Jump to content
weams

Villar Traded to Marlins for LHS Easton Lucas

Recommended Posts

5 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

It seems to me that Elias has three goals this offseason. Cut payroll (hopefully to be reinvested into the infrastructure of the organization), lose as many games as possible at the big league level next year (For better draft pick), and maximize any return for current players that he doesn't think will be part of a winning future here.

Even the relatively cheap resigning of Richards Bleier gives them a fairly low cost player who might bring back a player if a need arises from a contender if he can show he's fully healthy and pitching like he did pre-surgery.

If his thoughts are solely on the "strategic vision" of the future, then all of his moves makes sense, even the Villar move. The only problem I have with the Villar move under this scenario is could he have maximized Villar's value even more if Villar played well and a need arose from a contender during spring training or at the trading deadline. If that had happened, the chances are Elias could have netted a much better return than what he got now, though it appeared he wasn't willing to take that financial risk on to see if that scenario played out.

How could Villar's value have been maximized any more than it was last season? He was in the midst of a career year, they shopped him, and no one was interested. Why would you play that game of Russian roulette again when the industry consensus is that he will regress in 2020? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, DrungoHazewood said:

I think the league told Jeter he had to have at least a few players on the team making over the minimum or it might hurt negotiations on the new CBA.  I think that's the only reason they acquired Villar.

I think you're going Jeter too much credit. Jeter is the Elway of MLB. He's an idiot with zero long term vision or game plan for the franchise. This is just one of many stream of consciousness type moves since he's taken over the reigns. That Gallen for Chisholm trade he made last year was a terrible move too. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, NCRaven said:

I think they want to flip him in season.  They're betting that they'll get more in return than they gave us in the first place.  We'll see.

I have my doubts.  The Orioles have been actively trying to trade him for a while and got little interest, and he's coming off a career year so he may trend down a bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

They didn't. It's just another reason to bitch, complain and second guess. 

They *weren't (not didn't). Batting 1,000 with my poor grammar today. Too much coffee...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, wildbillhiccup said:

I think you're going Jeter too much credit. Jeter is the Elway of MLB. He's an idiot with zero long term vision or game plan for the franchise. This is just one of many stream of consciousness type moves since he's taken over the reigns. That Gallen for Chisholm trade he made last year was a terrible move too. 

You don't have to be a MacArthur genius to pick up a call from the league office, listen to someone tell you to get the payroll up, and go trade for Jonathan Villar.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, DrungoHazewood said:

You don't have to be a MacArthur genius to pick up a call from the league office, listen to someone tell you to get the payroll up, and go trade for Jonathan Villar.

...so we're going to assume that Jeter knows how to answer a land line? ;) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

Is there any chance that Elias has a need to use the funds that would have gone to Villar now for investment facilities, player development and international signings? I would have preferred to keep Villar, but if Elias ends up using that money into yielding multiple prospects I'm ok with it. Plus short term it's not like Villar turns the Orioles into a team that wins 81+ games. 

Potentially. I don't really know, but would be much happier with the Villar trade if we knew the money was needed for some kind of investment in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

How could Villar's value have been maximized any more than it was last season? He was in the midst of a career year, they shopped him, and no one was interested. Why would you play that game of Russian roulette again when the industry consensus is that he will regress in 2020? 

Well clearly Elias agree with you. Villar's value could go up with need by a contender and if he continues to play like he did last year. Villar is in his walk year so he has every reason to be in the best shape of his career and at 29-years old and with his skill set, it's doubtful he is going to have a huge regression. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

How could Villar's value have been maximized any more than it was last season? He was in the midst of a career year, they shopped him, and no one was interested. Why would you play that game of Russian roulette again when the industry consensus is that he will regress in 2020? 

Villar wasn't really in the midst of a career year at the trade deadline. His OPS was in the mid-700's in July. 

In fact, he only had one month with an OPS above .800, and that was August when his OPS was above 1.000. 

In other words, he didn't have much value last July. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Well clearly Elias agree with you. Villar's value could go up with need by a contender and if he continues to play like he did last year. Villar is in his walk year so he has every reason to be in the best shape of his career and at 29-years old and with his skill set, it's doubtful he is going to have a huge regression. 

Fangraphs has him projected for 17 HRs, 77 Runs, 66 RBI, 33 SBs, and .257 BA (with a .329 OBP). If he gets 600+ ABs again I think he can hit those numbers. If he doesn't, I think he'll fall short. And he'll provide you with average defense at 2B and below average defense at SS. Maybe I'm just being overly pessimistic, but I just don't see a player with those types of numbers being in high demand. If I'm wrong and the Marlins are able to flip him for a decent prospect I'll be the first to say I was wrong. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

Villar wasn't really in the midst of a career year at the trade deadline. His OPS was in the mid-700's in July. 

In fact, he only had one month with an OPS above .800, and that was August when his OPS was above 1.000. 

In other words, he didn't have much value last July. 

I hear you, but there still limited interest after his career year. For whatever reason it's pretty clear the other MLB teams aren't buying his success.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, wildbillhiccup said:

I hear you, but there still limited interest after his career year. For whatever reason it's pretty clear the other MLB teams aren't buying his success.

End of July you were getting a mid .700's poor fielding 2b/SS. This is a guy who was traded with another piece for Jonathan Schoop.

End of year you're getting a guy whose arb # is $10 million and who had one great month but was otherwise mostly still the mid .700's average at best fielding middle infielder. 

I seriously think the O's made out big time just by letting him go. We'd be marginally better with him, IMO, at a cost of $10 m. I don't think he'll net a great return at all at this year's deadline, but I guess we'll see.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, LookinUp said:

End of July you were getting a mid .700's poor fielding 2b/SS. This is a guy who was traded with another piece for Jonathan Schoop.

End of year you're getting a guy whose arb # is $10 million and who had one great month but was otherwise mostly still the mid .700's average at best fielding middle infielder. 

I seriously think the O's made out big time just by letting him go. We'd be marginally better with him, IMO, at a cost of $10 m. I don't think he'll net a great return at all at this year's deadline, but I guess we'll see.

Agree 100% with your last sentence. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

2 hours ago, wildbillhiccup said:

I think you're going Jeter too much credit. Jeter is the Elway of MLB. He's an idiot with zero long term vision or game plan for the franchise. This is just one of many stream of consciousness type moves since he's taken over the reigns. That Gallen for Chisholm trade he made last year was a terrible move too. 

Jeter makes Elway look like Bill Belichick in comparison. Jeter is only doing the job because he was given an ownership stake. Why would he want to do the day-to-day work of a MLB GM after making $265M in career earnings from the Yankees alone not including endorsements. He doesn't. 

I don't know who is really the day-to-day GM for the Marlins, but it's certainly not Jeter. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


Orioles Information


Orioles News and Information

Daily Organizational Boxscores
News

Tony's Takes

Orioles Roster Resource

Orioles Prospect Information

2018 End of Season Top 30 Prospects List

Prospect Scouting Reports

Statistics

2019 Orioles Stats

2019 Orioles Minor League Stats

Baseball Savant Stats






  • Posts

    • The .377 was a fluke.  But he did also hit .344 in the AFL that Fall, too.   Do I think he’s a potential .300+ hitter as a major leaguer?   Not at all.    But a guy who can play a solid major league CF doesn’t have to hit a ton to be a useful player.    His career MiL line of .264/.350/.387 would do the trick just fine if he could pull that off in the majors.    
    • I don’t think so.    I have a college degree and a law degree.    My wife has a college degree and two masters’ degrees.   All three of my kids have college degrees, from pricey private colleges that we paid for in full.   One of them has a graduate degree as well.    I totally understand the value of a good education (which is different than “intelligence”). But Kjerstad is a guy who chose to enter the draft before he’d finished college and take a pile of money to play professional athletics.    In my mind (and probably by contract), he’s obligated to give his employer priority over completing his degree, which plenty of players do without declining their professional obligations.    Now understand, I don’t think Kjerstad did this.   I believe he was unable to participate for medical reasons and decided to use the time to continue his education, which is great.    But I wouldn’t agree with it if he had simply chosen to blow off Fall Instructs to take classes.      
    • So now the goalpost is if makes an impact on his major league career the next season?  That's quite a jump.  I will say that one year of age when a player is making his MLB debut can hugely impact his future earnings. No one in this thread is suggesting that he shouldn't finish his degree at some point.  Also intelligence and education aren't the same thing.    Of course odds are very good that the speculation of him not being able to attend the camp and instead using his time to work on his degree is correct.
    • Yes, a player COULD benefit from the instruction league, even though its a fact that no one has ever benefited enough to be a starter on the major league level the following year, AND he COULD also be in an auto accident and not be able to play any sports. How much is the Instruction League going to help him then.  The topic of this thread is about the player, but the real discussion is about each Poster's value system . . . intelligence or athletics!
    • You must have seen a different guy than I saw.  He committed 4 errors in 9 games.  3 of those at SS.  From his minor league history I think he might have a chance at 2B but not SS.
    • I would say that's crazy, but after this year, I'd say nothing is out of the question.  The only thing they have going for them is they have a successful major league season under their belt with no deaths and limited interruptions (not surprisingly). Even if they don't want to have a season at all the stadiums and all the travel, they should be able to have a Florida and Arizona camp leagues like they should of had this year.
    • I’d say maybe yes, maybe no. He spends 4-5 weeks playing with and against other professionals, gets some coaching, gets some eyes on him and they give him a program for what to do over the winter based on that experience and maybe he gets some of his own ideas of what he needs to work on based on that experience.   That gives him a leg up on next year compared to not doing it.   If they thought Fall Instructs didn’t benefit players, they wouldn’t do them, right?
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...