Jump to content
Luke-OH

Frederick Keys on the chopping block

Recommended Posts

13 minutes ago, spiritof66 said:

I'm not sure that would work. MLB might call their bluff and move most of the minor leagues to the Caribbean and South and Central America, plus Cape Cod and other college league sites where there are underused ballparks. It would be interesting if the "surviving" clubs took a stand, but it could get pretty ugly.

I think their short-term plan would be to just have complex type leagues in Florida.  Use the spring training sites.  Intersquad games, eventually set up schedules to play other teams.  And release all the random organizational guys.

MLB has all the leverage here because a large number of MiLB teams need MLB money to exist, and the majors don't really need the minors.  MLB would be largely unchanged if the minors disappeared tomorrow and was replaced by all the real prospects just hanging out in Florida and working out, playing scrimmages.

But... maybe way back in the MLB owners heads is the idea that if they totally dumped bigger minor league cities new, bigger, more powerful independent leagues could spring up.  Players who don't like their draft position or bonus could have an alternate place to go, at least for a while.  I don't know if a 3rd major (really 2nd since AL and NL are just one league) is even marginally viable, but a fully independent AAA-ish league could seriously annoy the majors.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's premature to say that the MLB draft is moving to August.  MLB wants to move it after the College World Series.  Some have speculated that August makes sense as a date in August would eliminate the need for short-season A teams.  

Logically, it makes no sense to mandate which minor league teams will be axed although "leaking" a list may encourage towns on the fence to up their facilities.  How up to date are the facilities in Frederick? It location is great. 

Organizations such as the Orioles/Astros that are big on machine learning, regression models, and neural networks are more likely to be on board with this plan while organizations such as the Cubs/Yankees that have the resources to have a more balanced approach may have  misgivings. During the past season the Cubs had 300 players under control.  This new plan would lessen that number by at least 100. 

Youngsters that are unable to make the jump from the DSL or HS to full-season ball may stay at their respective complexes and play unofficial games against other organizations throughout the summer as opposed to until the draft as in past years. 

One advantage is that it will be easier to evaluate prospects with fewer non-prospects in the mix, although you could argue that 20-year old prospects benefit from playing with 25-year old non-prospects who know the little things but have limited tools.

The great statistics put up by top prospects during their first ML seasons in recent years suggests that top prospects may be spending too much time in the minors.  More rapid promotion for a select few is likely with a thinner pool of players. 

It is also possible that AAA will be more like AA is today, i.e., the place for top prospects.   Independent leagues comprised of released players could fill the role that AAA has today - although this will depend on the details of the next ML agreement. 

I've also heard that some teams would prefer a shorter season so that their prospects could spend more time in their respective pitching/hitting labs. 

 

 

 

 

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Satyr3206 said:

Sad. And pretty close to a fact.

In the 1920s the International League Orioles were probably among the top 10 professional teams in the world.  Jack Dunn refused to sign affiliation agreements.  He had all stars and Hall of Fame caliber players in their prime.  But eventually he was pressured by the rest of the league into caving.  The PCL made a little run in the 1950s at going independent and hinting a going major, but expansion and the Dodgers and Giants put an end to that.  Besides the relatively low-level indy leagues today there haven't been real minor league pennant races in my lifetime.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Luke-OH said:

The Orioles are on-board with this, the only way it's going to change is in the negotiations with the National Association of Professional Baseball Leagues. 

If both Frederick and Hagerstown are shut down, who does that part of MD belong to, Nats or Os?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, AnythingO's said:

If both Frederick and Hagerstown are shut down, who does that part of MD belong to, Nats or Os?

Umm, don’t know, but even the affiliates that are staying aren’t necessarily going to be with the same parent club. Norfolk could become a Nats affiliate for example.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So baseball want in increase their fanbase and tweak the game, and keep current fans, bring back old fans, and attract new fans.

So you go and screw with everybody minor league system.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I think their short-term plan would be to just have complex type leagues in Florida.  Use the spring training sites.  Intersquad games, eventually set up schedules to play other teams.  And release all the random organizational guys.

MLB has all the leverage here because a large number of MiLB teams need MLB money to exist, and the majors don't really need the minors.  MLB would be largely unchanged if the minors disappeared tomorrow and was replaced by all the real prospects just hanging out in Florida and working out, playing scrimmages.

But... maybe way back in the MLB owners heads is the idea that if they totally dumped bigger minor league cities new, bigger, more powerful independent leagues could spring up.  Players who don't like their draft position or bonus could have an alternate place to go, at least for a while.  I don't know if a 3rd major (really 2nd since AL and NL are just one league) is even marginally viable, but a fully independent AAA-ish league could seriously annoy the majors.

Major leagues definitely needs the minor leagues.  Players don't go from college straight to MLB.  Scrimmages are not going to make you major league ready.  It would cost them even more money to have games without fans. Plus how much would it cost to shuttle players back  and forth from Florida to say Detroit?   I think you are truly under estimating the value minor league baseball provides to MLB.

I think this is all about the lawsuit from minor league players saying they are being paid below minimum wage.  I guess a simpler solution is lower the amount of bonuses you pay drafted players and increase salaries.  That would make the pay more equitable.  And provide housing for the players.  And cater their food.   

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, atomic said:

Major leagues definitely needs the minor leagues.  Players don't go from college straight to MLB.  Scrimmages are not going to make you major league ready.  It would cost them even more money to have games without fans. Plus how much would it cost to shuttle players back  and forth from Florida to say Detroit?   I think you are truly under estimating the value minor league baseball provides to MLB.

I think this is all about the lawsuit from minor league players saying they are being paid below minimum wage.  I guess a simpler solution is lower the amount of bonuses you pay drafted players and increase salaries.  That would make the pay more equitable.  And provide housing for the players.  And cater their food.   

 

It would not surprise me if a goal--and a result--is to increase the number of students going to college.  Only expected stars would get drafted out of high school while MLB lets the colleges develop everyone else as is done in football and basketball.  It would be bad for college academics and for the prospects who aren't really interested in being students, but that's no skin off the owners.  About 80% of players  would enter the minors at age 21 and get at most 3 years to make the majors or become AAAA.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, AnythingO's said:

Do the Orioles get to appeal this? I would think they would want to keep Frederick, Bowie, Norfolk together to better support the fan base for Baltimore and sacrifice one of Aberdeen or Delmarva.

Why should Delmarva get sacrificed?  After all, they were the Minor League Team of the Year and has a modern stadium in Salisbury.  Screw convenience... it's nice to have professional baseball come through the Eastern Shore since 1996 and I don't see why that should be tampered with.  An increase in affiliation could lead to the team putting more seats down the left and right side of the diamond to encourage more revenue to accommodate their increased affiliation.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Enjoy Terror said:

I'm don't think I'm making any large leaps assuming that Aberdeen is hands-off because of Cal Ripken.

Not trying to be smart, but I thought Cal had sold off his share of the Aberbeen, along with another of his minor league holders. Nobody said why, but, shortly later, his divorce became public, and people assume he was putting together her part of the holdings.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, orioles119 said:

Why should Delmarva get sacrificed?  After all, they were the Minor League Team of the Year and has a modern stadium in Salisbury.  Screw convenience... it's nice to have professional baseball come through the Eastern Shore since 1996 and I don't see why that should be tampered with.  An increase in affiliation could lead to the team putting more seats down the left and right side of the diamond to encourage more revenue to accommodate their increased affiliation.

I don't think either should be sacrificed. All of the Orioles affiliates have decent stadiums and have decent attendance, none are anywhere close to being among the 50 weakest minor league teams in terms of fan support, or stadium and facility conditions.

It seems clear that if this plan goes through, while the Orioles would have to cut one of their affiliates, it should be scooped up by another team (with the Nationals the obvious choice, replacing the Hagerstown Suns).

That said, Delmarva IS clearly the weakest of the Orioles affiliates by attendance, drawing 1,000 fewer fans per game than Frederick, although the Shorebirds are still in the middle of the pack in the South Atlantic League (8th of 14 teams).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Not trying to be smart, but I thought Cal had sold off his share of the Aberbeen, along with another of his minor league holders. Nobody said why, but, shortly later, his divorce became public, and people assume he was putting together her part of the holdings.

The Ironbirds are owned by the Tufton group, and the Ripken brothers are majority shareholders.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


Orioles Information


Orioles News and Information

Daily Organizational Boxscores
News

Tony's Takes

Orioles Roster Resource

Orioles Prospect Information

2018 End of Season Top 30 Prospects List

Prospect Scouting Reports

Statistics

2019 Orioles Stats

2019 Orioles Minor League Stats

Baseball Savant Stats






  • Posts

    • I am still adjusting to all the new people, in part because I watch over the MLB app and I frenetically switch between the TV, radio, home/away feeds so everyone kinda blurs together (particularly after a few beers). I think Ben is awesome on color. I like Melanie the best so far on play by play. Her even, steady, slow, accurate calls are a classic style. I find her voice pleasing. Sure, she could work on the excitement a bit perhaps, but I think it is better to grow into excitement than to come to the door with it. She will find her signature call. She has the most upside of the lot I think.
    • I don't have a problem with the baseball knowledge or game calling accuracy of anyone on the TV or radio crews this year. I fully understand the difficult circumstances and that they're beholden to what they see on TV. I don't think any of them are dunces about baseball. I'm sure all of them are very nice people, too. The lack of excitement -- especially with Scott Garceau -- is the worst thing for me. Jim Hunter may not have known the sport, but at least he knew how to make a home run call. He was also an excellent setup man for Jim Palmer's often sarcastic retorts. Palmer was so great at underhandedly insulting Hunter for not even "getting it" after Palmer hinted at it and it was so funny. Their dynamic was far more entertaining than Garceau and McDonald.
    • In some areas of private industry, there's a (fairly brutal, honestly) performance management process called "stack ranking." In stack ranking, everyone's performance is compared against each other, using a combination of objective and subjective metrics. The elite few at the top get raises and/or promotions; the solid contributors get to coast along undisturbed; the struggling end up getting "help" to try to improve their performance; and the worst of the worst get fired. This happens on a monthly, bi-annual or yearly cadence depending on the company. Stack ranking of umpires would be based on their accuracy on calls compared to the "correct" call via video review / electronic strike zone. You could set up the strata exactly as you do for tech workers: give raises to the best, let the good ones keep going, pull the struggling ones from daily MLB games and have them work on their calls and improve in some kind of umpiring camp, and just fire the worst ~1% every year. The other thing you could do is add more umpires to the umpiring pool. This would increase the "overhead" cost of umpiring, yes, but by adding more umpires without adding more teams or games, you could set up a situation where only the best X% of umpires get to call MLB games on the regular. The rest would either call simulated games, extended spring training games, or minor league games until they get better.
    • Please no more Jim Hunter EVER.  Joe Angel is retired.  I expect Gary and Jim back next year.  I agree with Frobby and Tony.  I think the new crew has done very well under trying circumstances.  You are sitting in an empty stadium watching a TV calling play by play.  Ben McDonald is great.  I hope Brian Roberts comes back next year.  I like Melanie Newman.  Like Tony says she knows baseball.  She can work on her excitement at times but these are all new people she is working with again under unusual conditions.  Scott is fine.  Maybe I am unobjective because I know he is such a good guy but I think that comes through during the broadcast much like it does with Gary Thorne.  I like that this regime of the Orioles made changes in response to what fans told them.  They tried to make the presentation better and I think they have very much overall.  I am sure they will tweek the changes and make it even better.
    • I haven't heard much from our radio guys, but it's kind of hilarious how the MLB editors in this highlight reel had to pull in our radio broadcasters multiple times for the call when Scott Garceau is using a living room conversational voice to call a big play where the O's are scoring.  Based on this, I'm satisfied with the radio crew. I just really hate Scott Garceau's complete and total lack of energy. Ben is a great color guy but I wouldn't want him calling the play by play either, he's also extremely sedate.  
    • Here's a whole playlist. 1981 album.  
    • Absolutely atrocious. Never seen umpiring that bad.    8th inning, tying run on second, Castro should have had Quinn struck out on #4. Phillies announcer said "3-1...I think? That looked right down the middle." Also given a free ball on#1.  Game on the line, Sulser should have had Harper struck out on #4. Perfect pitch painting the corner. 
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...