Santander drawing interest

[OrioleDog]

Our 5 best guys could be anything in a year.   Spring's going to be like Christmas morning coming off its bye year, and the Orioles name tag is on many of the biggest boxes under the tree.   

Bachelor's degrees, high school pitchers, mononucleosis, Kyle Bradish, arm problems - we really have it all!

I see Nate Pearson and Deivi Garcia sure, but here we have a few of them to see if what they've been doing all this time is good. 

(And the Red Sox have Alex Verdugo.)

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

There were 171 offensive players in 2019 that had a 1.5 WAR or higher (of players who had at least 100 at bats).

That’s 40-45% of the league..5-6 offensive players per team.

So yea, that’s not hard production to find.

It’s not that easy.    But if all we think Santander can produce in a full season is 1.5 WAR, I wouldn’t lose any sleep over him.   

BB-ref and Fangraphs evaluate him very differently.   In 2019-20, over 130 games, he was worth 3.2 rWAR but only 1.7 fWAR.   So, which number do you trust more, and/or do you just split the difference?   I actually think 2-2.5 WAR is a decent guess at Santander’s annual value if he can stay healthy.    Maybe 3 but I wouldn’t bank on it.

 

[Philip]

3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

There were 171 offensive players in 2019 that had a 1.5 WAR or higher (of players who had at least 100 at bats).

That’s 40-45% of the league..5-6 offensive players per team.

So yea, that’s not hard production to find.

So what? How many of those guys are already signed to various contracts? How many of those guys are not on the trade block? How many of those guys are on the trade block but with unreasonable prices attached?

No one is denying they are out there, but those that are out there and available for acquisition are not plentiful. Our guy has value. Even to us.

If we let him go, no one should be saying that we will replace his production easily, because we won’t.

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, Philip said:

So what? How many of those guys are already signed to various contracts? How many of those guys are not on the trade block? How many of those guys are on the trade block but with unreasonable prices attached?

No one is denying they are out there, but those that are out there and available for acquisition are not plentiful. Our guy has value. Even to us.

If we let him go, no one should be saying that we will replace his production easily, because we won’t.

We could replace his offense by merely bringing back Nunez.  They are very similar offensively and Nunez will cost less money.  
 

the rest of your post is largely irrelevant to the point.  You are acting like 1.5 WAR is hard to achieve.  It’s not.

[Philip]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

We could replace his offense by merely bringing back Nunez.  They are very similar offensively and Nunez will cost less money.  
 

the rest of your post is largely irrelevant to the point.  You are acting like 1.5 WAR is hard to achieve.  It’s not.

To suggest that Nunez is similar to Santander because their WAR is similar exposes the weakness of WAR. Santander is so superior to Nunez a comparison is needless. He’s a better all round player. If all you care about is one dimensional guys you must have LOVED the Os of Pedro Alvarez, Danny Valencia, Trumbo and other lumbering DH’s turned defensemen.

[Frobby]

31 minutes ago, Philip said:

To suggest that Nunez is similar to Santander because their WAR is similar exposes the weakness of WAR. 

He didn’t suggest that.   Their WAR is not similar.   Their offense is similar.    

[Sports Guy]

5 minutes ago, Frobby said:

He didn’t suggest that.   Their WAR is not similar.   Their offense is similar.    

Thank you for pointing what reading comprehension will show you.  
 

And yes Phillip, their offense is similar.

So, you can replace his production by signing Nunez back and DHing him full time.  Then you find a RFer until Diaz is ready (unless you just want to call him up immediately).

[Philip]

19 minutes ago, Frobby said:

He didn’t suggest that.   Their WAR is not similar.   Their offense is similar.    

Well, I stand corrected on that point, but that just accentuates how much more valuable Santandar is Because he has gold glove finalist value with his glove And Nunez has none.

 

[Philip]

13 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Thank you for pointing what reading comprehension will show you.  
 

And yes Phillip, their offense is similar.

So, you can replace his production by signing Nunez back and DHing him full time.  Then you find a RFer until Diaz is ready (unless you just want to call him up immediately).

Hey, everybody reads it wrong once in a while.

Meanwhile, although this is getting a little far afield, it is patently ridiculous to bring aboard a guy With zero defensive value So he can clog the roster.

DH/1B is hopefully the realm of Mancini & MC.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Philip said:

Well, I stand corrected on that point, but that just accentuates how much more valuable Santandar is Because he has gold glove finalist value with his glove And Nunez has none.

 

Ah yes, gold glove finalist.  Must make him also as good in right as Jeter was short and Palmeiro was at first.

[wildcard]

22 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Ah yes, gold glove finalist.  Must make him also as good in right as Jeter was short and Palmeiro was at first.

Palmeiro had three Gold Gloves.  And he actually earned two of them.

[Philip]

23 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Palmeiro had three Gold Gloves.  And he actually earned two of them.

To poo-poo an honest achievement to by comparing it to an irrelevance is the very height of foolishness.

Santander is a good Defensive RF. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Philip said:

To poo-poo an honest achievement to by comparing it to an irrelevance is the very height of foolishness.

Santander is a good Defensive RF. 

To cite a player being a gold glove finalist as your sole evidence of their defensive skill is the very height of foolishness.

A gold glove nomination is not a meaningful achievement.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Thank you for pointing what reading comprehension will show you.  
 

And yes Phillip, their offense is similar.

So, you can replace his production by signing Nunez back and DHing him full time.  Then you find a RFer until Diaz is ready (unless you just want to call him up immediately).

Seems like a weak argument coming from you.    It’s a lot easier to find a Nunez-level DH than a Santander-level RF.   You don’t make up for losing Santander in RF by adding Nunez at DH.   

I don’t want to belabor the point because whether Santander should be traded now depends on what we can get for him.    Without knowing what the return is, arguing about trading him is pointless.   I have zero problem with the O’s shopping him and seeing what’s on offer.    
 

[Sports Guy]

58 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Seems like a weak argument coming from you.    It’s a lot easier to find a Nunez-level DH than a Santander-level RF.   You don’t make up for losing Santander in RF by adding Nunez at DH.   

I don’t want to belabor the point because whether Santander should be traded now depends on what we can get for him.    Without knowing what the return is, arguing about trading him is pointless.   I have zero problem with the O’s shopping him and seeing what’s on offer.    
 

My only point is that it wouldn’t be hard to replace Santanders offensive production.  That’s pretty much a fact.  
 

I also don’t think it’s nearly as difficult to replace Santander as an overall player...I think people on this site continue to overrate him and that’s coming from someone who does like him and does think he’s a good player.  But he’s treated as if he’s an AS level player around here and that’s over the top.