International Draft?

[JERSEYORIOLE]

I asked this at the end of another thread but the thread was dying. I do not know enough about the international side of things. There is alot of talk on here about international signings ect.

My question is. Why is there not an international draft? Or why are all players no included in the draft? It seems simple to me and would make for an even playing field. You would think the owners would want it.

Is this an issue with the players union?

Im sure there is something here im missing, but I just dont get it.

[Jagwar]

I asked this at the end of another thread but the thread was dying. I do not know enough about the international side of things. There is alot of talk on here about international signings ect.

My question is. Why is there not an international draft? Or why are all players no included in the draft? It seems simple to me and would make for an even playing field. You would think the owners would want it.

Is this an issue with the players union?

Im sure there is something here im missing, but I just dont get it.

I'm with you. It makes no sense to me that every team doesn't have the same opportunity to draft international players. They do it in every other sport.

The detractors will say that guys like Ichiro would unfairly get lumped in with unproven teenagers. I say who cares. Veterans like Ichiro or Matsuzaka are the exception, not the norm.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

I'm with you. It makes no sense to me that every team doesn't have the same opportunity to draft international players. They do it in every other sport.

The detractors will say that guys like Ichiro would unfairly get lumped in with unproven teenagers. I say who cares. Veterans like Ichiro or Matsuzaka are the exception, not the norm.

I hear ya. But then Ichiro would be the first pick. Is it any different then Harper or Strausberg?

[crowmst3k!]

Foreign governments and work visas probably play a roll that the MLB would rather just leave up to each club.

I personally like the current system. It allows any team, if they wanted, to grab up some good players even if they draft low. The fact that the Orioles have chosen to largely ignore international prospects doesn't speak to a systemic issue, rather an Orioles issue.

[BaltimoreTerp]

I'm with you. It makes no sense to me that every team doesn't have the same opportunity to draft international players. They do it in every other sport.

The detractors will say that guys like Ichiro would unfairly get lumped in with unproven teenagers. I say who cares. Veterans like Ichiro or Matsuzaka are the exception, not the norm.

They aren't going to get "lumped in" with anybody. They simply won't come over. They'll stay in Japan and continue to make big money on real contracts. So you just lost the Japanese market.

Then, if you make it so that every Latin player has to come into the league that way, you take away the incentive process to find those players. The reason so many are in the league now is because teams can go out and get those players cheaper than similar talent in America. All of those academies and scouts will go away. The talent system will go stagnant like Puerto Rico. So that takes away a large percentage of the Latin talent.

So a "detractor" would actually say you are destroying a large portion of your talent pool. Whether that risk outweighs the benefits, both economic and in balancing the talent pool (though it can be argued that the draft itself hasn't done that to the extent expected, either), is the question.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

They aren't going to get "lumped in" with anybody. They simply won't come over. They'll stay in Japan and continue to make big money on real contracts. So you just lost the Japanese market.

Then, if you make it so that every Latin player has to come into the league that way, you take away the incentive process to find those players. The reason so many are in the league now is because teams can go out and get those players cheaper than similar talent in America. All of those academies and scouts will go away. The talent system will go stagnant like Puerto Rico. So that takes away a large percentage of the Latin talent.

So a "detractor" would actually say you are destroying a large portion of your talent pool. Whether that risk outweighs the benefits, both economic and in balancing the talent pool (though it can be argued that the draft itself hasn't done that to the extent expected, either), is the question.

Hold on. Ichiro wouldn't demand a similar or a higher contract than Harper coming out of Japan when he did? And why would he need to get more then that unproven in the US? If he chose not to come, thats fine. If I recall correctly, there have been just as many if not more busts coming out of Japan, then stars.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

Foreign governments and work visas probably play a roll that the MLB would rather just leave up to each club.

I personally like the current system. It allows any team, if they wanted, to grab up some good players even if they draft low. The fact that the Orioles have chosen to largely ignore international prospects doesn't speak to a systemic issue, rather an Orioles issue.

Basketball and Hockey dont seem to have visa problems. MLB would have nothing to do with visa's anyway. If you draft a player you have that responsibility, just like if you sign a player. Where is the difference?

Maybe you feel the Orioles have been less then aggressive internationally. But that isn't the question. The question is, why doesn't MLB level the playing field?

[JERSEYORIOLE]

They aren't going to get "lumped in" with anybody. They simply won't come over. They'll stay in Japan and continue to make big money on real contracts. So you just lost the Japanese market.

Then, if you make it so that every Latin player has to come into the league that way, you take away the incentive process to find those players. The reason so many are in the league now is because teams can go out and get those players cheaper than similar talent in America. All of those academies and scouts will go away. The talent system will go stagnant like Puerto Rico. So that takes away a large percentage of the Latin talent.

So a "detractor" would actually say you are destroying a large portion of your talent pool. Whether that risk outweighs the benefits, both economic and in balancing the talent pool (though it can be argued that the draft itself hasn't done that to the extent expected, either), is the question.

This makes no sense. From a simple economic standpoint, MLB should change this system. Why should teams have to have academies. I can't believe the owners allow this to go on. Do major League teams have academies in Southern Cal? or in Kansas? The scouts would not go away. They would have to scout those players just like they do HS and college kids. The talent pool would not be destroyed. Decreased a little, but the real talent would still be there.

"teams can go out and get those players cheaper then talent in america" There are so many things wrong with that statement I dont know where to begin.

[VAB2110]

There's no international draft because the players union wouldn't stand for it and the owners aren't going to shut down the game for it. MLB would love to have a worldwide draft. Selig talks about it all the time but the players want as few players drafted as possible to make sure those youngsters get out in the free market and get top dollar.

[JDubs]

This makes no sense. From a simple economic standpoint, MLB should change this system. Why should teams have to have academies. I can't believe the owners allow this to go on. Do major League teams have academies in Southern Cal? or in Kansas? The scouts would not go away. They would have to scout those players just like they do HS and college kids. The talent pool would not be destroyed. Decreased a little, but the real talent would still be there.

"teams can go out and get those players cheaper then talent in america" There are so many things wrong with that statement I dont know where to begin.

The concern is less that the scouts would disappear than it is that the development would dry up. Teams (but not the O's) spend a lot of money developing the raw talents of these athletes. If there were a draft, the incentive to scout the players wouldn't change, but the incentive to develop them would to some degree because you couldn't guarantee that you would be able to draft the player that you developed. I could see situations where teams are trying to squirrel away talented players so other teams don't find out about them before the draft.

All that said, I find it hard to believe that they can't find a workable scheme to institute an international draft. If anything, the onus would fall to the league to encourage player development internationally, which is in the league's best interest anyways (i.e. fostering international interest in the sport, etc.)

[crowmst3k!]

Basketball and Hockey dont seem to have visa problems. MLB would have nothing to do with visa's anyway. If you draft a player you have that responsibility, just like if you sign a player. Where is the difference?

Maybe you feel the Orioles have been less then aggressive internationally. But that isn't the question. The question is, why doesn't MLB level the playing field?

That would imply that the draft itself is a level playing field. Agents have ways of ensuring that their top talent gets top dollar, and it often frightens teams from drafting these players.

I like that the international system is a free for all. The rich teams are not the only beneficiaries. The big three splashes in international free agency recently were the Twins, Reds, and Pirates. Any team has the option of making that investment.

Plus, as was stated by others, Puerto Rico can be seen as the case study. Far less talent is coming out of PR now than before they were incorporated into the rule 4 draft. It could end up being dreadful for baseball if the influx of latin talent dried up. International talent is great for baseball.

[Can_of_corn]

Do major League teams have academies in Southern Cal? or in Kansas?

They have these things in Southern California and Kansas, we call them High Schools, and these other things we call Colleges.

These things do not exist in the DR like they do in the U. S.. If the teams do not provide them, and if financial incentives are not there for Buscones, then the talent that is in Latin American will dry up.

Btw there is nothing stopping a team from opening up an academy in Kansas.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

There's no international draft because the players union wouldn't stand for it and the owners aren't going to shut down the game for it. MLB would love to have a worldwide draft. Selig talks about it all the time but the players want as few players drafted as possible to make sure those youngsters get out in the free market and get top dollar.

I figured that this was an issue. But why would a kid from another country have an advantage over a kid that is from the states? To me it makes little sense. International players, if I understand you correctly, are free agents from day one. American players have to go through the draft system. If they can not agree on a contract, then they sit a year. Is this correct? And if it is, how in the world is that fair?

[JERSEYORIOLE]

They have these things in Southern California and Kansas, we call them High Schools, and these other things we call Colleges.

These things do not exist in the DR like they do in the U. S.. If the teams do not provide them, and if financial incentives are not there for Buscones, then the talent that is in Latin American will dry up.

Btw there is nothing stopping a team from opening up an academy in Kansas.

These things are not paid for my MLB in anyway. And no matter how they are developed, they are available to all teams in the draft.

I do not believe they could open an academy in Kansas. Im sure it would cost them their amatuer status in some way, furthermore, even if they could, no team would do this, as they would be developing a kid that chances are they wouldnt end up with.

Im not saying to pull out of the DR. It is very simple. Each team is required to contribute X number of dollars to the DR system. Or the System in PR or whereever MLB thinks development is needed. Then there is a draft. It would level the playing field and if nothing else, eliminate a large number of posts on this board with complaints of our lack of investment internationally.

[srock]

These things are not paid for my MLB in anyway. And no matter how they are developed, they are available to all teams in the draft.

I do not believe they could open an academy in Kansas. Im sure it would cost them their amatuer status in some way, furthermore, even if they could, no team would do this, as they would be developing a kid that chances are they wouldnt end up with.

Im not saying to pull out of the DR. It is very simple. Each team is required to contribute X number of dollars to the DR system. Or the System in PR or whereever MLB thinks development is needed. Then there is a draft. It would level the playing field and if nothing else, eliminate a large number of posts on this board with complaints of our lack of investment internationally.

Two major things need to happen in order for an International Draft to occur:

1. MLB takes over the talent development (ie the academies) in developing countries. Teams don't do it themselves, but clearly there is a need for such infrastructure. Then all players coming out of the academies, Caribbean League, etc enter the draft (maybe a different draft then the Amateur).

2. Work out a CBA deal with MLBPA that is suitable. It might mean reducing the service time before a player becomes a FA or having a loophole for international players to start there service clock differently. (IE a 30 year Japanese player isn't likely to wait 6 years before FA)

These are not simple things to implement.