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Jbwest31

Should we Trade John Means?

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I’m just joining the site so forgive me if this has been discussed ad nauseam, but do you guys think we should get whatever we can for Means? His stock won’t get any higher, he’ll be 30 by the time we’re ready to compete, and there’s all the illegal substances talk around him. I say we trade him for whatever we can get. Some team will pay a premium for him.

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I say sign him to an affordable extension.  The O's need 5 somewhat dependable starter.  Means has been the O's only dependable starter for the last year and a half.  Yeah there have been stretches by other starters, but do you want to depend on a playoff game for Kremer or Akin or a reclamation project like Harvey.  Yeah Grayrod and Hall and coming, but that's only 2 starters and 1 (or dare I say both of them) could fail.  Yeah of course, if the O's get blown away, they should consider trading Means, but not for example what they got for Manny.  I don't understand what all the talk about Means and illegal substances is about.  Please post an article or other evidence that Means has been using illegal substances. 

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2 hours ago, Jbwest31 said:

I’m just joining the site so forgive me if this has been discussed ad nauseam, but do you guys think we should get whatever we can for Means? His stock won’t get any higher, he’ll be 30 by the time we’re ready to compete, and there’s all the illegal substances talk around him. I say we trade him for whatever we can get. Some team will pay a premium for him.

I don’t this is really true in Means case. He’s missed time this year and he could certainly come out next season and light it up. The Orioles have time to decide on Means.

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3 hours ago, Jbwest31 said:

I’m just joining the site so forgive me if this has been discussed ad nauseam, but do you guys think we should get whatever we can for Means? His stock won’t get any higher, he’ll be 30 by the time we’re ready to compete, and there’s all the illegal substances talk around him. I say we trade him for whatever we can get. Some team will pay a premium for him.

First off, if he is using spider tack,  which seems to be fact for Means in the speculation rumor mill from most I talk to, did he do that on his own? I am sure the GM that came from an org of sign stealing had zero to do with that, right? It’s just Means? Unlikely. 
 

The Orioles are an embarrassing franchise on so many levels, broken from dysfunctional ownership & management. One symptom is fans thinking you have to sell anyone that is good. We haven’t had a good home grown sp since Mussina, yet fans want to ship off Means? Geesh. 

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Welcome to the site, Jbwest31.    For me it depends on what is offered in return.  I can’t say if Means’ value will go up or down from here, but I’d be OK to trade him if the return were good.   Certainly more than what we got for Bundy, but I wouldn’t expect a Bedard-like haul.   I’d want multiple players, headlined by a top 50 prospect and another organizational top 6-7 guy and probably another piece or two.  Think we could get that?

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His value definitely could be higher than it is now.  I don’t think we could get the package right now to justify moving him.

That being said, if someone did want to pay up a lot to get him, sure why not?  I like Means and I feel he is a sub 4ish ERA guy going forward.  That’s very valuable and something we could use when we hope to be contending.  But I also think what you would trade him for could end up being more valuable than Means himself, although it’s obviously a risk.  
 

I think an interesting discussion to have is, if you had to trade Mullins or Means, who do you trade?  (And assume you get a good deal for either)

In other words, who do you feel is more important to keep around?

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2022 is Elias 4th  year of the rebuild.   Adley and Grayson should be with the O's followed by Hall in a few months.   Elias better start putting a winning  team together.   

So I say no to trading Means.   He will not be a free agent until after the 2024 season.  The O's need Means to get the rebuild to the next step which is fielding a winning team.

I guess there is at trade that would overwhelm Elias but I see the chances of that happening considering Means mid season injuries as next to zero.

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As with every player, it depends on the package.   Because of Means questionable durability and recent IL stint I don't think his value is sky high right now.   The decision would have to be based on what they see going forward as far as health and effectiveness go.    I would say now is not the best time to deal him but we may look back a year from now and realize it was.   You never know but Elias and team have the best information to go by.    I don't think they will deal him.

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37 minutes ago, wildcard said:

2022 is Elias 4th  year of the rebuild.   Adley and Grayson should be with the O's followed by Hall in a few months.   Elias better start putting a winning  team together.   

So I say no to trading Means.   He will not be a free agent until after the 2024 season.  The O's need Means to get the rebuild to the next step which is fielding a winning team.

I guess there is at trade that would overwhelm Elias but I see the chances of that happening considering Means mid season injuries as next to zero.

Or what?

Folks will stop coming out to the games?  The national media will ignore the team?

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I’m in agreement with those who don’t think his value is as high as it could be right now.

Regardless, they have time in the next couple years to maximize their return for Means.

Mullins certainly has more value at the moment than Means and yes I would trade him.

 

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51 minutes ago, Camden_yardbird said:

Who has more trade value Means or Scherzer?

Tough call but it could/should be Scherzer because anyone trading for him right now feels he is the better bet to win a WS with and they are probably right.

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8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Tough call but it could/should be Scherzer because anyone trading for him right now feels he is the better bet to win a WS with and they are probably right.

It is very dependent on what the other team wants and can afford.

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1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Or what?

Folks will stop coming out to the games?  The national media will ignore the team?

The consensus will start to turn to his rebuild will not work. That includes the fans, the media and then  ownership.   It happened to MacPhail in Baltimore where he was gone after 4+ years.  In Philly he was gone after 5 years.   It has happened at different places around MLB.   A GM only gets so long to begin winning.

Elias in not at the point yet.  But he is probably one more losing season away from the pitchforks coming out.   He has to show progress in 2022.

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17 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Tough call but it could/should be Scherzer because anyone trading for him right now feels he is the better bet to win a WS with and they are probably right.

Not that tough. Should be pretty clear to most people Scherzer is in a different class than Means. He’s definitely a better bet to help a team win a WS. 

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