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Legend_Of_Joey

What do you want from this rebuild?

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I want Elias to achieve his stated goal of building a sustainable pipeline of talent, so we don't have to go through a complete tear down again. I want competitive teams every year with a few contending and playoff teams sprinkled in for good measure. And I want the competitiveness to begin in 2022 or 2023 (at the latest).

And I don't think this is a "screw the fans" approach, more like a "screw the shortsighted fans" approach.

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Fighting for first in the East, even if they fall short a few times?

This is the one, we are a small market team, with the Nats on our doorstep in a tough division with big spenders. 

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3 hours ago, mdbdotcom said:

I want Elias to achieve his stated goal of building a sustainable pipeline of talent, so we don't have to go through a complete tear down again. I want competitive teams every year with a few contending and playoff teams sprinkled in for good measure. And I want the competitiveness to begin in 2022 or 2023 (at the latest).

And I don't think this is a "screw the fans" approach, more like a "screw the shortsighted fans" approach.

I agree with you 100% until the last sentence 

I still think that most fans could get behind them trading their chips. The Villar deal was really handled poorly by the Orioles. The result was a fringe prospect being the best offer that they could get before the tender deadline.

The other important fact is the different levels of Orioles fan. The folks that are buying season tickets are paying part of their budget on entertainment. Many aren't so heavy into the team that they regularly post on message boards. They see the team that they are investing money in 2019-2020 moved on from an exciting player like Villar and received a fringe pitching prospect. 

The casual fan who will buy tickets and attend a few games also doesn't care about the rebuild. They want to feel like they are getting value for their money. When they don't they obviously stop going or attend less games. The result of both of these factors is the declining attendance. 

I will start by saying that I havent had season tickets in years. I also don't attend many games as a result of my ongoing dissatisfaction with Peter Angelos. So I'm neither of the scenarios above.

I can say that these fans make up the majority. Who wants to watch the Orioles get demolished on most nights when attending a game? The bad press alone about the waiver wire false information will cost the team ticket sales in my opinion. The guys who errantly reported it won't go back and correct it. 

I think that the team can continue with the rebuild and try to make the product entertaining in the process. Villar gave fans something to be excited about. Watching Richie Martin who shouldn't have been in the major leagues be an automatic out most nights wasn't. The same goes for watching the waiver wire pitcher get pounded. I think you can market the let the kids play approach. But not the watch us finish dead last approach.

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25 minutes ago, MongoBoy said:

A little less of this maybe?

ImpureFalseAsianporcupine-size_restricte

So we care so much about Villar, and how it was a “soulless” move, but yet we laugh at one of our prospects slipping on a wet field and getting concussed?

But yeah... back to the Villar outcry and how much he meant to the organization. 

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20 hours ago, Legend_Of_Joey said:

We know this is going to be a cold, soulless, "screw the fans" process.

But what is "acceptable" for the end result?

World Series champions?

Playoff contenders every year Elias is here after the "rebuild" is done?

Fighting for first in the East, even if they fall short a few times?

.500 or better and you are happy? 

Anything in between? 

A self-sustaining competitor. A team that most years has the pipeline of talent to contend without having to sign a bunch of free agents.  Getting through the playoffs is a crapshoot; setting "winning a crapshoot" as a goal is foolish.

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20 hours ago, JR Oriole said:

Winning a World Series once.  It has been 36 years and counting since we even appeared in one, let alone won it.  Just one time, being the last team standing at the end.  It should not be too much to ask after all of this time. 

This. Want one in my lifetime.

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9 hours ago, Frobby said:

Yes, and I prefer Baltimore.    Houston is like LA without the spectacular weather and aspiring actresses.    Just a sprawling mess.   

I do too.

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16 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

The expectation of a W and the idea of a rebuild kind of don't go together.  Sounds like you want a team that wins more than they lose.  People say they don't want us to operate like we did from 1999-2011, but it sure sounds like they do.  

God forbid that I would like a team that wins more than it loses after a rebuild. I guess I should want a rebuild and 90+ loses after a rebuild, or a team that is in a continuous rebuild. For a rebuild, I want a team that can entertain and be worth watching for the 162 game schedule, the marathon. The playoffs are a sprint and a bonus IMO. 

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11 hours ago, thezeroes said:

World Series winner but along the way I would like:

To have a player brought up that is in contention for Rookie Of the Year, Every Year.

To have a Farm System that is in the top 5 every year.

To not have a single player signed to a contract that extends beyond their 30th birthday that is more than one year in length.

To not keep players beyond their serviceability.  Get rid of them before they start to fail/falter.

Have all trades be to our advantage.

Do not trade Prospects for Rentals.

Unload to reload when players get too expensive.

In other words, you're expecting any number of things that are realistically unobtainable.  No current organization comes close to meeting this list of expectations.

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I would like for this front office to be a top 10 front office and then we can have all the benefits of their success.  Having the success of a team like Tampa Bay but with some additional resources.  To others on this thread, even a large market team like the BoSox doesn't enjoy the type of success requested by some here - consistent top five farm system, consistent RoY contender, etc - lol.  This success only happens when a teams drafts ahead of the curve and signs international prospects ahead of the curve.  For the first time ever, I believe we have the ownership commitment and quality people in place to make that happen.  

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2 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

In other words, you're expecting any number of things that are realistically unobtainable.  No current organization comes close to meeting this list of expectations.

If we had a winning team, then what would people in OH have to gripe and complain about? :)

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