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Tony-OH

TT: Time to demote Smith Jr. and bring up Stewart

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1 hour ago, wildcard said:

See Service Time at this link.

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/league-info/transactions-glossary/

So its the 34 days of service time the Hays has plus the difference between 187 - 172 which is 15 day.  Maybe its 16 days to be safe.

That's what I thought. that's why I was saying if they don't bring him up this year and then wait a couple of weeks he would only have one full year of service time at the end of next season. I feel this is the course of action the Orioles will take with him which is why I don't think we will see him.

Why would anyone want to see him before then and potentially lose him a year earlier to FA when he's potentially a really good player and the team is potentially a contender? Add in the fact that no matter how much it sucks to lose, losing is better for the franchise long term. 

I don't know the difference between the #1 and #2 overall pick next year, but I do know I want #1 no matter.

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43 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Fine, extend him when you determine he's going to be a good player.  Problem solved.

This.  Be proactive and sign young players to extensions early.  Its a risk but then service time becomes a moot point. 

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1 hour ago, Roll Tide said:

Smith May be able to make adjustments that he hasn’t made yet. What’s the rush to push him out of town?

No need to push him out of town, but he's not been that good in AAA.  And for a guy who looks like a poor LFer he's going to have to hit a ton to be productive.  That's a lot of adjustments.  This year he's OPSing under .700 with sub-Mancini level fielding.

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45 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Fine, extend him when you determine he's going to be a good player.  Problem solved.

This is a great point. I really think we will see Elias use this avenue to buy out his key players until they are 32 years old or so. It will be interesting to see how he handles these kinds of players once he gets to that point.

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2 hours ago, MurphDogg said:

It does not. Unless they are going to wait until mid-June 2020 to bring up Hays, the service time die is cast. Tony's worry that Hays may help the Orioles win and get the #2 pick instead of the #1 pick is a valid concern, but it is, in my opinion, too cynical of a reason to deny him MLB at-bats.

Not judging it either way but we don't know yet how cynical ME is. Of course we plebes would never know if that really was the reason. Whatever happens behind closed doors in the Warehouse stays in the Warehouse.

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2 hours ago, atomic said:

If they are really good players you give the better player the call up first. But we aren't talking superstars.  We are talking about guys from other teams that got DFA'd.  You should give your own guys who had success the first chance. 

Who had success in the minors and never got a chance?  Certainly not the 28-year-old corner outfielder with the sub-.800 OPS in AA and AAA. Joey Rickard is both better and younger than Yaz.

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16 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

You're math may be right, I did mine quick. As for the Union, they have nothing they can challenge because it's in the rules. It's a big reason though why MLB is now starting negotiations early with the union in hopes of addressing these things before a work stoppage.

We settled on May 20th-ish.

As far as the Union goes, they certainly CAN challenge it by filing a grievance, they have in the past but have not yet been successful. They are arguably still bound by "a covenant of good faith".

I just hope it gets sorted out in the next CBA because it is a bad look all around to not have the best baseball players in America not playing at the highest level. Unfortunately the players union has a long history of giving away future members' interests in exchange for current member's interests at an exchange rate of pennies on the dollar.

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One note (I've only read the first page of this thread so far so I don't know if someone mentioned this).

Stewart was activated from the DL and sent to the minors I believe last Sunday night (14th).

Barring an IL move, Stewart cannot legally be brought up until he has been down 10 days (Wednesday, our least day in Arizona). 

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29 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

You're math may be right, I did mine quick. As for the Union, they have nothing they can challenge because it's in the rules. It's a big reason though why MLB is now starting negotiations early with the union in hopes of addressing these things before a work stoppage.

This. I don't resent players using ALL their options under the rules, like AJ refusing a trade last year. By the same token I don't resent management exercising ALL their options, under the rules.

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2 hours ago, MurphDogg said:

They DFA'd Broxton and brought up Kline after Saturday's game. They could easily return to a 12-man pitching staff and bring up Stewart (or Hays) without sending down Smith.

I have been beating the drum for weeks that it is time to see what Stewart can do and Smith definitely shouldn't be standing in his way.

Bundy will be coming off the DL tomorrow.

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2 minutes ago, SteveA said:

Bundy will be coming off the DL tomorrow.

And Bundy is an actual MLB starting pitcher, unlike some of the other guys who have been making starts up here. All the more reason not to have a 13-man pitching staff.

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29 minutes ago, Lucky_13 said:

This.  Be proactive and sign young players to extensions early.  Its a risk but then service time becomes a moot point. 

TB has done this a number of times, mostly to their own good I think.

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30 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

No need to push him out of town, but he's not been that good in AAA.  And for a guy who looks like a poor LFer he's going to have to hit a ton to be productive.  That's a lot of adjustments.  This year he's OPSing under .700 with sub-Mancini level fielding.

And a lollipop arm. Which teams are really starting to exploit.

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3 minutes ago, scOtt said:

TB has done this a number of times, mostly to their own good I think.

They had a few stinkers.  But on balance they’ve come out way ahead.  

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7 minutes ago, Frobby said:

They had a few stinkers.  But on balance they’ve come out way ahead.  

Didn't they manage to trade away the "stinkers"? 

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