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MLB makes new proposal- Union demands start date and terms by Monday

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5 hours ago, Redskins Rick said:

I think the lack of a real MLB commish, and just a puppet for the owners, doesnt bode well for us fans feeling that both sides are clowns.

That's the very purpose of a commish, since Kennesaw Mountain Landis days. Along the way many have worked around that parameter and did some very good things for the game. But every single one has been a mouthpiece for owners. It's in the job description. :noidea:

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10 minutes ago, scOtt said:

That's the very purpose of a commish, since Kennesaw Mountain Landis days. Along the way many have worked around that parameter and did some very good things for the game. But every single one has been a mouthpiece for owners. It's in the job description. :noidea:

There is no baseball equivalent of FIFA (not that that always works well), there is no higher level organization or voice for the good of the game.  Landis only got away with being independent because baseball was reeling from the Black Sox.  The commish has been a representative of MLB owners for my whole life and years prior to that.  Bud took it a step further by actually being an dual-hatted owner/commish.  Faye Vincent tried to be a little independent and was swiftly crushed for it.

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It dawns on me that this is EXACTLY like a strike (or lockout.) There's been a work stoppage, they are negotiating (arguing...) a deal where they can start back up. And now they're at a dead standstill. It's exactly like a strike and will probably have the same affect on a LOT of fans.

Cutting off their noses to spite their face.

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1 hour ago, Redskins Rick said:

We can put fake fans in the stands.

Like the cardboard cutouts in cop cars by the side of the road. 😛

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17 minutes ago, scOtt said:

That's the very purpose of a commish, since Kennesaw Mountain Landis days. Along the way many have worked around that parameter and did some very good things for the game. But every single one has been a mouthpiece for owners. It's in the job description. :noidea:

I remember Kuhn having no problem going after King George or Charley Finely.

I dont believe there is a single thing Manfred has done for the good of the game.

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Just now, Redskins Rick said:

I remember Kuhn having no problem going after King George or Charley Finely.

I dont believe there is a single thing Manfred has done for the good of the game.

Total and utter yes man. Yes SIR man...

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2 hours ago, weams said:

I watch the KBO. I absolutely want somebaseball. 

I've watched some KBO.  And thanks to @scOtt's shady Russian streaming site I've been watching my boys at 1860 München try to get promoted out of the German 3. Liga.  Premier League will restart in a few weeks.  I'll be okay for a while.

But MLB and the MLBPA are a bunch of idiots. Can you blame anyone for being apathetic about baseball when they don't seem to care?

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3 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

I remember Kuhn having no problem going after King George or Charley Finely.

Kuhn was a complete and total tool.  He went after Steinbrenner and Finley because he had personal disagreements with them.  He was a die hard traditionalist and Webster's dictionary conservative, who couldn't stand to see free agency or player sales or anything out of step with 1950s era hidebound MLB ownership.  I'd like someone to name just one thing Bowie Kuhn did that was of long-term benefit to the game of baseball. 

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1 minute ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I've watched some KBO.  And thanks to @scOtt's shady Russian streaming site I've been watching my boys at 1860 München try to get promoted out of the German 3. Liga.  Premier League will restart in a few weeks.  I'll be okay for a while.

But MLB and the MLBPA are a bunch of idiots. Can you blame anyone for being apathetic about baseball when they don't seem to care?

The players foolishly thought they had some leverage here. 

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3 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Kuhn was a complete and total tool.  He went after Steinbrenner and Finley because he had personal disagreements with them.  He was a die hard traditionalist and Webster's dictionary conservative, who couldn't stand to see free agency or player sales or anything out of step with 1950s era hidebound MLB ownership.  I'd like someone to name just one thing Bowie Kuhn did that was of long-term benefit to the game of baseball. 

MLB did double in attendance during his reign, but probably not because of anything he did.

I guess his shining moment was pitching the World Series to prime time and night time to NBC and they had 61 million tune in.

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1 hour ago, Redskins Rick said:

I remember Kuhn having no problem going after King George or Charley Finely.

I dont believe there is a single thing Manfred has done for the good of the game.

And what do you define as being “for the good of the game?”    What would you like to see a commissioner do?   I don’t mean right now (though I’m interested in that), but in general.   

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1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Kuhn was a complete and total tool.  He went after Steinbrenner and Finley because he had personal disagreements with them.  He was a die hard traditionalist and Webster's dictionary conservative, who couldn't stand to see free agency or player sales or anything out of step with 1950s era hidebound MLB ownership.  I'd like someone to name just one thing Bowie Kuhn did that was of long-term benefit to the game of baseball. 

If you like the DH, it came about during his reign.   Now I was too young then to remember the politics, as to whether he championed it or fought it.   There were actually two separate leagues then with their own CEO/management, and even before the DH I think there were some rules differences (maybe a different balk rule?).   So maybe the DH came about solely from AL leadership and Kuhn had nothing to do with it.

The owners had the reserve clause and the antitrust exemption and they weren't going to give that up without a knockdown drag-out legal and labor fight.   So Kuhn was certainly the right man for the job from their point of view.

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1 hour ago, SteveA said:

If you like the DH, it came about during his reign.   Now I was too young then to remember the politics, as to whether he championed it or fought it.   There were actually two separate leagues then with their own CEO/management, and even before the DH I think there were some rules differences (maybe a different balk rule?).   So maybe the DH came about solely from AL leadership and Kuhn had nothing to do with it.

The owners had the reserve clause and the antitrust exemption and they weren't going to give that up without a knockdown drag-out legal and labor fight.   So Kuhn was certainly the right man for the job from their point of view.

Charlie Finley, owner of the As, was the driving force pushing the DH rule change in 1973...But Bowie supported it....

Bill Lee, Red Sox pitcher, said “The DH is the bastard son of Charlie Finley and Bowie Kuhn.” 

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