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Olney: Orioles

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How are you so sure Milwaukee wouldn't trade those players? They don't have those guys. They did trade a 4.3 WAR pre-arb guy with four more years of control during their tank seasons.

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Davis is a decent bat in a corner outfield spot. Schoop is a good power bat at an up-the-middle position. Gausman is a good arm that could be an exceptional arm. Machado is a potential MVP candidate.

Machado isn't losing any trade value. I think they'd sit on him until at least next off-season (but could see them moving him then depending on where the rebuild sat). Personally, I think they'd be pretty pleased to have an Arcia/Machado left side for the next three years. And the team just isn't that far away from competing.

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Emerge in 4 or 5 years? When Angelos may no longer be with us? When Manny is in pinstripes? When Buck is retired? When the face of the franchise, Adam Jones, is no longer under contract?

If I'm an 87 year old owner who has invested millions in a team over the years, taken ridicule (rightfully so) for sinking the team into a 14 year abyss, you betcha I'm in "win now" mode. I wouldn't be worried whatsoever about a 14th round draft pick that might work out, or more likely given the O's draft history, be an injury bust or AAAA fodder. The man controlling the purse strings values those draft picks (which are already far from sure things) much lower than anyone on this forum, I would imagine.

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When ownership insists on 160 M to CD, what kind of retooling can they do? Next year if they can't extend him they can trade Manny, along with Britton. That should help the farm. And who knows maybe Bundy and Harvey will finally be healthy.

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When ownership insists on 160 M to CD, what kind of retooling can they do? Next year if they can't extend him they can trade Manny, along with Britton. That should help the farm. And who knows maybe Bundy and Harvey will finally be healthy.

What's the excuse for the last two offseasons?

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If I'm an 87 year old owner who has invested millions in a team over the years, taken ridicule (rightfully so) for sinking the team into a 14 year abyss, you betcha I'm in "win now" mode. I wouldn't be worried whatsoever about a 14th round draft pick that might work out, or more likely given the O's draft history, be an injury bust or AAAA fodder. The man controlling the purse strings values those draft picks (which are already far from sure things) much lower than anyone on this forum, I would imagine.

He might insist on a college pitcher if we keep it.

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What's the excuse for the last two offseasons?
They had an intact core that took them to the playoffs. It's ludicrous to expect them to trade away assets to retool in that situation. Besides I'm sure ownership wouldn't be for that either. Remember Pat Gillick?

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Reading this thread, it's apparent the Orioles will be criticized no matter what they do. Some people are unhappy they didn't spend even more money than it takes to retain all the players they retained and add Trumbo, Gallardo and Fowler. Others don't want them giving up draft picks and want them retooling now. The truth is, these choices aren't easy and we don't have perfect foresight of how this will all work out. I think Olney portrayed the dilemma well.

At bottom, I think it's too soon to start a retooling program. They've got three years with Machado and Jones and they are trying to compete while that window is open. I'm not totally thrilled with the way they spent the funds that apparently were available, but I think the decision to try to build up the current team made sense. It may work or it may not. If it's not working in July, I'd make a sharp course correction and trade some veterans for prospects. But I'm hoping it won't come to that.

Edited by Frobby

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They had an intact core that took them to the playoffs. It's ludicrous to expect them to trade away assets to retool in that situation. Besides I'm sure ownership wouldn't be for that either. Remember Pat Gillick?

So every single piece the team has had under control was indispensable? No possible tweaking in any form. Got it.

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Trying to maintain a winning team?

There were no possible moves available -- every single piece was necessary. Not buying it. Sorry.

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So every single piece the team has had under control was indispensable? No possible tweaking in any form. Got it.

It obvious that things could have been done differently while still trying to put a winning product on the field. We can all criticize some moves and non moves. You would have done things differently. I'm sure I would have done things differently. That doesn't mean that Duquette can't still come out smelling like a rose. I wouldn't bet on it but it's possible.

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There were no possible moves available -- every single piece was necessary. Not buying it. Sorry.

No one said that. Don't be silly.

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I'm not understanding the notion that signing Gallardo and Fowler is "going all in". These are not all in players, they are half measures. All in is signing top tier free agents in my view. Signing middling leftovers attached to draft pick compensation is not "all in". It's it's a desperate attempt to shore up weaknesses with marginal upgrades.

The O's don't possess enough resources for a full throttle all in.

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