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RZNJ

Matt Angle verses Adam Jones

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I've been kicking this around for awhile now. I've been thinking about the pros and cons of trading Adam Jones with the thought of putting Matt Angle in CF next season. On the surface, just about everyone would say Jones has more talent and upside than Angle. A lot of things tell me that Angle might just be the better baseball player, though. What does Adam Jones bring to the table? He's no more than average in CF at this point. He doesn't steal bases. His plate discipline is embarrassing. He has power but it's not great power. Angle, is kind of the anti Jones. He takes walks, steals bases, and plays a great CF (reportedly). He has zero power. His OPS is likely never to be much more than .700 because of the lack of power. And yet, my feelings are that if he can do what he's done in the minors at the ML level, that he can help a team win more games than Adam Jones can.

I keep coming back to the idea of trading Jones in the offseason while he still holds much promise. Adam Jones for a young SS (Alcides Escobar or someone else) makes a whole lotta sense to me.

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I've been saying they should shop Jones since the end of last season. You could center a package around him for an AGon or get a young SS for him.

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I'm not willing to give up AJ, for someone who is possibly Scott Podsednick at best.

He's not even played a game at the major league level, and you want to trade one of the most important pieces of our "Core"?

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Angle has been an on-base machine, and I would like to see him get some time this year (like next week, after a trade of CP). I'm not ready to ship AJ out of town, but Angle could push him to LF.

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I'm not willing to give up AJ, for someone who is possibly Scott Podsednick at best.

He's not even played a game at the major league level, and you want to trade one of the most important pieces of our "Core"?

Just because Adam Jones is part of the current core doesn't make that a good thing. BTW, I want to trade him for another young player who can also be part of the core.

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It is crazy to think that Angle could produce anywhere near Jones in '11.

I also do not see how anyone could believe Angle's ceiling comes close to approximating Jones' ceiling. I think it is logical to ask if Angle's ceiling comes close to approximating Jones' floor.

Even after you factor in what Jones would bring back to Baltimore, I do not think this has any merit.

Jones is 1 month older than Angle.

What is Jones's ceiling?

I'm guessing that we have two different ideas on that and also on the probability of him reachign it.

I think Angle's ceiling is a guy who plays plus defense in CF (now), hit .280-300, get on base 37% of the time, and steal 40-50 bases at a good rate.

The idea is to get something valuable for Jones. It's not like they are going to release him.

Why is it crazy to think Angle could produce like Jones in 2011. Say Jones repeats this season and is mid .700's OPS with a low OBP. Say Angle hit's .280 and puts up a .280/.370/.330 line. When you factor in the OBP, the defense, and the baserunning, is it that crazy?

Edited by RZNJ

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What is Jones's ceiling?

I'm guessing that we have two different ideas on that and also on the probability of him reachign it.

I think Angle's ceiling is a guy who plays plus defense in CF (now), hit .280-300, get on base 37% of the time, and steal 40-50 bases at a good rate.

The idea is to get something valuable for Jones. It's not like they are going to release him.

You need to see if Angle is even close to that type of player, before you go dealing away Jones.

Angle should be a 4th OF...first. See what his skill sets are, on the biggest stage, and then if you have something very special, then MAYBE you talk to other teams. Chances are...Angle isn't very special.

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You need to see if Angle is even close to that type of player, before you go dealing away Jones.

Angle should be a 4th OF...first. See what his skill sets are, on the biggest stage, and then if you have something very special, then MAYBE you talk to other teams. Chances are...Angle isn't very special.

No problem. Let's see him in September. He doesn't have to be special. He just has to do what he's done in the minors. Is Adam Jones something special? If I thought he was, I wouldn't think of trading him.

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Put Pie in CF, move Jones to LF....problem solved for the next 5-6+ years.

I'm not sure about Pie yet. I think this team needs to get away from these low on base types.

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No problem. Let's see him in September. He doesn't have to be special. He just has to do what he's done in the minors. Is Adam Jones something special? If I thought he was, I wouldn't think of trading him.

The probability that he is, outweighs the probability that Angle is. I have more confidence in AJ's skill set, than a guy who has never been on a major league team.

I don't have anything against Angle...I just think if he was anything more than a 4th OF, we would of heard more about him, both from the O's and from the national media.

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Angle could and should get called up as soon as the O's trade CPat. Then we can see for ourselves whether his defense is as good as advertised and whether he can get on base in the majors.

He's not as talented as Adam Jones, not by a long shot. But if he can hit .280 with an OBP of .360, steal bases and play excellent defense, he can hold down a starting position in the major leagues even if he doesn't hit for any power. I'd rather have Jones, but if Jones can bring back a king's ransom of talent, then you have to consider it.

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The probability that he is, outweighs the probability that Angle is. I have more confidence in AJ's skill set, than a guy who has never been on a major league team.

I don't have anything against Angle...I just think if he was anything more than a 4th OF, we would of heard more about him, both from the O's and from the national media.

What is Adam Jones's skillset? I know of his reality. A player who's defense has regressed in CF, a guy who can't steal bases, and a batter who can't get on base without getting a hit. If Adam Jones doesn't hit home runs, he has little value at all. He'll need to hit a lot of them, to be plus.

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