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Who is next?

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13 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

He’s not a poor defender at 2B. His numbers are hurt by being forced to play him at SS because Martin has no bat.

Im sick of hearing that our players are worthless because the Os are forced to play them out of position.

If you trade Mancini as an OF his defensive value hurts him. So you trade him as a 1B because that’s what he’s been his whole career. Obviously the Orioles have played him out of position because or Davis.

On the same note, you don’t trade for Villar  to play SS. His fielding percentage is 40-50 points higher at 2B

As I mentioned, he’s a hustle player. You act like he has no value.  Which is just wrong. I believe Elias would like to trade him. I stand bye my position that he’s not going to just dump him. So again, no chance they nontender him.

 

Ok, let's look at the contending teams. Tell me who he'd start over? I count one team (the A's) that "might" consider him a middle infield upgrade. So while you may think Villar is a valuable player in teh context of the other 2B and SS' in the league he really isn't, 

Yankees - LeMahieu / Torres

Red Sox - Chavis / Bogaerts

Rays - Lowe / Adames or Wendle

Twins - Schoop / Polanco

Indians - Kipnis / Lindor

Astros - Altuve / Correa

A's - Barreto / Semien

Rangers - Odor / Andrus

Braves - Albies / Swanson

Nationals - Dozier or Kendrick / Turner

Phillies - Hernandez / Segura

Cubs - Russell / Baez

Cardinals - Wong / DeJong

Brewers - Hiura / Arcia

Dodgers - Muncy / Seager

 

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17 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

They won’t just cut assets to save money. Who have they done that with this far.

 

Again, nearly half his starts are at SS. He is a lesser defender at SS. 

Also, I don’t like watching him get picked off. And yes the mistakes piss me off as well. But he’s better to watch than Martin and to a lesser extent Ruiz at the plate 3-4 times per night.

I’m not pretending he’s a superstar. But he’s far from worthless.

Trading O'Day was  complete salary dump. 

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20 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Ok, let's look at the contending teams. Tell me who he'd start over? I count one team (the A's) that "might" consider him a middle infield upgrade. So while you may think Villar is a valuable player in teh context of the other 2B and SS' in the league he really isn't, 

Yankees - LeMahieu / Torres

Red Sox - Chavis / Bogaerts

Rays - Lowe / Adames or Wendle

Twins - Schoop / Polanco

Indians - Kipnis / Lindor

Astros - Altuve / Correa

A's - Barreto / Semien

Rangers - Odor / Andrus

Braves - Albies / Swanson

Nationals - Dozier or Kendrick / Turner

Phillies - Hernandez / Segura

Cubs - Russell / Baez

Cardinals - Wong / DeJong

Brewers - Hiura / Arcia

Dodgers - Muncy / Seager

 

I don’t think any contender is looking at him as a “starter”, but more like a vet Middle Infielder. He also he is SH and can run. He’d be a valuable bench piece. Everyone is sure-ing up their benches for a run. Hopefully, we can pay his salary and get back something similar to what we got back in the Cashner trade. 

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53 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Ok, let's look at the contending teams. Tell me who he'd start over? I count one team (the A's) that "might" consider him a middle infield upgrade. So while you may think Villar is a valuable player in teh context of the other 2B and SS' in the league he really isn't, 

Yankees - LeMahieu / Torres

Red Sox - Chavis / Bogaerts

Rays - Lowe / Adames or Wendle

Twins - Schoop / Polanco

Indians - Kipnis / Lindor

Astros - Altuve / Correa

A's - Barreto / Semien

Rangers - Odor / Andrus

Braves - Albies / Swanson

Nationals - Dozier or Kendrick / Turner

Phillies - Hernandez / Segura

Cubs - Russell / Baez

Cardinals - Wong / DeJong

Brewers - Hiura / Arcia

Dodgers - Muncy / Seager

 

This is pretty tough to argue against. I even checked out the Pirates and Diamondbacks and yeah, I'm not sure Villar makes much sense there either. 

I agree that he probably wouldn't be viewed as a starter, but more of a bench/utility guy. 

It may take an injury somewhere though in the next couple of weeks. Especially since he's going to be sort of expensive next year for a bench guy. 

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7 minutes ago, interloper said:

This is pretty tough to argue against. I even checked out the Pirates and Diamondbacks and yeah, I'm not sure Villar makes much sense there either. 

I agree that he probably wouldn't be viewed as a starter, but more of a bench/utility guy. 

It may take an injury somewhere though in the next couple of weeks. Especially since he's going to be sort of expensive next year for a bench guy. 

Exactly. And I don't see teams paying a pretty penny for  a bench/utility guy unless, as you said, they're desperate and have a late season injury. Even if they do let's look at some of the other possible available 2B and see where Villar ranks. 

Royals - Might be willing to trade Merrifield. He's under contract through 2023, but his salary is pretty reasonable. 

Mariners - Probably willing to trade Gordon. Under contract through 2021. Mariner's would probably have to eat some of his contract though. 

Reds - Probably willing to trade Gennett if that fall out of contention. Free agent after this season so probably the most appealing of the bunch. 

Rockies - Have a glut at 2B. McMahon, Hamspon, and Murphy are probably all available. Hamspon and McMahon are still on rookie contracts. Murphy would be less appealing because he's old and under contract through 2022. 

I could also see the Rays shopping Joey Wendle to fill other needs. 

I'd say with the exception of Gordon and Murphy (and only because of their contracts/salaries) all of these players would be better options for teams than Villar. 

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Trade Villar for a Popsicle stick and a wrist band. He'll be available again in December after his new team non-tenders him, just in case we still want him.

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2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

The Astros also managed to cut payroll to a much lower level than the Orioles have.  In 2013 they were at 22M. 

What does 6 years of inflation look like?

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2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

They traded Brach for 1/3 of Jack Zoellner.

That was the old group with PA pulling the strings 

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7 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

That was the old group with PA pulling the strings 

So you are saying they haven't traded anyone to cut payroll using one trade, which did save them money, as your argument?  How about we wait and see if Elias makes another deal?

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2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

It doesn't look like 67M.

Corn ... what is 67 million?

I said there is no way they nontender him to save between 6 and 7 million.

 

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1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

So you are saying they haven't traded anyone to cut payroll using one trade, which did save them money, as your argument?  How about we wait and see if Elias makes another deal?

I’m not saying they won’t trade Villar. I don’t see them keeping him and nontenderibg him. 

I would assume that they want to trade him for assets. 

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1 minute ago, Roll Tide said:

Corn ... what is 67 million?

I said there is no way they nontender him to save between 6 and 7 million.

 

67M is roughly the O's payroll this year, as compared to the Astros low water mark of 22M.  At least I think it is, hard to make heads or tails of the various payroll numbers and what all they count.

As for the 6-7M number I addressed that already by expressing my doubts he would cost so little. 

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2 hours ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Ok, let's look at the contending teams. Tell me who he'd start over? I count one team (the A's) that "might" consider him a middle infield upgrade. So while you may think Villar is a valuable player in teh context of the other 2B and SS' in the league he really isn't, 

Yankees - LeMahieu / Torres

Red Sox - Chavis / Bogaerts

Rays - Lowe / Adames or Wendle

Twins - Schoop / Polanco

Indians - Kipnis / Lindor

Astros - Altuve / Correa

A's - Barreto / Semien

Rangers - Odor / Andrus

Braves - Albies / Swanson

Nationals - Dozier or Kendrick / Turner

Phillies - Hernandez / Segura

Cubs - Russell / Baez

Cardinals - Wong / DeJong

Brewers - Hiura / Arcia

Dodgers - Muncy / Seager

 

Someone who loses a guy to injury or is seriously underperforming. I’m not looking to try and figure it out. But as I recall the Cubs middle infield is underperforming. That doesn’t mean they will trade for him. 

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1 minute ago, Roll Tide said:

I’m not saying they won’t trade Villar. I don’t see them keeping him and nontenderibg him. 

I would assume that they want to trade him for assets. 

I think every team would prefer to trade a player for something instead of non-tendering them.

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