Jump to content

Another Fielder thread...my apologies


Sports Guy

Recommended Posts

Drungo had a post that essentially said better to throw a hail mary than kneel on the ball(this in regards to Fielder).

At what point, do we just say, F it...Spend the freaking money, who cares about the 5-7 years of the deal?

At this point, we are going to blow those 3 years anyway, so who really cares how much it hurts us?

Do you guys think it is that point? Do you think it is just time say, nothing we want to do is either working or getting implemented, so let's just spend stupidly and see what happens?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 72
  • Created
  • Last Reply
Drungo had a post that essentially said better to throw a hail mary than kneel on the ball(this in regards to Fielder).

At what point, do we just say, F it...Spend the freaking money, who cares about the 5-7 years of the deal?

At this point, we are going to blow those 3 years anyway, so who really cares how much it hurts us?

Do you guys think it is that point? Do you think it is just time say, nothing we want to do is either working or getting implemented, so let's just spend stupidly and see what happens?

Oh you mean the Treasian approach to baseball management! :D

Seriously tho, the bad part about all of this is that I am really starting to get the feeling that nothing is going to work. I believe that AM's plan is the correct way to build a baseball team but it has to be executed correctly and I think that is where the O's are falling apart.

I am quickly coming to the point where I would say if they are not going to spend money the right way then I would rather them spend money the wrong way (i.e Prince Fielder for 7 years).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you sign Fielder than you have to be in an "F it" mode. There's no reason to get him and make no other impact moves, it is an absurd terrible good for nothing waste of money. As we all mention, the last 2 or so years of a Fielder deal will probably be a waste. With that in mind, I don't see us contending next year, or the year after. So on my model there's no real reason to bring in Fielder. BUT, if we do the right thing AND sign Fielder it could work out. Bring in Fielder, move everyone you can possibly move for more value this deadline/offseason, bring in a quality LF and two good pitchers and then work on winning at the top and re-building the system. That way when you get to the end of the Fielder Contract, you aren't trying to tread water (like we are now).

This means trading guys like Jones, this means making hard decisions on who to extend and whether you should move them to bring in more talent.

So I agree, the next 1.5-2 years (and maybe 3) are a waste. On this teams current path we are 4th place at best over that span. I think we can redo everything and come back in 1.5-2 years, but you can also do it the right way AND bring in Fielder. What I don't want to see is us bring in Fielder and then make the same old stupid moves leaving the team essentially where it is now...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not my money and I'm tired of losing. The Orioles organization is either not savvy enough or unwilling to do what it takes to win by out-scouting and out-developing other teams in the AL East. I really see no way we win without throwing buckets of money at proven players.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drungo had a post that essentially said better to throw a hail mary than kneel on the ball(this in regards to Fielder).

At what point, do we just say, F it...Spend the freaking money, who cares about the 5-7 years of the deal?

At this point, we are going to blow those 3 years anyway, so who really cares how much it hurts us?

Do you guys think it is that point? Do you think it is just time say, nothing we want to do is either working or getting implemented, so let's just spend stupidly and see what happens?

We'll never get a player like Fielder without taking on extra financial risk or hitting a home run in the draft.

Do we want a player like Fielder?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drungo had a post that essentially said better to throw a hail mary than kneel on the ball(this in regards to Fielder).

At what point, do we just say, F it...Spend the freaking money, who cares about the 5-7 years of the deal?

At this point, we are going to blow those 3 years anyway, so who really cares how much it hurts us?

Do you guys think it is that point? Do you think it is just time say, nothing we want to do is either working or getting implemented, so let's just spend stupidly and see what happens?

This team has a lot more holes to fill. We need a first baseman, left fielder, second baseman, shortstop, at least 2 starting pitchers, and likely a couple of relief pitchers.

I don't think spending all our money to fix one hole is very smart.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh you mean the Treasian approach to baseball management! :D

Seriously tho, the bad part about all of this is that I am really starting to get the feeling that nothing is going to work. I believe that AM's plan is the correct way to build a baseball team but it has to be executed correctly and I think that is where the O's are falling apart.

I am quickly coming to the point where I would say if they are not going to spend money the right way then I would rather them spend money the wrong way (i.e Prince Fielder for 7 years).

The plan is to build around SP. You need at least a 3-1 ratio to get one good SP. We don't have 15 young SP prospects close to ready yet. We need to keep stockpiling them untill we have a solid rotation. The best course of action is bite the bullet and trade as many valuable pieces as you can to acquire 3-4 good near ML ready young SP. I doubt that happens, and my bet is PA will go after Fielder as a Hail Mary. Not sure AM will stay on board for that.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drungo had a post that essentially said better to throw a hail mary than kneel on the ball(this in regards to Fielder).

At what point, do we just say, F it...Spend the freaking money, who cares about the 5-7 years of the deal?

I think the much smarter thing would to do another round of rebuilds. However, even if MacPhail were inclined to do so, which I imagine he isn't, there's no way Buck would be game for that. I'm not sure where Angelos would stand on that.

Because the triumvirate isn't likely to go through with another two years of rebuilding, then I'm absolutely game for a hail mary. Fielder isn't a smart decision, but as Drungo put it, it's smarter than doing nothing.

The reality is we're not going to build a Dynasty in the way that Boston or New York have. Even if we're very savvy in the way the Rays are, we just don't have the resources to become dominant in this division. We can, however, compete for two or three years, then rebuild for two or three and come back swinging. Taking a cyclical approach might help the franchise out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't see Fielder signing here at all. He could literally come out and say I want to play for the Orioles and I will cut my salary demands in half and the Orioles would still try to negotiate with him. We are far too slow to react in negotiations and by the time PA approves an offer, he will have signed elsewhere

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, absoultely. Unless the O's want to trade everyone, and completely start over (with everything that would entail) then they need to try and win with the core assembled.

6 yrs $145M for Fielder5 yrs $50M for Darvish (+$35M posting fee)

3 yrs $27M for Hardy

Guthrie traded for Cozart, +

Darvish, Matusz, Britton, Arrieta, Tillman / Bergesen

Gregg

Uehara

Johnson

Bergesen / Tillman

Berken

Simon

Viola / Klein / Schrader / Johnson

Roberts 2nd

Hardy SS

Markakis RF

Fielder 1st

Jones CF

Wieters C

Reynolds 3rd

Scott DH

Reimold LF

Pie, Tatum, Cozart, Andino

What is the salary of that team?

That's not happening...Try 7/165 or so...Are you still in for that?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drungo had a post that essentially said better to throw a hail mary than kneel on the ball(this in regards to Fielder).

At what point, do we just say, F it...Spend the freaking money, who cares about the 5-7 years of the deal?

At this point, we are going to blow those 3 years anyway, so who really cares how much it hurts us?

Do you guys think it is that point? Do you think it is just time say, nothing we want to do is either working or getting implemented, so let's just spend stupidly and see what happens?

I would have preferred the Orioles to go absolutely nuts in the draft and the international market instead, but it seems there's no chance of that happening.

I would suggest a full scale rebuild, but MacPhail is not aggressive enough in any market to acquire the necessary talent to make it work. Combine that with a curiously inept development system, and I'm almost thinking, "what's the point?"

Fielder will get a stupid, risky contract, as will several other players in free agency. But nothing else the Orioles have tried has worked, and they seem to be stuck. I'm not advocating it, but I wouldn't be any more upset about throwing money at Fielder than I would be about holding on to Guthrie and the other trade chips and going about another ho hum offseason.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Plenty of people out there that think 6 $145M might happen.

If you can definitively get him with 7 $165M, sure I'd do that.... which was the real point of this thread. It makes more sense for the O's to potentially regret the last two years of that deal, vs. not obtaining the player.

And you wouldn't have found one person who would have said Werth would get his contract. It doesn't really matter if writers think he will or will not get it.

It only takes one dumb team and the Orioles have to pay a premium tax.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not my money and I'm tired of losing. The Orioles organization is either not savvy enough or unwilling to do what it takes to win by out-scouting and out-developing other teams in the AL East. I really see no way we win without throwing buckets of money at proven players.

THIS.

We need to stop low-balling and thinking we can get away with "lucky" moves without good lower development. In order to compete in the East, we're going to actually have to spend money on the better free-agents... Not the aging vets (ie. Lee, Vlad) or the wishful injured possibilities (ie. Duscherer).

No reason why we shouldn't be luring Fielder to the East with lots of $$$.

We need to be focused on good trades at the moment, too.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.




  • Posts

    • Yeah, it's hard for me to complain about a handful of winnable games in a season full of surprises. I never thought they would be a playoff team even when they were tied, or maybe ahead in a WC position earlier. There's a lot to look forward to for 2023... there's also a lot of work to do this off season.   
    • I feel like there's a default assumption that he's not a great blocker because most great pass catching TEs not named Kittle aren't.  But I've been looking out for him on running plays and this man is straight mauling people in run blocking.  He's easily Boyle's equal as a blocker even when Boyle is healthy.  But he's almost never playing tight end.   With the way he's pretty much permanently our slot receiver, having him as one of the main blockers on WR screens should be terrifying for DBs that have to shed this guy while tackling the receiver.  We put Ricard out wide a lot too, imagine Ricard and Andrews blocking for a WR screen to Bateman or Duvernay in trips.
    • Good post.  For me it doesn’t sting very much.   The team came a very long way this year.   But they were never more than a team with a puncher’s chance at the playoffs.   I’d still like to see them finish by playing a little better than they have for the last couple of weeks, to leave a good taste in our mouths after a fun season. 
    • I would want at least 3 years left for any pitcher we get in a trade.  I still think one of the young Astros starters makes the most sense.  The Astros were interested in Mullins before to upgrade their center fielder.   Elias knows that system so I like that as advantage.  Garcia, Valdez, Javier and Urquidy would be better fits because of at least 1 more year of control.  Javier would be my first choice because he has more strikeout stuff compared to other 3.  
    • Well Castillo was also dealt at the deadline and pitching usually gets more at the deadline. 
    • The Reds got two top 50ish prospects in Marte and Arroyo, plus two other solid prospects, from Seattle for 1.5 years of Luis Castillo, so 2 full years of Burnes or Woodruff (who have both been significantly better than Castillo over the last 3 years) should cost even more than that. Something like Cowser and Holliday, plus 2 or 3 more decent prospects from our top 30. Personally, I'd rather just throw a Brinks truck or two in Justin Verlander's general direction since our payroll is sub-Rays level atm.
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...