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Aristotelian

OH Challenge: Retool and Compete in One Year

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1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

And the physical.

Yep, and even that free agent starter -- Gallardo -- did end up signing with the O's, unfortunately.  

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46 minutes ago, weams said:

Can't be done. You need the five years of drafting real high. 

Yankees and Red Sox have both done it much faster than that. They have signed some guys but more importantly they got talent back in trades.

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11 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

Yankees and Red Sox have both done it much faster than that. They have signed some guys but more importantly they got talent back in trades.

They signed guys to trade. Both internationally and domestically and spent BIG money that this franchise already wasted. So sad. 

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11 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

Yankees and Red Sox have both done it much faster than that. They have signed some guys but more importantly they got talent back in trades.

Like I said. Can't be done. In Baltimore. You can maybe ride the wave a bit more. Or just rebuild. The right way. Not this buying and selling stuff.  Get the payroll down to 38 Million like the Astros. Or 62 like the Cubs. 

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6 minutes ago, weams said:

They signed guys to trade. Both internationally and domestically and spent BIG money that this franchise already wasted. So sad. 

 

 

6 minutes ago, weams said:

Like I said. Can't be done. In Baltimore. You can maybe ride the wave a bit more. Or just rebuild. The right way. Not this buying and selling stuff.  Get the payroll down to 38 Million like the Astros. Or 62 like the Cubs. 

I don't think their intention was to trade the guys that they signed. For what it's worth, despite his struggles, Trumbo's OPS this year is better than Cespedes the year that Boston traded him for Porcello. 

I agree, deep and painful rebuild is the long term answer, but I don't see that happening until July 2018 at the earliest. That is when the GM's contract is up, and the time we would trade Machado, QO Jones, etc.

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Trade Machado, Smith, and Kim.  I've looking for 4-5 top 20 prospects in return from some teams farm system for Machado, and a couple of them will be from their top 5.  Smith and Kim might each net a low level reliever type that might contribute to the 'pen in a year or so, and that's okay.

1B:  Davis

2B:  Schoop

SS:  Ruben Tejada or equivalent light hitting, solid defense SS (Alcides Escobar ?)

3B:  Sign Moustakas (preferred) or Frazier.  They have money to do this with Machado, Ubaldo, etc. coming off the books.  Worst case we end up with someone like Danny Valencia (ugh)

C:  Castillo (either he selects his option, or they negotiate an extension.  I'm bearish on Sisco).

LF:  Mancini

CF:  Low-Mid priced FA OR a prospect obtained in the Machado deal.  Lorenzo Cain is probably too expensive, but maybe Jarrod Dyson? 

RF: Jones

DH:  Trumbo

SP1:  Gausman

SP2:  Bundy

SP3:  Reasonably priced FA.  Maybe Alex Cobb, Jeremy Hellickson?

SP4:  Tillman on a 1 year deal?  Asher?  Mike Wright?

SP5:  Prospect obtained in Machado deal

Closer:  Britton

Setup:  Brach

MR: O'Day

MR: Givens

MR:  Bleier?

MR:  Asher?  Wright?

MR:  Hart?

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1 hour ago, esmd said:

Trade Machado, Smith, and Kim.  I've looking for 4-5 top 20 prospects in return from some teams farm system for Machado, and a couple of them will be from their top 5.  Smith and Kim might each net a low level reliever type that might contribute to the 'pen in a year or so, and that's okay.

 

The premise here is that we are aiming to retool and compete in 2018. I don't think you can trade Manny and leave two holes in our prime infield positions to fill with prospects.

Best I can come up with is we see what we can get for Smith, Kim, Trumbo, and Brach, and bring in two of Cobb, Estrada, and Darvish. 

Probably not enough to make us a 100 win team, but could be enough to give us a shot at a wild card, which seems to be the organization's current approach. 

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1 hour ago, Aristotelian said:

The premise here is that we are aiming to retool and compete in 2018. I don't think you can trade Manny and leave two holes in our prime infield positions to fill with prospects.

Best I can come up with is we see what we can get for Smith, Kim, Trumbo, and Brach, and bring in two of Cobb, Estrada, and Darvish. 

Probably not enough to make us a 100 win team, but could be enough to give us a shot at a wild card, which seems to be the organization's current approach. 

I'm not.  I'm replacing Manny with Moustakas, and Hardy with Tejada or another glove guy with no bat.  Moustakas isn't the player Manny is, but he's not a bad option to plug in there.  The issue really, is pitching.  If they can get a top prospect back for Manny that can hold a rotation spot, they would need to sign a couple of starters.  Cobb and someone like Hellickson may be enough if Bundy and Gausman pitch well, and the bullpen returns to it's dominant self anchored by Britton.

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If you want to compete next year you have to keep Machado.  If you keep Machado and are competitive next year then you don't trade him at all.  If you don't trade Machado at all you lose him to free agency.  If you lose Machado to free agency I don't care what the rest of a logical roster looks like, you are screwed.

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20 minutes ago, esmd said:

I'm not.  I'm replacing Manny with Moustakas, and Hardy with Tejada or another glove guy with no bat.  Moustakas isn't the player Manny is, but he's not a bad option to plug in there.  The issue really, is pitching.  If they can get a top prospect back for Manny that can hold a rotation spot, they would need to sign a couple of starters.  Cobb and someone like Hellickson may be enough if Bundy and Gausman pitch well, and the bullpen returns to it's dominant self anchored by Britton.

I would not consider Moustakas if he wants anywhere close to Panda years and dollars. I don't think Mousse is going to age well.

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