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Todd-O

Will the fans show?

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To restock OUR farm. Not hyperbole at all. Especially without the international market that the Red Sox exploited to penalty.

Well that is assuming we keep the same scouting apparatus in place. I for one, think we can and should do better. I would not be opposed to cleaning house in the minors/scouting department.

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Who is responsible for this apathy? The fans? The club?

This is the key. We always talk about how baseball is a business, well...attendance and revenue streams are where it's "a business" more than anywhere else. To me, this has to do with a number of factors, but from my vantage point this is an issue with marketing and poor pricing strategy. These are things that the club can control, the economic environment and the civil unrest aren't things they can change. They need to adapt to the market they are in and act accordingly.

Honestly, while pricing structure plays a role, the bigger thing is marketing. The team didn't do much differently in marketing in 2012 and 2014, but they didn't have to, the team did it for them. Those teams surprised and surged to the finish line, the 2016 team was in first place most of the year and has stumbled a bit into the position they're in now. It's momentum and that has something to say in the game and in the attendance. That's what leads to the apathy. Lets see the Orioles win three in a row against Boston and bring themselves within a game of first. That, if leveraged correctly in the market by the O's, could be just what's need to pump up the excitement once again.

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I'm in the music business on a small scale, and not necessarily successful, but I get by (mainly due to a very supportive wife these days after being a bachelor 53 years). I don't know if the comparison beyond music and baseball being entertainment will fly here, but here's an attempt. I do know that when audiences get bigger for a musician, the extra people at shows, the new people, are curiosity seekers, those with not that deep a knowledge about the artist and they're there because the act is finally on the radar of people far afield. Maybe they got some air play on NPR, college radio or got some big write-up somewhere or are getting regional coverage in indie magazines (even if it's an ad the artist or small label paid for). There are no guarantees of any of this adding up to more attendance, but these are the factors that help when throwing everything at the wall. Just being good doesn't translate into attendance or CD sales. I know of scores of worthy artists who can't break through for whatever reason, but it's not due to the quality of the "product". So much of it has to do with marketing. Too many can't afford it.

As for the O's, the ones not showing up are the casual fans that could fill the extra 20,000 seats. While as a baseball fan, I think it's extraordinary that the O's are still in the race with a bit of a chance at the AL East title (with better chances for a Wild Card slot). To get these local people off the couch on a weeknight, it's a tall order from what I'm reading here. It shouldn't be. I think a lot of these folks wait for the weekends, apparently and watch on MASN during the week. I'm in NC and it bums me out that the Red Sox midweek series is underselling. But I think the premium prices or lack of promos or deals for these kinds of games is part of the reason why the casual fans are staying away. The target audience isn't being reached, perhaps? To the 5% of the most informed fans like us, we don't need an incentive and know how to get good seats for decent prices, but probably folks with kids can't make it a family outing like on the weekends. It's likely two buddies going to games on weeknights. I know if we were up there, it would be probably me and a friend or me and one of the kids, not all of us. Reaching out to the college age or single folks, or downtown employees / dwellers who have more disposable income may be a good strategy for week nights. Wasn't there something like this in recent years with a college ID?

I keep asking my wife if she can find a university librarian job in MD like she has at UNC. We'd have a 29 game plan easily. We still make about 6 to 8 games a year driving up from our home in Durham NC. We'd triple that if we were up to an hour away. We spent our honeymoon there for opening week in 2015 as some of you read me mentioned several times.

I think the marketing angle comes down to reaching out to the casual fans to why they should leave the couch, HD-TV/MASN and be there in person. We here on OH are the choir and we know the importance of these games and going to support them.

Edited by NashLumber

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This is the key. We always talk about how baseball is a business, well...attendance and revenue streams are where it's "a business" more than anywhere else. To me, this has to do with a number of factors, but from my vantage point this is an issue with marketing and poor pricing strategy. These are things that the club can control, the economic environment and the civil unrest aren't things they can change. They need to adapt to the market they are in and act accordingly.

Honestly, while pricing structure plays a role, the bigger thing is marketing. The team didn't do much differently in marketing in 2012 and 2014, but they didn't have to, the team did it for them. Those teams surprised and surged to the finish line, the 2016 team was in first place most of the year and has stumbled a bit into the position they're in now. It's momentum and that has something to say in the game and in the attendance. That's what leads to the apathy. Lets see the Orioles win three in a row against Boston and bring themselves within a game of first. That, if leveraged correctly in the market by the O's, could be just what's need to pump up the excitement once again.

But they did market better. 2012 had "Turn back the clock'. They had holiday four packs and summer six packs.

Summers in Birdland are not complete without watching the O's play at Oriole Park at Camden Yards. The season is starting to heat up! Don't miss the chance to support your hometown team and show your Birdland pride.

With the Birdland Summer 6-Pack, choose any six remaining home games and save up to 20% off the cost of individual game prices.

This is your chance to help fill the park with Orioles fans and secure tickets to some of our popular giveaway dates, so don't delay! Click the button below to choose the six games and locations you want for your Birdland 6-Pack.

http://www.splicetoday.com/sports/orioles-turn-back-the-clock-on-ticket-prices

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I'm in the music business on a small scale, and not necessarily successful, but I get by (mainly due to a very supportive wife these days after being a bachelor 53 years). I don't know if the comparison beyond music and baseball being entertainment will fly here, but here's an attempt. I do know that when audiences get bigger for a musician, the extra people at shows, the new people, are curiosity seekers, those with not that deep a knowledge about the artist and they're there because the act is finally on the radar of people far afield. Maybe they got some air play on NPR, college radio or got some big write-up somewhere or are getting regional coverage in indie magazines (even if it's an ad the artist or small label paid for). There are no guarantees of any of this adding up to more attendance, but these are the factors that help when throwing everything at the wall. Just being good doesn't translate into attendance or CD sales. I know of scores of worthy artists who can't break through for whatever reason, but it's not due to the quality of the "product". So much of it has to do with marketing. Too many can't afford it.

As for the O's, the ones not showing up are the casual fans that could fill the extra 20,000 seats. While as a baseball fan, I think it's extraordinary that the O's are still in the race with a bit of a chance at the AL East title (with better chances for a Wild Card slot). To get these local people off the couch on a weeknight, it's a tall order from what I'm reading here. It shouldn't be. I think a lot of these folks wait for the weekends, apparently and watch on MASN during the week. I'm in NC and it bums me out that the Red Sox midweek series is underselling. But I think the premium prices or lack of promos or deals for these kinds of games is part of the reason why the casual fans are staying away. The target audience isn't being reached, perhaps? To the 5% of the most informed fans like us, we don't need an incentive and know how to get good seats for descents prices, but probably folks with kids can't make it a family outing like on the weekends. It's likely two buddies going to games on weeknights. I know if we were up there, it would be probably me and a friend or me and one of the kids, not all of us. Reaching out to the college age or single folks, or downtown employees / dwellers who have more disposable income may be a good strategy for week nights. Wasn't there something like this in recent years with a college ID?

I keep asking my wife if she can find a university librarian job in MD like she has at UNC. We'd have a 29 game plan easily. We still make about 6 to 8 games a year driving up from our home in Durham NC. We'd triple that if we were up to an hour away. We spent our honeymoon there for opening week in 2015 as some of you read me mentioned several times.

I think the marketing angle comes down to reaching out to the casual fans to why they should leave the couch, HD-TV/MASN and be there in person. We here on OH are the choir and we know the importance of these games and going to support them.

They have Friday student night. $7.00 tickets. Hopkins and other businesses can get discount tickets anytime.

http://hopkinsworklife.org/discounts/sports_fitness/sports/

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But they did market better. 2012 had "Turn back the clock'. They had holiday four packs and summer six packs.

Summers in Birdland are not complete without watching the O's play at Oriole Park at Camden Yards. The season is starting to heat up! Don't miss the chance to support your hometown team and show your Birdland pride.

With the Birdland Summer 6-Pack, choose any six remaining home games and save up to 20% off the cost of individual game prices.

This is your chance to help fill the park with Orioles fans and secure tickets to some of our popular giveaway dates, so don't delay! Click the button below to choose the six games and locations you want for your Birdland 6-Pack.

http://www.splicetoday.com/sports/orioles-turn-back-the-clock-on-ticket-prices

I agree, and I remember those. That's 2012. What compares to that now? They also had the statue nights (I was there for the Brooks one on 9/28/12).

Edited by NashLumber

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You can come up with any excuse you want. Ive heard them all. Theres only one answer.Its spelled A-P-A-T-H-Y.

Sure, there are a ton more imporant things than baseball. Baltimore has issues, all cities do, but in my opinion, when theres a crucial series people from the city should pack the place. The fact that the opposing teams fans come from hundreds of miles away and fill the home teams seats is appalling to me.

You're acting like this is something new.

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They have Friday student night. $7.00 tickets. Hopkins and other businesses can get discount tickets anytime.

http://hopkinsworklife.org/discounts/sports_fitness/sports/

That's good. With week nights not being an option for me living 300 miles away and having kid carpool duty on week days, this is good to know they have this for week nights and locals.

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I was in Cleveland for a business trip a few weeks ago, and was pretty happy that I was going to be able to catch a game or two at Progressive Field when I was in town. I was pretty impressed with the stadium, it was a nice place and it had a lot of things I really liked. But I was stunned at how few people were there. The weather was pretty perfect, the games were good, and they barely had 10K announced attendance.

I know this is not a disappointing attendance contest, but I've been to Camden Yards five times this year I think, and it was not nearly as bad as it is in Cleveland. I was very surprised.

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You can come up with any excuse you want. Ive heard them all. Theres only one answer.Its spelled A-P-A-T-H-Y.

Sure, there are a ton more imporant things than baseball. Baltimore has issues, all cities do, but in my opinion, when theres a crucial series people from the city should pack the place. The fact that the opposing teams fans come from hundreds of miles away and fill the home teams seats is appalling to me.

It's spelled R-U-S-T B-E-L-T. Baltimore, Cleveland, Pittsburgh are historically blue collar towns that have much smaller populations than LA, NY, BOS, DAL. They do not have high enough concentrations of wealth to produce 35,000 people per day with disposable income for baseball games. Add to this that the Orioles have been basically a .500 team for half the year and if you go to one of these Bos. games you will be shouted down by LOCAL Bos. fans (watching their team win) - what they hell do you want them to do? They care, they watch on TV and listen on the radio, but many of them just won't pull out their wallets unless there is a giveaway, because that money is hard to come by and they like getting something tangible in return for it. It's not like they work for companies with season tickets anymore like in earlier years. People that are not from around here just don't understand the realities of life in the rust belt in 2016 (not 1996). I am fortunate enough to be able to afford to go to games and I do, but it is just not that easy anymore for people of a certain income level in this area, Maryland is an expensive place to live. One day when old man Potter kicks, the boys will sell the team to the highest bidder and then the new owner will move the team to Nashville, or Montreal, or Havana. And then all will be well again on MLB broadcasts and no one will need to feel embarrassed for dirty, crumbling, crime ridden Baltimore anymore.

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I meant this year. That's 2012. What compares to that now? They also had the statue nights (I was there for the Brooks one on 9/28/12).

I was responding to the person who said they did not market different in 2012 ans 2014. I agree with you about this year. Camden yards will be 25 next year. Hopefully they have good promotions.. Something like 25 year old ticket prices. Bobbleheads of different great moments at Camden Yards. A 25 year reunion and like an Old Timers Day.

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I was responding to the person who said they did not market different in 2012 ans 2014. I agree with you about this year. Camden yards will be 25 next year. Hopefully they have good promotions.. Something like 25 year old ticket prices. Bobbleheads of different great moments at Camden Yards. A 25 year reunion and like an Old Timers Day.

I'd like to see an Andino throwback bobblehead beating the Sox in game 162. And maybe a Kevin Gregg bobblehead giving (or trying ) to connect with a right to Papi's dome.

Yeah, realized later that you were addressing the other post. I corrected it in my edit, but our posts crossed.

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It's spelled R-U-S-T B-E-L-T. Baltimore, Cleveland, Pittsburgh are historically blue collar towns that have much smaller populations than LA, NY, BOS, DAL. They do not have high enough concentrations of wealth to produce 35,000 people per day with disposable income for baseball games. Add to this that the Orioles have been basically a .500 team for half the year and if you go to one of these Bos. games you will be shouted down by LOCAL Bos. fans (watching their team win) - what they hell do you want them to do? They care, they watch on TV and listen on the radio, but many of them just won't pull out their wallets unless there is a giveaway, because that money is hard to come by and they like getting something tangible in return for it. It's not like they work for companies with season tickets anymore like in earlier years. People that are not from around here just don't understand the realities of life in the rust belt in 2016 (not 1996). I am fortunate enough to be able to afford to go to games and I do, but it is just not that easy anymore for people of a certain income level in this area, Maryland is an expensive place to live. One day when old man Potter kicks, the boys will sell the team to the highest bidder and then the new owner will move the team to Nashville, or Montreal, or Havana. And then all will be well again on MLB broadcasts and no one will need to feel embarrassed for dirty, crumbling, crime ridden Baltimore anymore.

Milwaukee and St Louis are drawing well. Milwaukee and St . Louis are not exactly wealth capitals. i know St . Louis is probably the best baseball town in the country and draws from all over. Philly when winning had the highest attendance and now will not even draw 2,000,000. Seattle with the wealth is drawing 1,000 fans more then the Orioles.

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    • Frankly I don’t remember reading a single negative thing about his personality or any clubhouse issues during his stint with the Orioles.    I don’t see that as a risk at all.   We’re talking about bringing a guy in on a minor league deal to compete for a spot held by Stevie (.669 OPS, -0.8 rWAR) Wilkerson and for which Richard Urena also will compete.    It’s not like we’re expecting him to be a starting infielder, or paying him millions of dollars, or using a spot on our 40-man roster until such time, if any, as he makes the major league team.   It’s simply not a very big deal.      
    • I'm unconvinced.  He's taking one year's worth of data and not really doing any comparisons to anyone else.  He's inferring from the fact that the 2018 Red Sox hit well with runners on second that the entire sign stealing scheme was worth 50 runs.  That's a stretch.  Teams have varying performances in splits every single year.  From '11-14 the Orioles had a mid-700s OPS with runners on 2nd.  From '15-17 they were in the mid-800s.  Did they have a sign stealing scheme going starting in '15? What he should do is look at 10 years of data across all teams in the league and see if the 2018 Red Sox' variation in performance is a big outlier or unremarkable.  
    • There are plenty of athletes/high draft picks that never ban out. There's also a very fine line between confidence and arrogance. The Beckham quotes I've read paint him an arrogant ego maniac and "me first" type of player. Also, let's not forget his was also suspended for 50 games in 2012 for testing positive for marijuana. Why would we want to bring that kind of mojo into our clubhouse? 
    • If you swing at balls in the dirt and take pitches right down the middle , then this has to be one of the few cases where size does not in fact matter. 
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