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Os acquire Saunders.

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Maybe this has been addressed earlier in the thread, but if Joe Saunders really is a worthwhile pitcher, why would no one else have claimed him during the waiver process? It's not like he has a crazy salary.

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His ERA is almost 2 runs lower, his home run rate is half of Hunter's, his strikeout rate is higher, their walk rates are similar. Saunder's FIP is a lot lower than Hunter's, and his xFIP is a half a run lower. They're really not similar at all. Even talking career marks Saunders has ERA/FIP/xFIPs between half a run and a run lower than Hunter.

I don't really expect Saunders to pitch to a 4.22 in the AL East, but I have to think he'll be an improvement over Hunter.

You're comparing Saunders' NL West stats to Hunter's AL East stats...from a statistical perspective, that doesn't seem very sound.

See my above post for an attempt to compare them under similar conditions.

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One thing I think is good about this trade is that Buck likes his moving parts. Lindstrom was a little redundant in the bullpen, even though he had pitched really well. Saunders gives him a few more options, potentially getting Chen a little more rest which he clearly benefits from.

Don't forget that Hammel has also done much better on longer rest--and that may be even more the case coming back from his surgery.

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You're comparing Saunders' NL West stats to Hunter's AL East stats...from a statistical perspective, that doesn't seem very sound.

See my above post for an attempt to compare them under similar conditions.

The issue there is that those results were from years ago, and I don't think the difference between Hunter pitching to a 4.00 and Hunter pitching to a 6.00 is all (or even mostly) division. I think you might be able to look at Saunders and say he's likely to add a half a run or maybe a bit more to his ERA. But it's hard to say the likely case is that his ERA will go up nearly 2.00 runs. Of course in six starts anything could happen.

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Meh, this move is fine. I'm not crazy about it, but I'm not gonna be depressed about it either. We traded bullpen depth for rotation depth. 13 one way a baker's dozen the other.

If Pommeranz were healthy, this wouldn't even be an issue.

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I'm really mixed on this move, mostly because it seemed like the Orioles pitching was really becoming solidified, especially the bullpen. And by adding Johnson, to Chen, Gonzalez, Tillman, Britton, and the soon-to-return Hammel, I felt the starters were really strong. And with Showalter saying he wanted to give Chen and Gonzalez more rest, I thought a 6-man rotation might be his answer. I assume that adding Saunders will likely push Johnson back to the long-relief role. Saunders is a better option than Hunter, but Hunter was already gone and replaced by Johnson. Too bad, because I think Steve has proven he is a very effective starter....more so than Britton.

While I don't think losing Lindstrom will be a major bullpen loss, especially with (hopefully) Patton coming back soon, I don't like messing with something that is working really well. And although Matusz looked sharp in his only relief appearance, I'm not convinced that he, or Arietta, are going to be effective. As I said, I don't like messing with success.

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I'm going to trust Duquette on this one, because I think he has a real good feel for how this trade affects the team. But I really hate losing Linstrom, because he's a veteran power arm who I thought was going to play a bigger role than he had been - down the stretch. I know some think he's easily replacable. I don't agree with that view. Counting on Arrieta in a role totally new to him in a playoff race... I wouldn't think that's going to work out, but I trust Duquette knows better than me - which is a pretty good bet. If Saunders eats 7 good innings a start, then it's a good trade.

Also, with Linstrom's salary, I don't think the O's would have kept him next year, so there's no long-term negative in this trade.

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Our pen is strong enough to take out a guy who rarely came into the game in crucial situations, and add a good back of the rotation guy. It's not like we traded Strop or O'Day or Ayala, who routinely pitch in tight games. Lindstrom always seemed a bit shaky as well. I'm thrilled with this trade tbh. Yes it takes away from our pen, but it doesn't take away one of our key guys, and adds a solid starter, Edith was a weakness.

Who's Edith? Is she on the 40-man roster?

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The issue there is that those results were from years ago, and I don't think the difference between Hunter pitching to a 4.00 and Hunter pitching to a 6.00 is all (or even mostly) division. I think you might be able to look at Saunders and say he's likely to add a half a run or maybe a bit more to his ERA. But it's hard to say the likely case is that his ERA will go up nearly 2.00 runs. Of course in six starts anything could happen.

In terms of runs scored, the ranks are as follows:

AL EAST (Excluding Baltimore):

2. Red Sox

4. Yankees

10. Blue Jays

17. Rays

NL West (excluding Diamondbacks):

7. Rockies

16. Giants

24. Dodgers

27. Padres

How can you say that division doesn't play a role when you're playing almost 60 games against teams in the bottom half of the league in terms of offense?? To make matters worse, you compare it to the AL East which has almost 60 games against teams in the top third!

I simply compared them the only way that made sense...and that was against similar competition in the AL West in a similar time span. Saunders is a joke...this trade is a joke.

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Based on that article, it seems like its a dick move when you do it when you have no chance or intention of acquiring the player. In this case, it was known that the DBacks wanted to move the player, so every team who had interest could have sealed a deal with a waiver claim, therefore no need to look like a jerk for placing a claim. The fact that no team placed the claim leads me to think no team actually had interest in the player. He was a below league average pitcher in the AL save for one season, so I'm not expecting much.

Edited by dorfmac

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Joe Saunders is not very good and will struggle against AL teams. If we wanted a lefty to pitch to a 5.00 ERA with 5.0k/9 we could have worked the 40 man to bring Eveland back. I'd much rather roll with the pitchers we have now then give innings to Saunders. I was pleased we dodged Joe Blanton - but now we went out and got the lefthanded Joe Blanton. I don't think Lindstrom is a huge loss - but he'd been effective when used and I'm not keen on giving up anything else - so it doesn't matter who the PTBNL is - we've already paid too much. I wouldn't have picked Saunders up for free if he was released - unless it was for Norfolk - so I'm not happy with this move. I'd be somewhat ok if we got Saunders for free and intended him to be an occasional lefty specialist/ and otherwise longman out of the pen - but they are going to start him. It's depth - and he'll be no worse than Hunter likely - but it's a move I'd rather have not happened. And if the PTBNL is anyone of anyone consquence I'm even more disappointed

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