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DFA Ubaldo

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2 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

Well it's that or let him keep pitching in some form or another. I guess you could stick him in the pen and only use him in mop up scenarios, but if he's that bad, why not just let him go? He's going to get paid this year no matter what. It's his last year. End it.

And face the prospect of him going to another team and them fixing him?  Oh noes!

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13 hours ago, bpilktree said:

Let's see when Ynoa goes into the rotation in Norfolk.  If he starts on Thursday that would put him in the spot to take over for Ubaldo

He can't be brought until June 1, right?

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I'm on the bandwagon now too.

It is time to DFA him.   He is not even an adequate bullpen piece, and he can't be allowed to start.   It's a sunk cost at this point.

I see no reason why some combination of Ynoa/Asher/Aquino/Verrett could not put up stats better than Ubaldo.   Worst case not a lot better, but at least a little better.   And it's not like putting one of them in the rotation cripples the bullpen, since we have rarely had more than one of them on the roster at the same time anyway.

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29 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

And face the prospect of him going to another team and them fixing him?  Oh noes!

At this point I'd have to imagine its the "principle" of the thing for Angelos. I don't even know that ownership would be worried about someone "fixing" Ubaldo - they just don't want to pay him to pitch for another team, no matter how detrimental he is to the O's proper.

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9 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

At this point I'd have to imagine its the "principle" of the thing for Angelos. I don't even know that ownership would be worried about someone "fixing" Ubaldo - they just don't want to pay him to pitch for another team, no matter how detrimental he is to the O's proper.

I don't know if it's true, but they were saying on 105.7 this morning that at one point LAST YEAR, Duquette was given permission by Angelos to DFA Ubaldo if he deemed it absolutely necessary, and Angelos would, reluctantly, eat the year+ left on his contract.   I think it was close enough to roster expansion that Duquette didn't do that.

But I really don't think Angelos would stop it at this point if Duquette told him it was the best baseball move and that it would help this team maintain its current position in the playoff race.

I think last night was the final nail in the coffin.   I think we might finally cut ties.

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8 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

At this point I'd have to imagine its the "principle" of the thing for Angelos. I don't even know that ownership would be worried about someone "fixing" Ubaldo - they just don't want to pay him to pitch for another team, no matter how detrimental he is to the O's proper.

Seems one way of looking at it is paying the rest of his contract no matter where he lands is "doing no harm" to the O's. Having him on the team is doing considerable harm to the games' outcomes and the bullpen for the very same price. When he's gone, we don't have that problem and either (or both) of Asher or Verrett can at the very least get us five innings and five runs or less. That's Ubaldo's baseline (and actually, I think it's more than five runs these days). It's got to be worth a try than doing what the O's have already tried. 

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Instead of a DFA, I would rather trade him to an NL team in exchange for small cash considerations or a PTBNL.  I don't want him staying in the AL, just in case he gets better and helps a WC contender (like he helped us make the WC last year in September).  

But yes, I do think it's time to fold on Ubaldo.  

But we probably won't do anything until June as we an skip his next start.  

If he stays on our roster until July 1, we're probably stuck with him, because after that we'll hear the "but we're only X weeks away from rosters expanding" excuse from the FO.  

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3 minutes ago, FanSince88 said:

Instead of a DFA, I would rather trade him to an NL team in exchange for small cash considerations or a PTBNL.  I don't want him staying in the AL, just in case he gets better and helps a WC contender (like he helped us make the WC last year in September).  

But yes, I do think it's time to fold on Ubaldo.  

But we probably won't do anything until June as we an skip his next start.  

If he stays on our roster until July 1, we're probably stuck with him, because after that we'll hear the "but we're only X weeks away from rosters expanding" excuse from the FO.  

How would you react if you found out your GM just traded money to the Orioles to obtain Ubaldo?

He's got negative value, like Webb and Matusz did.

 

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12 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

How would you react if you found out your GM just traded money to the Orioles to obtain Ubaldo?

He's got negative value, like Webb and Matusz did.

 

And that's an important point....I want to be rid of Ubaldo, but I'm concerned we may see a trade where we send Ubaldo, his entire remaining contract, and a useful prospect to a team for nothing.  That team will essentially be buying that prospect (or, say, a draft pick) by eating Ubaldo's salary. 

I unfortunately think this may be the mostly likely way that we get rid of Ubaldo.  Which would be ironic and depressing because he'd still be screwing us even as we offload him...

 

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20 minutes ago, FanSince88 said:

Instead of a DFA, I would rather trade him to an NL team in exchange for small cash considerations or a PTBNL.  I don't want him staying in the AL, just in case he gets better and helps a WC contender (like he helped us make the WC last year in September).  

But yes, I do think it's time to fold on Ubaldo.  

But we probably won't do anything until June as we an skip his next start.  

If he stays on our roster until July 1, we're probably stuck with him, because after that we'll hear the "but we're only X weeks away from rosters expanding" excuse from the FO.  

What CoC said. I can't even imagine an NL team with a spot on their immediate roster for Ubaldo right now. He has below zero value. 

A team would certainly give him a look if he was out and out released and they could bring him into whatever kind of deal they wanted (since he's getting paid by the O's anyway), but that's it. No one is trading for him.

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1 minute ago, ReclaimTheCrown said:

And that's an important point....I want to be rid of Ubaldo, but I'm concerned we may see a trade where we send Ubaldo, his entire remaining contract, and a useful prospect to a team for nothing.  That team will essentially be buying that prospect (or, say, a draft pick) by eating Ubaldo's salary. 

I unfortunately think this may be the mostly likely way that we get rid of Ubaldo.  Which would be ironic and depressing because he'd still be screwing us even as we offload him...

 

If the O's are desperate to save what's left on his contract (which diminishes with each passing day, mind you, as the O's are actively paying him), then I guess that's plausible. I don't see it being likely, however, as the O's have too few prospects as it is and DD will probably have to part with a few if the team needs to make moves before July 31.

Just release the guy and cut losses.

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1 minute ago, ReclaimTheCrown said:

And that's an important point....I want to be rid of Ubaldo, but I'm concerned we may see a trade where we send Ubaldo, his entire remaining contract, and a useful prospect to a team for nothing.  That team will essentially be buying that prospect (or, say, a draft pick) by eating Ubaldo's salary. 

I unfortunately think this may be the mostly likely way that we get rid of Ubaldo.  Which would be ironic and depressing because he'd still be screwing us even as we offload him...

 

This is why I am in favor of DFA or an "arm injury" that lands Ubaldo on the disabled list.  I don't want the O's to give up a decent prospect just to get out of paying Ubaldo another $9M.  

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Last year, Ubaldo started out with 3 good games in his first 6 starts, then was even worse than he's been this year all the way *through July 8th*, after which he was DL'd with an ERA of 7.38 (currently 7.17). He came back with a 5-inning, one-run performance on July 28 and pitched remarkably well the rest of the season all the way up to Buck's stupid late-inning decisions in the tie-breaker game. He put in a good 2014.

Unfortunately, Ubaldo's a bad bet for high-leverage relieving because of his wildness, first-inning problems, and what would probably be a poor inherited-runners stranded percentage. So he's a mop-up long reliever and spot starter. Considering how shaky the rest of the rotation is going to be, I think there'll be enough opportunities to justify keeping him until we see if he can pull off yet another post-ASB comeback (he's done it several times in his career).

Or package him with Kim in a trade, one of my favorite players, but a wasted spot on our poorly constructed roster and someone who would become even more redundant if Buck insists on Bourn.

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34 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

If the O's are desperate to save what's left on his contract (which diminishes with each passing day, mind you, as the O's are actively paying him), then I guess that's plausible. I don't see it being likely, however, as the O's have too few prospects as it is and DD will probably have to part with a few if the team needs to make moves before July 31.

Just release the guy and cut losses.

I agree with you, and hope that's the direction we take.  I'm just concerned that, depending on how miserly Angelos is feeling, that there may be pressure to jump at a chance to save some of that sunk money in exchange for something of value.  As CoC stated, we did it with Matusz and Webb; wouldn't be at all surprised to see us do it with UJ.

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