Jump to content
Tony-OH

Big announcement on the future of Orioles Hangout

Recommended Posts

There are plenty of places to discuss politics, politics of sport, sport in politics...This just ain't that place. 

  • Upvote 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

It has been very real, my friends.

Obviously some great people on here and I wish you all well. I’m grateful for the opportunity to have met a lot of you. 
 
I don’t pretend to think that baseball is gonna miss me at all, but the politicization of one of my first loves is enough for me to turn my back for good. I’ve got a 2 year old boy and we are expecting another on Monday. I’m hopeful that they will play the game as Daddy did and grow to love it as well. Hopefully by then the world will have unplugged its head from its ass.

Thank you Tony for providing a fantastic place to discuss, commiserate, and here and there, celebrate. Thank you Weams for being you. Thanks Drungo, Frobby, Paul, Sports Guy, Moose (youR Mom’s a pillow biter), Agent Orange, Bobmc, Scott, Bigbird, cindyluvsbrady and all of the other old timers for all of the laughs and semi reasonable trade proposals. And most of all thank you Mark Teixeira for going to that Ravens game back in the day. 

Enjoy the CBA pissing match!!!!

Congrats on the second son. Another masculine child.  You have my digits. And if you lost them, shoot me a note. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope the OH persists and thrives. There is something beautiful about a sports site that is so explicitly apolitical in the midst of societal upheaval that demands everything be political. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My two cents: Baseball is baseball. The people who run it, play it, and market it have always been politically active. Maybe their political affiliations have been consistent; maybe they've changed over time -- I don't honestly know. Sometimes those political statements have been loud and in-your-face in media, and sometimes they haven't. You only have to look back to the times of Jackie Robinson to find a time when baseball's politics were very much in the face of every fan, on display in every game and headline news in every newspaper.

Any social activity where people get to talking is bound to brush up against political beliefs, and that's true of broadcasters on the air as well as people on a forum. I am all for keeping this forum politics-free. I don't think the fact that some people in power at MLB corporate choosing a side should prevent us from talking about and enjoying the game apolitically here on the forum.

In writing this post, I thought long and hard, and spent a good few minutes really trying to immerse myself in this hypothetical situation: What if the MLB were overtly broadcasting with political beliefs I disagree with? Would I still watch the Orioles and talk about them on OH?

I decided that yes, I would, but only to a certain extent. I would ignore what I perceived as the incorrect babbling of the broadcasters, and focus on the game. If things were so constant and so unbearable that they started doing things like changing the name of the "Home Run" to a "Trump Run" or something, and made that a running theme throughout the entire lexicon of the game, that's when it would start getting too much for me.

In other words, I can see where someone on the other side could be looking at MLB's current politics and maybe deciding that it's "too much for them." I can sympathize with it. Like I said, I would try to look past the political exhaltations of the sport and focus on the game, but if that became impossible, I could see myself reaching a breaking point and deciding to bow out.

So it's complicated, and I don't think there's a hard and fast answer that applies to everyone. For that reason I'm totally, 100% respectful of any decision Tony makes whether it's to keep the forum up or to close shop in light of the political beliefs MLB has started to espouse this year.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Been lurking on this site since my parents had dial up internet. Not sure what I’ll read in the bathroom if it goes away.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, makoman said:

I agree that I don’t care about Trey Mancini’s political beliefs. That’s why I don’t care if he wants to express them. If he wants to stay quiet that’s great too. People just get all bent out of shape IMO when players they like suddenly come out with views they don’t like, and now they aren’t sure if they still want to like the player or not. If you think baseball and politics should be separate then you should be able to root for Trey Mancini even if he has disagreeable views about the 27th Amendment, or whatever your cause of choice may be. Or if that makes you like him less that’s fine too. But we don’t have to pretend these guys aren’t real people with opinions. I think I’m probably in the minority here but that’s alright. 
 

This is a different issue btw than whether I think we should talk about such things here. Heck no, no way should politics be discussed on this board, it’s one of the best things about this board and prevents it from being the cesspool that’s the rest of the internet. 

I agree with everything you said, but how many people hate Curt Schilling because of his politics? LotznLotz.

And how many people love player X because his politics are “correct”?

I hate Barry Bonds because he’s a jerk. I don’t know a thing about his politics.And that’s the way it should be.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

The Hangout will always be a politics free area. The question now is whether the Hangout will continue. It is something I've discussed with Michael and will sleep on as I consider all of the reasons why I want to take the time and energy to continue to support a sport that wants to be political. 

I support people of every race, sex, religion and sexual orientation. I have tried to make a place where none of that mattes, but now we exist in world that demonizes those of us who just want to celebrate what brings us together. I have a son who is a police officer now and I have to decide whether I can support a sport that glorifies an organization that hates police officers. An organization that has members/supporters who have shot and killed police officers for no other reason that they were doing their job.

I was going to make a decision but now have given pause. I will take some time to hear from trusted sources and then make the decision I can live with. At the end of the day, I have to look myself in the mirror and be able to like what I see and know I'm doing what's best.

I am trying my hardest to take my political opinion out of this decision but when baseball is forcing this upon us, I have to decide whether I can come to some kind of decision that takes many peoples best interest in mind.

I respect so many people on here, but in these times, as a leader of this community and site, I have to make the final decision. 

Do I continue to provide a politics free place where people can focus on baseball? Does that help? Or am I supporting a sport that hates my son and everything I stand for? 

Without getting more political, there is so much more to BLM than social justice, and the fact that major league baseball doesn't realize this has given me major pause. All my life I've been about being as fair as possible to everyone I've met. I've hired and led people of all races, religion and sexual orientations. I've prided myself that I've never treated anyone unfairly due to any of those reasons.

Now baseball wants to shove politics down our throats. In the past baseball has helped integrate this country by rightfully integrated baseball with Jackie Robinson and although it was just the first of many things they needed to do to be truly inclusive, it was a huge step in this country. Like MLK, Jackie Robinson was a true hero who fought against true racism within this country. Their fights and struggles for equality make them absolute American heroes. We are all better off because of their struggles to help this country get past true racist policies.

Now, we have people who have hijacked "social justice" for political causes and major league baseball has decide to support this and I'm struggling with this decision.

I will always be the first person to support peaceful protesting but it's clear that these same forces have joined forces with groups like ANTIFA to bring their political ways to the fore front while using "social justice" as a mechanism to hide behind. MLB has now chosen a side. They have decided they will choose the anti-police, the anti law and order, and anti Capitalism side.

As someone who has served under this flag in hostile countries, I can not idly stand by while MLB not only allows, but celebrates those who kneel during our national anthem, the song meant to bring us all together as Americans. Notice, I didn't put a color in front of that term. There should be no color to being an American. But we have forces in this country that hate that term and hate this country, and now MLB is celebrating this in the name of "social justice".

I realize I have strayed into politics in this post. But I wanted you to know all of the things I'm struggling with as I decide the future of this site. I want you to know that any decision that I make will not be in anger or because it was emotional, but because I ultimately had to do what I feel is right.

I will realize that no matter what I decide to do their will be a group of people who will not approve. I hope at least you will at least understand where I'm coming from and understand why I decided to make the decision.

Regardless, thank you for all of you support over the years. 

 

As a retired police officer, who worked front and center during the Freddie Grey riots and who dealt with racial issues daily based on the locations I mainly worked at, I want to thank your son for his service out there now.

As for the rest of your thoughts, I can see where you are going with it. Not that my opinion truly matters in the end, but definitely sleep on it.

Baseball, while it looks like it “chose” a side, did the least possible out of the three “major” sports. They aren’t putting written messages on their jerseys, fields, ect. Players didn’t speak up as much on social media as other sports and the one player who tends to turn everything political, didn’t opt out of the season, despite all of his whining. The predominant support of the factions you are referring to isn’t prevalent in baseball. Soccer has been more politically aligned. 

Unfortunately, I never got to serve under the flag like you did, so I might not feel the same way about it as you. I don’t like the kneeling either, but my stance has softened a bit about it. I still think the origins behind the reason for it are totally suspect (that can be a discussion for another time, if interested) and I still think it is not the best way, considering the circumstances behind the reason things hit a boiling point so far, but I will take it over the host of other stuff other leagues are not only allowing, but encouraging. 

This is a great site and the members are what makes it the way it is. There is a line on here that isn’t crossed. After possibly spending all day being inundated by news and opinions, coming here is great. I can see why it seems bad when the sport you love seems to cross that line, but in the end, did they not only step over the line, but spit on it, or straddle the line? 

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

The Hangout will always be a politics free area. The question now is whether the Hangout will continue. It is something I've discussed with Michael and will sleep on as I consider all of the reasons why I want to take the time and energy to continue to support a sport that wants to be political. 

I support people of every race, sex, religion and sexual orientation. I have tried to make a place where none of that mattes, but now we exist in world that demonizes those of us who just want to celebrate what brings us together. I have a son who is a police officer now and I have to decide whether I can support a sport that glorifies an organization that hates police officers. An organization that has members/supporters who have shot and killed police officers for no other reason that they were doing their job.

I was going to make a decision but now have given pause. I will take some time to hear from trusted sources and then make the decision I can live with. At the end of the day, I have to look myself in the mirror and be able to like what I see and know I'm doing what's best.

I am trying my hardest to take my political opinion out of this decision but when baseball is forcing this upon us, I have to decide whether I can come to some kind of decision that takes many peoples best interest in mind.

I respect so many people on here, but in these times, as a leader of this community and site, I have to make the final decision. 

Do I continue to provide a politics free place where people can focus on baseball? Does that help? Or am I supporting a sport that hates my son and everything I stand for? 

Without getting more political, there is so much more to BLM than social justice, and the fact that major league baseball doesn't realize this has given me major pause. All my life I've been about being as fair as possible to everyone I've met. I've hired and led people of all races, religion and sexual orientations. I've prided myself that I've never treated anyone unfairly due to any of those reasons.

Now baseball wants to shove politics down our throats. In the past baseball has helped integrate this country by rightfully integrated baseball with Jackie Robinson and although it was just the first of many things they needed to do to be truly inclusive, it was a huge step in this country. Like MLK, Jackie Robinson was a true hero who fought against true racism within this country. Their fights and struggles for equality make them absolute American heroes. We are all better off because of their struggles to help this country get past true racist policies.

Now, we have people who have hijacked "social justice" for political causes and major league baseball has decide to support this and I'm struggling with this decision.

I will always be the first person to support peaceful protesting but it's clear that these same forces have joined forces with groups like ANTIFA to bring their political ways to the fore front while using "social justice" as a mechanism to hide behind. MLB has now chosen a side. They have decided they will choose the anti-police, the anti law and order, and anti Capitalism side.

As someone who has served under this flag in hostile countries, I can not idly stand by while MLB not only allows, but celebrates those who kneel during our national anthem, the song meant to bring us all together as Americans. Notice, I didn't put a color in front of that term. There should be no color to being an American. But we have forces in this country that hate that term and hate this country, and now MLB is celebrating this in the name of "social justice".

I realize I have strayed into politics in this post. But I wanted you to know all of the things I'm struggling with as I decide the future of this site. I want you to know that any decision that I make will not be in anger or because it was emotional, but because I ultimately had to do what I feel is right.

I will realize that no matter what I decide to do their will be a group of people who will not approve. I hope at least you will at least understand where I'm coming from and understand why I decided to make the decision.

Regardless, thank you for all of you support over the years. 

Thank you for providing a place for me to state my views on baseball. 

I don’t normally do this, but that was truly a phenomenal post.

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

Orioles Information


Orioles News and Information

Daily Organizational Boxscores
News

Tony's Takes

Orioles Roster Resource

Orioles Prospect Information

2018 End of Season Top 30 Prospects List

Prospect Scouting Reports

Statistics

2019 Orioles Stats

2019 Orioles Minor League Stats

Baseball Savant Stats






  • Posts

    • Exactly. COVID restrictions really stopped the travel back and forth so it probably didn't make since to have Holt with the team and the minor leaguers. Either way, fraud is a really strong word to use and reeks of click bait by the NY Post.
    • That’s the thing, we have no idea when Holt was added to the coaches pension plan.  If it was when he was first hired in 2019 then it would seem more egregious, but if it was before this season as part of his promotion to Director of Pitching, then it seems more palatable, as his role was intended to blanket the majors & minors, and it sounds like the plan was for him to be in uniform on occasion, even if not once the game starts, since the number of coaches allowed during a game is limited. I just can’t see Elias potentially risking his career by covertly putting Holt in the coaches pension plan without getting approval from the Orioles HR department, or whoever is responsible for matters like this in the organization, along with MLB.  Elias is a smart guy, and only 2 years into what is likely his dream job as the GM of a Major League Baseball team.   I’m sure the other 3 coaches that were designated had to be approved as well, so if there was any issue with designating Holt as the 4th coach, you would think Elias and the O’s organization would have been told that when they first put him on the list of 4. To me, this article seems more like sensationalism, trying to tie Elias in with the Astros cheating scandal and making it seem like this situation with Holt is more of the same, as if anyone associated with the Astros must be deceptive and dishonest.  And the fact that they singled out Anthony Sanders as a coach that got  “screwed” seems like the lawsuit/claim of fraud could have come from his agent, because clearly this story was leaked by someone with an axe to grind.  But what if Holt was designated the 4th coach before Sanders got hired?  The point is, we don’t have all the facts, so to just assume Elias did this covertly to appease Holt without getting approval from anyone seems very irresponsible from a journalistic perspective.   Just the fact that this is being reported at all is obviously unsettling if you’re an O’s fan and a supporter of Elias, but I think this is more about sensationalism and click bait, by using the headline “Ex-Astros” and “fraud” to get people worked up about what is likely not much of anything.  It will be interesting to see if Elias or someone else with the organization talks about it and tries to clear it up, because you know that if he/they don’t, more and more people will start to wonder if this really could be a much more serious situation than it currently appears to be.
    • Yea, seems like an administrative issue with a potential fine at most. 
    • Remember when James Franklin was supposed to be the coach in waiting then wasn't? Lord almighty the MD decision makers for sports are awful.  BTW, Tagovailoa is awful. He looks scared, unprepared, inaccurate, and has really poor decision making skills. Good Lord, this is the guy who is the best they can find with all the transfers? Nice job there Locksley.
    • I am sorry but the word Fraud here is a little strong.  There are rules on which coaches can be listed to be eligible for the MLB pension and there maybe a question whether or not his role this past season qualifies or not.  I suspect the fact there were no minor leagues and the whole COVID situation may have changed what that role end up being probably is a factor.  To me fraud would be an intention to deceive what his role was, not whether it qualifies or not.  However in the world we live in today I guess it pays to use words like fraud. It makes the story more interesting. 
    • Here's something else to consider, maybe this was part of his agreement to come over to the Orioles? Maybe Elias told him he would use him in a "hybrid" role but due to COVID, that didn't really happen this year?  Maybe Sanders was told he would be hired but not on the pension plan for this year?  I'm going to wait until all the facts come out, but this piece to me makes it sound much worse. I mean, why bring up Sanders' race? What are they trying to insinuate by doing that? That seems unfair and it's doubtful that has anything to do with the decisions that were made. Either way, Elias does not seem like a guy who is going to risk something serious for a coaches pension situation. I'll let this play out.
    • Nothing new that I am aware of.   Not sure what will happen first, streaming or the end of the MASN court case. 
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...