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Why did Davis go after Hyde? He was not happy.

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2 minutes ago, Beef Supreme said:

You were not in the dugout and have no idea what you are talking about. 

I have a feeling that only one of us has held numerous positions managing people and it is not you.

Let me see if I have this correct.  You're criticizing someone else for taking Hyde's side when he has no idea what was said.  Yet you are taking Davis's side when you have no idea what was said.  Seems logical.  

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31 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

 

For the bolded part. I didn't like what he said about our pitching publicly, even though I know it's true. I think Hyde's on tilt a little right now. He's frustrated that he's not getting talented guys to work with, but he's lost perspective that this is what this year's about.

I probably shouldn't have upvoted it though. I'm not doubting Hyde, but I really didn't like the public comments about the pitching.

I do think he's venting a bit, but he's venting honestly which I appreciate and he's not singling a bad performance by one pitcher. I don't think Hyde has lost perspective at all on this season, but I have been getting upset watching guys groove middle of the plate pitches night in and night out, so I can understand his frustrations even thouhg I completely understand what this year is about.

Just because he understand what's going on doesn't make a loss easy to take when you see pitchers making the same mistakes game in and game out.

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Completely agree. What happened after Means last night was embarrassing, and I'm not referring to Hyde or Davis. That pitching was low-minors quality, if that. They had live arms, but absolutely no feel for pitching. That has to drive him crazy. You have to wonder what he thinks of the pitching coach too, TBH. 

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Davis has no room for error on anything.

In competitive athletics, what you can get away with is directly tied to how much you are able to help the team on the field. If you suck on the field, you better be a great teammate, hard-worker, humble,  plus makeup guy. Davis has shown at least a couple instances of not being those things while being pretty much the worst player at the MLB level. I think a private or public reprimand is necessary. Yeah, there are lines a manager shouldn't cross (insulting family, etc), but for me everything else is free game in this situation. If I had to guess, it was something to the effect of "you have no heart, you've given up, if you aren't going to try, go home" kind of stuff with some expletives thrown in.  

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1 hour ago, Tony-OH said:

Absolutely, these Hyde bashers are ridiculous and have no understanding of leadership. I really haven't been this pissed off that we have posters here on the Hangout with this kind of garbage take. That is MASN blog comments section BS, not Hangout quality awareness.

Unfortunately, it seems a lack of "Hangout quality awareness" is rife and growing this year. It seems too many people don't understand what a "rebuild" is or even what the approach is here and are too used to the way things used to be. Just DFA everyone after a week and bring "someone" else up from a system that has no one to bring up.

I wasn't sure I would like Hyde early on, but he's growing on me. I appreciate that he is outspoken and won't blow smoke up anyone's ass. For what he has to work with and deal with, I think he has done well in the role and I'm glad to have him. That could change at some point of course, but right now? I think he's the right guy for the job. The real test will come when we see how he manages a good team.

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41 minutes ago, BradyBunch said:

Huge difference, team meeting is behind closed doors. Pulling a player aside and saying hey what's up with that or this while in the dugout is different then saying something and walking away. 

Perhaps Hyde does this more often than not and reserves public call-outs for situations that actually deserve it.  I would be surprised if that isn't the case.  IMO Hyde has earned the benefit of the doubt when it comes to player management and even if this was a case of him having too short a fuse (unlikely from what I saw), that's not a license for a player to physically come after the manager.  

If Davis' delicate sensibilities have been horribly bruised then let's all give thanks that he can easily afford whatever it takes to heal such a grievous wound.

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4 minutes ago, Beef Supreme said:

Yes, if that had been what was said, i would be more likely to side with Hyde.

But not one of us was in the dugout, so the anger I have seen in so many replies to this thread seems baseless. I get it: people hate Davis so much that it determines their viewpoint, with no possible nuance of what may have happened. They hate Davis and his contract and it colors their viewpoint.  I want Davis gone, too. I never would have signed him to that contract years ago. But I am not going to side with a manager who provokes a player, especially not one who has never shown a bit of anger in his playing career. Even last night was about the least angry dust-up between a manager and a player I have ever seen. Davis never even got his arms above his waist and stopped after one step. This has gotten blown way out of proportion.

I have a feeling, though, that the tone that Brocail took with Hess and the content of their conversation does not resemble what Hyde said to start the altercation with Davis. I have a strong feeling that what Hyde said was personally insulting, at minimum, and was not just a suggestion to "tighten it up a little."

I absolutely agree that it has gotten blow out of proportion. I will also admit I am not a Davis fan and there is a lot of negative emotion there. I do think in general I am able to separate emotion from logic but I am human, so there's that. 

I do find it interesting that you say none of us was in the dugout to know what was said but you seem to assume that what Hyde said was very wrong. I can't assume that Davis is the principle instigator and neither can you assume that Hyde outrageously lambasted Davis. 

I also don't think it can be said that Davis has never shown any anger in his career. He has broken more bats than any player I have ever seen. That is an act of physical aggression. I also posted a clip, that I am aware has little context, that shows Davis possibly showing up Buck. And to me if Davis really was restrained in the way you say he was, it's even worse because he the implication would be that he was calm enough to act normally but wanted to intimidate his manager physically. 

Lastly, I would say your use of the words attack in relation to Hyde seemed a bit outlandish when Davis was the one actually showed physical aggression.

I don't want to pile on you and I think I covered what I wanted to cover. Thanks for your response. 

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14 minutes ago, Luke-OH said:

Davis has no room for error on anything.

In competitive athletics, what you can get away with is directly tied to how much you are able to help the team on the field. If you suck on the field, you better be a great teammate, hard-worker, humble,  plus makeup guy. Davis has shown at least a couple instances of not being those things while being pretty much the worst player at the MLB level. I think a private or public reprimand is necessary. Yeah, there are lines a manager shouldn't cross (insulting family, etc), but for me everything else is free game in this situation. If I had to guess, it was something to the effect of "you have no heart, you've given up, if you aren't going to try, go home" kind of stuff with some expletives thrown in.  

Great assessment! Probably just lighting a fire under him and Davis with his healthy paycheck should do everything in bold.

What kind of manager would Hyde be if he didn't try to get the most out of his players by pushing them beyond their comfort zone?

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Pretty clear that the time has come to do something about Davis.  Especially if the manager feels his effort or focus are not there. He has no future here and is going to be a bad example to the young guys in this case.

On the other hand, Hyde should probably try to keep this stuff in his office. Kinda embarrassing to the franchise to have it out in the open (which he admitted).

Ultimately though, as a fan, I'm happy to see guys caring, even if it boils over.

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My "safe space" is Orioles hangout and MASN at 7:05 p.m. I do think the term is drenched rightly or wrongly in political rancor and I hope that the abundant use of the term in this thread does not lead us down a black hole of bull crap that I am so grateful this site does not typically go into like lesser boards. 

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6 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Have fun defending Davis now. 

Roch Kubatko

·
7m
 
OK, here's what I've heard about the Hyde/Davis argument. We'll learn more tomorrow: Davis was frustrated by the inning, threw something in dugout, it hit Hyde, Hyde said something, you saw the rest. No punishment is expected. Had nothing to do with scooped ball, pop up, etc

Oof. Bad look for Davis.

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8 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Have fun defending Davis now. 

Roch Kubatko

·
7m
 
OK, here's what I've heard about the Hyde/Davis argument. We'll learn more tomorrow: Davis was frustrated by the inning, threw something in dugout, it hit Hyde, Hyde said something, you saw the rest. No punishment is expected. Had nothing to do with scooped ball, pop up, etc

If there's no discipline than Davis needs to come out and support his manager and say he was in the wrong, imo. 

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All indications point to Davis being in the wrong.
Then-- Hyde called him out for it.
Then-- Davis reacted inappropriately in response.
Then? Time will tell.
I think I, along with the vast majority of O's fans, believe the time has come (or came well before this) to release Davis and move on. Hopefully the Angelos' sign off on this and allow this mess to end.
 

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