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wildcard

Claimed: Pitcher Carson Fulmer

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1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Who has Elias claimed and turned around?

Terry Crowley has done a nice job with turning around Nunez, Severino, and Alberto. It’s on Obvious that all his years around the game really outweigh all this analytics stuff. 

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Just now, Frobby said:

Oh?   The 2013 Astros won 51 games.    Tell me who they turned around by then.  

https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/HOU/2013.shtml

I think you misunderstood my point.  It didn't take the Astros multiple years to turn around the careers of folks like Verlander, Cole and Morton.

That is what we are talking about here, not overall winning and losing.

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14 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think you misunderstood my point.  It didn't take the Astros multiple years to turn around the careers of folks like Verlander, Cole and Morton.

That is what we are talking about here, not overall winning and losing.

Not at all the same.   O's don't have the talent of Verlander or Cole to turnaround.    Way different.

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2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Not at all the same.   O's don't have the talent of Verlander or Cole to turnaround.    Way different.

So the guys Elias are picking up are two year projects instead of two months?

You don't actually believe this right?

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28 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

So the guys Elias are picking up are two year projects instead of two months?

You don't actually believe this right?

I think wildcard has a point on Verlander and Cole.   These were extremely talented pitchers who had been great in the past and just needed a tweak to get back on track.   The O’s don’t really have anyone like that to work with right now.    Charlie Morton is a more interesting case.    

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Remember the line from “all that jazz.”

”I can’t make you great, I can’t make you good, but I can make you better.”

Every player has a maximum ability, the best coaches help the player achieve the most of that maximum. I think this new guy is a lost cause, although I remember him being drafted and everybody thought he was a stud. However, if he’s better than the slop we have now, why not give it a try. Tate was traded twice after being bad and not he seems to have turned a corner. Scott has certainly improved. Means has had a bad season but he gets a mulligan. Overall, Mike is doing well at improving what he has, and I’m not going to say that Fulmer is a waste of time...not yet.

Phillips/Hess/Carroll at least certainly are.

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1 hour ago, Frobby said:

I think wildcard has a point on Verlander and Cole.   These were extremely talented pitchers who had been great in the past and just needed a tweak to get back on track.   The O’s don’t really have anyone like that to work with right now.    Charlie Morton is a more interesting case.    

Do you see any pitchers that you feel confident in saying have been claimed/signed by the Orioles since Elias has taken over that have shown tangible improvement that can be attributed to the Orioles "fixing" something?

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On 9/6/2020 at 10:03 AM, Frobby said:

I think wildcard has a point on Verlander and Cole.   These were extremely talented pitchers who had been great in the past and just needed a tweak to get back on track.   The O’s don’t really have anyone like that to work with right now.    Charlie Morton is a more interesting case.    

Morton was still a good pitcher for the Pirates at points before he went to Houston.  His stuff got better but he was not awful before he got there.  2011 29 starts era 3.83 2013 20 starts 3.26 ERA 2014 26 starts 3.72 ERA.  In Houston his two years era was 3.62 and 3.13.  We haven’t even brought in a guy that had close to that level of success in the majors so far to try and improve.  Lopez has the most experience in majors of the guys we have brought in and has two seasons with more then 20 major league innings,  In one of those years era was 5.03 and the other was 6.33.  

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I am cautiously optimistic that Elias's plan is working/will work.  Akin and Kremer not only had good raw stuff but an idea of how to use it.  A contrast from the past would be Cabrera and Bedard who had superior arms but no idea how to pitch when they got to the majors.  I'm not saying that Elias system or any other system will turn every talented arm into a major league pitcher, but it seems like these new pitchers (and position players) have an idea of what they need to do to be successful MLB players. 

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I like the idea of taking flyers on high upside guys. It costs next to nothing and if one really hits, its like striking gold.

Even a partial hit, like success in the pen, is totally worth it. My predictions for this individual aren’t bullish, but as an org strategy, I’m 100% on board.

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Fulmer has 3 above average pitches and poor command.  Lets see with the O's pitching coaches can work some magic.  Kline has options and still on the 40  to fight another day. Elias is trying to add talent.

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