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Todd-O

Will the fans show?

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I agree that Baltimore is not "less safe" than it was 5 years ago, but people believe that it is.

It's also obviously not the only factor in attendance issues. I do think that is a larger factor than people want to think. I personally don't think it's too much of a reach to say that a crowd of 24000 might be 20000 now due to the perceived "danger" of Baltimore, racial divide/issues, riots of 2015 and other similar issues. I think the amount of people staying away because of these things is a significantly larger % than most of us want to believe.

I remember last year reading about how the riots hurt downtown hotels. I haven't heard this year how the hotel and Inner Harbor area is doing.

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I blame fans of any age that don't support a very expensive playoff team. Probably too small a market base to continued if this doesn't change.

You can think whatever you like. Fact is, people in your generation grew up with a great team and a winning tradition - your generation had something to latch onto and be proud of. Fans in my generation grew up with some pretty terrible baseball for a prolonged period of time. Fans from my generation aren't nearly as attached to baseball and the Orioles as some of you older folks. It's all Ravens, all the time.

Then just when the team was starting to build a more dedicated following they let the fans down in 2015. You can blame fans of my generation all you want, but the Orioles organization dropped the ball big time.

Maybe when American football is replaced by international football, there might be a change.

Edited by weams

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You can think whatever you like. Fact is, people in your generation grew up with a great team and a winning tradition - your generation had something to latch onto and be proud of. Fans in my generation grew up with some pretty terrible baseball for a prolonged period of time. Fans from my generation aren't nearly as attached to baseball and the Orioles as some of you older folks. It's all Ravens, all the time.

Then just when the team was starting to build a more dedicated following they let the fans down in 2015. You can blame fans of my generation all you want, but the Orioles organization dropped the ball big time.

If an entire generation won't show up because the Orioles didn't follow their recommendations for how to execute the 2014-15 offseason then they're not very good fans. I'm sure part of that is a kind of lost generation from the 1998-2011 disaster.

I also see a huge divide across the country between reality and perception with regards to safety and a whole host of related things, primarily because it's in the best interests of certain groups to portray the country as a Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome post-apocalyptic nightmare. The most dangerous part of any trip to OPACY is almost certainly passing that guy on the interstate who's texting his girlfriend.

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If an entire generation won't show up because the Orioles didn't follow their recommendations for how to execute the 2014-15 offseason then they're not very good fans. I'm sure part of that is a kind of lost generation from the 1998-2011 disaster.

I also see a huge divide across the country between reality and perception with regards to safety and a whole host of related things, primarily because it's in the best interests of certain groups to portray the country as a Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome post-apocalyptic nightmare. The most dangerous part of any trip to OPACY is almost certainly passing that guy on the interstate who's texting his girlfriend.

I'm not saying that is the only reason - come on, you're a smart guy. It's just part of the equation, the same as the riots and perceived violence in the city.

Fans were basically strong armed into buying season tickets for 2015 if they wanted to attend a playoff game in 2014 for a reasonable price. Then the front office/team turns around and mails it in in 2015 - you don't think that soured fans a little?

The prolonged losing is as big a factor as any. A whole generation of fans that bleed purple, not orange.

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You can think whatever you like. Fact is, people in your generation grew up with a great team and a winning tradition - your generation had something to latch onto and be proud of. Fans in my generation grew up with some pretty terrible baseball for a prolonged period of time. Fans from my generation aren't nearly as attached to baseball and the Orioles as some of you older folks. It's all Ravens, all the time.

Then just when the team was starting to build a more dedicated following they let the fans down in 2015. You can blame fans of my generation all you want, but the Orioles organization dropped the ball big time.

I'm not going to sit in judgment of an entire generation of fans. For one thing, I don't even know if your diagnosis that the problem is coming from the 25-34 age group is correct. And I do agree that fans from my generation are probably more loyal because they enjoyed a long period of winning. Still, what I'm hearing about the current impact of the offseason before the 2015 season sounds like a pretty whiny complaint. The team has been .500 or better five years in a row. They have the most wins in the AL during that period. They've made the playoffs twice and have a good shot of making it three times in five years, in the toughest division in baseball. That is a team that deserves support. But I don't want it to sound like it's a moral obligation. It just disappoints me to see the team I love so much not getting fan support that would help them (both on the field and off).

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The most dangerous part of any trip to OPACY is almost certainly passing that guy on the interstate who's texting his girlfriend.

Or drank eight of the eight dollar beverages and will complain of price should he survive the trip.

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I'm not going to sit in judgment of an entire generation of fans. For one thing, I don't even know if your diagnosis that the problem is coming from the 25-34 age group is correct. And I do agree that fans from my generation are probably more loyal because they enjoyed a long period of winning. Still, what I'm hearing about the current impact of the offseason before the 2015 season sounds like a pretty whiny complaint. The team has been .500 or better five years in a row. They have the most wins in the AL during that period. They've made the playoffs twice and have a good shot of making it three times in five years, in the toughest division in baseball. That is a team that deserves support. But I don't want it to sound like it's a moral obligation. It just disappoints me to see the team I love so much not getting fan support that would help them (both on the field and off).

I agree with you for the most part. And I am not saying that is the only issue at hand here. As I said in a previous post, it's just part of the equation. I can tell you this, it's hard to have an in depth conversation about the Orioles with a lot people in my age group because they just don't care. The conversations never make it much past Manny Machado, Adam Jones and Chris Davis, seemingly because they don't know much else.

I love this team as much as the next diehard Orioles fan, and I long for the days of 40k+ in Camden Yards every night. And yes, fans should show up and support the team, but let's not pretend that the Orioles didn't exacerbate the situation some.

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Just bought my tickets for Thursday

It's the best i can do working at 5am or earlier Monday thru Friday. Friday I can handle being tired

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Fans were basically strong armed into buying season tickets for 2015 if they wanted to attend a playoff game in 2014 for a reasonable price. Then the front office/team turns around and mails it in in 2015 - you don't think that soured fans a little?

I think this part of your post wraps up some of the issues among some fans: Seeing a pretty common tactic to sell season tickets as strong-arming. When I was 26 and wanted playoff tickets I found a scalper. And the idea that if they didn't do thing like signing a 35-year-old Nelson Cruz to a long contract that's "mailing it in." In three years Duquette signed Cruz, Travis Snider, and Trumbo to fill similar holes. Two worked, one not so much. The not so much is portrayed as some kind of mini-treason to the fanbase.

When the Cardinals didn't sign Pujols and filled his roster spot with Mark Reynolds did the season ticket base revolt? Or was it business as usual?

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I agree that Baltimore is not "less safe" than it was 5 years ago, but people believe that it is.

It's also obviously not the only factor in attendance issues. I do think that is a larger factor than people want to think. I personally don't think it's too much of a reach to say that a crowd of 24000 might be 20000 now due to the perceived "danger" of Baltimore, racial divide/issues, riots of 2015 and other similar issues. I think the amount of people staying away because of these things is a significantly larger % than most of us want to believe.

What about the fans in Boston and other cities that draw good? I don't believe you can use the riots as an excuse.

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I agree with you for the most part. And I am not saying that is the only issue at hand here. As I said in a previous post, it's just part of the equation. I can tell you this, it's hard to have an in depth conversation about the Orioles with a lot people in my age group because they just don't care. The conversations never make it much past Manny Machado, Adam Jones and Chris Davis, seemingly because they don't know much else.

I love this team as much as the next diehard Orioles fan, and I long for the days of 40k+ in Camden Yards every night. And yes, fans should show up and support the team, but let's not pretend that the Orioles didn't exacerbate the situation some.

People who post here are the top, I don't know, 5% of the fanbase in dedication or knowledge. Nine out of 10 people in the stands on any given night of any age couldn't tell you who Christian Walker or Oliver Drake is. The sum total of their answer to "how did Duquette do this offseason?" is whether or not they're in the playoff race. Most fans are like my wife, who hasn't the slightest idea who Hyun Soo Kim is, and can't understand why they didn't sign Nick Markakis because he was a great guy.

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I think this part of your post wraps up some of the issues among some fans: Seeing a pretty common tactic to sell season tickets as strong-arming. When I was 26 and wanted playoff tickets I found a scalper. And the idea that if they didn't do thing like signing a 35-year-old Nelson Cruz to a long contract that's "mailing it in." In three years Duquette signed Cruz, Travis Snider, and Trumbo to fill similar holes. Two worked, one not so much. The not so much is portrayed as some kind of mini-treason to the fanbase.

When the Cardinals didn't sign Pujols and filled his roster spot with Mark Reynolds did the season ticket base revolt? Or was it business as usual?

I would imagine it was business as usual.

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I watch EVERY single game on TV and record the ones I dont see live. I know this has been beaten to death but Ill say it again, the Orioles in a crucial series against the Red Sox, indeed, the second to last home series this season should NOT be outdrawn or out energized by the Red Sox fans.This has been an issue for years.

I hear all kind of excuses about week night, school night games,even cost of tickets and parking, but I look at other cities like Boston and here in Los Angeles and the place is packed and rocking.The Dodgers had 57,000 screaming fans in their come from behind win over the Giants last night.

I love Baltimeore the city, and the team, and it just boggles my mind to think the fans cant support their team the way they should be.To be out energized from another fan base is inexcusable.

Maybe the 27 Yankees wouldnt have beaten Porcello last night, but the fans in NY wouldve been there backing their team.

I am embarrased for the great and wonderful city of Baltimore and the team that I love.

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I think this part of your post wraps up some of the issues among some fans: Seeing a pretty common tactic to sell season tickets as strong-arming. When I was 26 and wanted playoff tickets I found a scalper. And the idea that if they didn't do thing like signing a 35-year-old Nelson Cruz to a long contract that's "mailing it in." In three years Duquette signed Cruz, Travis Snider, and Trumbo to fill similar holes. Two worked, one not so much. The not so much is portrayed as some kind of mini-treason to the fanbase.

When the Cardinals didn't sign Pujols and filled his roster spot with Mark Reynolds did the season ticket base revolt? Or was it business as usual?

Snider was an obvious major downgrade from Cruz. Snider is an obvious downgrade from Trumbo as well. We had a real contender in 2014 and then subtracted from it - teams should build on good foundations, not take from it. Especially when they have 14 straight years of ineptness to make up for.

And you can't compare the Cardinals to the Orioles. The Cardinals are perennial contenders. The Cardinals organization deserves a lot more rope than the Orioles organization.

Edited by Es4M11

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People who post here are the top, I don't know, 5% of the fanbase in dedication or knowledge. Nine out of 10 people in the stands on any given night of any age couldn't tell you who Christian Walker or Oliver Drake is. The sum total of their answer to "how did Duquette do this offseason?" is whether or not they're in the playoff race. Most fans are like my wife, who hasn't the slightest idea who Hyun Soo Kim is, and can't understand why they didn't sign Nick Markakis because he was a great guy.

I understand this. Still, I think you underestimate the lack of care for this team among younger fans.

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