Pickles

No, no, no. This team can eat two roster spots and 150 million and have no adverse effects.

I wouldn't beat that offer.

You've come full circle in fifteen years. I'll give you that. If your 2006 self could see you advocating- essentially- for overpaying in FA for "veteranosity" to win that magical 63rd game, it would be interesting. The thing is, I agree with you. There's a time and a place for everything. Stabilizing the rotation would have a synergistic effect. And we must be smart about the target. Hence this thread. It will be interesting to see what Eduardo gets. But he's a guy that makes sense to me. Few others do. To the point, that instead of go after consolation prizes, I probably would just keep running through the Harveys of the world.

Ehhhh. There's essentially one: Get lucky and have the guy outperform.

I'd agree. Which suggests that signing any FA of any significance is a bad move for the O's.

I think it's more like add another year ~ 5/70.

This is where I put the price tag. But I don't think it's enough to get him here.

Has he been vaxxed? (Runs from room, cowering. LOL. Just a joke. No need to go down that route.) He did not pitch last year- I see he opted out due to his myocarditis. TBH, that is a risk I had not considered. Let's say operating off the idea that he is good to go from here forward- with no more risk than the avg pitcher with his profile- what kind of contract does he get? He's a steal at 4/48. Is 5/75 enough to get him here? Does that even make sense for the O's?

I know we all can't (nor should we) be Sports Guy, but there has been talk of whom one might target from outside the organization in this upcoming offseason. I think it makes for a good thread, as it is specific enough to avoid much of the more general critiques that seem to preoccupy so much space on this board. So I am inclined to throw my hat in the ring. Let me preface it by saying I am still pretty calm regarding the rebuild. I am not surprised by the breadth and depth of it. Next year I expect to see the first real improvements from the 108 loss team that was here in 2018. But not enough to be competitive, or even respectable. But again, that is no surprise. That said, I understand the growing angst. This team is pathetic, and it hasn't improved in three years. Mostly by design, but still, it is painful. I concede it very well may be wise to spend some resources- though it may be less than ideal- on improving the major league roster- if only for everyone's sanity. To that end, it is unlikely that we could really catch one of the "big fish." It probably isn't even wise. (I am less inclined to trade prospects now. Any of them, really. Unless you have a Crystal Ball.) We should be looking mid-market. (And we will have to overpay in all likelihood, yet another reason to avoid the top of the market.) Further, the single best thing we could do to improve this team is to bolster the starting rotation. All runs are indeed created equal, but when you are replacing Jorge Mateo instead of Dean Kremer, it is not as beneficial. Pythagoras be damned. So, with the criteria above in mind, let me suggest an old friend: Eduardo Rodriguez. He's had a fine career so far. Next year he'll be 29. I suspect the Sox are going to let him go, or they would have signed him to an extension by now. His era is up a bit this year, but his peripherals are as good, or better, than ever. What kind of contract do you think he gets? What kind of contract does it take to get him here?

I was kinda hoping Mullins would. He looked about ready. Hell, there's 2 outs in the ninth. Of course, he's better for not doing it. Cause Mountcastle hits a hr and we're tied up and now we have no CFer.

It didn't take a lip-reader to see that he was very unhappy.

That was a hell of an at bat. With a very generous ump who clearly had a dinner reservation. Yeah, he struck out, but he battled very well.

I didn't tune in until later, but I saw two egregious calls which basically shortchanged the O's ability to score in the 9th. The first was the first pitch to Stewart. 5 inches outside. Called strike one. Then he swings through the 2nd pitch, likewise 5 inches outside, because he figures it's a called strike. He managed to work back to a full count, but he probably should have been on base. And then the very next batter is Mullins, and he gets rung up on a 3-2 pitch that's four inches inside. He was livid and I don't blame him. So instead of walking the first two batters of the ninth, the Jays closer has two outs and nobody on. Made life a lot easier for him.

I think it is very possible. I want to watch Urias and Mateo for another month to get a stronger feel for how badly we need IF help. AR, Mullins, Mountcastle, Mancini, Hays, Santander is clearly the outlines of an above average offense. The answer to your question is: 1) Health. How much of the time do you get your best players on the field? Mullins, Hays, and Santander. That outfield looks to be above average offensively- but if McKenna and Stewart are going to get 500 abs between them, considerably less so. The same is true of how much does AR catch and when does he come up. I expect him to make an impact, because he's not just taking abs from Severino (whom I expect to stay) but also Sisco and Wynns. That's 200 abs of 40 ops+ we don't need to see next year. However, I do not expect AR to immediately become a middle order type of bat. 2) Production from 2B, SS, and 3B. This is obvious to all of us. I want to see more of Urias and Mateo before I would decide just how much leash I give them next year, and what kind of contingency plans I would need to make. That said, this is where the opportunity cost comes on. And I rarely see this appreciated when discussing the calculation of rebuilding. Signing Kris Bryant would be great. Throwing a dozen Craig Worthingtons at the wall until one is Justin Turner is better.

I've been very pleasantly surprised at his discipline over the course of the season. You can actually seem him growing and it is being reflected in the stats and performance. He has a better walk rate now than he did at any point in his MiL career- which was very productive. That's obviously an encouraging trend. I have been skeptical of Mountcastle really being able to develop into that 900 ops hitter, specifically because of his plate discipline issues. But I really have found his season so far to raise my expectations of what he might be come.

I agree with you but, of course, you didn't find Darren O'Day on the waiver wire, seems to be the exact opposite of damning with faint praise.

Now, granted anybody we would have turned over, I would have advocated trading almost immediately, so I don't think it would have changed much in the W-L column.

It's HARD to find a good SS without spending significant assets. It is comparatively easy to find a BP arm without spending significant assets. I think they could have done better in the last two years or so of rooting through that waiver wire, rule 5, etc, to get a few better arms.

I appreciate the idea behind the thread. It provides for far more interesting and constructive conversations than the ephemeral idea that the players just "should/could" be better than their current iterations. I too have a pitcher in mind that I'll make a thread about soon enough. That said, spending money next year to not improve the on-field product doesn't appeal to me. At all.

There's truth to this.

What is this new i bEt yOu tRuSt tHe mEdIa wHeN tHeY sAy gOoD tHiNgS bit? Is that what you think is rhetorical brilliance? Other than accusations, can you show any example of me hypocritically supporting my positions by selectively citing the media? I haven't even made a comment about the "media's" perception of our farm system. At any point. Why do you keep referencing it as if I did?

Well, that leads to the issue of BPA by whose criteria. Sometimes the professionals' and the media's is going to align, and sometimes it won't.

All excellent points. I think they will ease him into those workloads, but I do think, ultimately, in his prime, they will try to do just that: Catch him 130 games a year.

Of course. But if there's no clear BPA? And how often is there a distinguishable BPA at any one point in an MLB draft?

I think you're misinterpreting my original statement. The Ravens have been better than them the last 3 years- it's not really questionable- and other than a Covid fluke. What I was referring to though was they've been better than them for years on end at various periods in the past. The very recent past. It's not fair to say one organization is demonstrably better than the other. But from year to year it is fair to say that about individual teams. And yes, the games will always be close and hard fought, and back and forth, because it is the nature of the rivalry, and both teams are among the best in the sport annually. Let's keep it to baseball though. So I'll get to your other points.