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Last year's team was better

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2 hours ago, Redskins Rick said:

Hyde said this team is young, and he is working with them on getting their head totally in the game, and not have occasional mental lapses.

Broxton is not a young player. Davis is not a young player. The veterans are also making mental lapses. 

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Subjectively, last year's team was not better:  witness a 20-51 record through 71 vs. 21-50 this year.

But, that aside, last year's team SHOULD have been better - a LOT better. It was basically the same team that was in wild card contention for all but one month of 2017, and not all that changed from the 2016 team that made the playoffs. It was a team with a payroll more than 2x this year's. It was a team with 9 former All-Stars (this year's team has one - Davis).

Time will tell on the records. But I think it's inarguable to say that last years team should have been better than this year's team.

 

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2 hours ago, Slappy said:

Subjectively, last year's team was not better:  witness a 20-51 record through 71 vs. 21-50 this year.

But, that aside, last year's team SHOULD have been better - a LOT better. It was basically the same team that was in wild card contention for all but one month of 2017, and not all that changed from the 2016 team that made the playoffs. It was a team with a payroll more than 2x this year's. It was a team with 9 former All-Stars (this year's team has one - Davis).

Time will tell on the records. But I think it's inarguable to say that last years team should have been better than this year's team.

 

I completely agree with this. Last year's team was much, much better in terms of talent. It was unbelievable how much they underperformed.

This year's team really doesn't have much to work with. Hyde said it pretty good recently - the O's are lacking in talent and pretty much have to play perfect in order to have a shot at winning.

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o

 

In my rat's ass of an opinion, whether or not this year's team is slightly better or slightly worse than last year's team is not that important ........ I believe what matters most is how the numerous pitching prospects that are pitching extremely well at both the lower and upper levels of the Minors develops over the next 2 to 3 years, and/or how well the position players in the upper levels of the Minors and the ones who have played a little bit of Major League ball (Santander, Sisco, Hays, Stewart, etc) pan out as Major Leaguers in 2020 and beyond ......... and of course, how the players whom are already established in the Majors (Mancini, Bundy, Means, and Cobb if he comes back next year) continue to produce.

 

o

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So is the minor league pitching in the O's farm system deep enough to take a position player with the #1 overall pick in 2020?  Or do they go with a pitcher?  I have to believe next year's draft will be pitcher-heavy for Baltimore.

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9 hours ago, TheOtherRipken said:

Last years team was lack of effort, this years team is mostly lack of ability.  I’d take this years over last years personally, but its not saying much.

I disagree that last year's team was lack of effort.  I think with last year's team the club's lack of depth was exposed in a huge way.  It just wasn't in the cards for some of our players to have long, productive careers.  You need the next generation on its way from the minors to be somewhat ready when aging veterans start to falter; or you need to be more aggressive in the free agent and trade markets earlier on.  Players like Davis , Hardy and Tillman could not recover from injury and fading ability.  And there was no one else close to their level to replace them.  Now there won't be for awhile.

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49 minutes ago, Yossarian said:

So is the minor league pitching in the O's farm system deep enough to take a position player with the #1 overall pick in 2020?  Or do they go with a pitcher?  I have to believe next year's draft will be pitcher-heavy for Baltimore.

I read somewhere that this year's draft was considered to be one of the weakest in recent memory for pitching.  A pitcher wasn't drafted until the seventh pick, and only two were drafted in the top 15.  Hence the mantra draft the best player available, not the most needed position.  If the top prospect next season is a pitcher I'm sure the O's will be all over him.  

 

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36 minutes ago, CheeryO said:

I disagree that last year's team was lack of effort.  I think with last year's team the club's lack of depth was exposed in a huge way.  It just wasn't in the cards for some of our players to have long, productive careers.  You need the next generation on its way from the minors to be somewhat ready when aging veterans start to falter; or you need to be more aggressive in the free agent and trade markets earlier on.  Players like Davis , Hardy and Tillman could not recover from injury and fading ability.  And there was no one else close to their level to replace them.  Now there won't be for awhile.

No way -  went to those games, the team looked flat and like they didn’t care at all. Failure to run to first on pop outs, lack of effort in the outfield, weak swings during at bats.  Went to a lot of game during the 14 years of terrible and never saw a team so flat, boring, and unwilling to try at a major league level.  

Also Caleb Joseph called out the team for lack of effort publicly - although he really didn’t need to, it was pretty obvious.

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20 hours ago, Philip said:

Interesting list. From the guys you mentioned, Severino, Armstrong, maaaaybe Smith(but probably not) could be part of the next good team.

20 hours ago, SteveA said:

At least this year we are cycling new guys in and trying them out and seeing if we have something.   The following players have made their Orioles debut this year:   Jackson, Karns, Straily, Alberto, Martin, Ruiz, Broxton, Ortiz, Phillips, Severino, Smith Jr., Armstrong, Sucre.   A bunch more made their debuts last August and September.   Most of these guys will never amount to anything but it's better playing, and losing, and finding out about these guys than it was playing sub-.300 ball on a team with quality veterans like  Manny Machado, Alex, Cobb, Jon Schoop, Brad Brach, Kevin Gausman, Darren O'Day, and Mark Trumbo.   That was a truly horrific experience for a fan.

To,me this year is much worse.  We had some talented player last year,  This team has so many awful players who shouldn’t be in the big leagues that they are pretty much unwatchable other than for comic relief. 

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2 minutes ago, atomic said:

To,me this year is much worse.  We had some talented player last year,  This team has so many awful players who shouldn’t be in the big leagues that they are pretty much unwatchable other than for comic relief. 

Except they are not very funny… I agree with you. 

The only worthwhile part about this season is watching new guys get their feet wet. I don’t want to see guys who are bad continue to get chances with the big club, nor guys who are sloppy. Bring up anybody. Why does it matter whether they are good or bad? The only really good guys we have in the minors are going to be called up for very specific reasons. That only leaves guys who are mediocre or worse. But are they going to be considerably worse than the guys we already have? That is debatable.

I’m really hoping Gilmartin will turn out to be a pleasant surprise. Ortiz was neither pleasant nor surprising.

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5 minutes ago, atomic said:

To,me this year is much worse.  We had some talented player last year,  This team has so many awful players who shouldn’t be in the big leagues that they are pretty much unwatchable other than for comic relief. 

Really?   You'd rather watch a team with Manny, Britton, Brach, Schoop, Gausman, O'Day, Showalter, and company still manage to play under .300 baseball, knowing they would all be gone in less than two years?

Agree to disagree.

 

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Just now, SteveA said:

Really?   You'd rather watch a team with Manny, Britton, Brach, Schoop, Gausman, O'Day, Showalter, and company still manage to play under .300 baseball, knowing they would all be gone in less than two years?

Agree to disagree.

 

Yeah I was a big fan of Jones, Gausman, Brach, ODay, and Britton.  I liked watching them.  I am not sure why that is a surprise . Who wants to watch Davis, Broxton, Martin, Wilkerson and gang play. 

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2 minutes ago, SteveA said:

Really?   You'd rather watch a team with Manny, Britton, Brach, Schoop, Gausman, O'Day, Showalter, and company still manage to play under .300 baseball, knowing they would all be gone in less than two years?

Agree to disagree.

 

This year’s team has zero expectations and they are supposed to be this bad.  Orioles were trying to contend for a playoff spot last season and had the core of the 2016 team before the fire sale. 

2018 always will be the worst season in franchise history at least until a new low is reached. 

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