Jump to content
OsandBohs11

George...COME ON

Recommended Posts

I think we're on the same page, it's hard to argue with the point you're making.

I just don't understand why if Ramon has such a bad reputation in this area, that pitchers don't shake him off more?

Ever notice Jeremy Guthrie with Ramon?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You won't get a blast from me. If Loewen is ineffective, they might want to consider using Sherrill against the tough lefties again or in the Jamie Walker role. Johnson can close for me right now, but the problem is replacing Johnson as the main setup guy. Maybe Sherrill can take that role but right now, I don't want him facing a tough right-hander.

Disagree...Give Sherrill the next 3-4 games off...Let him rest his arm.

After that, he needs to close and keep his value up for the deadline.

Then you trade him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree that Sherrill gets part of the blame, but Hernandez can't possibly think a third straight slider in the exact same spot is a good idea. Not only is it not a good idea anytime, but especially after Sherrill just gave up a home run the previous day on the same pitch in the same location.

A catcher's job is to understand the flow of the game, the hitter, the pitcher, and the situation. A could find about thousand high school catchers who are smarter than to call that pitch in that location. If Sherrill misses on a low inside slider to a right-handed batter he's got a good chance of doing exactly what he just did.

Was it a bad pitch by Sherrill, sure. Is Sherrill pretty darn stupid for not shaking him off, absolutely, but Hernandez just cemented his reputation as a poor pitch caller.

Agree 100%, but doesn't that assume that Ramon was responsible for where Sherrill threw the pitch? Maybe the plan was to put a slider in the dirt, and Sherrill just didn't execute the pitch? :noidea:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Utterly idiotic pitch selection and placement by Ramon Hernandez. As soon as I saw him go down and in I was like, "No way!"

Sherrill throws two sliders down and in and had guys swinging through high fastballs all day. Olivio is a pull hitter. A Single-A moron catcher knows to call the fastball away after the first two pitches.

Yes, George Sherrill shares the blame for not being smart enough to shake off a ridiculous pitch selection. But I repeat, this is the exact reason why a lot of pitchers don't like being caught by Ramon. His stupid pitch selections are part of his legacy and this one just blew the second straight game.

Tony, I completely agree. I place most of the blame on Ramon. He has got to be smart enough to call a good game, especially in a crucial situation such as this. I pull for all Oriole players, but it has been a long time since I have been as frustrated in someone as much as I am in Ramon this year. Weiters can't make it to the big show fast enough in my opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree that Sherrill gets part of the blame, but Hernandez can't possibly think a third straight slider in the exact same spot is a good idea. Not only is it not a good idea anytime, but especially after Sherrill just gave up a home run the previous day on the same pitch in the same location.

A catcher's job is to understand the flow of the game, the hitter, the pitcher, and the situation. A could find about thousand high school catchers who are smarter than to call that pitch in that location. If Sherrill misses on a low inside slider to a right-handed batter he's got a good chance of doing exactly what he just did.

Was it a bad pitch by Sherrill, sure. Is Sherrill pretty darn stupid for not shaking him off, absolutely, but Hernandez just cemented his reputation as a poor pitch caller.

I don't have a problem with the pitch selection. I wasn't paying that close attention but did Ramon give a location? A slider is meant to appear like a fastball. If he throws it in the dirt he could possibly get the hitter thinking Fastball and swing.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As far as kicking Sherrill out of the closers role, I don't really think that is necessary yet. Stuff wise, I think he is still has good now as he has been all year. He just has made a couple of bone headed mistakes lately. IMO, his problem has not been with his "stuff", it has been with pitch selection.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Bedard didn't seem to have a problem with Ramon's game calling last season...

He did shake him off quiet a bit early in the season.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shaking off a catcher conveys information to the hitter so this isn't some minor thing to have to constantly "correct" the catcher.

Throwing a slider isn't as easy as you're making it sound here. The pitch is not particularly easy to control in the best of times, let alone in the wet weather of the 9th. Obviously, he was trying to throw it down and in about shoe high.

I have never ascribed to this theory. Suppose, as many are claiming in this thread, that the wrong pitch to throw is a third straight curve. Why would the hitter think that the first finger Ramon drops is 2?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't have a problem with the pitch selection. I wasn't paying that close attention but did Ramon give a location? A slider is meant to appear like a fastball. If he throws it in the dirt he could possibly get the hitter thinking Fastball and swing.

No offense, but if you are going to disagree with me, perhaps you should be freakin' paying close attention. :rolleyes:

Sometimes I think you just try to follow me around and disagree for the sake of disagreeing. in this caase, you just make yourself looking foolish by saying you didn't have a problem with pitch selection (thus disagreeing with my main point), the go about saying you weren't really paying attention and then ask if Ramon gave a location?

Goodness gracious, buy a clue before you post. :eektf::eektf:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have never ascribed to this theory. Suppose, as many are claiming in this thread, that the wrong pitch to throw is a third straight curve. Why would the hitter think that the first finger Ramon drops is 2?

From my playing days there is a better chance a fastball is coming if a pitcher shakes off the pitch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's Sherrill's job to shake it off if he doesn't like the call. The pitch should have been in the dirt after Olivo swung at two in a row at his ankles and didn't come close to either one. Same thing yesterday BTW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm going to respond before Dempsey gets a chance on the post game show. Tony is right. I called my father up and said what is Ramon doing calling the same pitch three times and setting up inside. I'm sure Olivo could tell where it was going. You can't see the catcher when he moves inside and we know all hitters cheat. Yes...Sherrill should have shook off Ramon or deliberately thrown a down and away pitch.

I said when Ramon hit into the DP with the bases loaded in the 8th we needed that run. Did you see the worried look on DT'S face when Sherrill was pitching with one out....before the HR pitch? I hate to say this but DT is starting to act like some other managers we have had before that insist on going to the closer almost every game. I would have given Sherrill a day off after blowing yesterday's game. No.....DT believes in getting them right back out there so they don't think about it too long. SP our former mgr did the same thing with Ray. How many times did we use Walker against lefties and he gave up homeruns? I believe Walker has given up six to lefties so far and we are only halfway through the season. Pena of the Rays has several off of him.

I thought Dt might let Johnson start the ninth and see what he can do. Did I really think that? No ......I was hoping but knew better. The long foul ball that just missed being a HR in the 8th probably scared him and he decided to go to the well one more time. I hope we still win this game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


Orioles Information


Orioles News and Information

Daily Organizational Boxscores
News

Tony's Takes

Orioles Roster Resource

Orioles Prospect Information

2018 End of Season Top 30 Prospects List

Prospect Scouting Reports

Statistics

2019 Orioles Stats

2019 Orioles Minor League Stats

Baseball Savant Stats






  • Posts

    • I'm curious how you mean that.  Do you mean folks like Moluntcastle and Diaz and are you talking going all out and bringing up Hall, Rodriguez and Adley?
    • To be fair, they are artificially the worst team.  If they let the best 26 play, they would win more games.
    • And you and yours as well!
    • I would prefer they play a normal 10th  or 11th. Then go to the new rule. For those of you who are diehard fans, I suppose this change is blasphemy, but other sports have changed their rules and it makes it more exciting. 4 on 4 hockey is more exciting than 5 on 5. Shoot outs are exciting. I don't like 4 hour games. I imagine players and managers hate long games. Your observation is like a kid seeing a food and says he doesn't like it before he tastes it. This is the non-season to try it, basically a 60 game exhibition schedule, where all stats are basically meaningless. Even the eventual WS winner have an asterisk. It will nice to see them play. In fact the O's may benefit more than normal...give the kids a chance and long look.
    • The 30 year treasury was around 6% in Feb. 2000, so we can consider that the risk free rate. It looks like high quality long term corporate bonds were around 8%, that’s probably more comparable. So this was probably pretty close to a fair deal. 
    • You’re going to eat those words.    
    • Is it wrong to make a choice that will work out in your favor 99% of the time, and there's no way to tell if this particular choice is the 1%? At 33: Carlos Delgado had a 161 OPS+.  Over his last four years of his career he was worth 4.8 wins. Jack Clark had a 148 OPS+.  Three years later he was done. Derrek Lee had a 146 OPS+.  Two years later he was an Oriole... and done. Pedro Guerrero had a 145 OPS+.  The next season would be his last with average batting numbers. Aubrey Huff had a 142 OPS+.  He never had a 100 again. Lance Berkman had a 140 OPS+. He'd have two more pretty good seasons. John Olerud had a 140 OPS+.  After that he played 214 games with a 98 OPS+. Jeff Bagwell had a 140 OPS+.  He actually had three more good years before falling off and retiring. Mike Easler had a 140 OPS+.  He had one more .800 OPS season. Cecil Cooper had a 138 OPS+.  He had one more season where he was an average or better hitter. Don Baylor had a 138 OPS+ (actually at 34).  He had one more season with an .800 OPS. George Hendrick had a 138 OPS+.  He had one more part-time season with an .800 OPS. Andre Thornton had a 123.  He's have one more good year. Adrian Gonzalez had a 130 OPS+.  Since then he's gone .784, .642, .672. Dmitri Young had a 129 OPS+.  The next year would be his last. Then you have Nelson Cruz and David Ortiz at 137.  Cruz has a .928 OPS and been worth 21 wins since leaving Baltimore.  And Ortiz had perhaps the best late career hitting and phone smashing record of all time. Also, remember Cruz was born July 1st, on the cutoff date, so if he'd been born 12 hours later his walk year with the O's would have been his age 34 season, so we'd be comparing him to these guys a year later and a year worse.
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...