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Jones wants say in offseason, plans to meet with Angelos

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I think Adam's quote about loyalty and opportunity was meant as a message to Chris Davis as much as anyone else.

I hope so!

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Yep, if AJ were a member of the board and said that, he'd get hit with fangraphs, neg reps and accusations of being a troll.

This. I can think of 100s of times last winter and spring when people on this board said exactly what Adam just said, and they would be met by a group of 5 or 6 elders on this board who basically told them they were dead wrong and they needed to stop 'trolling'. In fact I believe there was one poster who was banned (or at least he doesn't post here anymore) who talked about how the tone and momo for the upcoming season is actually set during the winter months and off season (like Adam just did). I believed he actually made an analogy to something Peyton Manning said about that, and he was called an idiot for lack of a better word.

Almost all of those who talked about the bad offseason leading to a bad season have turned out to be correct. While those that talked endlessly about fangraphs, WAR, stats, etc and that Dan and the offseason was fine, were 100% wrong.

Funny how that worked out.

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Almost all of those who talked about the bad offseason leading to a bad season have turned out to be correct. While those that talked endlessly about fangraphs, WAR, stats, etc and that Dan and the offseason was fine, were 100% wrong.

Funny how that worked out.

It is not black and white. Everybody wanted Nelson back. The only question is years and dollars. I was willing to take the risk that we come up short this year if we don't get locked into Nelson Cruz for 4+ years. I would have loved a massive payroll increase and extension, but I understand why the team couldn't do it. To say I understood the rationale does not mean I thought everything would be fine.

If Adam wants to win, he could take a pay cut and donate his money to Chen and Davis. I love AJ as a player and I understand he wants to win, but this is going to head down a path that leaves him disgruntled. Peter is never going to budge on dollars, DD is not going to let a player do his job.

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This. I can think of 100s of times last winter and spring when people on this board said exactly what Adam just said, and they would be met by a group of 5 or 6 elders on this board who basically told them they were dead wrong and they needed to stop 'trolling'. In fact I believe there was one poster who was banned (or at least he doesn't post here anymore) who talked about how the tone and momo for the upcoming season is actually set during the winter months and off season (like Adam just did). I believed he actually made an analogy to something Peyton Manning said about that, and he was called an idiot for lack of a better word.

Almost all of those who talked about the bad offseason leading to a bad season have turned out to be correct. While those that talked endlessly about fangraphs, WAR, stats, etc and that Dan and the offseason was fine, were 100% wrong.

Funny how that worked out.

God bless you sir.

I would give you more rep, but I have to spread some around before giving you more.

MSK

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If Adam wants to win, he could take a pay cut and donate his money to Chen and Davis. I love AJ as a player and I understand he wants to win, but this is going to head down a path that leaves him disgruntled. Peter is never going to budge on dollars, DD is not going to let a player do his job.

First off, Adam is already being underpaid based on today's market. Yeah, sounds crazy, but $13 mil is underpaying a consistent 4-5 win player. He doesn't need to donate money -- maybe Chen and Davis can ask for a bit less instead. But, Boras. So no.

Second, it very well could. Responses in this thread account for that when they mention he can be traded as part of a full rebuild.

Third, Peter doesn't have to budge on dollars. With several minor moves, the Orioles can have well over $50 mil to play with, without increasing overall payroll.

Fourth, you're absolutely right and I wonder if this is proof that DD is in Angelos' doghouse after the Toronto fiasco. Note that Adam names him third, after Peter and Buck.

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The line about not just talking about contending, but actually having a team that can contend is priceless. I'm sure he is as sick as us of the happy talk we get from the FO each spring trying to sell us on how scrubs like Kris Benson, Garrett Atkins, an over-the-hill Kevin Millar, or Steve Traschel are going to lead us to the playoffs.

How many of those guys were acquired by the current leadership? None of them.

Because all those "moves" the FO made last offseason worked out so well. How many players did we DFA this year again? I forget...

So... if the front office has a season where their plans didn't work out the solution is to let your vocal centerfielder become the de facto GM? There's no way that wouldn't work well.

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Fourth, you're absolutely right and I wonder if this is proof that DD is in Angelos' doghouse after the Toronto fiasco. Note that Adam names him third, after Peter and Buck.

That sounds like a reach of the magnitude of "Tillman (IIRC) wasn't on the cover of the program so that's a clear indication he's going to be traded." You really think that a player is going to parse his words so carefully that he wants us to read between the lines and divine management power rankings from an off-the-cuff comment?

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AJ has a combination of leadership and talent you are lucky to get once a generation. We are lucky to have him.

Yet he's still a player with a player's perspective. You can humor him, but he has no power or influence in player acquisition or teambuilding. Or at least shouldn't.

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That sounds like a reach of the magnitude of "Tillman (IIRC) wasn't on the cover of the program so that's a clear indication he's going to be traded." You really think that a player is going to parse his words so carefully that he wants us to read between the lines and divine management power rankings from an off-the-cuff comment?

I just think Jones is closer to Buck. Manager and likes to talk to him.

Also I think Adam is frustrated about this season. He says he does not want to be on a team in rebuild mode. Then says he would not mind signing a long term contract to finish his career in Baltimore.

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Yet he's still a player with a player's perspective. You can humor him, but he has no power or influence in player acquisition or teambuilding. Or at least shouldn't.

Maybe so. However, if I was the team top brass I'd at least consider some self reflection when my top player points the finger at me. Not to mention the national media has done that for months.

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Hopefully this leads to an even more intense focus on getting the very best that the Rule 5 and Minor League free agency has to offer.

Methinks that Jones will be less frustrated when he steps back and remembers that we will have Jason Garcia in Frederick next year.

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From the Sun:

Center fielder and undisputed team leader Adam Jones doesn't want to see a repeat of last winter, when the Orioles let go of home run king Nelson Cruz, long-time right fielder Nick Markakis and dominating reliever Andrew Miller, though he recognizes that that more top-talent attrition is probably unavoidable.

"I want this team, from Day One of spring training, to not just talk about competing like everybody else ? all 30 teams do that at the beginning of it ? but actually have the team to be able to go out on the field and get the job done,'' Jones said Tuesday.

He said Tuesday that he intends to seek a meeting with Angelos and sit down with both manager Buck Showalter and Dan Duquette at some point early in the offseason to make a case for treating next season like the Orioles should have treated this one.

"It's going to be a different offseason because a lot of the core is now in situations where they can do things differently," Jones said. "I want to make sure that, hopefully, I can persuade or say anything to keep this team intact, and if (that's not possible), go get guys who have similar attributes and pedigrees.

"I think after the season, I'll let things die down a little, get away from the game and then go have a meeting -? talk to Peter, go talk to Buck, go talk to Dan and see what direction we're going next year."

What Jones does not want is to spend one or two of his remaining three years under contract on a rebuilding team. He's gotten a taste of winning and he wants to help take the Orioles to the next level of success.

"Because I'm getting older," he said. "As you get older, you want to win. I may want to play until I'm 40, but every day you get older, so you want to win and win and win. You see why Torii (Hunter) is still playing. You want to win."

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/bs-sp-schmuck-orioles-column-0916-20150915-column.html

Good for him. I'm all for it. Loves me some Jonesy.

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So maybe we can just go without an official GM and let the players vote on who we should sign? I understand AJ is frustrated and wants to win and I have no problem with him expressing his desire to win. But what if Hardy also speaks up saying he wants to win, and he and Jones disagree on which players to keep and make offers to? Should Hardy and Jones both lobby PA on players? What if Manny has a buddy that he wants on the team? Should he be able to argue against AJ and Hardy and try to get money spent on his guy?

Adam should tell management that he wants to win now and expects moves to be made to benefit the team in 2016......then trust them to do it.....or ask for a trade.

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