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Mussina Retires

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Mussina a HOF? I say no. The Hall of Fame means greatness, and I never saw Mussina in that light. He was a very, very good pitcher for a lot of years.

Would a Hall of Famer tell his manager(Joe Torre at the time) to bump him down in the rotation because he doesn't want to continually face the top pitchers?

No chance.

Care to substantiate that one? I'm not his biggest fan and I don't ever remember this going down. Link please?

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Mussina a HOF? I say no. The Hall of Fame means greatness, and I never saw Mussina in that light. He was a very, very good pitcher for a lot of years.

Would a Hall of Famer tell his manager(Joe Torre at the time) to bump him down in the rotation because he doesn't want to continually face the top pitchers?

No chance.

Ahh the Colin Cowherd theory

I'll let the masters speak for me on this one.... http://www.firejoemorgan.com/2006/01/12-minutes-of-hell-with-colin-cowherd.html

God I am going to miss FJM :notworthy:

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Honestly, I don't want him there as an Oriole. I really don't want him there at all. He never got to 300 wins. He had a single 20 win season (his last). As far as I know he never even got a Cy Young award. A very good pitcher, YES, Hall of famer, NO. Its not even close.

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On whether he considers himself an Oriole or a Yankee:

“I was both. I made a name for myself pitching in Baltimore, but I had a lot more exposure and opportunity pitching in New York. Seven trips to the postseason, a couple trips to the World Series; you’re on a bigger stage pitching for the Yankees. I loved playing in both places, but when retirement came around, I was still a Yankee. That’s how I feel about it right now.”

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/yankees/2008/11/mussinas-final-call.html

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Mussina is a good pitcher. A modern day Rick Sutcliffe with more longevity.

Actually Sutcliffe has a better argument for being "great" than Mussina does.

It does not help his case with me personally that he left the Orioles- a team that if he would have pitched his whole career for, would have made him more feasible as a Hall of Famer, just for pitching for only one team. He could have been next in the line of B. Robinson, F. Robinson, Murray, Palmer and Ripken. But instead he is just another good player who chased the last dollar to be forgotten in New York. ( Do you think that Yankees fans or the organization could really care less about him now that he is retired, or even that he played for them? If you do, you are kidding yourself ) He would have been King of Camden Yards had he stayed in Baltimore.

Mussina was abrasive, moody and not a great teammate in the clubhouse... But most of all he was a good,solid pitcher, who went to the Yankees to get a World Series ring and a boat load of money. Mike- I hope that you are enjoying your money, because you sure did not get that ring!!!

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I think of Mussina as a modern-day Don Sutton: Good but not great. At no single time in his career would you have included him as one of the top three pitchers in baseball. He'd be top 10 for many of his years, however.

It was good enough for Sutton to get in the HOF, although Sutton was able to obtain more favorable milestones.

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I'm amazed at how few posters seem to recognize the accomplishment of finishing 117 games over .500, with a .638 winning percentage. Analogies to guys like Don Sutton (68 games over .500, .559 winning percentage) and Rick Sutcliffe (32 games over .500, .552 winning percentage) are not apt at all.

There are 21 pitchers who won 100 more games than they lost -- 16 in the Hall of Fame, and 5 not eligible yet. That's the company Mussina is in.

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I think if Moose would have gotten that no-hitter in Boston, and won a ring during his tenure as a Yankee, than you would hear about Moose to the Hall. But since his stats dont measure up, aside fom the 270 wins, its just not enough.

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I'm amazed at how few posters seem to recognize the accomplishment of finishing 117 games over .500, with a .638 winning percentage. Analogies to guys like Don Sutton (68 games over .500, .559 winning percentage) and Rick Sutcliffe (32 games over .500, .552 winning percentage) are not apt at all.

There are 21 pitchers who won 100 more games than they lost -- 16 in the Hall of Fame, and 5 not eligible yet. That's the company Mussina is in.

You also have to acknowledge that he was on a stacked Yankees team and pretty good Orioles team for many of those years.

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Honestly, I don't want him there as an Oriole. I really don't want him there at all. He never got to 300 wins. He had a single 20 win season (his last). As far as I know he never even got a Cy Young award. A very good pitcher, YES, Hall of famer, NO. Its not even close.

Jim Palmer never won 300 games and Mussina has better numbers.

I think if Moose would have gotten that no-hitter in Boston, and won a ring during his tenure as a Yankee, than you would hear about Moose to the Hall. But since his stats dont measure up, aside fom the 270 wins, its just not enough.

What stats? Let's compare...

Mussina = 270-153 for a .638 Winning %

Palmer = 268-152 for a .638 Winning %

Mussina = 123 ERA+

Palmer = 126 ERA+

Mussina = 1.192 WHIP

Palmer = 1.180 WHIP

Mussina = 2813 Strikeouts or 7.11 K/9

Palmer = 2212 Strikeouts or 5.04 K/9

Mussina = 785 Walks or 1.99 BB/9

Palmer = 1311 Walks or 2.99 BB/9

Mussina = 376 HRs or 0.94 HR/9

Palmer = 303 HRs or 0.69 HR/9

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Mussina is a good pitcher. A modern day Rick Sutcliffe with more longevity.

Actually Sutcliffe has a better argument for being "great" than Mussina does.

Really?

Moose has:

- 99 more W's

- a better win percentage (.638 vs. .552)

- 4 more shutouts

- 3 more seasons with 200+ IP

- a better career ERA (3.68 vs. 4.08)

- a better career WHIP (1.19 vs. 1.39)

- pitched 865 more innings

- had 1134 more K's

- gave up 296 fewer BB's

... all while pitching through the heart of the steroid era.

It does not help his case with me personally that he left the Orioles- a team that if he would have pitched his whole career for, would have made him more feasible as a Hall of Famer, just for pitching for only one team.

He's less of a HoFer because he pitched for 2 teams in his career instead of 1? :confused: That makes even less sense considering that his career number of wins and number of playoff appearances would look vastly different (and not for the better) had he stayed in Baltimore.

He could have been next in the line of B. Robinson, F. Robinson, Murray, Palmer and Ripken.

Frank Robinson was only here 6 years (vs. Mussina's 10) out of a 20 year career and his longest tenure was with Cinn. (10 years). Eddie Murray was here 21/2 years longer than Moose, but spent just as many years outside of the Baltimore city limits.

Moose is less of an Oriole than these guys because Angelos didn't wanna pay value for a guy that had already taken a home town discount on his prior contract? :confused:

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Jim Palmer never won 300 games and Mussina has better numbers.

What stats? Let's compare...

Mussina = 270-153 for a .638 Winning %

Palmer = 268-152 for a .638 Winning %

Mussina = 123 ERA+

Palmer = 126 ERA+

Mussina = 1.192 WHIP

Palmer = 1.180 WHIP

Mussina = 2813 Strikeouts or 7.11 K/9

Palmer = 2212 Strikeouts or 5.04 K/9

Mussina = 785 Walks or 1.99 BB/9

Palmer = 1311 Walks or 2.99 BB/9

Mussina = 376 HRs or 0.94 HR/9

Palmer = 303 HRs or 0.69 HR/9

Hahaha, I love the passion you have for getting Moose to the Hall. My dad would love this post even more. We look at Moose's stats like scientist all the time. I would love to see him go into the Hall. I just dont think the writers will vote him in. He is in a long line of guys ahead of him that will have more merit to go in before he does.

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