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awannabegeek

How do the Orioles become competitive again?

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And given that the Red Sox are on the cusp of winning the World Series yet again, this really does feel like an extremely dark era for Os fans and Os baseball in general.  Strong kudos to all of us who continue to read this board and post on it....we all deserve much better.

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Guest FFmikey

The on the field product will not be competitive for another 3-4 years.  Please, and I stress this, please be patient and do not focus on the on field results for a few years.  The Orioles have an incredible opportunity right now to right all the wrongs in this organization. In years past we were just good enough for the organization to think we could just patch the roster with some free agents and bubble gum to be competitive again.  Luckily we pumped out a horrific season that makes a full tear down obvious.  Houston being forced to switch leagues gave them their opportunity and this is ours.  Before we start talking about player signings we need to start at the top.  Peter Angelos is not dead and is still the owner of the Orioles.  His sons have taken a bigger role but that role and authority needs to be defined before we hire a president.  A fractured ownership will lead to infighting and a continued collapse of the franchise during the upcoming years of on field futility.  If and I stress if ownership is able to figure out who has the last say, we can hire a president and there are many solid candidates out there. Any president would need to focus on analytics, player development, player evaluation.  This is a modern direction but one that may hurt a lot of feelings within this organization. BALTIMORE has a long history of being very loyal to front office employees to a complete fault. An advancement of each of these departments would probably lead to feathers being ruffled or people being fired.  As an organization we need to decide whether we want to be loyal to ineffective employees and practices or be competitive on the field, I don’t think both are possible.  Unfortunately I don’t believe the ownership situation will be cut and dry and I think the in house loyalty is too strong to get away from.  This lack of certainty and full autonomy will discourage most presidential candidates from applying.  I think things will change but not nearly as much as it should and we will squander this great opportunity to fix the franchise.

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It begins with new ownership.

There is no path to competitiveness with the Angelos family in charge.

I do believe(pray) that they are working towards selling the team

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I will always have hope, and hopefully the new management, once hired, will be given some latitude and do a good job.

That said, they will be starting from a deep, deep hole.    Probably the deepest hole that any incoming Orioles management team ever has faced, except when the Browns first moved here from St. Louis.

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1 hour ago, Frobby said:

I will always have hope, and hopefully the new management, once hired, will be given some latitude and do a good job.

That said, they will be starting from a deep, deep hole.    Probably the deepest hole that any incoming Orioles management team ever has faced, except when the Browns first moved here from St. Louis.

Very true.  And a totally different era back in 1954.  The excitement of having a new team, combined with the extremely low expectations that are afforded a new team and an environment with no sports television, internet, or other avenues that allow you to truly see just how flawed you are versus everyone else makes this a much worse situation.  Hell, 1954 wasn't that far removed from an entire nation not even knowing that the President was in a wheelchair.  The people in charge in the warehouse now would love for it to be 1954 again.  In 2018, their absolute incompetence is on full HD display for everyone to see. 

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In all honesty I have no idea how to respond to the question in the title of this thread. Short of completely cleaning house (I'm looking at you Brady) and bringing in a savvy baseball mind to run the show I see no hope for the future of this franchise under the current regime. We are at rock bottom and it's hard to see any sort of light at the end of the tunnel. 

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2 hours ago, webbrick2010 said:

It begins with new ownership.

There is no path to competitiveness with the Angelos family in charge.

I do believe(pray) that they are working towards selling the team

This. I have zero faith in this franchise under anyone named Angelos.

Each year it becomes harder and harder to follow this team. Last season was unwatchable. I didn’t believe for a second that Duq’s statement about investing in the international market, analytics, etc was anything more than blowing smoke.

At this point I’m just holding onto hope that they will sell once Peter passes. Not sure if there is an inheritance tax (wishful thinking) on the O’s or not. If so, maybe that would push the Angelos family towards selling.

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9 hours ago, awannabegeek said:

 

Look at my post history, I'm not a negative guy.  I give the benefit of the doubt. I don't think Angelos is cheap, I do think he's a bad owner but I don't hate him as some do. i can acknowledge the Orioles pitching development is not the best but can recognize Wade Miley's luck driven ERA is not worth getting upset about.  I generally just don't post negative stuff, sports are a fun escape, if it's not fun I don't watch. I definitely don't get upset...with all that said.  

I have no hope for this team.  They had a key opportunity to jump-start a rebuild of their farm system and they've totally botched it. 

No Mesa(s), No Gaston which in turn makes the Gausman trade look horrible. You could squint, look at the international slot money and convince yourself if they signed the Mesa(s), Gaston, and maybe Bonilla it would be worth it. They didn't\haven't but the cherry on top is sending 750k to the Phillies for Zoellner.  Why? Gausman's context neutral\peripherals, age, and control should have fetched someone(s) of significance from a stacked farm system. 

The Machado trade was fine considering he was a pending free agent. Though how they let it get to that point is beyond me.

The Schoop trade looks fine but I don't think Ortiz is a future SP

Britton trade is okay.

How do the Orioles compete moving forward? The Blue Jays farm system is stacked.  The Rays have a limited payroll but have an extremely cheap and talented roster.  The Yankees and Red Sox not only can outspend everyone but they have over the last 5-7 years placed a greater emphasis on analytics and player development. 

The Orioles...have a middling farm system even after the fire sale.  While I do think it may be better than it is given credit for. It's not even close to the Blue Jays, Rays, or Yankees. 

Player development is questionable at best. 

Their analytics department seems antiquated from the outside looking in. 

Regardless of who the owner is, I'm a bit concerned about payroll moving forward. Quite frankly attendance was pretty garbage when they were contending, now it just looks sad. 

Closing in on the end of the WS and no GM or manager -- aside from that why did they even let Duquette trade anyone that wasn't a pending free agent if their intentions were to fire him. 

I've watched them botch the handling of a generational\HOF talent, put a historically bad team on the field, they are not smarter, better at developing talent, nor can they outspend their competition....

I have no hope for this team...I think this team will be bad for a very long time...I do hope I'm wrong.

Oh...and Chris Davis...enough said.

 

If they can get the right people in charge that will help. But yes it will be awhile I'm afraid. 

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3 hours ago, webbrick2010 said:

It begins with new ownership.

There is no path to competitiveness with the Angelos family in charge.

I do believe(pray) that they are working towards selling the team

And when the Angelos sons are still the owners what will you do then?

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1 hour ago, JR Oriole said:

Very true.  And a totally different era back in 1954.  The excitement of having a new team, combined with the extremely low expectations that are afforded a new team and an environment with no sports television, internet, or other avenues that allow you to truly see just how flawed you are versus everyone else makes this a much worse situation.  Hell, 1954 wasn't that far removed from an entire nation not even knowing that the President was in a wheelchair.  The people in charge in the warehouse now would love for it to be 1954 again.  In 2018, their absolute incompetence is on full HD display for everyone to see. 

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