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What the Astros did the offseason between their 3rd and 4th years of their rebuild?

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9 hours ago, luismatos4prez said:

I would love the Orioles to sign Andrelton Simmons this offseason. I bet he'd come here for 2/14. A Cesar Izturis-type player at this point in his career, but that's valuable. Mateo, Urias, and Jones can fight it out for 2B/3B/UT, with Vavra and Bannon hopefully joining later.

There is not one ML-ready starting pitcher in the Orioles organization besides John Means. That is a dire situation that requires investment. You can let Akin/Kremer/Lowther/Baumann/Wells/Zim/etc battle it out for 2 rotation spots and a long man. But 2 ML starters must be acquired or this team will be an embarrassment again next year.

Do you think the team's CEO or its general manager has been embarrassed by the woeful team they've put on the field the last couple of years? I don't. And if you don't think so, do you think they'd be embarrassed by putting together another woeful team (say, 50-60 wins) next year? I don't.

I think the CEO will be content as long as next year's payroll is low enough that the team makes money despite ticket sales that are near the bottom of MLB. I think the GM will be content as long as he can stockpile high draft picks who become successful MiL performers that he can point to as evidence his rebuilding plan is working.

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12 hours ago, bpilktree said:

The Astros had an advantage that we will never be able to match, which is they played in a weaker division with teams that spent similar amounts of money then they have.  We are in a division with teams with deep pockets or the best run franchise in baseball. 4 of the top 6 teams in the American League are in the AL East..  We will have to do it twice as good as they did to get similar results that is just the facts of playing in the AL East currently.  

You have a point, but are exaggerating to some degree.   When the O’s have a winning record outside the AL East, we can worry about the strength of the division.   Right now they are 29-50 outside the AL East.   That’s better than they are inside the AL East (18-50), but still awful.  

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I have no guess how to count it, but feel 2021 sandbagging (no Adley, developmental deployment, not signing Rick Porcello types) influenced the results so the true talent baseline is a little better with Rutschman and Rodriguez about to take the field next season.

2022 was always the only year in the process I felt unsure what it was.   Apart from the first wave of pitchers failing, I'll also wonder how much myocarditis factored into making us grind through another very likely lost year, barring the Why Not kinds of things.   If Kjerstad was who Elias thought he was as very early on Cowser/Mayo seem to be, that coulda/shoulda/woulda been another possible significant contributor for 2022's team.

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9 hours ago, spiritof66 said:

Do you think the team's CEO or its general manager has been embarrassed by the woeful team they've put on the field the last couple of years? I don't. And if you don't think so, do you think they'd be embarrassed by putting together another woeful team (say, 50-60 wins) next year? I don't.

I think the CEO will be content as long as next year's payroll is low enough that the team makes money despite ticket sales that are near the bottom of MLB. I think the GM will be content as long as he can stockpile high draft picks who become successful MiL performers that he can point to as evidence his rebuilding plan is working.

As of today, the payroll for next year (including Chris Davis, Mancini, and Santander) comes in at under 40 M. It's Mike's 4th year next year. Another 110 loss season is unacceptable. If this offseason looks like the last several, I won't tune in next year.

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Interesting thread.  The trade for Evan Gattis actually looked like a disaster for Houston.  Gattis was a great story in his battle to make the majors, but he was an awful defensive catcher, and Folty looked like he was going to be a TOR star - before he fell apart.  Not to mention (so we won't) giving up the superbly named Rio Ruiz.      

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On 9/18/2021 at 8:43 AM, Frobby said:

You have a point, but are exaggerating to some degree.   When the O’s have a winning record outside the AL East, we can worry about the strength of the division.   Right now they are 29-50 outside the AL East.   That’s better than they are inside the AL East (18-50), but still awful.  

I agree we have to play better vs every division but I think playing so many games against the best teams has a negative effect on the mindset of a team especially a young team..  You get a young pitcher coming up has to face the Rays then then the Jays and maybe Rays again in a three start span. You start to question if you can pitch at this level and make adjustments to how you have pitched to get you to this level and don’t pitch to your strength.  I think this is especially true for guys like Akin, Loewther and Wells they have been told forever they don’t have enough velocity to succeed at major league level you start to nibble more and more then get behind and that is trouble because their fastball is not good enough when behind.  I think that is why you see guys with similar stuff struggle in the majors so much but if they can hang around and learn to pitch at this level succeed at later ages.  These are guys like Jamie Moyer, Ruch Hill, Wade Miley, Those guys had to learn you don’t have to be perfect and nibble early in count but get ahead and then they chase pitches out if zone.  

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