Nunez DFA

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

They get those at bats whether Nunez is here or not.

The presence of Nunez changes absolutely nothing about your post.

His presence only becomes an issue IF Diaz is up and IF everyone is producing and healthy.

I brought up Santander and Hays only because your post addressed them.    I agree, Nunez wouldn’t have cost them at bats.  I take your point there.  It’s probably Stewart who benefits most from Nunez’s absence, at least until Diaz gets called up.  

[Philip]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Your DH doesn’t have to be versatile.  

But he does have to be good. I have already shown, using real stats from baseball savant, that he is not.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I brought up Santander and Hays only because your post addressed them.    I agree, Nunez wouldn’t have cost them at bats.  I take your point there.  It’s probably Stewart who benefits most from Nunez’s absence, at least until Diaz gets called up.  

If I'm the O's and Mancini is on the team and healthy enough to play, I'm putting him at DH a lot of the time to help him conserve his strength.

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, Philip said:

DH is NOT a full-time position unless you’ve got Edgar Martinez on the roster. Rotating DH is for roster flexibility, resting a regular, playing a guy on a hot streak, easing back in after an illness, and so on. Devoting a roster spot to one guy who does nothing but hit is a foolish use of a spot, unless he’s a glorious, “proof there is a God” hitter. And Nunez isn’t. I looked up his offensive stats at Baseball savant. Of ten offensive categories, his percentile rank was above average in only two, and one of those just barely(xSLG was %55) his sprint speed was  fairly close at 43%, but in the other 7, he was 35% Or lower. That’s not Edgar territory.

By comparison, Nelson Cruz was horrible in sprint speed( no bunt singles for HIM) and K rate, but terrific in every other category... and he’s 40. He IS a, “Proof there is a God” hitter.

Man, Cruz is amazing. That was really one we let get away.

You are wrong.  Just go look at the 2019 DH stats for example..several teams in the AL had the same guy taking up a large majority of the at bats, with many of them getting 500+ at bats and that doesn’t include Alvarez, who the Astros brought up later in the season and was their exclusive DH for the rest of the year (he had just under 400 at bats).

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I brought up Santander and Hays only because your post addressed them.    I agree, Nunez wouldn’t have cost them at bats.  I take your point there.  It’s probably Stewart who benefits most from Nunez’s absence, at least until Diaz gets called up.  

Hays and Santander could be better hitters but they aren’t now and if you want to assume that those guys will get better, Nunez could as well.  

Sure, Stewart benefits but he also could get at bats regardless if Nunez is here.  I can’t imagine Mancini is an everyday player right off the bat.  

[Sports Guy]

9 minutes ago, Philip said:

But he does have to be good. I have already shown, using real stats from baseball savant, that he is not.

Not really..you showed he’s not elite.  Obviously.  No one has argued otherwise.  

[Frobby]

2 minutes ago, Philip said:

But he does have to be good. I have already shown, using real stats from baseball savant, that he is not.

I’m not sure I buy your Baseball Savant argument.   It’s not like Nunez started playing yesterday.   We’ve seen him perform for parts of three seasons.    His style of hitting (somewhat low BA and OBP, fairly high K rate, good power) has some value.    The average team had a .227/.312/.407 OPS at DH last year.    Nunez has hit .253/.319/.463 for us the last three years, and better than that last year.    So he is a good enough hitter to help some team primarily at DH.

[Frobby]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Hays and Santander could be better hitters but they aren’t now and if you want to assume that those guys will get better, Nunez could as well.  

Sure, Stewart benefits but he also could get at bats regardless if Nunez is here.  I can’t imagine Mancini is an everyday player right off the bat.  

I posted way back at the beginning of the thread that I thought it was possible Nunez had another level of improvement left in him.   If I’m guessing (which is all it is), I think Hays and Santander will be better hitters than Nunez at their respective peaks.    But I don’t know it for sure.   It’s sort of a moot point since we agree Nunez isn’t really competing with those two for at bats.   As to Stewart, I’m guessing he will not turn out to be as good a hitter as Nunez, though I’m not sure about that, either.  

[Philip]

15 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

You are wrong.  Just go look at the 2019 DH stats for example..several teams in the AL had the same guy taking up a large majority of the at bats, with many of them getting 500+ at bats and that doesn’t include Alvarez, who the Astros brought up later in the season and was their exclusive DH for the rest of the year (he had just under 400 at bats).

Nah, I’m not wrong.

however, If I may my father’s comment half way through a performance of Mahler 8:

” well, I’ve had about as much of this as I can stand. Let’s go find something interesting to eat.“

And that is what I am going to do… God bless you and happy Thanksgiving to you and yours.

[Sports Guy]

23 minutes ago, Philip said:

Nah, I’m not wrong.

however, If I may my father’s comment half way through a performance of Mahler 8:

” well, I’ve had about as much of this as I can stand. Let’s go find something interesting to eat.“

And that is what I am going to do… God bless you and happy Thanksgiving to you and yours.

Umm..yes, you are wrong.  Several teams treat the position as of its a full time position.  That at bat stats is a fact you can’t argue against.  That’s the definition of “full time”.  
 

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Wait wait wait...

There are actually people legitimately upset that the Orioles dumped an expensive, mediocre DH-type player that literally no one else in baseball wanted at his original multimillion dollar price tag? Or is this some type of avant-garde digital performance art bit deconstructing the stereotypical uninformed and overly emotional sports fan that has simply whooshed right over my head...?

 

 

[Sports Guy]

Calling him expensive is pretty funny.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

7 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Calling him expensive is pretty funny.

Well, all 30 Major League Baseball front offices agreed with the notion that he was too expensive at his likely arbitration pricetag for the minimal value he offers, so...

[Sports Guy]

3 hours ago, DrinkinWithFermi said:

Well, all 30 Major League Baseball front offices agreed with the notion that he was too expensive at his likely arbitration pricetag for the minimal value he offers, so...

This is actually incorrect.

As of now, there is no DH in the NL in 2021, so he wouldn’t have a ton of value to teams over there.  If NL teams knew the DH was happening for them in 2021, maybe they would have found a suitor.

And we don’t know that someone won’t pay him 1-2M in 2021.  We just know that no one was willing to trade for him and pay him that money.  Big difference.

In any case, he’s not expensive.  The average MLB salary in 2020 was almost 4.5M.  He would have been paid well under that number.  In fact, with MLB minimum salary close to 600k, he will get paid much closer to the minimum salary than the average salary.  So no, he’s not expensive at all.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

This is actually incorrect.

As of now, there is no DH in the NL in 2021, so he wouldn’t have a ton of value to teams over there.  If NL teams knew the DH was happening for them in 2021, maybe they would have found a suitor.

And we don’t know that someone won’t pay him 1-2M in 2021.  We just know that no one was willing to trade for him and pay him that money.  Big difference.

In any case, he’s not expensive.  The average MLB salary in 2020 was almost 4.5M.  He would have been paid well under that number.  In fact, with MLB minimum salary close to 600k, he will get paid much closer to the minimum salary than the average salary.  So no, he’s not expensive at all.

I agree.    If you let Nunez go, it shouldn’t be primarily because of cost.    Now, if you think you can get equivalent or better production for your roster cheaper, that is okay.  But you don’t make your team worse over $2 mm or less.    

It’s going to be interesting to see what happens with Nunez.    There’s going to be a lot of players on the market after the non-tender deadline I suspect.    I do think he’ll get a major league contract somewhere and will get above the minimum, but it might be less than he was projected to get in arbitration.