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Philip

The team without an MVP?

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31 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Maybe.  It's a little bit of the old "we know he's not a .373 hitter, but do all the other GMs know that?" ploy.  Even if you believe that his last three years (308 games) is his new established level that makes him about a 2.5 win player.  How much could you expect in return for one year of a 31-year-old, 2.5-win player making $3.5M?  Who, oh by the way, missed 20 games this year and has only once played as many as 140.

Like all hypothetical trades I'll be skeptical until I see it happen.  I think they keep him for at least the first half of '21.

If he’s a 2.5 win player making 3.5M, he’s one of the better surplus values in the league, especially when you take away pre arb players.

I could see him providing some value to someone but I would think it would be a contender and one who has a big need at SS.  How many of those exist?

That being said, why wouldn’t the Os keep him?  Don’t get me wrong, I would trade him if we got value but the Os have nothing at SS anytime soon and I would guess his value to the Os is more than what they could get in trade.

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40 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If he’s a 2.5 win player making 3.5M, he’s one of the better surplus values in the league, especially when you take away pre arb players.

I could see him providing some value to someone but I would think it would be a contender and one who has a big need at SS.  How many of those exist?

That being said, why wouldn’t the Os keep him?  Don’t get me wrong, I would trade him if we got value but the Os have nothing at SS anytime soon and I would guess his value to the Os is more than what they could get in trade.

That’s probably correct, but I bet Mike gets some calls. Remember That a lot of the outstanding shortstops on contending teams are free agents, so those teams you mentioned will be needing somebody.

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1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Even if you believe that his last three years (308 games) is his new established level that makes him about a 2.5 win player.  How much could you expect in return for one year of a 31-year-old, 2.5-win player making $3.5M?  

So, $20 mm of value at a price of $3.5 mm?    Yes, I think you could get a decent return for that from a team that has real problems at SS.   Maybe equivalent to what we got for Castro?

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3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

If he’s a 2.5 win player making 3.5M, he’s one of the better surplus values in the league, especially when you take away pre arb players.

I could see him providing some value to someone but I would think it would be a contender and one who has a big need at SS.  How many of those exist?

That being said, why wouldn’t the Os keep him?  Don’t get me wrong, I would trade him if we got value but the Os have nothing at SS anytime soon and I would guess his value to the Os is more than what they could get in trade.

He has some surplus value, sure.  But I'm not sure anyone really buys into the idea he's a 2.5-win player. He's not durable, and he's at an age where his defense could very well decline.  And teams have to expect the O's want a premium because he just hit .370 in a 1/4 of a season.

Who in the Orioles system would you give up to acquire a player like Iglesias for a year?  Diaz?  That's pretty steep.  I'd have a hard time parting with any of my top 10 prospects.  If you can't get that level, you might as well keep him.

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5 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

He has some surplus value, sure.  But I'm not sure anyone really buys into the idea he's a 2.5-win player. He's not durable, and he's at an age where his defense could very well decline.  And teams have to expect the O's want a premium because he just hit .370 in a 1/4 of a season.

Who in the Orioles system would you give up to acquire a player like Iglesias for a year?  Diaz?  That's pretty steep.  I'd have a hard time parting with any of my top 10 prospects.  If you can't get that level, you might as well keep him.

If the Os needed a SS and were contending, I’m not sure he would be the first guy on my list.

That being said, I think you can justify a top 15ish prospect and perhaps a lower level guy for him especially if are a team that has budget concerns.

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3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If the Os needed a SS and were contending, I’m not sure he would be the first guy on my list.

That being said, I think you can justify a top 15ish prospect and perhaps a lower level guy for him especially if are a team that has budget concerns.

This is about what I had in mind.  

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2 hours ago, Frobby said:

So, $20 mm of value at a price of $3.5 mm?    Yes, I think you could get a decent return for that from a team that has real problems at SS.   Maybe equivalent to what we got for Castro?

Did we get an above average return for Castro? Iglesias’ age is a bit of a concern, but 31 isn’t THAT old. I’d expect he’d bring more for various reasons.

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1 minute ago, Philip said:

Did we get an above average return for Castro? Iglesias’ age is a bit of a concern, but 31 isn’t THAT old. I’d expect he’d bring more for various reasons.

Castro is under team control for 2 more years after this one, plus he was traded at the deadline and so played almost half of this short season for the Mets.   I think one year of Iglesias at $3.5 mm is about as valuable as 2+ years of Castro at whatever Arb salaries he earns (he was scheduled for $1.05 mm this year before COVID cut the season short, and I’d guess earns $2.5 - 3 mm next year and $4-5 mm in 2022 depending on performance).

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2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Santander announced at MVO

The right choice IMO.    Congrats to him.    I hope his strong performance in a relatively short period this year carries over into 2021.

Santander has now played just a little more than a full season’s worth of games (176) and his 162-game average is 29 HR, 91 RBI to go with his career .759 OPS (which includes his two partial Rule 5 seasons).     

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I have thought Iglesias could be a prime trade target.  It could come this offseason or perhaps we (and an acquiring team) would want to see him off to a good start offensively - even 775 OPS should generate a quality return.  Depending on how Iggy is doing would impact the prospect I want back.  Top 15ish sounds about right, but maybe more if Iggy does well in April and May ahead of a deal.

Iggy should have won the MVP.  Crazy to lineup Mountcastle's stats with Santander's and give it to Santander.  Anyone voting for Alberto, Nunez or Severino in their top 3 should be disqualified from ever watching baseball again.

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o

 

Between 1954 and 1957, each of the MVO's for those seasons are not in the Orioles Hall-of-Fame ...... they are Chuck Diering (1954), Dave Philley (1955), Bob Nieman (1956), and Billy Gardner (1957.)

 

The other MVO's since then whom are not in the Orioles Hall-of-Fame are Don Aase (1986), Larry Sheets (1987), Mike Devereaux (1992), Rafael Palmeiro (1995, 1996, and 1998), Randy Myers (1997), Delino DeShields Sr. (2000), Jeff Conine (2001), Rodrigo Lopez (2002), Jay Gibbons (2003), Miguel Tejada (2004 and 2006), Aubrey Huff (2008), Luke Scott (2010), and Nelson Cruz (2014.)

 

More recent MVO's whom are not yet in the Orioles Hall-of-Fame but who may be inducted in the future upon eligibility are Nick Markakis (2007), Adam Jones (2011, 2012, and 2018), Chris Davis (2013 and 2015), Manny Machado (2016), Jonathan Schoop (2017), Trey Mancini (2019), and Anthony Santander (2020) ...... Nelson Cruz was only with the Orioles for one season (2014), but oh what a season it was (both for Cruz individually, and for the Orioles as a team.)

 

 

M.V.O. (1954 - Present)

 

1954 – Chuck Diering

1955 – Dave Philley

1956 – Bob Nieman

1957 – Billy Gardner

1958 – Gus Triandos

1959 – Gene Woodling

1960 – Brooks Robinson

1961 – Jim Gentile

1962 – Brooks Robinson

1963 – Stu Miller

1964 – Brooks Robinson

1965 – Stu Miller

1966 – Frank Robinson

1967 – Frank Robinson

1968 – Dave McNally

1969 – Boog Powell

1970 – Boog Powell

1971 – Brooks Robinson, Frank Robinson

1972 – Jim Palmer

1973 – Jim Palmer

1974 – Paul Blair, Mike Cuellar

1975 – Ken Singleton

1976 – Lee May

1977 – Ken Singleton

1978 – Eddie Murray

1979 – Ken Singleton

1980 – Al Bumbry

1981 – Eddie Murray

1982 – Eddie Murray

1983 – Eddie Murray, Cal Ripken Jr.

1984 – Eddie Murray

1985 – Eddie Murray

1986 – Don Aase

1987 – Larry Sheets

1988 – Eddie Murray, Cal Ripken Jr.

1989 – Gregg Olson

1990 – Cal Ripken Jr.

1991 – Cal Ripken Jr.

1992 – Mike Devereaux

1993 – Chris Hoiles

1994 – No Award Given

1995 – Rafael Palmeiro

1996 – Rafael Palmeiro

1997 – Randy Myers

1998 – Rafael Palmeiro

1999 – B.J. Surhoff

2000 – Delino DeShields Sr.

2001 – Jeff Conine

2002 – Rodrigo Lopez

2003 – Jay Gibbons

2004 – Miguel Tejada

2005 – Brian Roberts

2006 – Miguel Tedada

2007 – Nick Markakis

2008 – Aubrey Huff

2009 – Brian Roberts

2010 – Luke Scott

2011 – Adam Jones

2012 – Adam Jones

2013 – Chris Davis

2014 – Nelson Cruz

2015 – Chris Davis

2016 – Manny Machado

2017 – Jonathan Schoop

2018 – Adam Jones

2019 - Trey Mancini

2020 - Anthony Santander

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Baltimore_Orioles_awards#Most_Vaulable_Oriole

 

https://www.mlb.com/orioles/history/orioles-hall-of-fame

 

o

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o

 

Steve Melewski: ) On my ballot for Most Valuable Oriole I had Anthony Santander 1st, José Iglesias 2nd, and Ryan Mountcastle 3rd. A strong case could be made for each of them, but Santander was named MVO yesterday.

For me, the fact that the guy led the entire AL in extra-base hits when he got hurt was a real plus. His run production was strong, not just on this team but in comparison to the top hitters in the league. Beyond that, his defense was solid. Metrics like outs above average liked his work, and he leads the club with four outfield assists. He was strong on offense and defense.

At 25 years-old, Santander is a core piece for the Orioles' future. I can see Mountcastle, Austin Hays, and Santander playing in the Orioles' outfield many nights next year.

 

 

Hyde’s Protocol Props: Notes on the MVO, and More

(By Steve Melewski)

https://www.masnsports.com/steve-melewski/2020/09/hydes-protocal-props-plus-notes-on-the-mvo-and-more.html

 

o

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