Pickles

Debatable. I'm surprised nobody is talking about how awful the Rangers are. It *doesn't* take five years of tanking to build a farm system. It *can* take five years. Again, you miss the crucial factor. The tanking isn't what is building the farm system. It can help. It can speed up the process. But it isn't actually the positive development.

Well, good for them. I'm not sure I'd be planting a flag if I was them, but they play in probably the worst division in baseball, so they have a chance.

I'm sorry to make multiple posts but I can't edit. It's also to use Andy MacPhail's phrase. "A snapshot in time." It is possible to have a solid farm system ranking, and be terrible at finding and developing players.

Addition to not be completely snarky: Rankings aren't definite. It's nice when rankings improve but that doesn't mean it's reality. It's the perception of reality.

Winning a lot of divisions, eh?

I think this question is framed completely wrong. And I think it leads to a lot of cross talk. The question isn't, "How long do the O's need to be bad?" You don't need to be bad to build a top notch farm system. It helps. It can speed the process up, but it isn't necessary. This isn't the issue. The issue is: 1) How long does it take to build a top-notch farm system starting from the position the O's were in when Elias took over? 2) How long does it take for a top-notch farm system to translate to having a winning MLB team. The answer to question one is debatable. The O's had a bad farm system when Elias arrived, but some of the talent which makes up its superior current ranking was already present. I, for one, think it takes a minimum of 3-5 years to develop a strong farm system, and not merely a collection of strong prospects. Elias, despite individual moves which I might disagree with, seems to be making more progress to that end than any of his predecessors since the 70s. The answer to number two is clearer: Depends, but it takes some time. I remember when the Royals assembled "The Greatest Farm System in History;" well, then they went and got their asses kicked three more years until they brought in a couple vet pitchers and then they started winning pennants. I have been cautioning some of the optimism I have read on this board for the last few years. There's been a lot of in 2021 talk, or in 2022 talk. To make an O's analogy, we're in the 2009 part of this rebuild. There are still several losing seasons in front of us- at least imo. In 2-3 years, we could have a strong farm system. And, imo, winning is probably about 2-3 years behind that.

Yes.

It was irrelevant to the score, but Mullins made an extremely poor throw to the plate in the first inning. It's hard to criticize the man for anything right now, but I think that was the first time I've appreciated how poor his arm is. That will cost you some runs over the course of a season.

The diving catch by Mullins was a hell of a catch, only necessitated by the fact that Mountcastle has very bad range. (And good thing he caught it because if he missed it, it would have bounced past a diving Mountcastle to the wall for at least a triple, if not more.) Mullins also made another fine running catch, staying on his feet this time, to catch a drive to the warning track in LCF. I've seen enough from Mountcastle to say pretty confidently that he will never play a ton in the outfield for a GOOD team.

It was a great performance. On a scouting scale, what would you put on that change today? 70? The kid has got a plus-plus big-league pitch. That typically bodes very well for his future.

Don't feel back for Frederick. Feel bad for the Orioles. They're the ones who just lost tens of thousands of fans, and more every year going forward, to the Nationals.

And this is why the corporate business model is hot garbage. Not everything fits on a spreadsheet. You have diminished the game of baseball. I'm glad you made three cents in the process. Guess what? In the long run, you'll cost yourself far more.

Tell em all to go eat a big fat s::t burger.

Is that in Ghostbusters? Now, that's a movie I haven't seen in a long time. Oh, I'm sure Ramis knew all about it.

I think it's actually apocryphal. But anybody who wants to understand the world today should read Spengler's "The Decline of the West." But Os related, I hate to see a man be crushed, and from my perspective, anyone with optimism about this upcoming year, is going to be crushed. But I confess, I am not much fun at parties either.

Optimism is cowardice. Oswald Spengler

If this kid doesn't repeat what he did last year, or get close, this could be a historical bad staff. Of it isn't/wasn't already.

Shouldn't that be the case in 5 years? Btw, that isn't entirely true. Gyvens, O'Day, and Britton all preceded DD. And I don't want to poop on the guy. He brought necessary things. But that competitive window was propped open by AM.

That's the key!

All of life is relative. If you think that is awful, then I suggest you haven't been watching the last few Orioles' starting staffs. Consider yourself lucky. And yes, stability has some value. It's the same reason they signed Iglesia.

I was kind of being facetious. Duquette did some good things here, and brought an urgency that was necessary. He was also excellent at dumpster diving and getting the most out of the backend of the roster. However, I think as late as 2016- our last playoff year- 7 out of 9 regulars had been acquired by Andy MacPhail.

Well it may have been both. But still, that kind of leads to the same question: Does pitching to your strengths improve your future ability to be a MLer?

Ok. I'll walk away and apologize. I'm sorry if I misunderstood the OP.

No, Elias, and every other baseball man worth his salt, values having good prospects. They're not concerned with minutely analyzing their minor league ranking after every transaction.

I guess I should have been more specific. I can see the advantage of some of the high-def cameras, etc. But I remember reading last year about increased advanced scouting for MiLs, particularly pitchers. That's what I want to know about. Does knowing that non-prospect on Durham can't hit a curveball, so throw him curveballs, actually lead to a guy being a better ML pitcher, or just lead to better MiL stats, like we saw almost across the board last year? They must think it does. I guess I want to know why. Other than maybe increased trade value of our players, which I think wouldn't be a lasting thing.