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DrungoHazewood

Ride 'em Hard

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Just now, DrungoHazewood said:

I believe that Bob Gibson wanted you to believe that.  I'm naturally skeptical of legendary stuff.  People talk about Gibson hitting a batter every other inning out of spite and meanness and intimidation.  But he hit fewer batters per inning than Chris Tillman or Miguel Gonzalez.

I don't know, maybe he did throw hard every pitch.  Maybe he was like Nolan Ryan and Livan Hernandez and had some kind of freakish physical build that let him throw more and harder than normal human pitchers.  But as I said, I'm naturally skeptical.

Well now, where's the fun in THAT?  Come on Drungo, you gotta love some of the legendary stuff.

That said, I will agree that he didn't hit as many as people are lead to believe.  But he had to be one of the most intimidating pitchers of the era.  I don't think he had any problems throwing inside.

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9 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Yeah, but...I mean, c'mon.  I don't believe that Bob Gibson wasn't a max effort guy all the time.  I will buy that other pitchers weren't max effort guys but I believe Bob Gibson wanted to shove every fastball and slider down everyone's throat from the first batter to the last.

Also, I think there's a difference between throwing hard and THROWING HARD.  Bob Gibson probably threw low to mid 90s, and did that for 300 innings.  But if he were born in 1990 he'd have thrown 98 for 200 innings, or would be turned into a reliever throwing 101 for 65 innings.

Yes, Ryan threw 101 for 300 innings and walked 220 guys some years.  But he is an alien.

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5 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Well now, where's the fun in THAT?  Come on Drungo, you gotta love some of the legendary stuff.

That said, I will agree that he didn't hit as many as people are lead to believe.  But he had to be one of the most intimidating pitchers of the era.  I don't think he had any problems throwing inside.

Legends are fun.  But they're also fun to poke and prod and sometimes debunk.  People claim Ruth hit 600 foot homers, when the biggest steroid-jacked guys hitting off 100 mph fastballs couldn't come close to that.  So I'm curious, I try to figure out if that was possible.  And I think it probably wasn't, not unless the QA on the baseballs was so poor that you'd often get a really juiced one.  You don't have to believe the legends to have fun with them.

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1 minute ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Legends are fun.  But they're also fun to poke and prod and sometimes debunk.  People claim Ruth hit 600 foot homers, when the biggest steroid-jacked guys hitting off 100 mph fastballs couldn't come close to that.  So I'm curious, I try to figure out if that was possible.  And I think it probably wasn't, not unless the QA on the baseballs was so poor that you'd often get a really juiced one.  You don't have to believe the legends to have fun with them.

They didn't measure the ball until it stopped rolling.

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2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

They didn't measure the ball until it stopped rolling.

Dan Brouthers hit one over the fence at Union Park in 1894 that rolled down the street, into a wagon, which got dumped into a ship and ended up in China.  Or something like that.  That's why they painted "HERE" on the fence, and why they put up the "HERE" flag at Memorial when Frank hit the one all the way out.

They should put a HERE flag on the top of the Warehouse just to mess with people.

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Has any of you read this Satchel Paige biograhy?

https://www.amazon.com/Satchel-Life-Times-American-Legend-ebook/dp/B002BH5HUS/ref=pd_sbsd_14_1/130-1112103-2008738?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B002BH5HUS&pd_rd_r=81969eb5-9378-48fb-88ae-fc22f562bddb&pd_rd_w=hdj1H&pd_rd_wg=FSp3H&pf_rd_p=2c2d0d3b-b3c5-4110-93fa-2c1270309ac1&pf_rd_r=E4NSP525FTAJB5BZHEVK&psc=1&refRID=E4NSP525FTAJB5BZHEVK

 

If the legends are even close to being halfway correct, the longevity and endurance of Satchel as a pitcher are incomprehensible.  This was a very interesting book for those that are looking for something to read.

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17 hours ago, Yossarian said:

Has any of you read this Satchel Paige biograhy?

https://www.amazon.com/Satchel-Life-Times-American-Legend-ebook/dp/B002BH5HUS/ref=pd_sbsd_14_1/130-1112103-2008738?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B002BH5HUS&pd_rd_r=81969eb5-9378-48fb-88ae-fc22f562bddb&pd_rd_w=hdj1H&pd_rd_wg=FSp3H&pf_rd_p=2c2d0d3b-b3c5-4110-93fa-2c1270309ac1&pf_rd_r=E4NSP525FTAJB5BZHEVK&psc=1&refRID=E4NSP525FTAJB5BZHEVK

 

If the legends are even close to being halfway correct, the longevity and endurance of Satchel as a pitcher are incomprehensible.  This was a very interesting book for those that are looking for something to read.

I have not, I'm sure it's very interesting.  Paige was probably one of the guys mentioned above who was a physical freak and whose body didn't break down at levels of abuse in 30 years that would have crushed a normal major leaguer in a season or two.

But also the Negro Leagues were something like Korea or Japan or Cuba today.  They had 28-year-old inner circle HOFers on the same field with 16-year-olds and 43-year-olds and guys who were A ball quality.  The Homestead Grays would play the Baltimore Black Sox one day, and some local semi-pro team the next.  Paige would almost certainly have been able to pace himself at reduced effort for a lot of his herculean stretches.

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On 5/21/2020 at 10:12 AM, Redskins Rick said:

MLB doesnt even include him, when you look at no-no's and 131+ pitches.

 

 

That's strange. I watched the game on Youtube.

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3 minutes ago, half hop said:

That's strange. I watched the game on Youtube.

I agree, strange, and I was sure the game was played, but was confused why they didnt capture it among the other no-no over 131 pitches.

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39 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

I agree, strange, and I was sure the game was played, but was confused why they didnt capture it among the other no-no over 131 pitches.

I'm sure it's because comprehensive pitch count data starts in the 1980s, and isn't even complete then.  I'd guess they'll eventually incorporate the handful of games where there are videos and other sources of data, but things like Project Scoresheet started the regular collection of this data a little over 30 years ago and it's a lot of work to incorporate scattershot information from other sources.

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19 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Also, I think there's a difference between throwing hard and THROWING HARD.  Bob Gibson probably threw low to mid 90s, and did that for 300 innings.  But if he were born in 1990 he'd have thrown 98 for 200 innings, or would be turned into a reliever throwing 101 for 65 innings.

Yes, Ryan threw 101 for 300 innings and walked 220 guys some years.  But he is an alien.

Gibson had a slider that the bottom fell out and hitters wished he had thrown.

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