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OFFNY

Peter Tork Died: The Make-Believe Band that Actually Came to Life

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o

 

As Micky Dolenz once stated, "Pinocchio came to life" in regard to the plight of the once artificial band evolving into a real band.

There still seems to be a contingent of people that still believe/presume that the Monkees were a fake band.

Part of the problem is that the Monkees DID start out as a fake band. After their first two albums, they gained their autonomy to play their own instruments on their albums (starting with the Headquarters album in 1967), and went on concert tours by themselves ........ the artificial quartet became an actual band. Additionally, Mike Nesmith wrote "Different Drum" for the Stone Poneys. 

 

As for the late Peter Tork, he and Mike Nesmith were both already hardcore musicians at the time in which they were chosen as two of the 4 members for the new television series. The other two members (Micky Dolenz and Davy Jones) were world-class singers, so the quartet had a solid foundation/basis for their subsequent evolution into a bonafide band. Tork left the group in 1968 after the release of the group's double-platinum Head album, and the band made two additional albums as a trio before the departure of Mike Nesmith finalized the dissolution of the band that fought for (and won) its autonomy from Don Kirshner and company.

 

Tork was 77 years-old.

 

Goodbye, Peter Tork. The Monkees Made Believers of Us All

(By Probyn Gregory)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/goodbye-peter-tork-the-monkees-made-believers-of-us-all/2019/02/22/ccc90c3e-36df-11e9-a400-e481bf264fdc_story.html?utm_term=.97484ca24e72

 

o

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On 2/24/2019 at 11:22 AM, OFFNY said:

o

 

As Micky Dolenz once stated, "Pinocchio came to life" in regard to the plight of the once artificial band evolving into a real band.

 There still seems to be a contingent of people that still believe/presume that the Monkees were a fake band.

Part of the problem is that the Monkees DID start out as a fake band. After their first two albums, they gained their autonomy to play their own instruments on their albums (starting with the Headquarters album in 1967), and went on concert tours by themselves ........ the artificial quartet became an actual band. Additionally, Mike Nesmith wrote "Different Drum" for the Stone Poneys. 

  

As for the late Peter Tork, he and Mike Nesmith were both already hardcore musicians at the time in which they were chosen as two of the 4 members for the new television series. The other two members (Micky Dolenz and Davy Jones) were world-class singers, so the quartet had a solid foundation/basis for their subsequent evolution into a bonafide band. Tork left the group in 1968 after the release of the group's double-platinum Head album, and the band made two additional albums as a trio before the departure of Mike Nesmith finalized the dissolution of the band that fought for (and won) its autonomy from Don Kirshner and company.

 

Tork was 77 years-old.

 

Goodbye, Peter Tork. The Monkees Made Believers of Us All

(By Probyn Gregory)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/goodbye-peter-tork-the-monkees-made-believers-of-us-all/2019/02/22/ccc90c3e-36df-11e9-a400-e481bf264fdc_story.html?utm_term=.97484ca24e72

 

o

All those 60's bands were fake bands then.  The Beach Boys, the Byrds and Mamas and Papas used the same people playing on their albums that the Monkees did.  The problem was when they started playing their own instruments and wanting to record their own songs they weren't as good.   Mickey Dolenz was a great singer.   Davey Jones sang some good songs as well.  

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Also while Peter Tork probably provided the least to the music.  He was the funniest actor of the bunch. 

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5 hours ago, atomic said:

 

All those 60's bands were fake bands then. The Beach Boys, the Byrds and Mamas and Papas used the same people playing on their albums that the Monkees did. The problem was when they started playing their own instruments and wanting to record their own songs they weren't as good.   Mickey Dolenz was a great singer.   Davey Jones sang some good songs as well.  

 

o

 

No they weren't, and I explained extensively how they were not fake.

Unless you were right there in the studio with them and witnessed other people playing their instrument for them while fraudulently crediting themselves for doing so on albums such as Headquarters in 1967 and Justus in 1996, you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

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26 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

No they weren't, and I explained extensively how they were not fake.

Unless you were right there in the studio with them and witnessed other people playing their instrument for them while fraudulently crediting themselves for doing so on albums such as Headquarters in 1967 and Justus in 1996, you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

o

I like how you quoted me but then are not replying to what I said.  

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10 hours ago, atomic said:

 

All those 60's bands were fake bands then.  The Beach Boys, the Byrds and Mamas and Papas used the same people playing on their albums that the Monkees did.  The problem was when they started playing their own instruments and wanting to record their own songs they weren't as good.   Mickey Dolenz was a great singer.   Davey Jones sang some good songs as well.  

 

 

 

5 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

No they weren't, and I explained extensively how they were not fake.

Unless you were right there in the studio with them and witnessed other people playing their instrument for them while fraudulently crediting themselves for doing so on albums such as Headquarters in 1967 and Justus in 1996, you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

o

 

 

4 hours ago, atomic said:

 

I like how you quoted me but then are not replying to what I said.  

 

o

 

OK, you  want to play incorrigible/obstinate ??? Fine.

 

Saying that the Beach Boys were a fake band is even more absurd than saying so about the Monkees. I don't know where you are getting your information from, but the Beach Boys (like the Beatles) wrote almost all of their own material starting with their first album in 1962 (Surfin Safari.) They would occasionally have a guest musician (such as Frank DeVito, Nick Venet, and Hal Blaine) play an instrument on a song or 2 on their albums. Other than that, it was the Beach Boys themselves singing, writing, and recording the instruments. The Rolling Stones would also do the same, as Nicky Hopkins, Bobby Keys, and Ry Cooder would often sit in on a song or 2 on their albums playing the piano, the sax, and the slide guitar. 

 

The Byrds were not as throughly independent as were the Beach Boys (and the Rolling Stones) because they had more help in the studio than did the Beach Boys (or the Rolling Stones.) But they still played more than half of the instruments on their albums, and wrote (or co-wrote) more than half of the material on those albums themselves, hence were far from a fake band, like the Archies and the Partridge Family. 

 

Regarding the Monkees, I already explained their progression/ascent into autonomy and realness, in detail.

 

Lumping in the Mamas and the Papas with bands such as the Beach Boys and the Byrds in terms of realness/fakeness/autonomy of their songwriting and instrument playing is absurd, or perhaps just another disingenuous method of yours to try make an argument that is blatantly false. Your behavior here on the Hangout board is (not surprisingly) very much like your behavior on the Orioles Hangout section.

 

o

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2 hours ago, OFFNY said:

 

 

 

 

o

 

OK, you  want to play incorrigible/obstinate ??? Fine.

 

Saying that the Beach Boys were a fake band is even more absurd than saying so about the Monkees. I don't know where you are getting your information from, but the Beach Boys (like the Beatles) wrote almost all of their own material starting with their first album in 1962 (Surfin Safari.) They would occasionally have a guest musician (such as Frank DeVito, Nick Venet, and Hal Blaine) play an instrument on a song or 2 on their albums. Other than that, it was the Beach Boys themselves singing, writing, and recording the instruments. The Rolling Stones would also do the same, as Nicky Hopkins, Bobby Keys, and Ry Cooder would often sit in on a song or 2 on their albums playing the piano, the sax, and the slide guitar. 

 

The Byrds were not as throughly independent as were the Beach Boys (and the Rolling Stones) because they had more help in the studio than did the Beach Boys (or the Rolling Stones.) But they still played more than half of the instruments on their albums, and wrote (or co-wrote) more than half of the material on those albums themselves, hence were far from a fake band, like the Archies and the Partridge Family. 

 

Regarding the Monkees, I already explained their progression/ascent into autonomy and realness, in detail.

 

Lumping in the Mamas and the Papas with bands such as the Beach Boys and the Byrds in terms of realness/fakeness/autonomy of their songwriting and instrument playing is absurd, or perhaps just another disingenuous method of yours to try make an argument that is blatantly false. Your behavior here on the Hangout board is (not surprisingly) very much like your behavior on the Orioles Hangout section.

 

o

What I am saying is true. And as for the Stones I have no doubt a session musician played on symphony for the devil.  Having heard keith Richard's play it live many times I know it wasnt him.

I never said anyone was fake. The Monkees destroyed their career by playing their own instruments and writing their own songs.

They could have just sung on the records and has a long career. They turned down Sugar Sugar.

The Beach Boys sang on their records but didnt play on them.  Heck Glen Campbell even played and sang in Brian Wilson's place on tour.  Watch the wrecking crew movie. 

I dont get this fake band comments. David Cassidy and Shirley Jones sang on the Patridge Family albums and had the same musicians play on them as the Beach Boys.  

Why worry about your standard of fake.  Just enjoy the music.  The Monkees music people love are on the first two albums. If they played the instruments the music would be worse.

Hell Aerosmith used session musicians their whole careers. Read how two guys from Lou Reeds played all the guitars on their second album. When people are out to make money they will use the best.  

 

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31 minutes ago, atomic said:

What I am saying is true. And as for the Stones I have no doubt a session musician played on symphony for the devil.  Having heard keith Richard's play it live many times I know it wasnt him.

I never said anyone was fake. The Monkees destroyed their career by playing their own instruments and writing their own songs.

They could have just sung on the records and has a long career. They turned down Sugar Sugar.

The Beach Boys sang on their records, but didn't play on them.  Heck Glen Campbell even played and sang in Brian Wilson's place on tour.  Watch the wrecking crew movie. 

I dont get this fake band comments. David Cassidy and Shirley Jones sang on the Patridge Family albums and had the same musicians play on them as the Beach Boys.  

Why worry about your standard of fake.  Just enjoy the music.  The Monkees music people love are on the first two albums. If they played the instruments the music would be worse.

Hell Aerosmith used session musicians their whole careers. Read how two guys from Lou Reeds played all the guitars on their second album. When people are out to make money they will use the best.  

 

o

 

That's a flat-out lie. Again, where the hell are you getting your information from that the Beach Boys did not play their own instruments on their albums ???

As I said before, you have no idea what you are talking about, and I am not going to continue to argue with somebody who is being as incorrigible as you are.

Also, you did say that they were fake bands. These are your exact words .......... 

 

All those 60's bands were fake bands then. The Beach Boys, the Byrds and Mamas and Papas used the same people playing on their albums that the Monkees did. 

 

Seriously atomic, you have some balls on you to say the bull**** that you spew, like that the Beach Boys didn't play their own instruments, and therefore were essentially the same and/or on par with the Partridge Family. Whether or not you actually believe your own lies or you just like to get people riled up, you're an ill person either way.

 

o

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23 minutes ago, atomic said:

What I am saying is true. And as for the Stones I have no doubt a session musician played on symphony for the devil.  Having heard keith Richard's play it live many times I know it wasnt him.

I never said anyone was fake. The Monkees destroyed their career by playing their own instruments and writing their own songs.

 

And btw, it's SYMPATHY For The Devil...

 

I see no session musicians here, as the song evolves in the studio... Just Mick, Keith and Brian.

 

Longer film.

 

 

 

As for the Monkees... I think this is GENIUS! Opinions vary, I'll give you that, but this was definitely The Monkees as a WORKING band.

 

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I'm not even going to justify your Beach Boys or Byrds comments with a response. So many different legendary geniuses in those two bands... your ignorance is showing.

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19 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

That's a flat-out lie.

As I said before, you have no idea what you are talking about, and I am not going to continue to argue with somebody who is being as incorrigible as you are.

Also, you did say that they were fake bands. These are your exact words .......... 

 

All those 60's bands were fake bands then. The Beach Boys, the Byrds and Mamas and Papas used the same people playing on their albums that the Monkees did. 

 

Seriously atomic, you have some balls on you to say the bull**** that you spew, like that the Beach Boys didn't play their own instruments, and therefore were essentially the same and/or on par with the Partridge Family. Whether or not you actually believe your own lies or you just like to get people riled up, you're an ill person either way.

 

o

I am not judging them. Have you seen the wrecking crew movie? I am guessing you haven't.  The guys in the wrecking crew were great musicians so I am not sure why it bothers you. I like Patridge Family songs, like the Beach Boys songs mostly though think pets sounds is overrated.  Brian Wilson wrote most of their songs. Didnt write Komomo which I believe was their biggest hit.   The wrecking crew also played on Simon and Garfunkels records.  Some of the best records ever made.  

 

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3 minutes ago, scOtt said:

I'm not even going to justify your Beach Boys or Byrds comments with a response. So many different legendary geniuses in those two bands... your ignorance is showing.

I think you are the one that is ignorant.  Rodger Mcquinn played guitar on the songs.  But they had session musicians on songs.

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10 minutes ago, scOtt said:

And btw, it's SYMPATHY For The Devil...

 

I see no session musicians here, as the song evolves in the studio... Just Mick, Keith and Brian.

 

Longer film.

 

 

 

As for the Monkees... I think this is GENIUS! Opinions vary, I'll give you that, but this was definitely The Monkees as a WORKING band.

 

At what point in the videos is Keith playing the guitar so in Sympathy for the Devil? I watched first video and they are just strumming on acoustic guitars.  And I am not watching 45 minute video.

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