s, but went downhill from there. With the O’s expecting Matt Wieters’ arrival in 2009, they traded Hernandez after the 2008 season for Ryan Freel, Brandon Waring and Justin Turner. That could have turned out well if the O’s had recognized the potential of Turner. Melvin Mora (2007-09): 3 years, $25 mm rWAR: 4.0 fWAR: 5.6 Fangraphs value: $33.0 mm Fangraphs surplus value: $8.0 mm Comment: This deal was signed shortly after the 2006 season began, after terrific 2004-05 seasons by Mora under a very favorable contract. He also had played a key role in calming down Miguel Tejada over the winter, after Tejada briefly demanded a traded. Mora started slipping a bit in 2006 after signing the deal, was OK in 2007-08, and slid badly in the final year of the deal. As I recall, Fangraphs valued this as a mild loser at the time. But later, Fangraphs re-jiggered its WAR calculations and now it comes out on the positive side. I’d basically call it a break-even deal. Sidney Ponson (2004-06): 3 years, $22.5 mm rWAR: -0.7 (0.1 as an Oriole) fWAR: 4.5 (4.0 as an Oriole) Fangraphs value: $19.6 mm ($17.1 as an Oriole) Fangraphs deficit in value: -$2.9 mm (-$5.4 mm as an Oriole) Comment: Another case where I agree with rWAR and think fWAR is ridiculous. After signing his contract, Ponson came to camp fat as a whale, then spent the following offseason getting thrown into jail for punching a judge. He got caught for drunk driving that summer and the O’s released him and tried to void his contract, a move that apparently failed in the end. Javy Lopez (2004-06): 3 years, $22.5 mm rWAR: 6.3 (6.9 as an Oriole) fWAR: 6.1 (est. 6.1 as an Oriole) Fangraphs value: $21.1 mm (est. $26.6 mm as an Oriole) Comment: Lopez went from well above average to average to terrible in his 2.7 years in Baltimore. When we signed him, we were trying to play Lopez and Ivan Rodriguez against each other in negotiations, as if they were equal players. Big mistake. JJ Hardy (2012-14): 3 years, $22.5 mm rWAR: 10.3 fWAR: 8.6 Fangraphs value: $62.0 mm Fangraphs surplus value: $39.5 mm Comment: One of Andy MacPhail's parting gifts to the Orioles, signed in the second half of 2011. This deal was better than the 2015-17 deal was bad, as Hardy anchored the great defenses that led the O's to two playoff berths, including their one division title in the last 20 years. Yovani Gallardo (2016-17): 2 years, $22 mm rWAR: -0.3 (0.1 as an Oriole) fWAR: 0.7 (0.6 as an Oriole) Fangraphs value: $6.0 mm ($5.0 mm as an Oriole) Fangraphs deficit in value: -$16.0 mm (-$4.0 mm as an Oriole) Comment: The O’s initially signed Gallardo to a 3-year deal, but following a physical the deal was restructured as 2 years plus an option. Good move. After the 2016 season, the O’s were able to unload Gallardo’s remaining guaranteed year in a trade for Seth Smith. Mike Mussina (1998-2000): 3 years, $20.1 mm rWAR: 15.0 fWAR: 17.5 Comment: This deal was arguably too good, as it made the Player’s Association angry and then Moose got alienated when Angelos lowballed him in the next round of contract negotiations. Mussina was probably worth 2-3 times what he got paid in his 1998-2000 contract. Aubrey Huff (2007-09): 3 years, $20 mm rWAR: 2.7 (3.5 as an Oriole) fWAR: 2.8 (est. 3.6 as an Oriole) Fangraphs value: $15.8 mm (est. $20 mm as an Oriole) Fangraphs deficit in value: -$4.2 mm (est. $1 mm surplus as an Oriole) Comment: Almost all the value of this deal came in the 2008 season. Huff had a terrible 2009, and was traded at the waiver deadline to Detroit, where he was even worse. For me the big winners were Jones, Tejada, Ripken, Palmeiro, Hardy I and Mussina. The big losers were Davis, Belle, Cobb, Jimenez, Roberts, Hardy II, Trumbo, Erickson, O'Day, Anderson, Segui, Ponson, and Gallardo (though we really minimized that damage by trading him). I put Markakis, Mora, Lopez, Hernandez and Huff in the roughly break even category. So, the bad deals outnumber the good ones by about 2:1, and the Davis deal probably outweighs all the good ones all by itself.
  33. 7 points
    Well part of that was probably your super human brain power with the ability to mask the pain.
  34. 7 points
    Severino should get a full 1 WAR for tonight's game.
  35. 7 points
    It's a split in Boston and the O's have yet to lose a road series! Dan Straily: Great success. 5 strong innings of mostly weak contact, only 2 hits and 1 walk allowed, and got the win. This is the kind of stabilizing performance we hoped to see from Dan. In fact, maybe we can cautiously say the rotation is beginning to come around. Chris Davis: I will refrain from Bordick-isms, but it was nice to see the big man go deep. He sure relished that trip around the bases 😂. He's now nipping at Mullins' heels with a .086. Oh, and he broke another bat on his knee after a strikeout, which must be a very satisfying thing to be able to do and I'm jealous. Dwight Smith Jr.: Bounced into 2 double plays before going Super Sayan and deciding to drive in 4 runs with his second 2-run Pesky Pole Squeaker and a 2-run opposite field double in the 9th. Good for an even .800 OPS on the year. Gotta love this guy! Pull that lawnmower cord, young man. Renato Nunez: Speaking of finding good players on waivers, Renato continues to show that, yes, he's a Major League hitter, thank you very much. Slammed an RBI single off the monster and picked up 2 more hits, including a 2B. 3-5 on the day and his average is closing in on .300. That'll work! Trey Mancini: Ho hum, another two hit game with a double from the All Star RF. OPS hanging out at 1.101. 🤷‍♂️ Jonathan Villar: RBI single, SB, 2 BB, 2 R. Good fantasy line! Jimmy Yacabonis: He's getting a lot more trust to pitch in big spots this year and he's not disappointing. He's an expert gap-filler in all these 5 inning starts and he came up big again today, notching another scoreless outing over 1.1 IP. Paul Fry: Couple of really big outs. Can't say enough about Paul Fry, man. He and Jimmy are a steady duo out there. Phillips and Castro: 2 scoreless innings to end the game, and nice to see Castro have back-to-back scoreless outings. Perhaps he's coming around a little. The Red Sox: Consider the following: The Sox got beat at home on Patriot's Day by $500,000 Dan Straily who throws 90mph, the .086-hitting Chris Davis, two waiver claim guys who drove in 5 runs combined, and a bullpen consisting of Some Guys. All while inexplicably playing their catcher at 2B and Pearce in LF (who has actually played 2B) and generally looking goofy out there. And they're a game behind the O's. Yikes! Brandon Hyde: Attaboy Skip! Get your money's worth babayyyy!!! Mini 🌈s: So Ruiz is basically good for a walk per game, which is pretty cool. Sucre had a nice hit to go with a walk of his own. And Martin picked up two walks himself, which, whatcha doin Red Sox? Two double plays were turned, one started by Martin, the other by Villar. NO HOME RUNS ALLOWED
  36. 7 points
  37. 6 points
    Today it’s freezing by FL standards and in the way to the fields coach Tim DeJohn and I compared layers. He told me where and when they’d be doing high rate double play drills today, field 2 if you’re around. The players did a great short burst explosion contest this morning and I’ll go through my footage. Highlights include JC Encarnacion beating Mason Janvrin who gets to top speed in 2-3 strides. Right now they’ve moved to sliding drills. I don’t want Ripken or Zach Jarrett coming for my legs! I’ll have more soon. 10:30am Update-Just got a nice little tidbit talking to a starter. He told me that the guys who are here early as far as pitchers are all starters whose throwing programs include 30 mound pitches and a live BP every 3 days. I had thought something like that but he confirmed it, he went yesterday so after calisthenics and stretches he was basically done for the day. Kind of like most baseball fans he wanted to go to the O’s game and ‘watch Chris Davis. I reminded him of his .800 spring average and he cracked up. 2:30pm Update-I left the complex after a few talks with coaches and team staff discussing some issues I was unsure of. Today was chilly but so many drills and pitchers establishing a usage schedule. I am starting to like the practice environment more and more the more I see but the best part is seeing the bits of improvement that pave the way to more confidence/success. I watched more than I filmed today as the pitchers showed similar attributes and stuff as they did two days previous. I got some more looks at Jensen Elliott and he’s starting to warm up a bit. Brnovich too was a focus of mine and he’s got his stuff rounding into form as he harnesses control in this early camp setting. Fans haven’t heard or seen much of him but he’s going for the K and his arsenal is going to make people watch. There were diving catch drills in the outfield and that was awesome. Guys showed some range and as usual, Zach Watson has lots. Nuestrom showed good stride length and positioning too, it was my first look at him. Also in the cage he was smashing soft tosses into the stratosphere testing the strength of the nets. I realized looking through the note pad that I am formulating profiles on each and every guy here and several have really made a strong impression with skills, focus, attitude and especially effort. There is not a single player out here trying harder and getting more out of what he’s got than Willy Yahn. I haven’t figured him out totally but he will not stop busting his ass or going all out so I really just want to watch. You would too. His teammates absolutely love him because they see it too. He’s less blessed than other guys here but his name is William Wallace and it’s fitting. Also Cadyn Grenier and his grounder stopping skills and body are just made for fielding. His swing is leveling and his contact ability better than before but not complete. His defensive positioning, motions and feet are just natural and coaching is only helping shape these skills into a pro-ready package. He can play D. From my pad ‘every Cadyn defensive movement demonstrates natural ability’. I want opponents hitting it on the ground near him today. I watched drills, hit the cage and then saw live BP’s and here are my observations: -Joey Ortiz throwing fundamentals are his best defensive weapon. -Darell Hernaiz gained a few lbs but it didn’t affect his foot quickness in the slightest-good sign for more weight. Also he likes his own sliding technique In the cage I watched Zach a Jarrett again. He has a good initiation of motion and strong hands force the action to start happening. I don’t know about the plane, I need to watch more. Also he’s not big guy so perhaps morphing into more of an uppercut may really help him. I focused more on hands with a few guys and not much to see but I saw Thorburn with a few good knocks in a row and was using the top hand as guidance, turning it into the ball’s path. In the live BP’s I noted that Hammer worked in tandem with Gillispie today again. Brnovich steps on to the hill and has slide in his first throw. It’s great to see a guy whose straight isn’t even that straight. Escarra laced a double off him past RF. He’s pretty much on everything with timing. JC is the hottest hitter through week 1 and it works because he’s got a good attitude and lots of chatter. I wrote Brnovich is maybe even moving more then he wants at this point because they’re not all strikes and he got touched up a little. He’s got stuff to work through to get placement but it’s a good assignment for the coaches and he seems like a good project to want to fulfill. Houston Roth not only threw a water bottle into the trash from 18 feet away, he had significant depth on off-speed and corkscrewed Hernaiz into the dirt. Next guy Roth whipped a cut fastball down under Ben Brezeale’s bat (nasty) but Brezeale laced a high velocity return past the SS hole. Great work not getting stuck. Grenier was next and he waited out everything that wasn’t straight-I dont think there’s a count yet, and then he hit the cage low with a liner. Good work on both sides of the ball here. I got to another field in time to see Connor Gillispie and his battery mate today Cody Roberts finished off Joey Ortiz looking with a breaking ball that stayed tight even if high and Joey was not going to be able to swing. Nice finish. Roberts again is an excellent communicator. More Jake Lyons and I noticed he’s already looking svelt-er and we haven’t truly hit sweating weather yet. Stuff wise he’s yet to show me a lack of anything. Today I was directly behind the catcher and I noticed his breaking ball goes heavy on the third base side even almost outside a righty. That angle made it pretty clear. He and Cannon worked together, TX and OK. My last note for the day says ‘Escarra took a step in the box and laced one to deep RF/wall...he’s on fire! Before leaving I talked to a few more guys and got some good info on the upcoming games. I didn’t want to talk about the MLB pipeline list that came out last bout because it’s just another list and feel like I have some disagreements. But it was on my mind that each name on it was either at major or minor league camp and some of those guys are starting off really well. We’ll see who is throwing tomorrow and I’ll study some video and read some hitting stuff until then.
  38. 6 points
    MLB is seeing a fairly dramatic exodus of guys dumping the current broken system for better times in Japan and Korea. Honestly, if you're Jones, why WOULDN'T you just say "to hell with waiting until March to get a minor league offer". Go hit some dongs off some sub-par pitchers, play the hero for another couple years, eat some interesting food for your instagram, and witness fans in the stands who actually care and pay attention to the game and cheer. There's literally only one downside if you're Jones and that's moving your family.
  39. 6 points
    Didn’t see this posted yet, O’s with the 31st pick in the 1st round https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/12/2020-competitive-balance-draft-pick-order.html
  40. 6 points
  41. 6 points
    I get the impression that Rob Manfred doesn't even like baseball. He should go become the commissioner of an e-sports league.
  42. 6 points
    We're finalizing our official Top 30 prospects list and will start putting it out next week. I'm thinking of doing something different this year and go from 1-10 with us putting out a poll and then releasing two prospect at a time until 10. then five at a time afterwards until we reach 30. We will also be releasing a "Keep an eye on" group for guys that just missed the Top 30 or were in consideration. In the meantime, let's see you guys put out your top 30 lists in this thread. Luke and I will try not to comment too much in this thread after this so we don't give away too many hints.
  43. 6 points
  44. 6 points
    Thorne and Palmer are the very best. And I don't care how Thorne pronounces or doesn't pronounce names, I don't care that he sometimes misjudges how hard balls are hit. Golden pipes. Could listen to Thorne read a phonebook. Palmer is a knowitall but he's got a right to be. He's great to listen to, as well. I actually like Hunter on the radio, but the always sunny disposition on TV is intolerable. I feel bad saying this because I think he's a genuine good guy, but Bordick isn't good. And I'm being nice. He tries hard though. McDonald is fantastic. Carpenter and Santangelo are absolutely atrocious. If I happen to catch a Nats game, I'd almost prefer to mute it.
  45. 6 points
  46. 6 points
    I mean short of insulting his mother or wife does anything warrant Davis going after Hyde? This isn’t a player on another team it’s HIS MANAGER. Just cut this clown already.
  47. 6 points
    Tony's response is appropriate. Loverro is either...out of touch or has an axe to grind. Or just needed to fart out a column to meet a deadline and couldn't be bothered to do any research. Or a combination of the three. And I like Loverro. I've been around him, he's a nice guy. It's easy to kick the Orioles while they're down, no doubt about it. The correct story to tell would be that Angelos is reportedly out of the picture, the sons are in charge and have given the reigns over to part of the FO team that helped get the Astros to become yearly contenders. That's all factual, not hyperbole. You can still write that column and still take shots at Angelos. By and large, his ownership has been a failure, no one will debate that.
  48. 6 points
    I was at a game five years ago, Memorial Day. Random guy sitting next to me notices that recently-recalled Caleb Joseph is 2-for-29. He goes on for what seems like an hour about how he can see a GM putting up with, like, 1-for-7 or maybe 1-for-9. Everybody has to adjust. But Duquette should be looking for a new job if you let a slump get to 2-for-20, much less 2-for-29. I now realize that I've met wildcard.
  49. 6 points
    If he indeed is the chosen one, I hope this movie is better than the last one I saw about a switch hitting catcher.
  50. 6 points
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