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John Means 2021

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30 minutes ago, bpilktree said:

I would hope more then Musgrove.  Musgrove has never been great and just one year era under 4 which was last year at 3.86 in 8 starts.  He also had two years less control. The Pirates didn’t get that much for Musgrove either.  We better get lot better deal then Pirates gif for Musgrove or we shouldn’t trade him.  They didn’t get one top 100 guy and the only got one guy in their current top 15 in organization.

The O's will not get more than the Pirates got for Musgrove because they are not trading Means for many years.

Name a player that Elias has traded that is part of the future core.

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Love that a 6 IP, 1.00 WHIP (0 BB), 0 ER start in which he had a low pitch count and was only pulled for a pinch hitter in a situation that clearly called for it is so ho-hum / expected at this point :) 

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4 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

Now leads the league in ERA at 1.21.  

Also leads in WHIP at .712

 

An eye-popping 351 ERA+ as well, it's obviously very early, but that's probably his craziest number right now.

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We know Means has elite fastball command and an excellent CU.

The next time in his game comes if his curveball gets more consistent.  That is the difference between him settling into a 2/3 guy and being a 1/2 guy. 

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2 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

Don't forget the changeup, too.

It's pretty much elite fastball, I'd argue borderline elite changeup and a fantastic curveball.  It's three quality pitches.

He doesn’t have a fantastic curveball.  That pitch has to get better and more consistent.

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8 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

He doesn’t have a fantastic curveball.  That pitch has to get better and more consistent.

Yeah — if his curveball does not improve, he’ll probably never progress past being a 1.26 ERA pitcher.

At this point, the word I’d use to describe his curveball is “credible.”  He should continue to work on it, but it’s never going to be his bread and butter.

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1 minute ago, Frobby said:

Yeah — if his curveball does not improve, he’ll probably never progress past being a 1.26 ERA pitcher.

At this point, the word I’d use to describe his curveball is “credible.”  He should continue to work on it, but it’s never going to be his bread and butter.

Credible is a nice way of saying inconsistent and needs improvement.  
 

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22 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Credible is a nice way of saying inconsistent and needs improvement.  
 

Better than it used to be, not as good as it could be.    But the question of whether it needs to improve in order for Means to be a 1/2 starter is unclear.    Hitters haven’t handled his current mix so far this year or in his last few starts of last year.   We’ll see if the start handling it better as the season progresses and then the issue of how good his third pitch is could become more important.    We’ll find out.   

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5 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Better than it used to be, not as good as it could be.    But the question of whether it needs to improve in order for Means to be a 1/2 starter is unclear.    Hitters haven’t handled his current mix so far this year or in his last few starts of last year.   We’ll see if the start handling it better as the season progresses and then the issue of how good his third pitch is could become more important.    We’ll find out.   

SSS isn’t really worth discussing imo.  
 

I think he needs it to be a little more consistent.  It doesn’t have to be a great pitch but it needs to be more consistent.  Means himself has talked about the inconsistency of the pitch.  

 

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